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KarelXWB
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First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Fri May 03, 2013 5:39 pm

The first A330 for Cebu Pacific (RP-C3341) has been spotted in its full livery. Also, this one is equipped with - hold your breath - 436 seats! All economy, 9 abreast configuration.

Question: are there any other A330 operators out there with that many seats?

http://oi41.tinypic.com/2rvz8cx.jpg

[Edited 2013-05-03 10:41:08]
Close, but no cigar http://vine.co/v/OjqeYWWpVWK
 
falkerker
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Fri May 03, 2013 5:41 pm

That has more seats than some A380 operators!!!!

Talk about a can of sardines!!
 
anstar
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Fri May 03, 2013 5:58 pm

Is thst even possible?
Air transat do 342 seats with a small premum cabin... and 2 -4 -2 down back... I struggle to see how you can get 436 on the 333????
 
boswashsprstar
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Fri May 03, 2013 5:59 pm

Has anyone else ever done a 9-abreast A330/A340? This is the first I've heard of it.
 
Devilfish
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Fri May 03, 2013 5:59 pm

Quoting falkerker (Reply 1):
That has more seats than some A380 operators!!!!

   Now, who needs an ultra expensive VLA?

Quoting falkerker (Reply 1):
Talk about a can of sardines!!

   We love sardines...especially with beer!   
"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Fri May 03, 2013 6:02 pm

Quoting boswashsprstar (Reply 3):
Has anyone else ever done a 9-abreast A330/A340? This is the first I've heard of it.

There are a few others like Air Transat, but their A330's also have business class seats. The one for Cebu Pacific is all Y.
Close, but no cigar http://vine.co/v/OjqeYWWpVWK
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Fri May 03, 2013 6:06 pm

Quoting anstar (Reply 2):
Is thst even possible?
Air transat do 342 seats with a small premum cabin... and 2 -4 -2 down back... I struggle to see how you can get 436 on the 333????

According to Airbus it should be possible to seat a maximum of 440 passengers in the A330.
Close, but no cigar http://vine.co/v/OjqeYWWpVWK
 
DUSint
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Fri May 03, 2013 6:08 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 5):
Quoting boswashsprstar (Reply 3):
Has anyone else ever done a 9-abreast A330/A340? This is the first I've heard of it.

There are a few others like Air Transat, but their A330's also have business class seats. The one for Cebu Pacific is all Y.

Before AB sold its A333, they had 389 seats (all Y) in 8-abreast.
I remember that boarding seemed to take forever - especially when one anticipated only a 2-hour flight from PMI to Germany...

So, if you add one seat per row for 9-abreast, you can easily fit 436 seats in there with 31'' pitch.
 
kaitak
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Fri May 03, 2013 6:08 pm

Quite a few charter operators - Monarch, Thomas Cook etc - have nine abreast on their A330s.

Has Cebu Pacific indicated what routes it wants to fly? I assume MNL-DXB is probably high on the list?
 
DUSint
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Fri May 03, 2013 6:10 pm

Quoting DUSint (Reply 7):
with 31'' pitch

Though I am not sure about this one - maybe it was more like 30''.
 
dforce1
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Fri May 03, 2013 7:30 pm

Here is a good article with plenty of information on route deployment and what the future holds for Cebu Pacific's first A330 and the remaining 7 to be delivered... http://www.philippineflightnetwork.c...limpse-of-cebu-pacifics-brand.html
 
falkerker
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Fri May 03, 2013 7:36 pm

Maybe MOL will follow suit and we'll see FR fly long haul on an all-Y 77W...   

