Andrensn
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Wed May 22, 2013 9:52 am

With aircraft such as the SAAB 340 and the Beech 1900 becoming older and less efficient is there currently a need for a new aircraft or series of aircrafts in the 19-40 seater market. I feel that unless a manufacturer is able to create a plane to replace aging aircraft of this size many routes and airlines around the globe will cease to exist soon.
Also how many passenger aircraft seating between 19 and 40 PAX are in service globally and how bigger market really is this???

Your thoughts??
 
JoKeR
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Wed May 22, 2013 10:41 am

The need is definitely there, though the numbers may not be to very large OEM's liking.

Attempts to replace turbo-prop oldies has been rather disappointing so far, I guess the big OEM's simply don't see this as profitable enough, and others will say that ATR still offers the fantastic 42-600 and that plane is not selling on droves.

But I always had a feeling that the ATR42 is simply too much of a plane for certain required missions. Still wiping my tears over the 328 demise, what a fantastic little performer, but they did not survive either.

So let's see if someone will be brave enough to tackle this market niche.
Kafa, čaj, šraf?
 
cobra27
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Wed May 22, 2013 10:52 am

True, there is market gap there. Embraer should develop one
 
PlymSpotter
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Wed May 22, 2013 11:16 am

In my opinion the market is there for a ~35 seat STOL frame capable of operating within RFFS Cat 3 requirements and from Code 1 runways - those with declared distances of 799m or less. Much of the original 35 seat market has ceased to exist and what is left focuses around this niche, where there will be a significant void over the coming 10 years.

In other words, a Dash 8-100/200 and Do328 replacement will be required for remote/island operations like Wideroe. If you are currently using a J-41, Saab 340 or EMB-120 then you don't need such a STOL aircraft and the best replacement is most likely the ATR 72 or, if demand is low, the ATR 42 - both offer better performance.

I wouldn't rule out a reintroduction of the Q200 by Viking, it's less costly and risky than a clean sheet design.

Quoting cobra27 (Reply 2):
Embraer should develop one

Embraer have categorically said they will not be returning to the 50 seat and below category.


Dan  
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drgmobile
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Wed May 22, 2013 6:28 pm

As the largest operator of Dash 8-100s with 36 aircraft, Jazz has indicated that it would be interested in a new 37-seat aircraft but I don't think that's enough of a commitment to justify the launch of a new model. On the small capacity end of the range, the Twin Otter is now being built once again by Viking Aircraft That's a 19-seater
 
gr09
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 12:04 am

At the bottom of the range (19 passengers) there should be a new version of L-410 soon.
http://www.let.cz/clanek_295_vyvoj-l410-ng.html?lang=2
 
Viscount724
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 12:38 am

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 3):
I wouldn't rule out a reintroduction of the Q200 by Viking, it's less costly and risky than a clean sheet design.

Viking owns the type certificates for the DHC-1 through -7 only, not the Dash 8.
 
PlymSpotter
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 1:25 am

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 6):
Viking owns the type certificates for the DHC-1 through -7 only, not the Dash 8.

Bombardier stated they have no intention to return to the Q200 market size, but it doesn't take a giant leap of the imagination to consider that they would sell the type or license production to someone who would. There is no competition between a Q200 size aircraft and any current Bombardier products, so unless they have something planned for the future it would be another revenue stream.


Dan  
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KarlB737
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 1:52 am

Quoting Andrensn (Thread starter):
I feel that unless a manufacturer is able to create a plane to replace aging aircraft of this size

Similar threads on this subject in the past have indicated that you can still get an E-120.
 
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TWA772LR
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 2:46 am

Maybe Pilatus is willing to step up to the plate?
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macsog6
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 3:01 am

With Beech dropping out of the jet business, would they consider putting the B1900D back into production after updating it? The C model faced pax dislike due to the low cabin ceiling, but the D model, whilst a bit awkward looking, was nice to fly.
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hawaiian717
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 3:31 am

US Airways has openly stated they're looking for a small and slow prop. Manufacturers don't seem to want to build one.

http://crankyflier.com/2013/04/25/ac...and-new-york-to-american-and-more/
 
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Francoflier
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 6:06 am

Quoting gr09 (Reply 5):
At the bottom of the range (19 passengers) there should be a new version of L-410 soon.

