geg2rap
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Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Wed Feb 20, 2013 4:09 am

Ok, rumors are just that, but this one has at least one fact to it.
I have several buddies who were on furlough from Mesa, we keep in contact regularly.
None of them were close to the top of the recall list (one was a couple hundred below me, and I just gave up and went into teaching)
3 of them got recall notices last week, 5 more today, one person even mentioned that mesa's website is now taking applications for anticipated openings in 2013. Which I confirmed it is.
Mesa lost a large # of RJ's in the last 2 years, so them having openings makes me wonder
1. Are they getting new business? Besides American, I don't even know who is looking for RJ work via RFP.
2. Did a large # of pilots bail? Get mainline jobs?
3. Are they wishfully thinking most pilots won't come back?
Anyone else got insight?
 
jethawk
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Wed Feb 20, 2013 4:14 am

Hmm, very interesting
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boberito6589
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Wed Feb 20, 2013 5:03 am

Word on the street is that Mesa is getting 9 additional CR9s for US...possibly some of the ex-PLUNA aircraft...supposed to start flying April 1st to coincide with the USX Chautauqua draw down
 
CRJ900
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Wed Feb 20, 2013 11:11 am

Quoting boberito6589 (Reply 2):
Word on the street is that Mesa is getting 9 additional CR9s for US...possibly some of the ex-PLUNA aircraft...supposed to start flying April 1st to coincide with the USX Chautauqua draw down

That would be great, those ex-PLUNA aircraft are brand new and should be flying, not sitting idle.
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ERJ170
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:19 pm

Quoting boberito6589 (Reply 2):
Word on the street is that Mesa is getting 9 additional CR9s for US

Good grief.. why doesn't US just get them for PSA? If Mesa is picking them up, that means they can't be that expensive.. Goodness gracious..
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usxguy
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Wed Feb 20, 2013 5:03 pm

Because PSA only has CRJ 200s and CRJ 700s.... that's why.

and what's wrong with some Mesa growth? Their USX ops (CR9) have always been really good...
xx
 
FutureFO
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 3:46 am

They actually are being dropped like hot potatoes from all carriers they have a contract with. US owns a 30% share in YV currently so that is why they are still around. Once the merger finalizes and regional carriers are figured you can almost bet YV being out of the picture as well as ZW, Piedmont and possibly even PSA CRJ-200's.
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RyanairGuru
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:00 am

Quoting FutureFO (Reply 6):
Once the merger finalizes and regional carriers are figured you can almost bet YV being out of the picture as well as ZW, Piedmont and possibly even PSA CRJ-200's.

Hmm.

ZW definitely, that contract is almost expired and if the new AA wants to cut 50 seaters then that would be the first place to start, especially with (IIRC) some agreement with Eagle guaranteeing them a certain number of aircraft. Sadly that would be the end of ZW  

Piedmont I could see staying. They fill a pretty valuable role in USEx, flying missions that RJs simply can't (intra-PA for example). If anything they might be able to grow: pick up some ATRs, -42s for PMUS flying and -72s for MIA. We will see...

PSA, well we will see about that one... they may well go the way of Mesaba and Comair

BUT - and back on topic - why do you think Mesa are going anywhere? There are the only CR9 operator in the combined US/AA operation, and - short of more restrictive scope imposed from the AA side* - those aircraft will prove very valuable, quite probably for the next decade.


*I admit that I know nothing about AA scope!
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JBirdAV8r
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:12 am

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 4):
Good grief.. why doesn't US just get them for PSA? If Mesa is picking them up, that means they can't be that expensive.. Goodness gracious..
Quoting usxguy (Reply 5):
Because PSA only has CRJ 200s and CRJ 700s.... that's why.

and what's wrong with some Mesa growth? Their USX ops (CR9) have always been really good...

1) PSA adding -900s wouldn't be a huge deal. There is not all that much difference between the -700 and -900 from either a pilot or maintenance standpoint. Aside from Mesa, they are the best-positioned US regional to take -900s.

2) I wouldn't be surprised to see a fairly significant -900 order spread out among a couple of regional partners fairly soon.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 7):
PSA, well we will see about that one... they may well go the way of Mesaba and Comair

I wouldn't count on that. There aren't really any parallels.
I got my head checked--by a jumbo jet
 
usflyer msp
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:22 am

Quoting FutureFO (Reply 6):
They actually are being dropped like hot potatoes from all carriers they have a contract with. US owns a 30% share in YV currently so that is why they are still around. Once the merger finalizes and regional carriers are figured you can almost bet YV being out of the picture as well as ZW, Piedmont and possibly even PSA CRJ-200's.

