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Mortyman
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Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Wed Mar 20, 2013 9:04 pm

Norwegian ceo Bjørn Kjos indicates in an interview With Bloomberg that he is considering ordering the Boeing 787-9. Number unknown.

Norwegian already have 8 787-8 on order.

The ceo comments that the 787-10 are economically attractive, but don't have the range he wants.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...order-for-stricken-boeing-787.html


http://www.hegnar.no/bors/article723378.ece

On what routes can Norwegian be interested in using the possible 787-9 Equipment on ?

The airline keeps on expanding ... Wonder how large this possible order will be

[Edited 2013-03-20 14:06:43]

[Edited 2013-03-20 14:27:17]
 
sunrisevalley
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:34 pm

Quoting Mortyman (Thread starter):
The ceo comments that the 787-10 are economically attractive, but don't have the range he wants.

Draw a 13hr ~ 6300nm radius from Oslo on GC Mapper and it covers an awful lot of territory. The -10X will haul ~33t on that time sector . Not too bad I would say. Would be interesting to see what he has in mind.   
 
CXfirst
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:57 pm

Norwegian pack 291 pax into their 787. At 75kg per pax + 15kg bag per pax (90kg per pax), that is already over 26 tons.

The -10x stretch will add quite a bit of pax and therefore payload. It might not hit 6 33t, but with GC Mapper, you can already see destinations like GIG are already close to the boundary. Add in unfavourable winds, and it will be a stretch for the -10x.

And that is before any cargo (don't know how much, if any, cargo Norwegian intends to transport).

However, I do agree, the -10x will suffice for many routes Norwegian intends to operate, such as BKK, NYC, Florida, while the 789 and 788 could be used on the longest routes.

-CXfirst
 
sunrisevalley
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:27 am

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 2):
Norwegian pack 291 pax into their 787. At 75kg per pax + 15kg bag per pax (90kg per pax), that is already over 26 tons

On the 788 they will get 7000nm /~15 hrs. with that load. This allows for a 4t spread between OEW and DOW. Typically westbound that would be about 6600nm.
 
B747forever
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:22 am

They haven't even started to operate long haul to see if it will work out for them, and they start talking about more and larger airplanes. With their huge narrowbody order of 222 airplanes they must have some serious plans of dominating Europe. But they should be aware that they will face much stiffer competition than what they have so far from SAS, and therefore should be more cautious with how they will go on from here.
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Mortyman
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 5:45 am

Quoting B747forever (Reply 4):
But they should be aware that they will face much stiffer competition than what they have so far from SAS

Don't think they regard SAS as their main competitor.
 
sweair
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 6:13 am

Norwegian is aiming to win some business travelers too now I read, I think time slots will decide if you go from ARN with Norwegian or SK via CPH?
 
B747forever
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 6:25 am

Quoting Mortyman (Reply 5):

Quoting B747forever (Reply 4):
But they should be aware that they will face much stiffer competition than what they have so far from SAS

Don't think they regard SAS as their main competitor.


Not anymore maybe, but they will not be able to steal passengers and market shares as easily as they did from SAS, once they start expand more outside of Scandinavia. With 222 airplanes on order they will have to start flying from more places outside of ARN/OSL/CPH and to some extent HEL.
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
sweair
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 6:48 am

To get to BKK from ARN would be a bit faster with Norwegian, no connection through CPH, the other routes I don´t know Florida is not SK territory and NY is CPH I guess. One more plus, the 788 will fly a bit faster than SKs 343 to BKK, shorter flight time.
 
sunrisevalley
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:24 am

Quoting sweair (Reply 6):
Norwegian is aiming to win some business travelers too now I read

Not with 291 seats in a 788   
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:58 am

Quoting Mortyman (Thread starter):
Norwegian ceo Bjørn Kjos indicates in an interview With Bloomberg that he is considering ordering the Boeing 787-9. Number unknown.

I think Kjos is suffering from "dillusions of grandure".

Quoting sweair (Reply 6):
Norwegian is aiming to win some business travelers too now I read

If they started operating lounges, started a real FF program and joined an alliance then I might be interested in flying with them more often. They've also go to stop losing my bags, charging me for luggage and allocated seating while they are at it.
 
SASDC8
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:59 pm

Quoting sweair (Reply 8):
To get to BKK from ARN would be a bit faster with Norwegian, no connection through CPH, the other routes I don´t know Florida is not SK territory and NY is CPH I guess. One more plus, the 788 will fly a bit faster than SKs 343 to BKK, shorter flight time.

Not faster than you will on the 747/777 from TG. How much faster is the 787 at cruise than a 340, when you count in winds etc? DYs DEP/ARR times are not ideal either, ore at least not for me so TG and SK it is then  

[Edited 2013-03-21 09:08:46]
2-3-2 is NOT a premium configuration
 
sweair
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:05 pm

Quoting SASDC8 (Reply 11):

TGs 747s fly to BKK faster than SKs 343s as I remember, not that much difference but still, any flight time you can cut from a long haul flight is good time imo.

Anyway I think it´s great with another option in the market, BKK is probably only the start eastward.
 
AY-MD11
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 5:34 pm

I think even if they ordered the 777W it would be full of holiday travellers if the price is cheaper than the competitors. They must have high load factors on the 788s.
 
jumpjets
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 6:39 pm

Quoting sunrisevalley (Reply 1):
Draw a 13hr ~ 6300nm radius from Oslo on GC Mapper and it covers an awful lot of territory

Maybe they might be considering down the line expanding their LGW operations to include long-haul.
 
sweair
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:04 pm

The 787-10 will be an excellent TATL shuttle bus, what typical range will it have with say 320 seats filled? Making a buck is about moving as many seats as you can without carrying too much dead weight to do it. The ANA 787s that go to FRA with 170 seats feels like a waste, but I guess it´s premium heavy?
 
sunrisevalley
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:36 pm

Quoting sweair (Reply 15):
The 787-10 will be an excellent TATL shuttle bus, what typical range will it have with say 320 seats filled?

320 seats is close to max passenger load which it will haul 7100nm. Bear in mind this load/range is always based on OEW . To this must be added catering, potable water , magazines etc. etc. to bring it up to DOW which will add +- 4t to the weight and reduce the payload accordingly. TK for an aircraft with this number of seats adds ~ 4.2t to take it from OEW to DOW.
 
sweair
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:34 pm

So say you can fill 300 seats and want to go from west coast US to Asia, what aircraft would be the best on this type of route?
 
sunrisevalley
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Fri Mar 22, 2013 1:50 am

.

Quoting sweair (Reply 17):
So say you can fill 300 seats and want to go from west coast US to Asia, what aircraft would be the best on this type of route?

Depends how you stuff them in. 300-seats is about CX's load for a 77W. Or you could have a Norwegian type operator with 291 seats in a 788.   
The longest sector is LAX-HKG at ~ 14hr 30 min. All the 787 series can haul 300-passengers for that sector time assuming you can make them fit into the 788. The -10X is closest to being maxed out. Probably an A332 could also do it .
 
CXfirst
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:52 am

Quoting sweair (Reply 15):
The ANA 787s that go to FRA with 170 seats feels like a waste, but I guess it´s premium heavy?

Yes it does, seeing as many airlines have that amount of seats in a 738, even with a couple business class seats!

-CXfirst
 
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Mortyman
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:07 pm

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 10):
If they started operating lounges, started a real FF program and joined an alliance then I might be interested in flying with them more often.

You already have that option. It's called SAS ...
 
sweair
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RE: Norwegian Consider Ordering 787-9

Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:25 pm

Why do you need FF programs to go from A to B, are you just that cheap?  

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