The LET 410 is a great little aircraft. Very underrated due to its Soviet roots, but a new version equipped with recognizably named equipment and engines would hopefully muster more interest in the west.
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bomber996
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 6:23 am

Quoting hawaiian717 (Reply 11):

US Airways has openly stated they're looking for a small and slow prop. Manufacturers don't seem to want to build one.

http://crankyflier.com/2013/04/25/ac...more/

Very interesting link.... Thanks for sharing!!

Peace   
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planemaker
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 6:24 am

Quoting hawaiian717 (Reply 11):
US Airways has openly stated they're looking for a small and slow prop. Manufacturers don't seem to want to build one.

They can always buy the Dornier 228NG.
Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. - A. Einstein
 
gr09
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 6:50 am

Quoting francoflier (Reply 12):
Very underrated due to its Soviet roots

The L410 project was initiated based on a demand from Russia looking for an An-2 replacement and Aeroflot was it's biggest customer but the plane itself was designed and manufactured in Czechoslovakia.

I also with it would sell better in the West, let's see how successful the L410NG will be.
 
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seahawk
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 6:58 am

Do228 is too small. On the other hand I wonder if AA could not do with the ATR 42-600.
 
yenne09
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 1:07 pm

In eearlier thread this subject has been discussed a lot. There are many new versions of older aircraft already or that will be ready soon in the category up to 19 aircraft:

1)up to 9 seats: Britten-Norman Turbo-Islander (UK), Evektor EV-55 Outback (Czhek republic), Vulcanair A-Viator (Italy),

2)10-19 seats: Dirgantara N-219 (Indonesia), Gipps Aero GA-18 (a kind of new Nomad) (Australia) ,
Harbin Y-12F (China), Let 410 NG (Czhek Rep.), NAL Saras (India), PZL M-28 Skytruck (Poland),
Technoavia Rysachok (Russia), RUAG Do 228NG (very expensive) (Swiss-Germany),
Viking Twin Otter 400.
3)70-90: PT Ilthabie/PT Eagle Cap «New 70-90 pax aircraft (Enlarged N-250?) (indonesia)

Unfortunately, up to now theris is no new project bet 21 and 50 pax. It seems for a time that Saab was looking to return to commercial aviation but there is no confirmation of that.
 
AirbusA6
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 2:56 pm

One problem is that everyone has become obsessed with regional jets, thus when countries want to start or reboot their aviation industry, it's the overcrowded RJ market they target. An-148, Mitsubishi MRJ, the Superjet, the ARJ-21, the larger C series etc. Even India is targetting a new RJ.

If one of them had decided to produce an all new 30-40 seater prop, they'd have a whole segment to themselves. Not massive sales, but steady sales and a good way to build up a customer base. After all Embraer worked their way up from small props, and it worked well for them!
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TWA772LR
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 3:38 pm

Quoting AirbusA6 (Reply 18):
One problem is that everyone has become obsessed with regional jets,

But with everyone realizing they are a money pit, the worlds RJ fleet will be back to almost nothing but 70+ seaters, with 50 seaters here-and-there.

The turboprop will regain the throne of most profitable regional aircraft, albeit in about 10-20 years.
Beauty is watching a 787 bank to make a short final. Bliss is watching that 787 with a good beer. Nirvana is all of that with a beautiful woman on your side.
 
JoeCanuck
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 8:53 pm

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 6):

Viking owns the type certificates for the DHC-1 through -7 only, not the Dash 8.

I would be willing to be that BBD would sell the rights for the 100/200/300.

