AA767400
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US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Thu Feb 28, 2013 6:52 pm

Good news to all parties involved. With this, a combined AA/US FA integration will be expedited, and smoother.

The tentative agreement was passed with 80% in favor. Here's to a new American!

http://afausairways.org/Eline/feb28_13.htm
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bobnwa
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Thu Feb 28, 2013 7:52 pm

Quoting AA767400 (Thread starter):
Good news to all parties involved. With this, a combined AA/US FA integration will be expedited, and smoother.

Does thia vote men 80% of the combined AA/US/HP flights voted? I would guess not!
 
ouboy79
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:09 pm

Quoting bobnwa (Reply 1):
Does thia vote men 80% of the combined AA/US/HP flights voted? I would guess not!

All your answers are in the first post, unless you are just trying to stir the pot.

Good news though to hear them getting this moved along pretty quickly.

Here is the breakdown by base:

http://ourafa.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/Voting-Results.jpg

[Edited 2013-02-28 12:15:31]
 
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lightsaber
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Thu Feb 28, 2013 8:24 pm

Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 2):

Here is the breakdown by base:

First, good news. However, I'm surprised by the CLT response...

Now for the merger with AA...


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bobnwa
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Thu Feb 28, 2013 10:44 pm

Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 2):
All your answers are in the first post, unless you are just trying to stir the pot.

I was serious in my question about the particpants in the vote about whether the HP FAnd the US FA were currently in the same union, since the pilots are not
 
chepos
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Thu Feb 28, 2013 11:22 pm

I sm surprised with CLT as well, they failed they TA last time by a wide margin. Many in the base are ex Piedmont and not happy with the whole no co-pairing thing. I guess the merger, the VEOP and the signing bonus turned them around this time.
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HPRamper
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 12:19 am

This is a huge step for US and bodes well for labor relations going forward.
 
ouboy79
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:52 am

Quoting bobnwa (Reply 4):
I was serious in my question about the particpants in the vote about whether the HP FAnd the US FA were currently in the same union, since the pilots are not

I believe the pilots are the only ones in a split union.
 
TW870
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 5:57 am

Quoting ouboy79 (Reply 7):
I believe the pilots are the only ones in a split union.

The flight attendants for America West and pre-merger USAirways were both in AFA. The constitution of AFA guarantees date-of-hire seniority. So the outstanding contractual issues have been about aligning wages, benefits, and work rules across the two carriers - which have now been completely solved.

The pilots for America West and USAirways were also in the same union - ALPA. But ALPA's constitution does not have language that guarantees date of hire seniority. Thus, if the individual groups from the two merging carriers can't agree on an integration plan, they must go to arbitration. If that fails, they go to court. The seniority dispute is what has made the integration particularly troublesome at HP-US.

Overall, being in the same union does not guarantee a quick integration - though the AFA date-of-hire seniority policy absolutely helps. And though the McCaskill-Bond law - which came out of the American-TWA fiasco - guarantees that seniority integrations must be "fair and equitable" (citing the old language from the Allegheny-Mohawk LPPs), there can still be extremely arduous wrangling amid defining "fair and equitable" - a la the USAirways pilots.
 
YYZbound
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 1:31 pm

Quoting chepos (Reply 5):
Many in the base are ex Piedmont and not happy with the whole no co-pairing thing

Can you elaborate on the "no-copairing" thing? At AA I believe that term means something different than at US
 
chepos
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 2:49 pm

Co-pairing at US means, same crew in the front and in the back from the beginning all through your trip. PHX base does not have co-pairing. AA does not have this either except on some international long hauls.
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luv2fly
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 2:53 pm

Quoting chepos (Reply 10):
Co-pairing at US means, same crew in the front and in the back from the beginning all through your trip. PHX base does not have co-pairing. AA does not have this either except on some international long hauls.

I thought the co-paring was US and HP FA's did not work together on the same flights as crews? Has that been resolved.
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chepos
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 2:59 pm

People can start transfering from an "east" base to PHX and vice versa starting in May, but integration per se will not happen until a couple of months. Co pairing does not mean west and east f/a's flying together, it has to do with the flight deck crew and cabin crew flying together all throughout the trip, this was only in effect in the "east" bases.

[Edited 2013-03-01 07:03:19]

[Edited 2013-03-01 07:04:30]

[Edited 2013-03-01 07:05:04]

[Edited 2013-03-01 07:05:21]
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luv2fly
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:05 pm

So can East and West FA's now fly together?
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chepos
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:11 pm

Not yet, an "east" F/A can transfer to PHX, however, he/she will become part of the PHX base. However, for the time being you will not see PHX based and CLT based f/a's working the same flight. If you transfer to PHX you will become PHX based and can only fly west metal, the same goes for a west person who chooses to transfer to an east base. If today you are PHX based and choose to transfer to CLT you will become part of the CLT base and will only fly east metal operated flights. A tad bit confusing to explain. Co-pairing btw flight deck and cabin crew is expected to end in October, I believe. As mentioned above base transfers will start taking place in May.

