QF175
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Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Mon Jun 03, 2013 11:48 am

G'day and welcome to the Australian Aviation Thread # 74. In the previous thread, the following points were discussed/raised:

* Emirates expresses concern at Perth Airport's lackluster airport infrastructure
* Qantas A330 operations
* Brisbane and Perth Airports - birds eye view
* Rydges Sydney Airport Hotel opens, directly opposite the International Terminal
* Air Niugini leases an Icelandair 757 (which will be operated to Brisbane)
* QantasLink 717s
* Qantas and Emirates agreement
* Rumours about Qantas leasing Emirates aircraft
* Jetstar announces it will take delivery of its first 787 in September
* Qantas 747 operations
* Melbourne Airport masterplan released
* Clive Palmer's new jet revealed with a rather 'Aussie' livery
* Virgin Australia's 737-700s
* Slow progress on construction work at Perth Airport
* Multiple flight diversions to Brisbane & Melbourne Airports due three consecutive days of fog in SYD
* Qantas announces an upgrade of its Perth terminal and facilities
* Possible walk-out by contracted security staff at Perth Airport
* First details on rego for first batch of JQ 787s and Qantas Freight 747-400ERF
* Philippine Airlines returns to Brisbane after a 2 year hiatus
* Turkish Airlines announces further plans regarding their intentions to fly to Sydney in 2014

Australian Aviation Thread # 73
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Mon Jun 03, 2013 11:57 am

QantasLink announces further flight increases from Brisbane (no surprises here!)

Quote:
QantasLink upgrades and improves services on Queensland routes

QantasLink today announced it will deploy larger aircraft and put on additional services on key routes in Queensland from 1 July, meeting the strong demand from Queensland communities and corporate customers.

The announcement includes:

Six additional return flights between Roma and Brisbane per week, increasing the number of seats on this route by 372 seats to 3174 seats.

Key services between Bundaberg and Brisbane upgraded to the faster, larger Q400 74 seat aircraft, which will add 144 seats per week.

An extra return flight between Longreach and Brisbane on Thursday’s, serviced by a Q300 50 seat aircraft, adding 100 seats per week.


QantasLink Executive Manager John Gissing said he was delighted QantasLink is increasing capacity and deploying larger aircraft in Bundaberg, Longreach and Roma.

Continues...

Source

And while on the regional carrier front, some news from Skytrans...

Quote:
THE boss of regional airline Skytrans, which is cutting about 20 staff and has sold three aircraft, remains committed to Cairns as its headquarters and to the 180 staff in the city.

Managing director Simon Wild told The Cairns Post that most of the cutbacks involved 70 staff in Brisbane.

He said the airline was looking for new business as mining charters and State Government work dropped.

The airline has sold three Dash 8 aircraft surplus to its needs for $15 million and is looking to cut about six staff in Cairns and 14 in Brisbane, mainly pilots and flight crews.

Continues...

Source
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Tue Jun 04, 2013 2:45 am

Jetstar has announced details of the B787:

335 seats 21 biz and 314 economy with Panasonic eX2 in seat inflight entertainment system:

http://www.ausbt.com.au/jetstar-deta...g-335-seats-usb-power-touchscreens

First flights will be in November, all A330s replaced by 2015:

http://www.ausbt.com.au/jetstar-to-b...gin-boeing-787-flights-in-november

Thanks
 
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allrite
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Tue Jun 04, 2013 3:35 am

Quoting vhebb (Reply 2):
Jetstar has announced details of the B787:

335 seats 21 biz and 314 economy with Panasonic eX2 in seat inflight entertainment system:

I'm personally happy with a 3x3x3 economy configuration. My small family will get to sit together and I get the window instead of being split up or having to sit in the middle row as is currently the case in the A330. Seatback entertainment is also good. Pity no lie flat business seats as they would be nice for the overnight Japan return flights.
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Tue Jun 04, 2013 10:46 am

Quoting vhebb (Reply 2):
Jetstar has announced details of the B787:

335 seats 21 biz and 314 economy with Panasonic eX2 in seat inflight entertainment system:

http://australianaviation.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/IMG_1181.jpg

Due To Be Delivered September 2013

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CXfirst
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Tue Jun 04, 2013 4:43 pm

Quoting vhebb (Reply 2):
335 seats 21 biz and 314 economy

That is a tight configuration. Compare it to Norwegian, which is another low cost carrier, they have 32 premium economy seats (also in 2-3-2) config, but only 259 Y seats, and people commented on that being tight. So, with a slightly larger premium cabin (1 and a half rows more), they have more than 50 less Y-class seats.

Thompson, another tight configuration airline, has 291 total seats as well. They have more premium seats (49), but those are in 2-3-2 with only 38 inches in pitch, so I'd expect Jetstar premium to be a bit spacier.