None of these carriers (except for Piedmont maybe) are going anywhere. AA will need a wide variety of regional carriers in order to whipsaw them against one another to keep costs low ala DL.

As far a Mesa hiring, Mesa has long had turnover issues (they are informally known as the Skywest Training Academy) and now that the pilot market is returning to somewhat of a equilibrium Mesa is probably suffering.

[Edited 2013-02-20 20:35:34]
 
FutureFO
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 5:01 am

The YV -900's could disappear and they would not be missed. YV is not the greatest carrier in terms of airplanes or comfort. I got to ride on a -900 operated by XE for DL and it was a 1000000000 times better in terms of comfort and customer service.


As far as what would replace the -900's it would be the 175's that we have been signed on for by AA and then in turn for the merger. So you take the 58 airframes we all ready have in the US system and add the 100 airplanes that we contracted with AA for we would be the largest operator of regional feed for the new company.
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Sean-SAN-
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 5:10 am

Mesa is facing an increase in block hours, and pilot attrition. They are recalling pilots, but most of them are already working for better regional airlines or will not meet the ATP mins to be legal in a few months. There is no way they will be growing because with much better regionals hiring coinciding with the ATP rules, there is no way Mesa can staff much additional flying.
 
dsuairptman
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 5:25 am

The recalls have nothing to do with growth. It has to do with the new rest rules coming into effect. Mesa knows that of all the pilots still furloughed, only 100ish will have the required hours by the rule implementation date. There is no guarantee that all the eligible pilots recalled will accept, so the are taking apps in preparation to fill needed slots.
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Sean-SAN-
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 5:30 am

The problem is nobody with ATP mins will goto Mesa when there are places paying $5000-10000 signing bonuses and have better contract terms and career potential.
 
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usxguy
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 7:40 am

Quoting FutureFO (Reply 10):
The YV -900's could disappear and they would not be missed. YV is not the greatest carrier in terms of airplanes or comfort. I got to ride on a -900 operated by XE for DL and it was a 1000000000 times better in terms of comfort and customer service.

Are you sure? Did you know that America West, err USAirways, owns the interiors? That they have *nothing* to do with Mesa? Mesa doesn't decide the configurations, types of seats, etc.
xx
 
dsuairptman
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 6:52 pm

Quoting Sean-SAN- (Reply 13):
The problem is nobody with ATP mins will goto Mesa when there are places paying $5000-10000 signing bonuses and have better contract terms and career potential.



Except JO is in denial of other places offering better. In his thinking, he doesn't understand why someone with all those hours wouldn't want to be his slave working for peanuts while based in Hawaii.
GEAUX SAINTS!
 
Alias1024
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 7:23 pm

Quoting JBirdAV8r (Reply 8):
1) PSA adding -900s wouldn't be a huge deal. There is not all that much difference between the -700 and -900 from either a pilot or maintenance standpoint. Aside from Mesa, they are the best-positioned US regional to take -900s.

I agree that it wouldn't be a big deal to add the 900 to PSA, but I'd argue that OO is actually better positioned than PSA to add 900s to the US fleet. OO already has considerable experience with the aircraft, and crews have already been trained on it. Literally all they'd have to do is send out a manual revision to crews outlining cabin layout and emergency equipment locations for US 900s, and make a very slight change to their OpSpecs to add that they would be flying the 900 as US Airways Express.

It wouldn't be a big change for PSA, but it's slightly easier for OO.
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silentbob
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 8:00 pm

Quoting JBirdAV8r (Reply 8):
1) PSA adding -900s wouldn't be a huge deal. There is not all that much difference between the -700 and -900 from either a pilot or maintenance standpoint. Aside from Mesa, they are the best-positioned US regional to take -900s.

Has US ordered/added any aircraft for their wholly owned regionals since the HP-US merger?
 
JBirdAV8r
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:30 pm

Quoting Alias1024 (Reply 16):
I agree that it wouldn't be a big deal to add the 900 to PSA, but I'd argue that OO is actually better positioned than PSA to add 900s to the US fleet. OO already has considerable experience with the aircraft, and crews have already been trained on it. Literally all they'd have to do is send out a manual revision to crews outlining cabin layout and emergency equipment locations for US 900s, and make a very slight change to their OpSpecs to add that they would be flying the 900 as US Airways Express.

Well, it would all come down to time and total cost. I get the feeling that a large order would be split among regional partners, and there have been rumblings (however slight) of adding the CRJ-1000. I'm not sure SkyWest would bring a cost advantage over either PSA or Mesa, either. Too many variables to say for sure.

Don't know if the SkyWest CRJ pilots are qualified on all variants at the same time.