[Edited 2013-03-01 07:12:15]
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brilondon
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:24 pm

What real choice do they have if they did not accept the TA?
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luv2fly
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:41 pm

Quoting chepos (Reply 14):
Not yet, an "east" F/A can transfer to PHX, however, he/she will become part of the PHX base. However, for the time being you will not see PHX based and CLT based f/a's working the same flight. If you transfer to PHX you will become PHX based and can only fly west metal, the same goes for a west person who chooses to transfer to an east base. If today you are PHX based and choose to transfer to CLT you will become part of the CLT base and will only fly east metal operated flights. A tad bit confusing to explain. Co-pairing btw flight deck and cabin crew is expected to end in October, I believe. As mentioned above base transfers will start taking place in May.

Hasn't this created conflict between East and West. I mean East has more International to pick from where West has short hops like Mexico.
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YYZbound
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 3:52 pm

Quoting chepos (Reply 10):
AA does not have this either except on some international long hauls.

At the LGA base at AA you will see a co-pairing occasionally on some 3-day trips still with the Super-80. It's rare but it still happens
 
luv2fly
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 4:04 pm

Quoting chepos (Reply 10):
AA does not have this either except on some international long hauls.

AA's South American based FA's don't ever fly with the USA based ones and they can only operate flights into and out of MIA.
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AA767400
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 4:59 pm

Quoting luv2fly (Reply 18):
AA's South American based FA's don't ever fly with the USA based ones and they can only operate flights into and out of MIA.

He meant co-pairing pilots and flight attendants on the same trip.

Piedmont had a rather antiquated rule in their contract that stated they had to fly with each other throughout an entire flight sequence. This lives on today at their CLT base. Many senior FAs didn't like the idea of change, and one of those changes was separating from the pilots, hence keeping co-paring in their contract. That will be gone with this new tentative agreement.

Frankly, most FAs today would rather not see the same pilot every flight leg. I would even go as far to say that most FAs don't really want to interact much with them. Especially if it's a male FA. So the whole co-pairing rule seems rather bizarre to many.

Now let the retirement flood gates open, and let these people move on to a quiet garden, and in turn bring in new faces. It's been too long!
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YYZbound
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 5:36 pm

chepos, are there a lot of US west f/a's that want to transfer to the east bases?
 
chepos
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 8:12 pm

Quoting YYZbound (Reply 20):

chepos, are there a lot of US west f/a's that want to transfer to the east bases?

Some do, the ones who commute from the east to the west or want to fly TATL, however, many in this base live here so I do not expect many PHX based to transfer to CLT/DCA/PHL. That being said, we have many ex-PSA "current east" who either live here or commute from California to the east coast, you will see some of them transfer to PHX. Some ex-Psa are very senior and hold TLV/FRA/FCO and other desirable trips out of PHL, those will stay put in PHL. But many/most from the PHX base will stay put.
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YYZbound
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 8:16 pm

Quoting chepos (Reply 21):
Some do, the ones who commute from the east to the west or want to fly TATL, however, many in this base live here so I do not expect many PHX based to transfer to CLT/DCA/PHL. That being said, we have many ex-PSA "current east" who either live here or commute from California to the east coast, you will see some of them transfer to PHX. Some ex-Psa are very senior and hold TLV/FRA/FCO and other desirable trips out of PHL, those will stay put in PHL. But many/most from the PHX base will stay put.

Interesting. USAir was actually my first airline....and to give you an idea of how long ago that was....I worked the BAE-146!
 
chepos
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Fri Mar 01, 2013 9:22 pm

Oh wow, those were retirred in the early 90's (ex-PSA birds). Full circle, I guess. We have a few ex-HP who were once with AA.
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b727fa
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:43 pm

Quoting TW870 (Reply 8):
And though the McCaskill-Bond law - which came out of the American-TWA fiasco - guarantees that seniority integrations must be "fair and equitable" (citing the old language from the Allegheny-Mohawk LPPs), there can still be extremely arduous wrangling amid defining "fair and equitable" -

We even had a huge go around with F&E using strict Date of Hire...Training credit, adjusted date, DOS, etc. But at least no folded skinny pieces of metal piercing through two sheets of paper here...  
My comments/opinions are my own and are not to be construed as the opinion(s) of my employer.
 
gen2stew
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Mon Mar 04, 2013 3:02 am

Was a "buy out or paid separation" offered? If so, are there quite a few who would want to take it?
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chepos
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RE: US FAs Vote Yes To New TA.

Mon Mar 04, 2013 3:38 am

Quoting GEN2STEW (Reply 25):
Was a "buy out or paid separation" offered? If so, are there quite a few who would want to take it?

Yes, who knows how many will take it. Many say they will, at the end of the day only time will tell. I am sure many of the very senior mamas voted for it just because of the VEOP.
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