RCS763AV
Topic Author
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### The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

So to start this new topic I post the news on Aviancataca's 2012 profit, which jumped 73% to 195 million USD:

http://www.portafolio.co/negocios/ut...des-la-firma-aviancataca-crecen-73

To a good discussion,

RCS763AV
Topic Author
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### The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

The master plan for BOG:

It includes an extension of the north runway to 4700 meters. Is that necessary? Wouldn't the aircraft reach their maximum tire speeds before being able to use the whole length of it?

trent772
Posts: 137
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:08 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 1):being able to use the whole length of it?

Airplanes never use the whole length of the runway for take-off, the length of the runway must be enough to accelerate to V1 loose an engine, abort the take-off and stop within the paved surface using wheel brakes only or, accelerate to V1 loose an engine, continue the take-off and cross the opposite threshold at 35ft AGL.

That's why you see airplanes lifting off from the runway at about 2/3 of the length most of the time.

 Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 1):Wouldn't the aircraft reach their maximum tire speeds

They indeed would, at BOG's elevation this plays a big role when calculating MTOW, also with the higher speeds another limitation comes into play, Brake Energy, this is the capability of the wheel brakes to stop the airplane when it reaches its maximum kinetic energy accelerate-stop speed, brake energy is typically the limiting factor in high/moderately hot conditions, on long runways, with lower flap settings.

IMO the plan to add 900m to the northern runway lacks an in-depth investigation on the matter, I think 300m should do the trick, but who cares? Why stretch the runway 300m for a price if you can stretch it 900m for 50 times the same price?

The master plan is nice and all but it won't be finished in our lifetimes.

One question though, will the 900m be added to the western (13L) threshold or the eastern one (31R)?

[Edited 2013-03-11 23:06:53]
Pedaling Squares…

A388
Posts: 7497
Joined: Mon May 21, 2001 3:48 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

Nice and clear explanation trent772, thanks

RCS763AV, a tip when starting a new thread would be to put the number of the thread at the end of the thread title so it is easier to find, just as all other country threads do. I didn't see this thread because the "13" was mentioned within the front part of the title. Even so, thanks for starting it.

About AV's new livery, is there more news? It is supposed to be unveiled this month, right? I have a scale model of the AV 787 where you see the airline titles slightly larger on the aircraft then it is now. Could this be the only change to the new revised livery? I think such a change would be enough. As the saying goes: "Why fix it, when it isn't broke"

A388

RCS763AV
Topic Author
Posts: 3680
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:22 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting trent772 (Reply 2):IMO the plan to add 900m to the northern runway lacks an in-depth investigation on the matter, I think 300m should do the trick, but who cares? Why stretch the runway 300m for a price if you can stretch it 900m for 50 times the same price?

That's exactly what I thought. 900m is way too much.

 Quoting trent772 (Reply 2):The master plan is nice and all but it won't be finished in our lifetimes.

I think we will, the new legal framework (public-private association law) and reinforced institutional forces that the Santos government has taken time to put in place will surely get the project going much faster than the inept Pastrana and Uribe governments, at a much lower price too. That said, this is still Colombia so I don't expect it to be ready in 15 years, more like 25-30.

 Quoting trent772 (Reply 2):One question though, will the 900m be added to the western (13L) threshold or the eastern one (31R)?

Western of course. It would require a lot of valuable land inside the city to extend to the east.

 Quoting A388 (Reply 3):About AV's new livery, is there more news? It is supposed to be unveiled this month, right?

The week May 20 is what they're saying.

On other news, CM Colombia keep reinforcing their ADZ operations after the addition of PEI, the CLO-ADZ route goes from 7 to 12 weekly flights starting may 31st.

CM7466 CLO0001 %u2013 0156ADZ E90 x47
CM7464 CLO1157 %u2013 1352ADZ E90 D
CM7467 ADZ0226 %u2013 0426CLO E90 x47
CM7465 ADZ1225 %u2013 1425CLO E90 x67
CM7465 ADZ1634 %u2013 1834CLO E90 67

They've certainly found their domestic niche in ADZ, they seem to be making money off of it.

 Quoting A388 (Reply 3):RCS763AV, a tip when starting a new thread would be to put the number of the thread at the end of the thread title so it is easier to find, just as all other country threads do.