Imagine an 400+ passenger FR flight trying to board

"Sir, I'm gonna have to check your bag to see if it can be taken as carry/on"
 
Pacific
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 1:21 am

Given the target market (the low-fare, low-yielding passengers), they are likely to be used to high-density conditions. From FX taxis, Jeepneys, Busses, LRT/MRT, PNR to Mitsubishi L300 private vans crammed with 12 people, it is not surprising that the next step is the aeroplane. The Philippines is a high-density country with a rapidly growing population.
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 3:40 am

AirAsia X's A333s are 9-abreast, not sure of their A343s though.
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 5:05 am

Didn't Air Inter A330s have 400 seats?
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 5:06 am

I like the livery very much.  

mariner
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crownvic
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 5:24 am

Have RP-C tail numbers been assigned to this new fleet yet?
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 6:24 am

That's a very nice looking A330! It's a shame we won't see them in Europe.
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IndianicWorld
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 7:02 am

Umm.. how do they seriously expect to fill 400+ seats to AVV? MEL already has PR flights, and adding even 3 weekly flights would require over 1200 seats each way to be filled by Cebu Pacific alone.

To the Middle East it may work, but the potential to many other markets may be harder to achieve.
 
EY460
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 7:36 am

Probably Corsair is pretty close to that number.
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 7:36 am

The livery is all it has going good for it. I for one wouldn't want to fly on a high density A333!   

EK413
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KarelXWB
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 8:16 am

Quoting carpethead (Reply 13):
AirAsia X's A333s are 9-abreast, not sure of their A343s though.

Their A343's are 9 abreast too.

Quoting EY460 (Reply 19):
Probably Corsair is pretty close to that number.

Business: 26
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Total: 360
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 9:39 am

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 5):
There are a few others like Air Transat, but their A330's also have business class seats. The one for Cebu Pacific is all Y.

The A330 looks very nice in the colors of Cebu Pacific. An all Y configuration makes sense for them. Everyone who has visited the Philippines frequently, and has seen the most common type of passenger in this country with so many islands, will acknowledge that this choice of configuration makes sense for them.  .
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 10:12 am

Quoting boswashsprstar (Reply 3):
Has anyone else ever done a 9-abreast A330/A340? This is the first I've heard of it.

Besides those already mentioned above, in a previous thread about Cebu Pacific A330s, I remembered that the type's first operator, Air Inter, used theirs for a short time in a 9-abreast 400+ seat configuration.
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 10:36 am

Quoting crownvic (Reply 16):
Have RP-C tail numbers been assigned to this new fleet yet?

rp-c3341 onwards.
 
KaiTak747
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 12:03 pm

I like the livery, very colourful! I'm surprised they won't do what AirAsia X do and have a small premium cabin, as I'm sure there will be some, albeit tiny, premium demand.

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 21):
Their A343's are 9 abreast too.

I think they have phased these out, and now operate 9 A330s.

Quoting kaitak (Reply 8):
Quite a few charter operators - Monarch, Thomas Cook etc - have nine abreast on their A330s.

I'm booked on KUL-HND return this autumn on AirAsia X, what's the comfort like with 9-abreast? Maybe similar to 10 abreast on the 777?
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 12:09 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 5):
Quoting boswashsprstar (Reply 3):
Has anyone else ever done a 9-abreast A330/A340? This is the first I've heard of it.


There are a few others like Air Transat, but their A330's also have business class seats. The one for Cebu Pacific is all Y.

Emirates on 332s
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 1:26 pm

Quoting KaiTak747 (Reply 25):
I think they have phased these out, and now operate 9 A330s.

9M-XAB and 9M-XAC are still flying with AirAsiaX.
Close, but no cigar http://vine.co/v/OjqeYWWpVWK
 
Devilfish
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 2:21 pm

Quoting Pacific (Reply 12):
Given the target market (the low-fare, low-yielding passengers), they are likely to be used to high-density conditions. From FX taxis, Jeepneys, Busses, LRT/MRT, PNR to Mitsubishi L300 private vans crammed with 12 people, it is not surprising that the next step is the aeroplane. The Philippines is a high-density country with a rapidly growing population.

Remember what they say..."quantity has a quality all its own"...    .

