MesaFlyGuy
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PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:41 pm

FINALLY FINALLY FINALLY some good news for ISP!

Announced today:

Twice daily flights from MacArthur to Boston are to commence July 25th.

http://westislip.patch.com/articles/...ights-coming-to-macarthur-b2a043e6

http://www.townofislip-ny.gov/news/n...-to-long-island-macarthur-airport-

[Edited 2013-04-02 16:42:42]

Fares are 119.00 per person each way


[Edited 2013-04-02 17:01:23]

Flight 420 lv BOS 0700 arr ISP 0810
Flight 424 lv BOS 1730 arr ISP 1840

Flight 421 lv ISP 0840 arr BOS 0950
Flight 425 lvISP 1910 arr BOS 2020


[Edited 2013-04-02 17:05:11]
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CXA330300
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:34 am

Nice to see ISP getting some more service back! I could see this timing nicely to connect with B6 services...although much of that market would just fly out of JFK.
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adamh8297
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:57 am

Quoting CXA330300 (Reply 1):

Nice to see ISP getting some more service back! I could see this timing nicely to connect with B6 services...although much of that market would just fly out of JFK.

They don't interline with B6 and B6 has Cape Air as a regional partner. Connecting from terminal B to a crowded terminal C isn't that great either.

They are an AS partner first and foremost being based in Alaska but interline with *A carriers as well.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AM, BA, B6, CO, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WN
 
Flytravel
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:03 am

They should have the ISP-BOS flight leaving early in the morning, so that one could reach work/client site near BOS before 9am. Instead they have the BOS-ISP flight reaching ISP early.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:11 am

153 miles but SO much traffic potential in the way or ferries. It really should be a hit if they timed it perfectly for business traffic. The timing seems really good if you are in bos and need to head to LI for the day but not ideal for LI to BOS for a meeting.
 
usflyguy
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:14 am

Quoting adamh8297 (Reply 2):
They are an AS partner first and foremost being based in Alaska

     

AS is based in Seattle, Washington. I'd be surprised if a carrier code-shares with an airline just because they're based in a state that's name is painted on the side of another airline. I'm pretty sure they'll code-share with whoever they can as long as the airline adds value to their network. AS would add absolutely NO value to this flight.
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usflyguy
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:15 am

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 4):
It really should be a hit if

  

Agreed, WN used to fly ISP-PVD.
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MesaFlyGuy
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:46 am

Quoting usflyguy (Reply 5):

Even though it's not because of the state thing, PenAir is an AS partner airline. It's advertised on their website.
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slcdeltarumd11
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 3:23 am

Still great news for ISP, I really hope it works.

With the merger of AA and US i hope they try ORD.
 
BOStonsox
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 4:51 am

This is quite a surprise. I've always thought that B6 would be the carrier to launch this route someday, but PenAir should be able to make it work.
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Art at ISP
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 6:02 am

ORD from ISP has been tried regularly since 1971 by AA, and perhaps UA at one point. Flights could be full but still lost money. Southwest only recently cut ISP-MDW, so I think that market is still poor from a business perspective.

I'd still like to see one of the majors back at ISP other than US, I just don't think there is a large enough market left to attract a big player. This new service is on Saab 340's. Shades of Business Express...deja vu all over again..
 
Tango-Bravo
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 6:05 am

Quoting mesaflyguy (Thread starter):
PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Who'd have ever imagined!? An airline known (to those who even know of PenAir at all) as a modern-day successor to Alaskan bush airlines flying as a commuter some 3,400 miles from 'home.' PenAir is a well-run airline for whom I have the utmost respect...and wish them the very best in their ventures a proverbial 'world away' from from their origins.
 
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adamh8297
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:59 am

Quoting usflyguy (Reply 5):
AS would add absolutely NO value to this flight.

