Boeing777300
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UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Tue Feb 26, 2013 10:52 pm

I have noticed that the latest batch of 767-322ER's N664UA-N677UA, have all now visited Europe, previously being restricted to the American continent and Hawaiin routes and was wondering what the chances of the missing 777-200ER's being refurbished and visting Europe eventually. The batch in question is N210UA-N215UA inclusive, which to my knowledge have not yet been across the pond.

Any comments would be welcome.
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Polot
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Tue Feb 26, 2013 10:56 pm

All of PMUA's domestic 763s have been converted to a 2 class international product. There are no plans to get rid of the domestic 777 subfleet (in fact I believe they are going to grow the fleet slightly) so they won't be visiting Europe anytime soon.
 
AADC10
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Tue Feb 26, 2013 11:46 pm

Quoting Boeing777300 (Thread starter):
what the chances of the missing 777-200ER's being refurbished and visting Europe eventually

The 6 domestic 772s are not going anywhere. They are the only sUA aircraft that can operate ORD-HNL and it continues on to GUM. I suppose the 764 might make it but sCO does not have any to spare.
 
United1
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:13 am

Quoting Boeing777300 (Thread starter):
have all now visited Europe, previously being restricted to the American continent and Hawaiin routes and was wondering what the chances of the missing 777-200ER's being refurbished and visting Europe eventually. The batch in question is N210UA-N215UA inclusive, which to my knowledge have not yet been across the pond.

UAs actually increasing the number of domestic 777-200s from 6 frames to 9. UA uses them on flights from the lower 48 to Hawaii and onto GUM/Japan....probably no chance of ever seeing them in Europe.

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 2):
I suppose the 764 might make it but sCO does not have any to spare.

The 4 low-J 764's are being reconfigured to the standard lie flat configuration.
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DualQual
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:53 am

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 2):
I suppose the 764 might make it but sCO does not have any to spare.

The 764 can make ORD-HNL. It does EWR/IAD-HNL so ORD would not be an issue. With that said I think the plan (at least today) is for the domestic 777 to end up on HNL while the 764s are moved to Europe flying from ORD/IAD/EWR
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calpsafltskeds
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:15 am

While the 764 with new international configuration does not have F seating as the sUA772A with old international config, it has only 16 fewer total seats (22 fewer premium seats, but 6 more Y seats).

The 772A in Hawaiian config should hold about 100 seat more than the sCO 764 which have flown Hawaii and GUM until last year.

That's good trade for seat demand along with standardizing both fleets, isolating both fleets in East Coast (764) and HNL (772A). They have the same stated range and are both capable of EWR-HNL and TATL up to EWR-IST.

Expect the 9 772A Hawaiian configured aircraft to fly the following when completed:

1.) GUM-NRT X2
2.) HNL-GUM
3.) EWR-HNL
4.) IAD-HNL
5.) IAH-HNL
6.) ORD-HNL
7.) SFO-HNL
8.) DEN-HNL??
9.) SPARE (maybe ORD-OGG Sat.)

This would put 5-7 of the 9 units in HNL in the early evening for swap out. HNL could do light maint work, with SFO being the heavier maint shop.
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USAirALB
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:27 am

Not giving UA any ideas here, but I wonder if UA would be interested in converting the Domestic 777s into 3-4-3 in Economy.
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N505fx
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:33 am

Quoting USAirALB (Reply 6):
Not giving UA any ideas here, but I wonder if UA would be interested in converting the Domestic 777s into 3-4-3 in Economy.

I'm not giving A.net mods any ideas...but you should be banned from this site for life  
 
United1
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:37 am

Quoting N505FX (Reply 7):
Quoting USAirALB (Reply 6):
Not giving UA any ideas here, but I wonder if UA would be interested in converting the Domestic 777s into 3-4-3 in Economy.

