atlflyer
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Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 2:50 pm

"We're going to keep investing in New York," says Anderson. "We're doing another $300 million in investment here and one day we want to build the third phase of this facility."

The third phase will allow Delta to consolidate all of its operations in terminal 4, says Gail Grimmett, senior vice-president for New York, on the sidelines of the event. The airline will still operate some select mainline flights from terminal 2 after phase two opens, she explains.

Delta is in discussions with the PANYNJ and JFK IAT regarding the third phase but has yet to determine a timeline the project, she says.

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...sion-announces-third-phase-386342/

Also, from a 2010 document from the PA of NY/NJ, it looks like they are on schedule...Phase Iii will be a head house expansion and expansion of Concourse A.

http://www.panynj.gov/corporate-info...ion/pdf/aug_5_2010_ops_Minutes.pdf
 
cokepopper
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 3:07 pm

Phase III should look something like this minus the old Term2 (now C60-70) and the walkway
 
DL747400
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 3:19 pm

Quoting cokepopper (Reply 1):
Phase III should look something like this minus the old Term2 (now C60-70) and the walkway

Negative. The pic you show above reflects what a completion of Phase 2 will look like except there will be no T4-T2 connector. Phase 3 will include new elements not reflected in your pic.
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jfklganyc
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 3:25 pm

Very cool indeed.

T2 can not be long for this world.

I am noticing on the AirTrain that they have all checkin for Delta at T4 now.

That means that a good chunk of people are taking a bus.

This is not good...and I am sure they will move to get those flights into T4 sooner rather than later
 
EricR
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 3:25 pm

Quoting DL747400 (Reply 2):

I thought phase III is the extension of T4A, which is reflected in the above picture. What else is phase III supposed to include?
 
cokepopper
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 3:26 pm

This picture show the expanded Concourse A, and as I mentioned Minus the walkway and connector
 
DL747400
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 3:34 pm

Quoting cokepopper (Reply 5):
This picture show the expanded Concourse A, and as I mentioned Minus the walkway and connector

Yes, but you are calling this the completed Phase 3 when this is actually the completed Phase 2. There are new renderings coming soon from PANYNJ / JFK IAT which will reflect a completed Phase 3.
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cokepopper
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 3:40 pm

Quoting DL747400 (Reply 6):
Yes, but you are calling this the completed Phase 3

Actually I'm not.
What I wrote on the top of the picture is:
"Phase III should look something like this minus the old Term2 (now C60-70) and the walkway"

Again this picture is the only one for now that gives an IDEA what phase III should look like with
an EXPANDED Concourse A thats all.
 
atlflyer
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 4:06 pm

Quoting DL747400 (Reply 6):

How is this completed Phase II? Concourse A is not being touched during Phase II...
 
atlflyer
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 4:14 pm

Here is what a completed Phase II will look like...

http://delta.thedigitalcenter.com/as.../29317-jfk-with-phase-ii-expansion
 
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mayor
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 4:16 pm

Quoting Atlflyer (Reply 8):
How is this completed Phase II? Concourse A is not being touched during Phase II...

So, which one is Concourse "B" and which is "A", again? Is JFK designating them backwards?
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atlflyer
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 4:26 pm

Quoting mayor (Reply 10):

In the photo, Concourse A is on the right, B on the left.

They are not backwards. When you enter the Terminal, Concourse A starts on the left and B on the right.
 
DL747400
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 4:54 pm

Quoting Atlflyer (Reply 8):
How is this completed Phase II? Concourse A is not being touched during Phase II...

Forget T4A. Focusing exclusively on T4B, the rendering above reflects a completed Phase 2, minus the connector to T2. More renderings coming soon to clarify all.
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 4:55 pm

I think the most disputable comment in the article is:

Quote:

The opening today begins to level the playing field between Delta, American Airlines and United Airlines in terms of terminal facilities at New York's three airports. Terminal 3 at JFK has long been derided a decrepit and functionally obsolete, despite its historical importance as the Pan Am Worldport when it opened in 1960.