Or maybe just take a closer look. Many of the other country threads have a phrase behind the number and people keep responding to them.

av757
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2004 5:49 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

Avianca chooses LEAP-1A engines from CFM for its A320NEO fleet.

http://www.cfmaeroengines.com/press/...with-cfm-valued-at-2-7-billion/690

AV757

A388
Posts: 7497
Joined: Mon May 21, 2001 3:48 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 4):Or maybe just take a closer look. Many of the other country threads have a phrase behind the number and people keep responding to them.

No matter how you look at it, we can all agree that it is much easier to find when the number is at the end, unless we all read from right to left!!!!

A388

troest
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:08 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

Avianca initiates BOG-MAD service increase from 10 to 14 weekly effective 17MAY13. Initially planned from 30APR13 but got postponed.

AV026 BOG1447 – 0725+1MAD 330 D
AV010 BOG2135 – 1415+1MAD 330 D

AV027 MAD0925 – 1300BOG 330 D
AV011 MAD1720 – 2054BOG 330 D

troest
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:08 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting trent772 (Reply 2):IMO the plan to add 900m to the northern runway lacks an in-depth investigation on the matter, I think 300m should do the trick, but who cares? Why stretch the runway 300m for a price if you can stretch it 900m for 50 times the same price?

Arrivals:
Larger planes will have more length to brake on a wet runway. Planes come in at a higher speed on high altitude airports as you mentioned than those at sea level.

Departures:

 Quoting trent772 (Reply 2):One question though, will the 900m be added to the western (13L) threshold or the eastern one (31R)?

It would be added on the western threshold.

[Edited 2013-03-12 16:23:50]

SJOtoLIR
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Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:41 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 4):CM Colombia keep reinforcing their ADZ operations after the addition of PEI, the CLO-ADZ route goes from 7 to 12 weekly flights starting may 31st. CM7466 CLO0001 %u2013 0156ADZ E90 x47 CM7464 CLO1157 %u2013 1352ADZ E90 D CM7467 ADZ0226 %u2013 0426CLO E90 x47 CM7465 ADZ1225 %u2013 1425CLO E90 x67 CM7465 ADZ1634 %u2013 1834CLO E90 67

Speaking about their international routes, CM BOG-CUN goes from 2x to 4x weekly from June 15th and CM PTY-HAV goes from 1x to 3x weekly from June 16th.

Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"

RCS763AV
Topic Author
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### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 9):Speaking about their international routes, CM BOG-CUN goes from 2x to 4x weekly from June 15th and CM PTY-HAV goes from 1x to 3x weekly from June 16th.

Indeed. That was discussed on the previous thread. Thanks.

Brazil is studying giving their support to Avianca in the acquisition of TAP. They suggest the bidding be done via the AviancaTaca holding which is only focused on aviation and not the Synergy Group which has a number of different interests:

http://www.latercera.com/noticia/neg...n-la-compra-de-aerolinea-tap.shtml

This is great news. AV and TP will make great partners across the atlantic.

trent772
Posts: 137
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:08 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting troest (Reply 8): Arrivals: Larger planes will have more length to brake on a wet runway. Planes come in at a higher speed on high altitude airports as you mentioned than those at sea level.

Nice graphs!! Now I clearly understand why LH Cargo won't start the approach into BOG with a wet runway, I've heard them request a hold when the brake actions is less than good.

I understand the landing, it makes perfect sense having the chance to land airplanes into BOG at MLW, more cargo, what's not to like?.
I strongly disagree with the Take-off graph as it clearly does not take into account the elevation, and if it somehow does it is not taking into account the ground speed during take-off, at sea level indicated airspeed equals ground speed if the wind is calm, at 8360ft above sea level, ground speed is close to 20% higher than indicated airspeed so you would be getting awfully close to the tire speed limit with a rotation speed of 155kt, airplanes are already reaching these speeds with the present runway without a problem, no airplane out of BOG is field restricted rendering the runway extension useless, the problem with BOG is the second segment climb due to the surrounding terrain.

I had a chance to see a render claiming it was the final thing, all I can say is EPIC FAIL!!!! (Just as I predicted  )
it was going around facebook, maybe someone else has seen it?

 Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 4):the inept Pastrana and Uribe governments

At last, we agree on something
Pedaling Squares…

A388
Posts: 7497
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### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting trent772 (Reply 11):Quoting A388 (Reply 3): About AV's new livery, is there more news? I had a chance to see a render claiming it was the final thing, all I can say is EPIC FAIL!!!! (Just as I predicted ) it was going around facebook, maybe someone else has seen it?