I'm not giving A.net mods any ideas...but you should be banned from this site for life  

hehe.....now now

AFAIK 3*3*3 was the plan....I did hear a rumor at one point that it would retain 2*5*2 reusing the old international Y seats.
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airsmiles
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:11 pm

So which aircraft are now the 9 domestic B772's? 210-215 + which 3 others?

Thanks
 
flybhx764
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:04 pm

I am not sure if it was a 752 or a 763 in LHR on the night of 26/02/2013. I seen it parked up opposite gate 411. Looked like a 752 in the old United colours. I did not know they flew the UA aircrafts there, thought they only used the CO ones
 
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United787
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:53 pm

Quoting CALPSAFltSkeds (Reply 5):
That's good trade for seat demand along with standardizing both fleets, isolating both fleets in East Coast (764) and HNL (772A).

Has it been confirmed from UA that 3 international 772s are going domestic (HNL/GUM based) and the 4 764s AirMike (GUM based) are going international? If so, I think the UA widebody fleet will finally have a rational organization to it post merger...

Quoting USAirALB (Reply 6):
Not giving UA any ideas here, but I wonder if UA would be interested in converting the Domestic 777s into 3-4-3 in Economy.
Quoting N505FX (Reply 7):
I'm not giving A.net mods any ideas...but you should be banned from this site for life

Funniest thing I have heard on A-Net in a long time and I have heard some funny things!

Quoting airsmiles (Reply 9):
So which aircraft are now the 9 domestic B772's? 210-215 + which 3 others?

According to the thread below, three of these 7 will become the domestic birds and 4 still need the new international seats.
768/772/779/786/791/796/799

United/Cont. Existing Fleet Upgrade Status 15 (by iowaman Feb 19 2013 in Civil Aviation)
 
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Polot
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:18 pm

Quoting flybhx764 (Reply 10):
I am not sure if it was a 752 or a 763 in LHR on the night of 26/02/2013. I seen it parked up opposite gate 411. Looked like a 752 in the old United colours. I did not know they flew the UA aircrafts there, thought they only used the CO ones

If it was in old UA colors then it had to be a 767. No UA 757s are sent across the pond (many are not even ETOPS rated). It is the PMCO 757's that perform the transatlantic flying.
 
TW870
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:37 pm

Quoting United787 (Reply 11):

According to the thread below, three of these 7 will become the domestic birds and 4 still need the new international seats.
768/772/779/786/791/796/799

I believe 786, and certainly 791, 796, and 799 were all delivered as PW4084-powererd 777-200ERs, whereas 768, 772, and 779 - plus 210-215 - are PW4077-powered 777-200s. So is the idea that they might mix the 2-class fleet with both -200s and -200ERs?
 
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United787
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:50 pm

Quoting TW870 (Reply 13):
I believe 786, and certainly 791, 796, and 799 were all delivered as PW4084-powererd 777-200ERs, whereas 768, 772, and 779 - plus 210-215 - are PW4077-powered 777-200s. So is the idea that they might mix the 2-class fleet with both -200s and -200ERs?

So, is 768, 772 and 779 are converted to the 2-class domestic (HNL and GUM) fleet, then the 9 planes in that fleet would all be 777-200. Is that correct?
 
FriendlySkies
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:33 pm

Quoting United787 (Reply 14):
So, is 768, 772 and 779 are converted to the 2-class domestic (HNL and GUM) fleet, then the 9 planes in that fleet would all be 777-200. Is that correct?

I believe that was the conclusion we came to on these boards anyway. There are 3 772As (768, 772, 779) that haven't been converted to IPTE, so those would go to HI config. It makes absolutely no sense to put a 77E in domestic config.

799, one of the ERs, had just entered for IPTE when the 787s were grounded, so it was returned to service in the old config. I believe 786 is undergoing IPTE right now.
 
flybhx764
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:35 pm

Quoting Polot (Reply 12):
If it was in old UA colors then it had to be a 767. No UA 757s are sent across the pond (many are not even ETOPS rated). It is the PMCO 757's that perform the transatlantic flying.