Quoting scbriml (Reply 17):
That's a very nice looking A330! It's a shame we won't see them in Europe.

It's a fair guess that 5J would be exploring every opportunity to extend services to Europe as soon as the ban is lifted (if ever). A comparatively short hop from the ME to the UK, to be sure.

[Edited 2013-05-04 08:00:58]
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virgin747
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 2:52 pm

I'm here on vacation in the Philippines... The local buzz here is that if you're an Overseas worker and "like" them on Facebook. Cebu Pacific is paying the airfare of 100 passengers to go home to the Philippines when they start their Dubai service in October.
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 2:56 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 6):
Quoting anstar (Reply 2):
Is thst even possible?
Air transat do 342 seats with a small premum cabin... and 2 -4 -2 down back... I struggle to see how you can get 436 on the 333????

According to Airbus it should be possible to seat a maximum of 440 passengers in the A330.

Someone's going to get fired. They could have gotten 4 more seats in and they missed it? What were they thinking? 
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 3:00 pm

Maybe the seats are there but will serve as crew rest for F/A ? Or the 440 seats only work on short haul with limited numbers of toilets and the like.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
davidho1985
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 3:05 pm

Quoting Aesma (Reply 31):
Maybe the seats are there but will serve as crew rest for F/A ? Or the 440 seats only work on short haul with limited numbers of toilets and the like

They will use the A330 for new long haul routes!
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 3:24 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Thread starter):
The first A330 for Cebu Pacific (RP-C3341) has been spotted in its full livery. Also, this one is equipped with - hold your breath - 436 seats! All economy, 9 abreast configuration.

Wow--perfect for the Philippines-Gulf market, and likely to put the hurt on the ME3, at least in Y, and there's not much F/J anyway.

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 18):
Umm.. how do they seriously expect to fill 400+ seats to AVV?

That would be a disaster.
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dforce1
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 6:30 pm

If Category 2 gets lifted by the FAA and flights to Europe are permitted, these A330's could become a real game changer in the market especially if Cebu Pacific launches flights to Europe. They could make a significant dent in the Europe to Asia/Australia market with their incredibly low overhead and dirt cheap fares. No airline has been able to successfully do it yet but if Cebu Pacific can, Manila may eventually get repositioned as a transit hub stealing from Bangkok, Kuala Lumpur, Hong Kong, and Singapore.

Having said that, I am not sure how kindly the Western travelling public would take to being crammed in a flying sardine can for a lengthy flight. But Cebu Pacific might just make the fares worthwhile! The cheapest I have seen them offer Manila-Dubai round-trip is about $250 USD round-trip including all taxes and fees. But you must pay extra for baggage, meals, etc.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 8:01 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 27):
9M-XAB and 9M-XAC are still flying with AirAsiaX.

Indeed, but they are now all white and operated for other airlines like SV.
 
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sat May 04, 2013 8:06 pm

Oh, I didn't know that. Have they changed the cabin configuration too?
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crownvic
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sun May 05, 2013 3:35 am

Quoting RobK (Reply 24):
Quoting crownvic (Reply 16):
Have RP-C tail numbers been assigned to this new fleet yet?

rp-c3341 onwards.

Thank you for this information...
 
AR385
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sun May 05, 2013 5:02 am

Quoting dforce1 (Reply 34):
Having said that, I am not sure how kindly the Western travelling public would take to being crammed in a flying sardine can for a lengthy flight.

I´d rather not go anywhere than fly in a can of sardines like that. I understand some people do need cheap fares and don´t care as long as they get there. Me too, to a certain degree. Board an A330 9 abreast with 436 seats? I´m 1.87 mts tall and 100kg. It would be a nightmare. I can already hear the DVTs forming.

So I do not think the Western type passenger is what Cebu is aiming for. More telling is the fact they haven´t even considered a premium cabin.
 