I'd say it's a tiny step, no where near large enough to say it's starting to level the playing field with AA and UA's facilities in NYC.

We're only now seeing the completion of Phase I, and Phase II is described as "The 6,968 square metre phase two includes the addition of an 11-gate regional aircraft facility on concourse B.", thusly:

Quoting Atlflyer (Reply 9):
Here is what a completed Phase II will look like...

http://delta.thedigitalcenter.com/as.../29317-jfk-with-phase-ii-expansion

so another $175 mil and a few more years added just to put 11 RJ gates at the end of the horrendously long Concourse B, which already generates comments such as:

Quote:

"I did need a plane ride to get from the entrance to here today," says US congressman Joseph Crowley, joking about the walk to gate B41 - the last on the concourse - at the event.

And then the Phase III which is truly needed to get to approach that level playing field, which should take the same order of magnitude of spending as did Phase I, i.e. $1.2B, and result in a facility far better than today yet IMHO still inferior to what AA already has at JFK and UA already has at EWR, in terms of layout and efficiency.

In the mean time we read:

Quote:

United announced at least $150 million in investments to the check-in, gate and baggage systems in terminal C at Newark Liberty International airport on 21 May. The move was seen by many industry followers as an attempt to distract from Delta's terminal 4 opening.

This shows that the competition can chose to improve their already superior facilities with far less spending than DL is having to do just to appear to (but IMHO not quite reach) the level playing field.
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 5:46 pm

Thunderclouds are making the sound "tram.
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EricR
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 8:44 pm

Quote:

"I did need a plane ride to get from the entrance to here today," says US congressman Joseph Crowley, joking about the walk to gate B41 - the last on the concourse - at the event.

I am amazed at how many people complain about walking. You'll be on a plane for the next several hours. A walk will do you and your waistline some good.
 
BN747
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 9:31 pm




Sorry.. it's just a little difficult to get all excited about a 1960s design reintroduced in 2013.

The comment by the congressman of needing a plane to get from the entrance to the gate is already on everyone's mind and will become a slogan of sorts to be use against Delta by rivals in the future - count on it.

BN747

[Edited 2013-05-25 15:28:20]
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atlflyer
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 9:52 pm

 
EricR
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 9:55 pm

Quoting BN747 (Reply 16):

The comment by the congressman of needing a plane to get from the entrance to the gate is already on everyone's mind will become slogan of sorts to use against Delta by rivals - count on it.

Oh, do you mean the same way that competitors have created slogans about the long walk at ORD when someone has on UA has to go from C31 to gate B2 or someone on AA that has to go from gate G21 to L8.

No competitor is going to waste their time and dollars on something so trivial, especially when all large carriers face this issue at one or more of their hubs. This is called making an issue out of a non-issue.
 
BN747
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 10:07 pm

Quoting EricR (Reply 18):
No competitor is going to waste their time and dollars on something so trivial, especially when all large carriers face this issue at one or more of their hubs. This is called making an issue out of a non-issue.

No competitor???

..you must be joking! All carriers these days are on the Southwest level of thinking .. aka anything goes and no one is above the fray!

The 1st commercial will show an 17yo kid with a backpack checking in... and he's sent a text saying 'congrats, now that you're 65, you're eligible for social security" .. as we see an old man checking in to board the pax version of a space shuttle!

BN747
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PanAm1971
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sat May 25, 2013 10:12 pm

I can't get over how boring this all looks. It's as though it was designed by the Borg.
 
YYZAMS
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 12:03 am

Quoting EricR (Reply 15):
I am amazed at how many people complain about walking. You'll be on a plane for the next several hours. A walk will do you and your waistline some good.

haha! Agreed! Next thing you know they want the plane to drop them off at their house!
 
FWAERJ
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 12:25 am

Quoting EricR (Reply 18):
Oh, do you mean the same way that competitors have created slogans about the long walk at ORD when someone has on UA has to go from C31 to gate B2 or someone on AA that has to go from gate G21 to L8.