Quoting silentbob (Reply 17):
Has US ordered/added any aircraft for their wholly owned regionals since the HP-US merger?

No. I think, but am not sure, that Piedmont may have (re?)acquired some secondhand aircraft--but they've had a net fleet loss in the past ten years.
I got my head checked--by a jumbo jet
 
Goldenshield
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Fri Feb 22, 2013 12:51 am

Quoting JBirdAV8r (Reply 18):
Don't know if the SkyWest CRJ pilots are qualified on all variants at the same time.

Some are, some aren't. It more a matter of recency of experience, and which crew base they fly from. As one might expect from being a DL base, only SLC and MSP crew bases fly the -200, -700, and -900 on a regular basis.
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RyanairGuru
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Fri Feb 22, 2013 12:54 am

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 19):
As one might expect from being a DL base, only SLC and MSP crew bases fly the -200, -700, and -900 on a regular basis.

What about LAX? Between DL, UA and AA, aren't all three types cycled through?
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Goldenshield
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Fri Feb 22, 2013 1:13 am

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 20):
What about LAX? Between DL, UA and AA, aren't all three types cycled through?

It's all about recency of experience and if they are qualified or not (in the case of the -900's.)

The LAX AA crew base staffs crews that used to fly UA or DL lines, but that doesn't mean that they would be current, or even comfortable flying the -700 or -900 (if they were current in---or even qualified in the case of the -900---to begin with,) but they would be more than current and qualified if called upon to cover a DL or UA -200 line. The same can work in reverse if a crew member bids -900 lines, or in the case ASE qualified crews, only fly -700 lines. Those crews might not be comfortable flying the -200.
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Alias1024
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:47 am

Quoting JBirdAV8r (Reply 18):
Don't know if the SkyWest CRJ pilots are qualified on all variants at the same time.

All first officers are qualified on all three variants from the day they finish IOE. There's no difference for them between the 700 and 900. Captains have to do a flight or two with a check airman, mostly to make sure they aren't going to put a main tire off a taxiway in turns since the distance from nose gear to the mains is so much farther. Not really a big deal.

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 19):
As one might expect from being a DL base, only SLC and MSP crew bases fly the -200, -700, and -900 on a regular basis.

Not true. LAX was a 700/900 only domicle until the AA flying began. SFO was a 700/900 only domicile until about a year and a half ago. Both domiciles now routinely fly all three variants.

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 21):
The LAX AA crew base staffs crews that used to fly UA or DL lines, but that doesn't mean that they would be current, or even comfortable flying the -700 or -900 (if they were current in---or even qualified in the case of the -900---to begin with,) but they would be more than current and qualified if called upon to cover a DL or UA -200 line.

There is no separate bid for AA versus UA/DL in LAX. It's all one bid. A pilot can fly DL one trip, AA the next, and UA the one after that.
It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems with just potatoes.
 
Goldenshield
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:08 am

Quoting Alias1024 (Reply 22):
Not true. LAX was a 700/900 only domicle until the AA flying began. SFO was a 700/900 only domicile until about a year and a half ago. Both domiciles now routinely fly all three variants.
Quoting Alias1024 (Reply 22):
There is no separate bid for AA versus UA/DL in LAX. It's all one bid. A pilot can fly DL one trip, AA the next, and UA the one after that.

Err, then I stand corrected. I was thinking that LAX was a reserve base serving UA until AA came along.
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n7371f
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:17 am

I can confirm the Mesa adding 9 CR9's is correct. US posted it in the very back end of the 10K just filed.
 
dsuairptman
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:01 pm

Quoting n7371f (Reply 24):



Many thoughts come to mind over what the intentions of this are. YV is already short staffed and with their pay and work rules coupled with the ATP/hour requirements they won't be getting many takers as far as pilots go. Any new hires would still be going straight to Hawaii as current displaced and downgraded pilots will benefit most from this aircraft addition.

It is highly unlikely Mesa will be getting a boost in their fee for departure, which was reduced greatly in bankruptcy. Bottom line, their overhead is still going to be high. Then their is LCC stock ownership, which has been allegedly growing. All this makes me wonder if this isn't "sweetening" the pot for a buyer of YV or its assets (planes). Could LCC be setting up YV to be merged with another wholly owned to form a wholly owned portion of the new AmEagle? Mesa has ten 700s coming off the UA contract at the end of this year, possible adding more planes to the contract. Yet, it still goes back to the required pilot requirements, Mesa's ability to hire enough and their overhead. Things that make you go, humm?
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DashTrash
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:10 pm

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 4):
Good grief.. why doesn't US just get them for PSA? If Mesa is picking them up, that means they can't be that expensive.. Goodness gracious..