IndianicWorld
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sun May 05, 2013 6:26 am

Quoting AR385 (Reply 38):
So I do not think the Western type passenger is what Cebu is aiming for. More telling is the fact they haven´t even considered a premium cabin.

That's even more worrying as there is no way that they can rely on only attracting Filipino traffic on most routes, especially on their planned Australian services. It needs to be a broader based approach to generate sufficient demand into these markets.

Remember that even JQ and D7 operate a J type class on their LCC services to appeal to the market.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 33):
Wow--perfect for the Philippines-Gulf market, and likely to put the hurt on the ME3, at least in Y, and there's not much F/J anyway.

True. On Middle East routes this would likely add up well, given the levels of lower yielding demand that exists.

The ME3 will likely be just as strong given their network connections, but it will be interesting to see.
 
ben175
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sun May 05, 2013 6:33 am

How many A330's are they getting? Perhaps they could configure a few with a small J-cabin of say 14-21 seats in a 2-3-2 configuration for their planned Australian services.
 
IndianicWorld
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sun May 05, 2013 6:40 am

Quoting Ben175 (Reply 40):
How many A330's are they getting? Perhaps they could configure a few with a small J-cabin of say 14-21 seats in a 2-3-2 configuration for their planned Australian services.

I don't think thats the avenue they are looking at.

PR already tap into that market and Cebu Pacific will likely aim at lower yield market segments instead. Just how they will achieve that is a big questionmark.

Trying to make AVV work with a product as uncomfortable as this will likely be is definately not an attractive option.
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sun May 05, 2013 10:35 am

Quoting Ben175 (Reply 40):
How many A330's are they getting?

They have 8 on order.
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ben175
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sun May 05, 2013 10:47 am

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 41):
Trying to make AVV work with a product as uncomfortable as this will likely be is definately not an attractive option.

Exactly why I think they need to be logical with their Australian services and perhaps venture down this avenue. Pretty much all low cost long haul from Australia still offer a premium product - Jetstar, AirAsia X, Scoot etc. Having a small sub fleet of say 2-3 aircraft with J out of the 8 could be viable and would definitely help them down under.
 
dforce1
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Sun May 05, 2013 3:30 pm

Cebu Pacific is going to need to re-evaluate their product for long-haul in order to appeal to a broader segment. It may very well work for Filipinos but if they want to serve the mass-budget conscious market, they will need to diversify their product especially if they want to be competitive.

They won't even have much time to breathe before facing competition from PAL Express on their Dubai-Manila route. In regards to service to Australia, Air Asia X has a fairly solid position in that market and Air Asia has just taken a giant leap forward in its efforts to penetrate the Philippine market.

Thanks to Air Asia's new partnership with Zest Airways, Air Asia now has the ability to offer flights from Manila. They will be launching a new Manila-Kuala Lumpur service which will be able to connect to Air Asia X flights. In addition, Air Asia now has access to all of Zest's existing route network which will feed Air Asia X flights via the Manila-KL route from all major Philippine cities. Air Asia's website just took over the handling of all Zest Air bookings.

More information here:
http://www.philippineflightnetwork.c...-philippines-marriage-to-zest.html

Long story short - Cebu Pacific will not be without competition for very long in their attempt to command the budget long-haul market in the Philippines.
 
DeltaB717
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Mon May 06, 2013 1:01 am

Quoting mariner (Reply 15):
I like the livery very much.

Me too, but I think I'll save my admiration for the outside... doesn't sound like a lot of fun on the inside!
 
YLWbased
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Mon May 06, 2013 3:19 am

Quoting kaitak (Reply 8):
I assume MNL-DXB is probably high on the list?

They've already started selling tix on this route about 2-3 months ago, so far the sale is pretty good AFAIK.

Timothy
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LurveBus
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Mon May 06, 2013 6:47 am

Quoting dforce1 (Reply 44):
Cebu Pacific is going to need to re-evaluate their product for long-haul in order to appeal to a broader segment. It may very well work for Filipinos but if they want to serve the mass-budget conscious market, they will need to diversify their product especially if they want to be competitive.