Quoting macsog6 (Reply 10):
With Beech dropping out of the jet business, would they consider putting the B1900D back into production after updating it? The C model faced pax dislike due to the low cabin ceiling, but the D model, whilst a bit awkward looking, was nice to fly.

They still make the King Air, and there is some commonality there so I would venture that it's possible.

One problem is that these turbo props last forever, and there are so many out there...though fewer every year.
At some point, the used supply will shrink enough for new planes to be worthwhile.

Another problem is the price of fuel. People will only pay so much money to fly on a little plane and the CASM is just low enough to make it pay.
What the...?
 
freeze3192
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 9:00 pm

The CommutAir President/Owner recently spoke at an RAA conference and mentioned this very subject:

Quote:
Asked about using out-of-production aircraft, Sullivan noted that those in the CommutAir fleet “have had about 30,000 hours of operation, so they’re pretty early in their life cycle”. That does not stop him from wanting a more modern replacement though. “I could use one now. I would be delighted to hear that someone was going to produce a 30-50 seat turboprop with modern technology, materials, and maintenance schedules. We haven’t counted out the ATR 42, but we don’t like the idea of just a single source.”
http://www.hmgaerospace.com/news/show/5265

I think Bombardier would do very well with an updated Q200/Q300 with new engines and avionics. There was a thread a few months back about them considering starting the line back up again, but I think someone claimed that the tooling was destroyed. Who knows. Either way, there's a market for a new 19-50 seat turboprop. Just takes a manufacturer to realize it.
"A passenger bets his life that his pilot is a worthy heir to an ancient tradition of excellence and professionalism."
 
panais
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 9:19 pm

What engine? any new 40-50 seater, needs to be able to beat the CASM of the MRJ and the E-175 neo.
 
JoeCanuck
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Thu May 23, 2013 9:38 pm

Quoting panais (Reply 22):
What engine? any new 40-50 seater, needs to be able to beat the CASM of the MRJ and the E-175 neo.

CASM isn't everything. If you only have 30 passengers, the great CASM of those extra seats is just extra expense.
What the...?
 
YVRLTN
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 1:30 am

Quoting planemaker (Reply 14):
They can always buy the Dornier 228NG.

If RUAG can build the 228, is there anything to stop them building the 328? Also you should be able to confirm the truth of the below which I have seen stated several times?

Quoting KarlB737 (Reply 8):
Similar threads on this subject in the past have indicated that you can still get an E-120.
Quoting panais (Reply 22):
What engine?

If PWC cant uprate the PT6A further, Im sure they would offer the PW118 which powers the EMB120 still.

Quoting francoflier (Reply 12):
The LET 410 is a great little aircraft. Very underrated due to its Soviet roots, but a new version equipped with recognizably named equipment and engines would hopefully muster more interest in the west.
Quoting drgmobile (Reply 4):
As the largest operator of Dash 8-100s with 36 aircraft, Jazz has indicated that it would be interested in a new 37-seat aircraft but I don't think that's enough of a commitment to justify the launch of a new model. On the small capacity end of the range, the Twin Otter is now being built once again by Viking Aircraft That's a 19-seater

Its an interesting conundrum for Jazz. Q400's are coming in, but as CRJ replacements. The aircraft is far too large for many of the routes.

The main issue I think is that these types are generally operated by second tier carriers like 8P and Hawkair in YVR for example, who dont have the money to buy new metal. They are already operating hand me downs, so when there are no more left Im not sure what they will do. 8P's 1900C's are 28 years old, and the "new" Saab's which replaced the Shorts (which were not much younger and already largely out of service...) are not far behind as early c/n's. Theres no way they can afford a new RUAG 228 or an ATR.
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briboy
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 1:39 am

BBD has a rebuild program for the Dash-8
http://www.bombardier.ca/en/aerospac...ses/details?docID=0901260d800c2ab8

"Bombardier Commercial Aircraft has launched its Extended Service Program (ESP) to extend the economic life of the Dash 8-100 turboprop to 120,000 flight cycles from the original 80,000 flight cycles."
next up: YYC, SFO, SYD, AKL, WLG, CMB, BKK, SIN, FRA, VCE, JFK
 
PlymSpotter
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 2:09 am

Quoting briboy (Reply 25):
BBD has a rebuild program for the Dash-8
http://www.bombardier.ca/en/aerospac...ses/details?docID=0901260d800c2ab8

"Bombardier Commercial Aircraft has launched its Extended Service Program (ESP) to extend the economic life of the Dash 8-100 turboprop to 120,000 flight cycles from the original 80,000 flight cycles."