I was thinking the same thing but I am very certain it was a 752.
 
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American 767
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:24 am

Quoting Polot (Reply 12):
It is the PMCO 757's that perform the transatlantic flying.

Right. And when you see United 757s you can tell which is which, because PMUA 757s are PW powered and PMCO 757s are RR powered. The PW engines have their nozzle coming out of the cowling, the RR engines don't. That's how I can tell a United 757 comes from Continental.
It is true that United (pre merger) never flew the 757 to Europe.

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rocket45
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:55 am

Bad news for the business traveler flying United SFO-GUM or MNL. The almost 8 hour HNL-GUM flight in business/first is the old 38 inch seat while fares match competitors fares offeringr 60 inch to flatbed seating.
 
United1
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:07 am

Quoting rocket45 (Reply 18):
Bad news for the business traveler flying United SFO-GUM or MNL. The almost 8 hour HNL-GUM flight in business/first is the old 38 inch seat while fares match competitors fares offeringr 60 inch to flatbed seating.

UA is removing the domestic first class seats and installing the old J class seats in their place. Should be a fairly comfortable ride.
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jayunited
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:17 am

Quoting FriendlySkies (Reply 15):
I believe that was the conclusion we came to on these boards anyway. There are 3 772As (768, 772, 779) that haven't been converted to IPTE, so those would go to HI config. It makes absolutely no sense to put a 77E in domestic config.

It does make a little since because supposedly the 4 CO 764 that are in HI Config will be converted to international service with CO lie flat businessfirst seats. So once all the conversions have been done there will be no 767-300 or 400 in domestic config and all the domestic 777 will get refreshed with all new cabins although UA has not to my knowledge release the details on the interior config. However, I suspect that UA will still use some 764's for HI service because a 777 on the IAD-HNL route is really to much capacity on that route I think EWR-HNL will remain a 764 as well even though it probably could support a 777 and DEN-HNL I think will either be a 763 (2 class) or 764 during the high season. I suspect SFO-HNL will probably go to 3 777 and a 753 a day during the high season. ORD, IAH will have 777 service daily LAX might get 777 service back while the other flights would be on a 753. The remaining 777 aircraft will be used for HNL-GUM and NRT-GUM routes which should leave UA with a few spares.
 
DualQual
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:26 am

Quoting flybhx764 (Reply 16):

If it was the United blue tulip paint, it was a 767. The PMUA 757s do not cross the Atlantic.
There's no known cure for stupid
 
AeroWesty
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:32 am

Quoting DualQual (Reply 21):
The PMUA 757s do not cross the Atlantic.

Correct. The reason why: Why United Can’t Use Its Own 757s to Fly to Europe
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Norcal773
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:45 am

Quoting USAirALB (Reply 6):
Not giving UA any ideas here, but I wonder if UA would be interested in converting the Domestic 777s into 3-4-3 in Economy.

Ooh no no no, please take that back! Have you been on a 10-abreast 777? It's absolutely horrible.

Quoting N505FX (Reply 7):
I'm not giving A.net mods any ideas...but you should be banned from this site for life

Ditto!
If you're going through hell, keep going
 
rocket45
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:16 am

Thanks United1 for the seat news. Will look forward to flying SFO-HNL-GUM -MNL when the J seats are flying, assuming they will have the 55-60 inch leg room.
 
United1
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:26 am

Quoting rocket45 (Reply 24):
Thanks United1 for the seat news. Will look forward to flying SFO-HNL-GUM -MNL when the J seats are flying, assuming they will have the 55-60 inch leg room.

Should be a good ride....I should put the caveat out there that UA has announced nothing formally but that is what has been reported on here by multiple people.
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Norcal773
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:40 am

Quoting United1 (Reply 19):
UA is removing the domestic first class seats and installing the old J class seats in their place. Should be a fairly comfortable ride.