I'm not sure if all the connections work on this BOS-ISP route but AS does serve three destinations from BOS - SEA PDX and SAN.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AM, BA, B6, CO, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WN
 
mirrodie
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 11:15 am

Islip is a joke and a jerk chain for long islanders. It had more majors and jets out of there in the 80s.

Then WN comes in, the town adopts a "build it and they'll come" attitude, they throw tons of cash into the place, build it up and now it's a desert town airport. It's sad.
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knope2001
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:57 pm

Brief synoposis covering some of the facts of this, including some things which were in the OP's links (which some appear not to have seen.)

--PenAir is already operating in Boston with a handful of EAS markets they were awarded last year.

--The partnership with Alaska Airlines is long-standing based on their operations in the state of Alaska. It's nothing established for nor intended to benefit the operation in New England.

--PenAIr does not code share with Alaska on their Boston flights.

--Because PenAir's operating is focused on Boston, if they're going to fly the classic business schedule it essentially needs to be based on Boston, not in Islip. Both the morning and evening round trip operates BOS-ISP-BOS, not ISP-BOS-ISP. Were it to be "based" in Islip and fly ISP-BOS-ISP with an early-morning flight, then the plane would sit idle in ISP all day until the evening ISP-BOS-ISP flight. That essentially strands a crew and an aircraft in ISP all day until the evening flight. If they're committed to a classic business schedule as they have published, basing the place and crew in ISP is a non-starter until/unless a more complex and frequent operation comes to pass.

--This service is "subsidized" with incentives and initial marketing money, but not with revenue guarantees, travel banks or similar loss-covering provisions. These sorts of incentives and marketing stipends are very common at airports large and small for specific new services. So while it is definitely a subsidy of sorts, it's not out of the ordinary and definitely does not ensure profits for PenAir.

I'm definiltey hopeful the service succeeds and demonstrates a niche exists for turpoprop service in targeted markets. The days when 6x/day 200-mile hops with 19-seat props were commonplace and profitable are long gone. But I do think there are many city pairs with perhaps 5-7 hour drives where enough travelers (esp business travelers) are willing to pay fares high enough to support nonstop turboprop service. My biggest concern...both about BOS-ISP and about similar services I propose...is that they face real dificulty if they operate without a frequent flyer tie-in. The real road warriors you need to chose your nonstop flights are often additcted to FF programs. Even if they're Delta junkies and you can only offer them United miles, they probably have a lesser-used United account to at least earn something. But if those travelers can't earn useful credits, many won't make the change from their current means of travel, whatever that may be.
 
MesaFlyGuy
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 1:05 pm

Quoting knope2001 (Reply 14):

Thank you for that very detailed synopsis. Indeed, it doesn't guarantee profits but I think this service can survive with the right timings, which look good to me.

Quoting mirrodie (Reply 13):

There are many airports that I'd consider a joke before ISP.
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B6JFKH81
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Wed Apr 03, 2013 7:03 pm

Glad to see ISP and BOS connected once again, and it'll be neat seeing the Saab coming in and out!

Quoting BOStonsox (Reply 9):
This is quite a surprise. I've always thought that B6 would be the carrier to launch this route someday, but PenAir should be able to make it work.

I hate to say this, but I honestly think my airline would be WAY too much lift unless we had significant transfer opportunities....and that's coming from someone who is a life-long Long Islander so far and has quite a bit of pride in my airline. Even with significant transfer capabilities, where are they going to transfer to that they couldn't get a non-stop flight out of JFK on us (I know, I know, ISP is barely 1/2 way into Long Island, but still....) as I know many people that don't like adding extra legs to their trip and are willing to just schlep to JFK.

Any way you look at it, this sure as hell beats having to head all the way to the Throgs Neck Bridge or taking an expensive and slow ferry to get to the other side of the Long Island Sound and into New England!!!
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MesaFlyGuy
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:03 am

Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 16):

I concur, I think an e190 would be too much aircraft. But, presumably they'd fly to FLL/MCO and maybe they could parlay that into some stroner brand-recognition which MIGHT help them a bit if they did start BOS.
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B6JFKH81
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Thu Apr 04, 2013 6:29 pm

Quoting mesaflyguy (Reply 17):
But, presumably they'd fly to FLL/MCO and maybe they could parlay that into some stroner brand-recognition which MIGHT help them a bit if they did start BOS.