Or worse... the walk on UA where you go from Gate F11A to Gate C21 after your connecting flight into ORD was delayed by an hour and 15 minutes, where you have 20 minutes to make your connection from F11A to C21.

Trust me - it's bad, and I had to do it once, almost missing my connection in the process.
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Cubsrule
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 1:37 am

Quoting EricR (Reply 18):
Oh, do you mean the same way that competitors have created slogans about the long walk at ORD when someone has on UA has to go from C31 to gate B2 or someone on AA that has to go from gate G21 to L8.

No, it's a little different at ORD because everyone's walks are about the same. New Yorkers are used to short walks at all three airports, so a big terminal is something that is basically new (even EWR C--the largest single terminal in NYC--is compact compared to, say, MSP Lindbergh or DTW MacNamara). Will it make much difference? I can't argue that it will; maybe the odd passenger who flies only to Los Angeles will prefer UA for the ease of Terminal 7 as opposed to Terminal 4, but how many passengers fly to only one place?
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DL747400
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 2:12 am

Quoting Atlflyer (Reply 17):
This is not a completed phase II

Yes, that is a completed Phase 2.

Phase 3 will include some changes to be reflected in new renderings.
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rwy04lga
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 2:52 am

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 23):
even EWR C--the largest single terminal in NYC

EWR is not in NYC. Saying it over and over will not make it so.
Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
 
EricR
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 3:35 am

Quoting BN747 (Reply 19):

No competitor???

..you must be joking! All carriers these days are on the Southwest level of thinking .. aka anything goes and no one is above the fray!

The 1st commercial will show an 17yo kid with a backpack checking in... and he's sent a text saying 'congrats, now that you're 65, you're eligible for social security" .. as we see an old man checking in to board the pax version of a space shuttle!

Yup.......this is such a big issue that it is going to cause DL to lose significant share in NY because someone has to walk to their gate (heaven forbid someone has to walk). Walking to a gate is not unique to DL, but keep exploiting an insignificant issue if it makes you feel better.

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 23):

No, it's a little different at ORD because everyone's walks are about the same. New Yorkers are used to short walks at all three airports, so a big terminal is something that is basically new

.

Apparently you missed the larger point. The airport you compare it to is irrelevant. Furthermore, citizens of NYC probably are the most accustomed to walking out of any major US metro area. Therefore, while the concourse itself may be longer than other terminals, walking that distance is nothing new to New Yorkers.

[Edited 2013-05-25 21:02:46]
 
questions
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 4:08 am

When Phase 3, the extension of T4A, will there be an underground walkway between concourses A and B? Or will connecting passengers have to walk through the main terminal/ head house?
 
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jfklganyc
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 6:05 am

Quoting EricR (Reply 26):

Apparently you missed the larger point. The airport you compare it to is irrelevant. Furthermore, citizens of NYC probably are the most accustomed to walking out of any major US metro area. Therefore, while the concourse itself may be longer than other terminals, walking that distance is nothing new to New Yorkers.

I personally think the AA mess with the escalator down to walkway to escalator up is much worse. Annoying and slow. And then you get to the midfield concourse and you have a good walk to the right or left if you are unlucky.
 
ikramerica
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 6:25 am

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 28):

Agreed. The first and last time I was at AA JFK after the rebuild I was frustrated by that design, but even worse, AA had decided to sell the entire space to Microsoft, who made it a visual assault torture chamber you had no way to avoid. Has AA thought better of alienating their customers to sell someone else's product or do they still allow advertisers to hijack that space in an "in your face" manner.
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mnik101
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 8:33 am

What strikes me as odd is that $1.2 billion, just to extend T4! and it just a really long concourse extension, not a new terminal.

I could understand the cost if it were part of a phased project to build a new separate terminal to replace T2 and T3 with one stand alone building, but that's not what has happened.
 
PIEAvantiP180
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 12:08 pm

Quoting mnik101 (Reply 30):

$1.2B did not just buy 9 extra gates at the end of B concourse. The terminal building it self went thru a renovation and expansion. Also a very good portion of that money will go into demolishing and paving over T3 site. From what i have read disposal and clean up of hazardous materials from T3 site will be one of the major expenses. Another factor to consider is that the construction was done with union labor that tends to be more costly especially in NY then non union labor, its just the cost of doing business in NYC these days. If this job was done in Tampa FL where I live the labor costs alone would probably be half of what they are paying workers at JFK.
 