Now I'm getting more interested, someone please post a picture of this rendering...

A388

troest
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:08 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting A388 (Reply 12):Now I'm getting more interested, someone please post a picture of this rendering...
 Quoting trent772 (Reply 11):I had a chance to see a render claiming it was the final thing, all I can say is EPIC FAIL!!!!

This is what I could find. I personally don't like the "Avianca" name written so big on the side fuselage. Prefer the same size as it is used today. The new colors.... I still don't like. What do you think?

[Edited 2013-03-13 10:01:04]

A388
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Joined: Mon May 21, 2001 3:48 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting troest (Reply 13):This is what I could find. I personally don't like the "Avianca" name written so big on the side fuselage. Prefer the same size as it is used today. The new colors.... I still don't like. What do you think?

Is this really the official new livery? It doesn't look official. In any case, I see they have copied the eagle that the new AA livery has, only difference is that this eagle is the AV eagle or condor. All in all, if this really is the new livery, then damn. Bad bad bad. Changing a corporate livery totally as AA did, is very risky and the chances of it firing back is much bigger than it is a success. AA did a great job, even though I didn't like it at all at first. The new AV livery to me is different and I think the current livery is way much better.

A388

troest
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:08 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting A388 (Reply 14):Is this really the official new livery? It doesn't look official. In any case, I see they have copied the eagle that the new AA livery has, only difference is that this eagle is the AV eagle or condor.

Not sure and hope not. But this one is circulating on the web.

AA's new livery reminds me of Cubana de Aviación.

The ninth AV A330 N280AV will arrive from TLS to MDE on Friday 22MAR13 painted in all white. Maybe this one will be painted is Star Alliance colors or in the new livery. Hopefully not like the one posted.

[Edited 2013-03-13 10:39:30]

Summa767
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### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting troest (Reply 13):The new colors.... I still don't like. What do you think?

I like the tail: A red parrot (Taca) perched, with its long tail going under the fuselage (so one would be able to identify from underneath).
The condor (Avianca) has been left to the engines and logo. 2 birds in one plane. What I don't like is the large Avianca title in all that fuselage whiteness. It looks cheap. If only there was a counterbalancing motif towards the front and smaller titles, it would look better.

The design is clearly a compromise to include both TA, AV and cost. But there is room to go the extra mile.
If it stays like shown, I trust that, at least, the colours will look better on the metal.

 Quoting troest (Reply 15):The ninth AV A330 N280AV will arrive from TLS to MDE on Friday 22MAR13 painted in all white. Maybe this one will be painted is Star Alliance colors or in the new livery

We'll have to see. It might well be the new livery.

RICARIZA
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### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

I doubt (hope not) that's the final livery. I expect something better from AV taking into account they currently have a successful and beautiful and fairly new livery.. I expect to see something closer to the current livery with some TA influence...

I really hope this is not the livery, this will be a complete fail !!
I miss ACES, I am proud of AVIANCA & I am loyal to AMERICAN

MEA-707
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### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

How is EasyFly doing? They fly about 10 Jetstream-41 props. I read somewhere they temporarily ceased operations on 31 January but further research showed the operate as normal.
nobody has ever died from hard work, but why take the risk?

RCS763AV
Topic Author
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### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting MEA-707 (Reply 18):How is EasyFly doing? They fly about 10 Jetstream-41 props.

They're actually making money, and they fly more than the jetstreams. the fleet is constantly expanding with them opening new bases every couple of years (right now the bases are BOG, EOH and BGA with BAQ consolidating as one too).

 Quoting MEA-707 (Reply 18): I read somewhere they temporarily ceased operations on 31 January but further research showed the operate as normal.

There is an issue and it's the fact that 40% of the airline was owned by a capital fund called Interbolsa that resulted in bankruptcy due to illegal and irresponsible practices which was a major scandal in the country. It is a major concern and no one still knows what's going to happen with this share of the company. I didn't know they had suspended operations on January 31 but it's probably due to that.