That kicks the ball further down the road, but then what? I know in theory it gives the aircraft 50% more life, but most are likely to be withdrawn well before then as they generally become life expired and costly to maintain.


Dan  
...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
 
YVRLTN
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 4:15 am

Quoting YVRLTN (Reply 24):
Quoting francoflier (Reply 12):
The LET 410 is a great little aircraft. Very underrated due to its Soviet roots, but a new version equipped with recognizably named equipment and engines would hopefully muster more interest in the west.
Quoting drgmobile (Reply 4):

Meant to add the L410 has operated in the UK with a couple of carriers now for a while with little negative result.
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RyanairGuru
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 4:47 am

Quoting YVRLTN (Reply 24):
Theres no way they can afford a new RUAG 228 or an ATR.

I believe that this is the biggest problem. The larger carriers are more interested in the ATR/Q400 (UA, AC, QF, NZ etc) and while they do operate smaller props along side them, the biggest market is among small airlines that are flying PSO routes in the Canadian Tundra or Australian Outback (or similar markets).

Thinking here in Australia, Rex, Skytrans, and Brindabella are going to need to replace the SF3/8-100/J41 at some point, but I can't see what they would buy. The best they could do is buy ex-AA SF3 or ex-DL E120 out of storage, as those aircraft were relatively young when they were retired.
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AirNovaBAe146
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 6:01 am

Quoting JoeCanuck (Reply 20):
One problem is that these turbo props last forever, and there are so many out there...though fewer every year.
At some point, the used supply will shrink enough for new planes to be worthwhile.

How big is the supply of Dash 8/J41s/SF340s/ATR42s/D328Props/E120s and even B1900/J31&J32s/D228Prop on the used aircraft market? I know in the last decade several US airlines (Comair, ASA, ACA, PSA, Mesaba, Pinnacle) have parked huge numbers of those type and many are just sitting around waiting for a buyer. As you noted, once the supply shrinks enough, then basic economics dictate something new will come along.
 
JoeCanuck
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 6:25 am

Quoting AirNovaBAe146 (Reply 29):

There must be a glut at the moment because nobody is ordering them. It's easy to say you'd like some new aircraft...but all it takes is one order to make it real.

BBD would be thrilled to sell a few Dash 8-200/300's...or Beach with the 1900D, or anyone who can still make what was a desirable aircraft.

When the market becomes available, somebody will make them...like Viking has done with the Twin Otter.
What the...?
 
silentbob
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 6:32 am

Quoting JoeCanuck (Reply 30):
BBD would be thrilled to sell a few Dash 8-200/300's

If that were the case, they wouldn't have shut down the line
 
AirNovaBAe146
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 6:44 am

Quoting JoeCanuck (Reply 30):
There must be a glut at the moment because nobody is ordering them. It's easy to say you'd like some new aircraft...but all it takes is one order to make it real.

I've been working in aviation in third world countries for the last ~6 years or so. Anytime an airline or charter operator acquires something "new" to them, it usually is an old Dash 8 or E120 or B1900 from Piedmont or CommutAir or ASA. From talking to the people at the receiving end, they make it seem like there is no shortage of available options.

But the next decade will be interesting, with Jazz and Piedmont having to focus on replacement for their mega Dash 8 fleets. Maybe American Eagle will want to get back into the turboprop game as well.
 