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jfklganyc
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 1:39 pm

They did quite a bit of work to the head house, especially on the lower level and AirTrain level

Expanded customs and immigration area, new baggage claim, new security checkpoint.

The actual departures hall was not expanded (much to my chagrin) but everything else was.
 
Cubsrule
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 6:24 pm

Quoting EricR (Reply 26):
Apparently you missed the larger point.

Not at all. Had you bothered to read the rest of my post, you'd see that I came to the same conclusion.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
BN747
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 8:49 pm

Quoting EricR (Reply 26):
Yup.......this is such a big issue that it is going to cause DL to lose significant share in NY because someone has to walk to their gate (heaven forbid someone has to walk).

I'm fit to dash it back n forth, but many people will not be, and trust me on this travellers fit or not - notice long corridors at certain airports! THIS ONE will be in the record books and is going to draw a lot of notice to those who tell themselves "I'm never coming thru this terminal again"...or 'I'm going to avoid this at all cost' . Frequent travelers notice these things regardless of how insignificant you think it is.

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 31):
nother factor to consider is that the construction was done with union labor that tends to be more costly especially in NY then non union labor, its just the cost of doing business in NYC these days.

Yep! That's were most of that 1.2 Bil went... payroll!

This is like opening up a can coke.. and all the fizz is gone. ... this perfectly describes 'all over the place'. Good Luck Delta-JFK.. you're gonna need it

BN747
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ldvaviation
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 9:15 pm

Quoting Revelation (Reply 13):
This shows that the competition can chose to improve their already superior facilities with far less spending than DL is having to do just to appear to (but IMHO not quite reach) the level playing field.

As the US airlines return to competing with products, rather than on price, the layout and appearance of their facilities will matter more and more to their customers, specifically HVC"s,

And, while the facile argument today is that most customers don't care about the long walks, the narrow passageways, low ceilings, bad food choices, and cramped hold rooms, that argument is likely to lose some of its cogency as airports in such places from Sacramento to RDU (with their superior architecture and customer experience) begin to outshine airports in larger, more prominent cities.

At that point, it will be interesting to see what the Big 4 US airlines do about their main facilities, the decrepit as well as the poorly designed. As you indicated, at least two of them have much more to work with. That is not just true in NYC. See LAX and their other hubs.
 
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Sun May 26, 2013 10:47 pm

Quoting mnik101 (Reply 30):
I could understand the cost if it were part of a phased project to build a new separate terminal to replace T2 and T3 with one stand alone building, but that's not what has happened.

Isn't that the plan? Isn't that why this was Phase I and we have Phases II and III to come to do exactly what you've described?
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
PIEAvantiP180
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 12:46 am

Quoting BN747 (Reply 34):
Yep! That's were most of that 1.2 Bil went... payroll!

Dude no need for personal attacks. You might need to go back to an English course or two and learn reading comprehension. Where in that paragraph did I say payroll was where most of $1.2B went to. I clearly stated that it was part of the eqasion along with the actual expansion of T4 and demolition and disposal of materials form T3. Like I said union labor rates are usually higher then non union construction jobs, I did not say that being union was bad or that people don't deserve to make the most amount of money they can get. As I stated if this job was done in FL it would probably be less then $1.2B. You prove me wrong on anything I have stated and ill back of my statements.

[Edited 2013-05-26 18:12:50]

[Edited 2013-05-26 18:13:18]
 
mnik101
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 12:46 am

Quoting mayor (Reply 36):
Quoting mnik101 (Reply 30):
I could understand the cost if it were part of a phased project to build a new separate terminal to replace T2 and T3 with one stand alone building, but that's not what has happened.

Isn't that the plan? Isn't that why this was Phase I and we have Phases II and III to come to do exactly what you've described?