As I have told Senator Schumer personally when he came to visit my facility and we startded discussing ISP, ISP - FLL/MCO would be an absolute money losing bloodbath until someone pulls out. WN already serves ISP - MCO, TPA, PBI, FLL, RSW. Many of these are seasonal with their higher demand periods so capacity is already at/exceeds demand, people are typically looking for the cheapest ticket which often times would be WN, and the only thing we had that WN couldn't offer before was the chance to transfer in FLL/MCO to continue to the Caribbean. Now that WN and FL are in bed together, that edge is slightly reduced as FL has some (not a lot, but some) presence in the Caribbean through FLL/MCO/BWI. NK had a HUGE edge over WN for that transfer capability in FLL which is why I was quite surprised to see them pull out of the ISP-FLL route they were offering.

As far as brand goes, it amazes me how Newsday and News12 continue to bash our airline. It seems every time we are featured in Newsday or News12 for any type of story (even the good ones like new service, a special event, etc.), they bring up the 2007 Valentines Day meltdown (come now....its been 6 years, really?). My father (who actually takes WN out of ISP most of the time intead of my own airline....I always get weird looks when dropping my parents off at ISP for their WN flight, walking into the terminal with B6 jacket on and whatnot LOL) was the one that noticed the trend and sent it to me with many examples. Not sure if that has changed recently as I do not watch News12 nor do I read Newsday, but my father did send me that stuff about a year or so ago. But I still know plenty of people who go all the way to JFK for our service. My friend from Quogue just flew out today for some sun-n-fun in the Caribbean actually (that is ONE HELL of a drive LOL!!!).

On a side note, when did WN drop ISP-MDW?? I was just looking at their route map and it doesn't pop up as a non-stop anymore?
"If you do not learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it"
 
JBAirwaysFan
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Thu Apr 04, 2013 7:04 pm

Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 18):
On a side note, when did WN drop ISP-MDW?? I was just looking at their route map and it doesn't pop up as a non-stop anymore?

Last June.

Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 18):
people are typically looking for the cheapest ticket which often times would be WN,

While I'm not expecting B6 in ISP anytime soon, I don't think this is too accurate. JetBlue's operating costs are lower than Southwest's so I imagine it would actually be the other way around.
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B6JFKH81
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Thu Apr 04, 2013 7:39 pm

Quoting JBAirwaysFan (Reply 19):
JetBlue's operating costs are lower than Southwest's so I imagine it would actually be the other way around.

...however the operating costs for B6 continue to climb, rapidly, and the folks higher up continue to push the "they're willing to pay a slight premium to take us instead of the other guys for the same route because of our service and products", so our fares have risen quite quickly. I do believe you are correct that there is a chance for the fares to be lower, but I have a feeling it would only be temporary until service is established and there is a customer base willing to pay the premium over WN. Time will tell, I guess. I wonder where B6 would operate out of at ISP. It would be weird operating out of the WN terminal, but I don't think there is anywhere else to operate out of LOL.

Quoting JBAirwaysFan (Reply 19):
Last June.

Amazing. Didn't they start with like 6 round-trips a day on that route and now it's completely gone?
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usflyguy
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RE: PenAir Announces BOS-ISP

Thu Apr 04, 2013 8:31 pm

Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 20):
It would be weird operating out of the WN terminal, but I don't think there is anywhere else to operate out of LOL.

Next to US Airways via air stairs.

Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 20):
Amazing. Didn't they start with like 6 round-trips a day on that route and now it's completely gone?

That was before 6 flights a day each between both MDW-LGA and MDW-EWR.
My post is my ideas and my opinions only, I do not represent the ideas or opinions of anyone else or company.