JoeCanuck
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 9:12 am

Quoting silentbob (Reply 31):

If that were the case, they wouldn't have shut down the line

They would be thrilled to make their aircraft. They stopped building them because customers stopped buying them. If customer decide they want them again, BBD will probably make them again.
What the...?
 
YLWbased
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 9:29 am

There is the DHC6-400, it seats 20.

YLWbased
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PlymSpotter
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 10:18 am

Quoting JoeCanuck (Reply 33):
They would be thrilled to make their aircraft. They stopped building them because customers stopped buying them. If customer decide they want them again, BBD will probably make them again.

Perhaps long term, but Bombardier have made it very clear that for now the Q200/300 line is closed and will remain that way for the foreseeable future.


Dan  
...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
 
BMED
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 12:52 pm

One UK company that jumps to mind is Loganair. With a fleet of SAAB 340s they will need replacing an there isn't a need to jump to anything larger so what is available to them!
Living the jetset life! No better way to be
 
PlymSpotter
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 12:58 pm

Quoting BMED (Reply 36):

One UK company that jumps to mind is Loganair. With a fleet of SAAB 340s they will need replacing an there isn't a need to jump to anything larger so what is available to them!

They have a small fleet of Do 328s - this is a contender, it's still a younger aircraft than the Saabs. Otherwise I suspect the ATR 42 would be their choice. It has much better runway performance than the Saab 340 and similar economics but with more available seats.


Dan  
...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
 
silentbob
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 6:07 pm

All of the Colgan/Mesaba Saabs that were retired must be available if someone really wanted them.
 
NWAROOSTER
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Fri May 24, 2013 11:12 pm

If my information is correct, there are only about two Saab 340B+ aircraft in storage. They were built between 1994 and 1999. The Saab 340B was built from about 1991 though 1994. There are several of these that are in "storage"and what is the condition of these aircraft maybe very questionable. You are basically looking at a twenty year old aircraft and much older if you want fly the even older Saab 340A, which still have a high percentage of them that are flying. Most will continue flying as no replacement is currently being built or studied. When they run out of cycles and also are needing heavy maintenance, they will go the way of the foo-doo bird.   
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SXDFC
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Fri May 24, 2013 11:23 pm

How about a small freighter that's a twin engine/ prop that could be use as a Beech 99 replacement. I know many people here say pages don't care, but some of those Ameriflight 99's look ancient!
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
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ssteve
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Sat May 25, 2013 1:00 am

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 35):
Perhaps long term, but Bombardier have made it very clear that for now the Q200/300 line is closed and will remain that way for the foreseeable future.

I has sounded to me like any reoffer of the 200/300 would be essentially a shrink of the Q400. And generally, shrinks suck. They advertise the Q400 as having a breakeven at 1/3rd full. That's not necessarily worse than a 50-seater with a breakeven at 1/2 full, then.
 
JoeCanuck
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Sat May 25, 2013 1:46 am

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 35):
Perhaps long term, but Bombardier have made it very clear that for now the Q200/300 line is closed and will remain that way for the foreseeable future.

All it takes is a large enough order and BBD could have the jigs dusted off in no time. They certainly aren't going to do it on spec. The already shuttered the line because of a lack of sales and the ATR42-600 isn't exactly flying off of the shelves.

There just isn't a market yet...and probably won't be for at least a decade. By then, who knows what tech might be available?
What the...?
 
93Sierra
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Sat May 25, 2013 1:48 am

There isn't and hasn't been a replacement for the Beech 1900. The "new" aircraft offered by Viking isn't new, its 40 plus years old with a glass cockpit, not to mention its slow as a dog and the Beech 1900 is way more efficient and a better platform.

The 328 prop was way ahead of its time and is a very quick and nice aircraft, just to expensive to buy. The Saab 2000 albeit larger than what we are talking about was in the same boat.

Looking back, the flying shed, the SD-360, was well liked by airlines for having a large aircraft cabin feel, great dispatch reliability and low operating costs....its only downsize was its slow speed.