Avianca
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### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 4):They've certainly found their domestic niche in ADZ, they seem to be making money off of it.

no wonder with such high fares!

cheers
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia

SCL767
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### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

Chile's DGAC recently approved LAN Colombia's AOC and the carrier is now permitted to operate flights between Colombia and Chile. LAN Colombia is currently the only LATAM affiliate carrier that does not operate into Chile. LAN Colombia's COO stated that the carrier plans on launching a daily non-stop service between BOG and SCL by 01JUL13 utilizing the B-767-316ER:
LAN COLOMBIA OPERARÁ EN CHILE

SCL767
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Joined: Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:25 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

Also starting in June, LAN Colombia will increase frequencies on the BOG-ADZ, BOG-CTG, BOG-CUC, and BOG-SMR routes.

RCS763AV
Topic Author
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### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting SCL767 (Reply 22):Also starting in June, LAN Colombia will increase frequencies on the BOG-ADZ, BOG-CTG, BOG-CUC, and BOG-SMR routes.

CUC, SMR and ADZ I imagine will be going from three to four daily flights, and BOG-CTG to six daily flights?

On other news, Avianca are adding a 7th daily flight to SMR, which will depart at 22h from BOG, RON is SMR and come back at 6am. This will enable the city to be connected to the international night arrival bank and the morning departure bank, which wasn't possible before, meaning Santa Marta will have much better connections to North America. Flight is to be operated by the Airbus A318.

SJOtoLIR
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### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

Does "Cubana de Aviación" still operate the BOG-HAV sector using their own planes?
Any word concerning to the low amount of weekly frequencies served by either AV BOG-HAV and CM BOG-HAV.

Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"

SCL767
Posts: 2812
Joined: Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:25 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 24):Does "Cubana de Aviación" still operate the BOG-HAV sector using their own planes?

On a weekly basis:
CU348 08:15 HAV 10:30 BOG TU-204
CU349 12:00 BOG 16:45 HAV TU-204

 Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 24):Any word concerning to the low amount of weekly frequencies served by either AV BOG-HAV and CM BOG-HAV.

Well there are more frequencies between LIM and HAV compared to BOG-HAV...

SCL767
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Joined: Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:25 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

With the introduction of the B-767-316ERs into its fleet; LAN Colombia has implemented new schedules on the BOG-GRU and BOG-MIA routes:
Boeing 767, una nueva experiencia

LAN Colombia is also the first Colombian carrier to offer full flat seats that recline 100% horizontally in its Business Class.

Summa767
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Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 1:30 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

Route News:
jetBlue will go double on BOG-MCO from 20th June. The current flight will change schedule to make for a more efficient operation.

AV has programmed its flights BOG-SJU, which will be 3 x weekly from 17th July: Wed, Fri & Sun
Departure from BOG at 2.23 pm, arriving back at 9pm.
These are timed so that connections from the south of the continent, such as SCL, EZE, GRU, GIG among others that arrive at BOG near midday can easily connect onward to SJO, and similarly in the other direction.

RCS763AV
Topic Author
Posts: 3680
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### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 24):Any word concerning to the low amount of weekly frequencies served by either AV BOG-HAV and CM BOG-HAV.
 Quoting SCL767 (Reply 25): Well there are more frequencies between LIM and HAV compared to BOG-HAV...

For real? That's your what you have to say?

The amount of frequencies is indeed low, but this was an untapped market which was being milked by CM via PTY at sky high fares (CU's sole weekly flight was, until about three years ago, the only connection between Colombia and Cuba), and just around a year ago did Avianca introduce their flights. As the route matures the airlines will keep on adding service, for example, CM Colombia will soon be going from 1 to 3 weekly flights on the route, and Avianca is flying it 4 times a week. I'm sure that gradually (like it happened in LIM), frequency will be improving.

 Quoting summa767 (Reply 27):jetBlue will go double on BOG-MCO from 20th June. The current flight will change schedule to make for a more efficient operation.

That route seems to be doing very well. Both operators are enjoying healthy O/D plus sizeable connecting traffic at both ends. Could we see B6 surpass NK as the second largest US carrier to Colombia this year?

 Quoting summa767 (Reply 27):AV has programmed its flights BOG-SJU, which will be 3 x weekly from 17th July: Wed, Fri & Sun Departure from BOG at 2.23 pm, arriving back at 9pm.

Great! This flight will do well for sure. Now waiting for confirmation on CUN. I read somewhere that MAR and LET are still doubtful for the summer timetable.

 Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 23):CUC, SMR and ADZ I imagine will be going from three to four daily flights, and BOG-CTG to six daily flights?