I think I'll disagree with this one. They have indeed a unique product - monoclass long haul. That's bound to depress prices. If there's anything we've learned about the LCC revolution, it's that people will put up with almost anything if it's cheap enough. Margins may be smaller, but selling an extra hundred economy seats may be more feasible than selling a watered-down premium product. The OFW market is extremely price-sensitive.

Besides, as mentioned earlier, there's already an airline that provides a watered-down premium product. It's called PAL.

MNL also has slot issues. The monoclass A330 enables 5J to use the aircraft in its short-haul operations, ensuring maximum utilization of the aircraft.

They've done the cost-benefit analysis. They're taking a risk. No other LCC is going this route. This would either fail or end up being totally revolutionary.
 
dforce1
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Mon May 06, 2013 10:31 am

Quoting LurveBus (Reply 47):
I think I'll disagree with this one. They have indeed a unique product - monoclass long haul. That's bound to depress prices. If there's anything we've learned about the LCC revolution, it's that people will put up with almost anything if it's cheap enough. Margins may be smaller, but selling an extra hundred economy seats may be more feasible than selling a watered-down premium product. The OFW market is extremely price-sensitive.

The argument was that this approach likely will NOT appeal to a broader segment (westerners) of the global population but will to appeal to Filipinos and OFW's. You only need to read the shock and horror in the various aviation threads that 436 seats is going to be squeezed onto this aircraft in order to get an idea of whether this will have mass appeal or not.

Furthermore, if they want to stretch beyond the Filipino market and steal marketshare from JetStar and AirAsia X on routes to Australia, they will need to re-evaluate their product offering. The majority of people are willing to make sacrifices in order to save money. But there is a good reason that it hasn't been proven to work long-haul yet. Cramming more seats into a plane dramatically reduces the guest experience and what we do know is that people want to save money, but ultimately, they don't want to sacrifice what they deem to be base comforts on international service - meals, baggage allowance, entertainment, and certainly comfort.

The western population would spend an extra $100-$200 for more comfort hence how the economy plus segment was born. But Cebu Pacific's product is BELOW STANDARD of even a standard economy on a charter carrier like Air Transat -- and you still need to pay extra for all incidentals! It might look appealing at first but 4-5 hours into a transcontinental flight attempting to sleep or eat, most westerners will likely regret being cheap and in the end complain, "you get what you pay for!" Guest satisfaction is the main business driver of airlines. What is okay for a 1-2 hour flight will not be for a 8-12 hour flight. AirAsia achieves competitiveness through a low-cost model without sacrificing comfort on board aircraft.
 
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neutrino
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RE: First A330 For Cebu Pacific

Mon May 06, 2013 1:27 pm

Quoting Devilfish (Reply 4):
We love sardines...especially with beer!
Quoting dforce1 (Reply 34):
But Cebu Pacific might just make the fares worthwhile! The cheapest I have seen them offer Manila-Dubai round-trip is about $250 USD round-trip including all taxes and fees.

Worthwhile indeed! CP's low low SIN-MNL/CRK nett return fares of around US$80 to 85 have made me go to the Philippines more often in the last few years. Its less than a third of what PAL charge and I don't need the inflight refreshments or IFE for the short 200 minutes flights.

Quoting AR385 (Reply 38):
I´d rather not go anywhere than fly in a can of sardines like that. I understand some people do need cheap fares and don´t care as long as they get there. Me too, to a certain degree. Board an A330 9 abreast with 436 seats? I´m 1.87 mts tall and 100kg. It would be a nightmare. I can already hear the DVTs forming.

At your height & weight, CP and the like's tight seatings is definitely not for you. I certainly won't like you beside or worse, at the back of me. For the price, its just bearable for my 1.7m & 70kg.
Potestatem obscuri lateris nescitis