LO231
Topic Author
Posts: 2227
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2004 5:55 pm

Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:21 pm

I was just wondering, left and right we are bombarded with bad financial results etc.

My shocker for 2012 was Malev.

Is there a sunny side to all the listings?

Any thoughts appreciated.

Rgds,

LO231
Got both LO 788 frames already, next LO E95 and 734 BRU-WAW-BRU
 
northstardc4m
Posts: 2724
Joined: Fri Apr 28, 2000 11:23 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:25 pm

Well Ryanair is profitable...   
Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
 
LO231
Topic Author
Posts: 2227
Joined: Tue Sep 28, 2004 5:55 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:32 pm

Quoting northstardc4m (Reply 1):

  Let's call 'em United European, lose all the rest and be happy.  

Somehow I'm not tempted by flying from inbetween cow fields to between shopping malls runways...

Next I know, I live next to ANR- Brussels North International...
Got both LO 788 frames already, next LO E95 and 734 BRU-WAW-BRU
 
User avatar
DolphinAir747
Posts: 1691
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:07 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:39 pm

TK seems to be doing well...

What about LH, especially LX?
 
User avatar
HELyes
Posts: 1213
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 4:26 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:50 pm

Finnair have their own troubles, but they are expected show profit from 2012, the numbers will be out next week.
 
PHX787
Posts: 7877
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 7:46 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:53 pm

Quoting northstardc4m (Reply 1):

Well Ryanair is profitable...


Unfortunately. Lol

Isn't BA profitable? If they weren't connected at the hip to IB

In my opinion:
BA
LH
TK
will do well this year. Others may but I don't know about them well enough to give an opinion.
Follow me on twitter: www.twitter.com/phx787
 
LOWS
Posts: 1194
Joined: Sun Oct 23, 2011 5:37 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:56 pm

Quoting DolphinAir747 (Reply 3):
What about LH

Problems with *cough* OS and their stake in SN.

OS is making a lot of progress, they just launched the brand new interiors for the 767 and 777, and finances are better since the transfer of operations to VO.
 
Burkhard
Posts: 1916
Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:34 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Tue Jan 29, 2013 9:22 pm

I would say LH isn't in Trouble. The have a lot of work to do, but starting from half a Billion annual Profit is not really a Problem.
 
ScottishDavie
Posts: 177
Joined: Fri Feb 25, 2011 10:48 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Tue Jan 29, 2013 9:55 pm

U2 made a net profit of GBP 255,000,000 in the financial year ended 30 September 2012. I'm no financial expert but I'd say that looks pretty good going.

http://2012annualreport.easyjet.com/...ormance-risk/financial-review.aspx
 
Eagleboy
Posts: 1699
Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2009 2:29 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:19 pm

I previously read that only 3 European airlines are currently profitable on shorthaul.........

FR, EI are 2, and I don't know the other. With the above post can it be true that only these 3 are profitable on shorthaul.
(Obviously larger network carriers make their money from longhaul....I'm looking at you BA)

I assume we will see all the 2012 full year results published over the next few weeks, will be interesting to see which carriers are profitable and/or stabilsing. (Losses can also point to a restructuring program under way...ie Air Berlin)
 
Viscount724
Posts: 18838
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:42 pm

Ryanair is forecasting a ful year profit after tax of around 540 million euros (around $728 million) for their financial year which ends March 31. That's close to $2 million net profit every day.
 
SCQ83
Posts: 2658
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:59 pm

Vueling is profitable and has short-haul only too.
 
mozart
Posts: 2018
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2003 12:21 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 7:31 am

What about Norwegian? Aren't they doing well?

Swiss is doing well, actually lifts up the entire LH group results.

Also some smaller airlines are doing fine (Darwin and the likes), whilts others go bust (OLT)
 
ely747
Posts: 138
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:28 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 9:22 am

 
steffenbn
Posts: 169
Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2010 2:37 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 10:07 am

EZ has also posted great profits again this year!

Sorry for the Danish link, couldn't find an English version. http://www.sun-air.dk/cms.cfm?nPageNo=72615





[Edited 2013-01-30 02:10:41]
A330, A319, 737,738,752,763,763ER,764ER,777-200LR
 
Eagleboy
Posts: 1699
Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2009 2:29 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 10:19 am

So not all doom and gloom in Europe?
 
kjellverschuren
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2012 12:53 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 11:52 am

Kl is doing good right? The combination with AF however..
 
vv701
Posts: 5773
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2005 10:54 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 2:21 pm

Nineteen out of nineteen analysts are currently forecasting that IAG will declare a profit for 2012. According to Reuters here:

http://www.reuters.com/finance/stocks/analyst?symbol=ICAG.L

these 19 are forecasting a profit per share of a low of 0.02, a high of 0.28 and a mean of 0.14 euros per share. This compares with a declared profit per share of 0.21 euros for 2011 when IAG made an operating profit of 485 million euros.