So I was checking LAN.com and,

BOG-BGA is not being served fully at 4x daily, but rather 25x a week.
BOG-SMR is going from 2 to 3 daily flights (Aires had three daily flights so this is actually restoring previous service levels)
BOG-CUC also only shows 2 dailies when Aires managed to operate 3 daily rotations.
BOG-ADZ is showing two daily flights on certain days of the week and one daily flight on others (again, Aires had three daily flights every day to the Island, so depending on what the upgrade will be this will just be a return to previous levels or even less).

I thought LAN's expansions would be more aggressive. All I can say is I'm not impressed, but at leadt they're returning to the previous schedule offered by Aires on those routes.

Also, interesting review from CAPA on the prospects of the colombian domestic market. It's impressive how Viva is now the third largest operator with 9% of the market which is concentrated in Avianca with 61% (dangerously growing to an almost monopolistic share) and LAN maintaining the same 19% they had last year, with Copa and Satena being the main loosers to Viva, and the only airlines that actually lost pax. Copa's strategy is well known but SATENA's woes continue to trouble the state company. ADA and Easyfly grew their pax numbers too:

http://centreforaviation.com/analysi...y-vivacolombia-avianca--lan-101354

Summa767
Posts: 1799
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 1:30 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 28):That route seems to be doing very well. Both operators are enjoying healthy O/D plus sizeable connecting traffic at both ends. Could we see B6 surpass NK as the second largest US carrier to Colombia this year?

Could wel happen. NK has really stagnated in Colombia after a fast rise. We never heard any more about the plan for a small hub at BOG.
I forgot to mention that jetBlue's double daily MCO-BOG appears to be only for the peak season, until the end of August.

RCS763AV
Topic Author
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### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting summa767 (Reply 29):NK has really stagnated in Colombia after a fast rise. We never heard any more about the plan for a small hub at BOG.

They have indeed, but it's because they have stopped growing at FLL after having found a very lucrative market at other US fortress hubs that have very high fares. I don't think the mini BOG hub is going to be a reality now.

 Quoting summa767 (Reply 29):I forgot to mention that jetBlue's double daily MCO-BOG appears to be only for the peak season, until the end of August.

Makes sense. In the future we might see it become year-round.

NK's Colombia schedule:

BOG-FLL daily A320
MDE-FLL 6xw-daily A320
CTG-FLL 4xw-daily A319
AXM-FLL 2xw-4xw A319

B6's:

BOG-MCO 1x-2x daily A320
BOG-FLL 1x daily A320
MDE-FLL 1x daily A320
CTG-JFK 3x weekly A320

We'll see what happens.

av757
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2004 5:49 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

Avianca will do today the delivery ferry flights from LFBO/TLS of its tenth A330-243 registration N280AV/cn1400 which is in an all white livery to SKRG/RNG, and Tampa freighter number two A330-243F registration N331QT/cn1380 which is inTampa livery to SKBO/BOG.

AV757

airliner777
Posts: 416
Joined: Thu May 25, 2000 6:38 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting av757 (Reply 31):Avianca will do today the delivery ferry flights from LFBO/TLS of its tenth A330-243 registration N280AV/cn1400 which is in an all white livery to SKRG/RNG, and Tampa freighter number two A330-243F registration N331QT/cn1380 which is inTampa livery to SKBO/BOG

Great news for both carriers!!!

777jaah
Posts: 852
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2006 11:38 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting Avianca (Reply 20):was owned by a capital fund called Interbolsa

Not to be picky, but Interbolsa was more of a financial holding, not a capital fund, like Grupo Aval.

 Quoting summa767 (Reply 29):It's impressive how Viva is now the third largest operator with 9%

AV has always said that Viva is the real competitor in the colombian market. I guess they were right. Personally, I'm glad they're doing fine and hope they keep growing.

 Quoting troest (Reply 13):I personally don't like the "Avianca" name written so big on the side fuselage

Personally, I don't like anything on it.

av757
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2004 5:49 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

It has been confirmed that A330-243 N280AV/cn1400 will be painted in the white/black Star Alliance livery next week before starting regular operation sometime next month while the paperwork for its Colombian Operational Permit is in process. So far there is no news when the first aircraft is going to be painted in the new livery of the Avianca Holding.