Phase 1 alone was $1.2 billion. and it was just an expansion and rehab job of T4. To me it still seem like a lot of money for a pretty modest gain, even when you factor in the cost of doing business in NYC and the haz-mat abatement, demolition, and paving over of T3.

Just think they should have gotten a lot more for the money, and just don't' think it very efficient way of getting people to and from there planes given the length of the concourse.
 
Cubsrule
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 1:41 am

Quoting LDVAviation (Reply 35):
And, while the facile argument today is that most customers don't care about the long walks, the narrow passageways, low ceilings, bad food choices, and cramped hold rooms, that argument is likely to lose some of its cogency as airports in such places from Sacramento to RDU (with their superior architecture and customer experience) begin to outshine airports in larger, more prominent cities.

The trouble is that New York is, well, New York and as nice as RDU and SMF (and DTW, IND, JAX and all the rest) might be, if I need to go to NYC, they don't do me much good. There are only a handful of decent terminals in NYC, and a couple of them have vocal detractors (see some of the discussion of Terminal 8 in this thread).

I think the Terminal 2/3 complex was so bad that some people were actively avoiding Delta. I know I avoided JFK connections in the past, instead opting for some other sub-optimal nearby locales (IAD, EWR). I'm much less likely to avoid JFK now. That's the point, not to have a Taj Mahal.
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RobertS975
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 1:58 am

I have been through the DL JFK facility many times and here were my peeves in no particular order: often arriving on an RJ from BOS, I detested having to lug my roll aboard piece up the stairs on those rinky dink gate positions on the back end of T2. The CBP facility has seen better days, sometimes escalators working, sometimes not. And the post CBP luggage re-check was too small and so was the post-CBP TSA check to get to your connecting flight. I have disliked the bus ride from T2/T3 over to T4, but in reality, that is not going away...

BTW, will the new post-CBP TSA security check point have a TSA pre-check line by any chance??
 
BN747
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 2:48 am

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 37):
Quoting BN747 (Reply 34):
Yep! That's were most of that 1.2 Bil went... payroll!

Dude no need for personal attacks

What the hell are you talking 'personal attack'??? I've said nothing to you about you in any shape or form!

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 37):
You might need to go back to an English course or two and learn reading comprehension.

Now that is a personal attack - directed at the speaker (me) and very condescending..care to apologize?

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 37):
Where in that paragraph did I say payroll was where most of $1.2B went to. I clearly stated that it was part of the eqasion along with the actual expansion of T4 and demolition and disposal of materials form T3.

I never said you did, that is my assertion that it is payroll and mine alone.

I guarantee you if you could get your hands on a ledger disclosing full accounting of the 1.2 billion is expenditures - 600 million of that will NOT be materials! Payrolls will win out as the #1 item of cost.

New York construction/labor has long championed itemized cost in any category of development right after real estate acquisitions - for decades now! And in this deal there were no real estate acquisitions necessary...so where did the money go???

I sure as hell hope the architect who said "let's extend the piers into super long fingers' did get anything above a C note!

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
PIEAvantiP180
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 2:59 am

Quoting BN747 (Reply 41):

I can admit when I'm wrong, I do apologize how I reacted. I interpreted that statement as that you were taking a pop shot at me for starting that union labor costs were so much and was solely blaming them for the $1.2B cost.
 
BN747
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RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 3:16 am

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 42):
Quoting BN747 (Reply 41):

I can admit when I'm wrong, I do apologize how I reacted. I interpreted that statement as that you were taking a pop shot at me for starting that union labor costs were so much and was solely blaming them for the $1.2B cost.

Thank you, I was fully endorsing your point..which is the spot on truth about NY Labor Cost.

I had a buddy who worked on every bridge (upkeep and overhauls) and many skyscrapers in NYC..and to listen to that guy layout city labor costs was mind-blowing!

BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
questions
Posts: 1144
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2011 4:51 am

RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 3:28 am

I don't understand all the complaining about the length of "finger" T4B. It appears to be about the same length as half of ATL's concourse A or B which do not have moving walkways. And the ceiling height appears about the same!