An updated EMB 120 platform IMHO would be a great performer. With the backing of a large company like EMB and todays technology it doesn't seem that hard to imagine the possible improvements.
 
JoeCanuck
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Sat May 25, 2013 1:55 am

Quoting 93Sierra (Reply 43):

You're right on all counts...and all it takes is orders from airlines...which isn't happening. Beach probably would have little trouble restarting the 1900D line, but nobody is asking for them, or any other small turboprop twin.

Either nobody has the money to buy new or the market is saturated. Either way, you don't build what isn't wanted.
What the...?
 
Boeing717200
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Sat May 25, 2013 2:10 am

The ATR-42 fills this void if an airline really needs something under 60 seats. I don't think we'll ever see a 19 seater again with the new weight requirements and to be honest, the economics of the 30 seater have imploded in the same way the 50 seat RJ. It just costs too much for the airframe. I think the first EMB-120s went out the door for just under $4 million. A new one would cost over $10 million. An ATR-42 ain't cheap either. Those list around $15 million.
 
flyinggoat
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Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Sat May 25, 2013 2:46 am

I'd like to see Embraer produce a prop similar to their 123. Offer it in 20, 35, and 50 seat variants. It could be heavily based on the current ERJ-135, but with new wings and, of course, new engines. Think of it as a more fuel efficient, next gen ERJ-135/145.

Most of the flying public probably wouldn't notice the props on the rear, and the fear of flying on an "old prop" should be greatly reduced.

[Edited 2013-05-24 19:55:32]
 
YXwatcherMKE
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Joined: Sat May 05, 2007 3:06 pm

Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Sat May 25, 2013 3:24 am

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 3):
Quoting briboy (Reply 25):

That program is great for the airlines that have the A/C. But what does the that do for the airline that is looking for new A/C to replace old and tired A/C? Nothing, now if they were to bring that line back into production with the upgrades I would think there would be several airlines that would be knocking on Bombardier Sales Department door asking to buy a number of the A/C. But Bombardier has made it clear that they are not willing to do that, I think that is shortsighted on their part.

Quoting FlyingGoat (Reply 46):
I'd like to see Embraer produce a prop similar to their 123. Offer it in 20, 35, and 50 seat variants. It could be heavily based on the current EMB-135, but with new wings and, of course, new engines. Think of it as a more fuel efficient, next gen EMB-135/145.

Most of the flying public probably wouldn't notice the props on the rear, and the fear of flying on an "old prop" should be greatly reduced.

I agree a great deal with your comment here. They need to make an effort to make the A/C look like a Jet or at least look more modern so that the flying public feel more comfortable about boarding the A/C.
I know that there many routes/cities in the Midwest and Rocky Mountain region that have lost or could lose air service if they lose there EAS status that would benefit by these A/C. And here is another case of shortsightedness on the part of the manufacturer. What really needs to happen is the airlines have to start really making it known loud and clear that they want a prop replacement, and soon.
I miss the 60's & 70's when you felt like a guest on the plane not cattle like today
 
columba
Posts: 5045
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 10:12 pm

Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Sat May 25, 2013 4:53 am

Wasn´t there a rumor that Saab wants to enter the regional market again ?
It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
 
masseybrown
Posts: 4425
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:40 pm

Need For New 19-40 Seater Aircraft?

Sat May 25, 2013 5:20 am

New turboprops have good operating costs but seemingly they cannot be built cheaply enough; ownership costs sink a lot of potential deals.

A company called Nextant is remanufacturing the Beechjet/Hawker 400 adding new engines, new avionics, and airframe tweaking. Nextant says the result is added range, speed, and improved fuel burn at half the price of a new plane; they got FAA as well as non-US certifications and are in production with orders for about 175 of the rebuilt craft so far.

I wonder if there is a fifty-or-fewer seat passenger aircraft that could benefit from similar treatment - like the successful upgrading of old Convair 240/340/440s to 580/600/640 models.