AV757

troest
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 2:08 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

Found this from other forums:

The Colombian ministry of (proteccion social) social protection gave LAN Colombia a sanction effective 13 march 2013 for not respecting Colombian union laws. The sanction came after the unfortunate situation facing Colombian flight crews in LAN Colombia.

http://www.dinero.com/empresas/articulo/confirman-sancion-lan/172475

falkerker
Posts: 167
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:53 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

Dont bang me if this question is ignorant (perhaps it is just me talking with my desire) but is it aerodinamically possible for large airlines (EK comes to mind) to expand their operations into BOG. I mean, if we assumed just for a second they were VERY interested in coming, would it be possible from a physics point of view for a current-gen airplane to travel BOG-DXB, for instance? I know DXB-BOG is possible, but due to the altitude, would the return trip be feasible or must we keep travelling via MAD or LAX to reach Asia?

777jaah
Posts: 852
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2006 11:38 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting falkerker (Reply 36):would the return trip be feasible or must we keep travelling via MAD or LAX to reach Asia?

From what I've read in this forums, fue to max tire speed, it won't be possible, despite runway lenght. IMHO, the best way we could get a direct link to Asia, is with a ME carrier such as QR or EK and through a stop in CCS, just like the old days when AF and other european carriers used to serve BOG.

 Quoting troest (Reply 35):The sanction came after the unfortunate situation facing Colombian flight crews in LAN Colombia.

Nothing different than a situation poorly managed by management. I bet they already fixed that, I can't think of LA as a company actively trying to violate any labour laws where it operates.

trent772
Posts: 137
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:08 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting falkerker (Reply 36):would it be possible from a physics point of view for a current-gen airplane to travel BOG-DXB

Well, it could make it from a physics stand point, it would have to be empty though, and that would be a disaster from a business stand point.
 Quoting troest (Reply 35):The sanction came after the unfortunate situation facing Colombian flight crews in LAN Colombia.

This happened a while back, some pilots were wrongfully fired just for being a part of the pilots union, the other pilots that were not unionized were all given a pay raise, all very clear violations.
I'm glad the lawsuit has been ruled in favor of the pilots involved.

They fixed it because they were ordered to by a court of law, otherwise things would have stayed the way they were.
Aires's management was basically trying to make a point, be a part of any union and suffer or not unionized? Great! Enjoy your stay.
Thankfully they were stopped in their tracks.

 Quoting 777jaah (Reply 37):I can't think of LA as a company actively trying to violate any labour laws where it operates.

You'd be amazed at how many labour laws companies try to break or violate while looking the other way or just playing dumb as if they didn't know, especially in Colombia.

And now with the new and upcoming "reforma tributaria" pilots in Colombia are really going to get their butts kicked.
Pedaling Squares…

trent772
Posts: 137
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:08 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

A couple of weeks back Aires finally changed its callsign to "LanColombia" thus effectively ending 31 years of Aires history.

May LAN Colombia last another 31 years and a lot more.
Pedaling Squares…

A388
Posts: 7497
Joined: Mon May 21, 2001 3:48 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

Is there more information on AV's new livery? What is the final look of the new livery and when will the first aircraft be painted and which aircraft will be painted first? I would assume the Star Alliance A320 with the sharklets (N477AV?) and the latest Star Alliance A330-200 recently delivered to AV (N280AV?)?

I saw a nice photo of the new check-in area in the new terminal building on the jetphotos website, very impressive!!!

A388

777jaah
Posts: 852
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2006 11:38 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting trent772 (Reply 39):And now with the new and upcoming "reforma tributaria" pilots in Colombia are really going to get their butts kicked.

Come on! That's a really unfair, every employee in Colombia wil get their butts kicked!!!

Has anyone seen any f the works being done at BOG regarding the new control tower?

RCS763AV
Topic Author
Posts: 3680
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:22 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

While talking about the renovation works being finished in CTG by SACSA and in BAQ by Aerocivil themselves, the director of the organism has spilled out that AA is actively studying starting flights to both destinations. BAQ would be re-started after they left the city in 2003:

Interesting news. Both cities are crying for more US service, specially Barranquilla.

trent772
Posts: 137
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:08 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting 777jaah (Reply 41):Has anyone seen any f the works being done at BOG regarding the new control tower?

I don't think they've started yet. I'm guessing that to have a clear view of the entire complex the best place to put the new tower is where CATAM is today? Or have they said where this new tower will be located?

 Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 42):works being finished in CTG by SACSA

When will these be finished? Haven't they taken a long time to finish? Just the other day I thought that it would have been probably better to just make a new terminal on the western side and extend the runway some 300m to the south, just a thought.
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RCS763AV
Topic Author
Posts: 3680
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:22 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting trent772 (Reply 43):When will these be finished? Haven't they taken a long time to finish?

They're finished.

 Quoting trent772 (Reply 43):Just the other day I thought that it would have been probably better to just make a new terminal on the western side and extend the runway some 300m to the south, just a thought.

You mean the eastern side? Also, due to environmental concerns with the ciénaga surrounding the airport, the runway extension wouldn't be an easy task, not to mention much more expensive.

The new renovations will surely be too small in a couple of years though, it won't 2020 as they say, more like 2016.

trent772
Posts: 137
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:08 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

They are? I was there last week and they surely don't look like they're done, I saw a lot of cardboard walls and unfinished work, I sincerely hope they haven't finished.

 Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 44):environmental concerns with the ciénaga

The Cienaga is dead, I'm sure the tree huggers will disagree but it has been for awhile, sure it would be more expensive but the task of reclaiming land from a body of water is sort of a simple one, just ask the Dutch and the Japanese.
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tavong
Posts: 707
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2001 1:59 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting trent772 (Reply 45):The Cienaga is dead, I'm sure the tree huggers will disagree but it has been for awhile, sure it would be more expensive but the task of reclaiming land from a body of water is sort of a simple one, just ask the Dutch and the Japanese.

Or Bogotá, remember that Bogotá was more or less a lake before the city is now. I´m not a geologist, but if i remember correctly more or less 50% of the city was occupied by water boies beofer the city´s expansion came. It´s not the same that has been done in Japan or Holland, but i think that here in Colombia we also have some experience on that (even if it was more "corruption-related or invasion-related" by politics that an actual real plan. In fact, mucho of the actual grow of the city is from "reclaimed" land.

 Quoting falkerker (Reply 36):Dont bang me if this question is ignorant (perhaps it is just me talking with my desire) but is it aerodinamically possible for large airlines (EK comes to mind) to expand their operations into BOG. I mean, if we assumed just for a second they were VERY interested in coming, would it be possible from a physics point of view for a current-gen airplane to travel BOG-DXB, for instance? I know DXB-BOG is possible, but due to the altitude, would the return trip be feasible or must we keep travelling via MAD or LAX to reach Asia?

Well AFAIK EK was (is?) interested in BOG, i really think that an A340-500 could do the route with not that much restriction (but still restricted), i think that if EK really wants to come to BOG it would need to make a stop in Europe to make the route with more cargo and PAX, thus making more money that doing BOG-DXB non stop.

Just my two cents.

Gus
SKBO
Just put me on any modern airliner and i will be happy, give me more star alliance miles and i will be a lot happier.

jfk777
Posts: 6194
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

is LAN ever going to fly to Miami from BAQ or CTG ?

RCS763AV
Topic Author
Posts: 3680
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:22 am

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

 Quoting trent772 (Reply 45):They are? I was there last week and they surely don't look like they're done, I saw a lot of cardboard walls and unfinished work, I sincerely hope they haven't finished.

They were handed to Aerocivil on the date the article was published. They're done.

 Quoting trent772 (Reply 45):The Cienaga is dead, I'm sure the tree huggers will disagree but it has been for awhile, sure it would be more expensive but the task of reclaiming land from a body of water is sort of a simple one, just ask the Dutch and the Japanese.

Let's see what happens with CTG. If they really want to make it a large tourist destinations they're going to have to put a lot of money into the city.

 Quoting tavong (Reply 46):Well AFAIK EK was (is?) interested in BOG, i really think that an A340-500 could do the route with not that much restriction (but still restricted), i think that if EK really wants to come to BOG it would need to make a stop in Europe

Most likely it would be via CCS.

On other news, on top of the new SJU flights, AV is launching a 5th weekly frequency to HAV.

trent772
Posts: 137
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:08 pm

### RE: The 13th Colombian Aviation Thread

Hello All,

Today while leaving the active runway (13R), we crossed paths with a B737 belonging to the Colombian Air Force, I'm sure it was either a series 300 or 400, named "Atlas", having never seen this particular plane here in Colombia and needless to say operating for FAC I would like to know if anyone has any info on this particular plane.

Thanks.
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