Granted T4 is neither architecturally significant nor a grand public/people space, however it is vastly more functional and efficient than T3. Which of Delta's domestic hubs/growing focus cities is anything other than a utilitarian transportation centre?

- ATL... no
- JFK... no
- LGA... no
- CVG... no
- DTW... no
- MSP... no
- MEM... no
- SLC... no
- SEA... no
- LAX... no
 
BN747
Posts: 5344
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2002 5:48 am

RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 7:23 am

Quoting questions (Reply 44):
I don't understand all the complaining about the length of "finger" T4B. It appears to be about the same length as half of ATL's concourse A or B which do not have moving walkways

You couldn't be more wrong .. 'same length as HALF of ATL's A or B?


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Count the number of jets for half (or the entire concourse for that matter) and consider that the JFK finger gates are fixed-widebody gates whereas you see what's parked at the ATL gates, no 747s, no A340s, no A380s.
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
cokepopper
Posts: 388
Joined: Wed May 28, 2008 9:44 pm

RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 8:35 am

Quoting BN747 (Reply 45):

Do you have any numbers?
Delta's JFK Term T-4B looks 1/2 the size of Delta's Detroit terminal
 
PIEAvantiP180
Posts: 486
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 6:04 am

RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 11:38 am

Quoting BN747 (Reply 45):
Quoting cokepopper (Reply 46):

Rough estimate using google earth and its measuring feature shows about 2200ft from start to end of T4B concourse, and that will become longer once the 11RJ gates are added on the end, with people movers available in T4B.
DTW south terminal concourse A is roughly 4900ft long overall and we can estimate about 2450ft from center to end, with a automated people mover if you need to go from one end to the other.
By the looks of it ATL concourse A is the longest at about 2400ft long and 1200ft from center line, so if you are connecting from one end of A to the other and as someone mentioned ATL does not have people movers its just about the same walk as if you were to walk from one end of T4B to the other.
 
FlyPNS1
Posts: 5271
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:12 am

RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 1:50 pm

Quoting BN747 (Reply 34):
THIS ONE will be in the record books and is going to draw a lot of notice to those who tell themselves

Try going from a gate like A1 to B30 in ATL.
Or try going from E30 to B12 in CLT.
Or try going from C1 to D20 in IAD.

I'm not saying it's ideal, but there are plenty of other airports with long walks and it's not that big of a problem.
 
panamair
Posts: 3761
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2001 2:24 am

RE: Delta Announces Phase III Of JFK T4

Mon May 27, 2013 2:01 pm

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 47):
Rough estimate using google earth and its measuring feature shows about 2200ft from start to end of T4B concourse, and that will become longer once the 11RJ gates are added on the end, with people movers available in T4B.
DTW south terminal concourse A is roughly 4900ft long overall and we can estimate about 2450ft from center to end, with a automated people mover if you need to go from one end to the other.
By the looks of it ATL concourse A is the longest at about 2400ft long and 1200ft from center line, so if you are connecting from one end of A to the other and as someone mentioned ATL does not have people movers its just about the same walk as if you were to walk from one end of T4B to the other.

Thanks for the facts! I did the walk this past weekend (both international arrivals, as well as departures), the 'feeling' of the length will be different between the two. For departures, there are plenty of distractions along the way (shops, restaurants, etc.) so the walk won't feel long. International arrivals is in a sterile area and the path is pretty much two straight lines, one after another, so it will feel longer to many people. And probably because it's just a plain 'straight-through' walk (without 'distractions' such as an up and then a down escalator to break the monotony), people will feel that it is longer than it really is. Overall, I don't think that it is as bad as many (who have yet to try it) make it out to be.

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 48):
Try going from a gate like A1 to B30 in ATL.
Or try going from E30 to B12 in CLT.
Or try going from C1 to D20 in IAD.

Or in AMS from the B gates to the G gates
Or BRU from the Schengen arrivals just to baggage claim
Or JFK T8 from the extreme of the satellite terminal (say gate 47) to immigration

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