Considering the problems that IB have been experiencing recently and the costs BA must have incurred in operating loss making BD's timetable from 20 April to 27 October 2012 in parallel with their own (with flights to the same destination sometimes as close as 10 minutes apart) this looks likely to be an outstanding performance unless 19 different analysts have got it entirely wrong.
 
User avatar
SRQKEF
Posts: 1026
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2011 7:10 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 3:01 pm

Quoting ely747 (Reply 13):

I was going to mention Icelandair but you beat me to it! Consecutive profits from 2010, had a rough time in 2009 just after the collapse of the banks but rose from the dust and is doing great.

Isn't Norwegian also doing great?

Regards,
Sveinn  
Nothing compares to taking off in an empty 757 with full thrust!
 
1400mph
Posts: 1051
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 11:29 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 3:16 pm

Quoting VV701 (Reply 17):
Considering the problems that IB have been experiencing recently and the costs BA must have incurred in operating loss making BD's timetable from 20 April to 27 October 2012 in parallel with their own (with flights to the same destination sometimes as close as 10 minutes apart) this looks likely to be an outstanding performance unless

Good point !!
 
User avatar
fallap
Posts: 719
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:36 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 3:25 pm

I'll bet that SK will be in trouble again this year.
Grease monkey buried head to toe inside an F-16M
 
harmonium
Posts: 89
Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2012 6:07 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 5:21 pm

Quoting Fallap (Reply 20):

I'll bet that SK will be in trouble again this year

Yep, I think we'll see another major crisis for SK. The sale of Wideroe was supposed to bring in 1,5 billion Danish Kroner, but from what I've read the high bid right now is 550 million Danish Kroner.. That leaves out a whopping hole in the expected 2,6 billion Danish Kroner that SK were to find if the company should keep running. Also, both the sales of Wideroe and SAS Ground Handling are both seemingly stalled, with every potential buyer well knowing that they have the benefit since SK are under time pressure to get both sold.

Quoting SRQKEF (Reply 18):
Isn't Norwegian also doing great?
Quoting mozart (Reply 12):
What about Norwegian? Aren't they doing well?

Financially, DY are doing fine. But they have a few may-become-problems underway. Norwegian Government denied them the right to use foreign staff on the 787 - and the 787 itself isn't doing all too well, as we all know.
 
Burkhard
Posts: 1916
Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:34 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 5:36 pm

Quoting EagleBoy (Reply 15):
So not all doom and gloom in Europe?

How should? Europe is doing very well currently, only in Southern Europe some local governments are in trouble.
 
LOWS
Posts: 1194
Joined: Sun Oct 23, 2011 5:37 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 6:18 pm

Quoting Harmonium (Reply 21):
Norwegian Government denied them the right to use foreign staff

And rightly so, legally that could have been incredibly complicated, for the work visas and stay permits for staff that would only be staying in Oslo for short periods of time.

Not to mention any potential language issues.
 
ely747
Posts: 138
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:28 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 7:10 pm

Quoting Burkhard (Reply 22):

I like the sound of it "some local governments are in trouble"
 
UALWN
Posts: 2171
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:27 pm

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 7:21 pm

Quoting Burkhard (Reply 22):
only in Southern Europe some local governments are in trouble.

Moslty due to the misguided economical policies dictated by some local governments in Northern Europe...
AT7/111/146/Avro/CRJ/CR9/EMB/ERJ/E75/F50/100/L15/DC9/D10/M8X/717/727/737/747/757/767/777/787/AB6/310/32X/330/340/380
 
ely747
Posts: 138
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:28 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 7:30 pm

Just to put some minds at rest. This is an airliner forume, let's all keep it that way and avoid being dragged into the politics.
 
adriaticflight
Posts: 405
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2004 3:43 am

RE: Is ANY European Carrier Stable/out Of Trouble?

Wed Jan 30, 2013 10:38 pm

Of the big boys Aerofloft is doing well it seems.

My bets for closure in 2013 are Adria of Slovenia and perhaps CSA (would be a big one..but it's sort of in terminal decline for the past decade), perhaps JAT in Serbia and definatly BiH airlines in Bosnia.