US hasn't shown any interest in paying market rates for aircraft flown at the wholly owned carriers.

Quoting usxguy (Reply 5):
Because PSA only has CRJ 200s and CRJ 700s.... that's why.

Not much of a reason. Differences training is all that would be required outside of adding it to the certificate. Not a big deal.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 7):
Piedmont I could see staying. They fill a pretty valuable role in USEx, flying missions that RJs simply can't (intra-PA for example). If anything they might be able to grow: pick up some ATRs, -42s for PMUS flying and -72s for MIA. We will see...

Piedmont is like a roach. You can't kill it. I left there in '08 and thought it would be extinct by now when the company wasn't negotiating with the flight crews. Now, the pilots have a TA. Quite possibly to smooth things over with the US/AA merger. They also have frames that time out in the next few months. At least two of the -100s will be going to the scrap man by summer.

Quoting Sean-SAN- (Reply 13):
The problem is nobody with ATP mins will goto Mesa when there are places paying $5000-10000 signing bonuses and have better contract terms and career potential.

Mesa sucks. Not my opinion, just the common thought among regional pilots, or even aspiring regional pilots. It SHOULD be tough to fill classes when they need to hire, but somehow I think they'll get what they need.

Quoting silentbob (Reply 17):
Has US ordered/added any aircraft for their wholly owned regionals since the HP-US merger?

Hell no.

Quoting JBirdAV8r (Reply 18):
No. I think, but am not sure, that Piedmont may have (re?)acquired some secondhand aircraft--but they've had a net fleet loss in the past ten years.

Piedmont in the past has not been willing (or authorized) to pay what the market will bear to acquire new aircraft. They are scoped out of 400s, which might have a chance to change with a JCBA during the merger. Otherwise, they have missed opportunities to procure aircraft, including the 300s at Commutair.
 
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usxguy
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:23 pm

Quoting DashTrash (Reply 26):
Not much of a reason. Differences training is all that would be required outside of adding it to the certificate. Not a big deal.

Um... I've been involved, in management, in adding a new fleet type, even with commonality its not that easy. For the pilots - yes, its just training depending on your POI. But then you have to update all of your manuals that covers everything, still do FAA proving flights, etc. Granted its nothing like doing tabletops for certification, its still not cheap.

Which is why I still believe there's a reason that Republic & Compass are the only 2 major EMB 170/175 operators.... otherwise if it was "that" easy, then you'd see EMB 170s at SkyWest, Trans States, Pinnacle, etc.
xx
 
doug_or
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:14 pm

Quoting GEG2RAP (Thread starter):
Mesa lost a large # of RJ's in the last 2 years, so them having openings makes me wonder
1. Are they getting new business? Besides American, I don't even know who is looking for RJ work via RFP.
2. Did a large # of pilots bail? Get mainline jobs?
3. Are they wishfully thinking most pilots won't come back?
Anyone else got insight?

Alright, back to the actual OT, I think it is mostly #3. If you were furloughed by Mesa 2 years ago would would almost certainly have found something better by now. I'm not sure who much they're wishing no one comes back. There is going to be some difficulty filling classes with ATPs at a regional with a bad reputation and stagnant seniority list.
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apodino
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:55 pm

This is no rumor. According to a recent 10k filing from USAirways earlier this week.,,they are adding 9 Mesa 900s to replace the ERJs that Chautauqua is pulling. I don't have a link to the filing...but this is a done deal.
 
HNLPointShoot
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Sun Feb 24, 2013 3:38 am

US Airways' 10-K is available via the "Investor Relations" section of their website, here. (Filter for "Annual Filings," since the 10-K is an annual report filed with the SEC.)

Quote from page 9:

Quote:
In February 2013, we executed an amendment to our capacity purchase agreement with Chautauqua which removes the nine Embraer 145 regional jets they currently operate from our express fleet by July 2013. In addition, we executed an amendment to our capacity purchase agreement with Mesa Airlines to add nine CRJ 900 aircraft.
 
LAXintl
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:53 pm

Here is a press release:

Mesa Air Group to Extend Partnership with US Airways
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/mesa-a...-extend-partnership-130000426.html

Total 47 CRJ-900s on contract for 8-years.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
wingnutmn
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RE: Mesa Getting Some New Business?

Thu Feb 28, 2013 4:32 pm

I noted this in a different thread but could signing YV to some new flying be a sweetening of the pot for a takeover of YV? Maybe OO to be merged into EV, or ZW who desperately needs to diversify its fleet? OO could eventually swap out the 900's for MRJ's because I believe they are allowed under pilot scopes at US, and move the 900's to DL or UA?

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