That's good to know. I've avoided UA to MNL specifically for that reason, crappy J...thus have flown longer routes to enjoy the SQs and OZs of this world.
If you're going through hell, keep going
 
flybhx764
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 4:19 am

Quoting DualQual (Reply 21):

I contacted my friend at United and she told me that is was a 767 not a 757, it was the cancelled flight from Washington. Sorry for the confusion.
 
lhcvg
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 4:39 pm

Just clarify regarding the fate of the 764s, is it confirmed that they are in fact all going to be int'l configured in the future a la DL, or are we guessing/hoping? It does sound like a good plan.
 
TW870
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 5:22 pm

Quoting CALPSAFltSkeds (Reply 5):
Expect the 9 772A Hawaiian configured aircraft to fly the following when completed:

1.) GUM-NRT X2
2.) HNL-GUM
3.) EWR-HNL
4.) IAD-HNL
5.) IAH-HNL
6.) ORD-HNL
7.) SFO-HNL
8.) DEN-HNL??

Just a clarification on this. Can a PW4077-powered 777-222 make EWR-HNL fully loaded? I think FRA-ORD was about the longest flight sUA flew the standard -200 on, and EWR-HNL is about 500 nautical miles further. I know they had to wait for the -222ERs to make LHR-LAX, which is only 400 nautical miles further than EWR-HNL. Perhaps it was implied above that EWR-HNL is going to stay 767-400ER, but I am wondering if that is because of performance issues.
 
FriendlySkies
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:40 pm

Quoting LHCVG (Reply 28):

Just clarify regarding the fate of the 764s, is it confirmed that they are in fact all going to be int'l configured in the future a la DL, or are we guessing/hoping? It does sound like a good plan.

Nothing was publicly confirmed from United but reliable sources on this board have said the first of the 4 high density 764s is already in mod.
 
codc10
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:13 pm

Quoting FriendlySkies (Reply 30):
Nothing was publicly confirmed from United but reliable sources on this board have said the first of the 4 high density 764s is already in mod.

I believe the ship in HKG receiving the mods is N69063 (#3063), one of the sCO 76H birds in the 20/236 configuration.
 
lhcvg
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:23 pm

Quoting FriendlySkies (Reply 30):
Nothing was publicly confirmed from United but reliable sources on this board have said the first of the 4 high density 764s is already in mod.

Fair enough, thanks for the info! I must have missed that.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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RE: UA Domestic Widebodies To Europe

Thu Feb 28, 2013 11:53 pm

Quoting TW870 (Reply 29):
Just a clarification on this. Can a PW4077-powered 777-222 make EWR-HNL fully loaded? I think FRA-ORD was about the longest flight sUA flew the standard -200 on, and EWR-HNL is about 500 nautical miles further.

Not sure. The 777-200 has a 5240NM stated range and the 764ER has a 5625NM stated range. EWR-HNL is 4962NM, but there are heavy winds at times and ETOPS fuel has to be carried.

It may be depend on seasonal winds and cargo carried. I believe TATL flights carry more cargo than Hawaii flights, so maybe that's why FRA-ORD had an issue. I don't recall the 764 making fuel stops EWR-HNL, but maybe it has with heavy winds.

The 400NM difference may be enough to keep the 772 off EWR-HNL, but maybe UA would take minimal weight restrictions to carry close to 100 more pax than the 764.

On the other hand, keeping the 764 on HNL-EWR/IAD makes some sense as basically the HNL leg would be another spoke from the east coast hubs and have maintenance covered away from HNL.

In other words, the swap of configurations is a positive with UA and gives them plenty of options. The 764 lost only 14 total seats with the new configuration compared with the Hawaii configuration, but added 19 lie flat premium seats. As such it can be used on Hawaii profitably. The 772 adds about 80 seats vs. the current premium heavy 3 class configuration. More seats for Hawaii whether East Coast or a mix of West Coast/DEN/OGG, etc.
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