So, overall, Jetstar has 44 seats more than the other 2 low-cost airlines, with really just a marginally smaller premium cabin (at least that of Norwegian).

-CXfirst
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Tue Jun 04, 2013 4:48 pm

Edit function doesn't seem to be working.

Just saw that JQ premium class will have a seat pitch of 38" (like Thompson), while Norwegian has seat pitch of 46" in premium, so that might explain most of the seat count increase, but still, going to be cramped!

-CXfirst
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:27 am

http://www.businessday.com.au/busine...ent-flyer-fall-20130605-2npb3.html

An interesting article quoting Tim Clark on the impact of the EK/QF alliance on EK. Apparently there has been a slowing in growth of EK's loyalty scheme in Australia which is the main casualty of the QF alliance. But apart from that he's happy.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:34 am

Quoting sydscott (Reply 9):

From that article, it is interesting to note that Clark blames no A380 service to PER on increasing competition from QR and SQ, and not on the lacking infrastructure! Perhaps a sign that EK will not bring the A380 immediately even if infrastructure was up to date (and perhaps the reason PER has delayed it).

-CXfirst
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 05, 2013 6:53 am

http://www.businessday.com.au/busine...ent-flyer-fall-20130605-2npb3.html

I found this to be an interesting article today especially in relation to a slowdown in growth at Emirates awards scheme which they attribute to the Qantas relationship.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 05, 2013 8:02 am

Does anyone know why VH-FVX operating VA642 to Canberra left gate 31 in Sydney and returned shortly afterwards today? The aircraft sat for two hours with engineers surrounding it.

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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 05, 2013 8:57 am

Really really looking forward to seeing the 787 in Australia. IMHO the Qantas livery on the 787 is gonna ROCK!! That and BA will be mighty fine looking aircraft.  
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 05, 2013 2:07 pm

Now this is really interesting. Who bought 5% of VA yesterday? If it was EY they didn't waste any time. If it was SQ or NZ, a takeover bid would be imminent.

http://www.4-traders.com/VIRGIN-AUST...Heavily-Traded-in-Sydney-17003988/
 
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allrite
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 05, 2013 11:23 pm

Quoting xiaotung (Reply 14):
Who bought 5% of VA yesterday?

According to the Sydney Morning Herald it was NZ.

Quote:
Air New Zealand is increasing its stake in Virgin Australia, but says it has no intention of taking control of the airline.

Air New Zealand intends to take a further three per cent interest in Virgin Australia, raising its ownership level to 22.99 per cent.
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EK413
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 05, 2013 11:32 pm

http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2824/8953979236_185095048d_b.jpg
Jetstar 787 by Jetstar Airways, on Flickr

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3725/8954337978_84c892f5af_b.jpg
Boeing Everett factory tour by Jetstar Airways, on Flickr

And it will get their normal livery.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8419/8755920577_a1826b2744_b.jpg
Jetstar & Boeing 787 event by Jetstar Airways, on Flickr

EK8413

[Edited 2013-06-05 17:22:07]
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mariner
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 05, 2013 11:47 pm

Quoting allrite (Reply 15):
According to the Sydney Morning Herald it was NZ.

Quote:
Air New Zealand is increasing its stake in Virgin Australia, but says it has no intention of taking control of the airline.

And Air NZ may go to 26%:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/n...ticle.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10888772

"Air New Zealand has agreed to lift its holding in Virgin Australia to about 23 percent from 19.99 percent in a series of off-market transactions and indicated it may seek to hold as much as 26 percent."

At that point, Air NZ and Singapore would own about 46%. I suggested they should jointly take control (despite the spectre of Ansett) and screw it, just do it.

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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Thu Jun 06, 2013 7:50 am

Quoting EK413 (Reply 4):

Great photos -- can't wait!

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 7):

Interesting comparison. Makes me wonder whether DY has been a bit optimistic with their 259 seat configuration, given that JQ has a very good idea for how to make the LCC model work on mid-long haul. Time will tell...
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:10 am

Etihad CEO James Hogan has provided some details about their first A380 and B787 plans. EY will take delivery of their first A380 and B787 aircraft in late 2014.

- A380 will feature a three-class cabin configuration
- B787 will be in two configurations with two and three classes
- A380 is intended to operate to LHR, JFK, SYD & MEL
- B787 routes will be announced later

Source: http://centreforaviation.com/news/ia...te-2014-235281

Sydney and Melbourne was expected as A380 destinations  

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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Thu Jun 06, 2013 9:38 am

Quoting mariner (Reply 15):
At that point, Air NZ and Singapore would own about 46%. I suggested they should jointly take control (despite the spectre of Ansett) and screw it, just do it.

What are the rules surrounding foreign ownership limits on VA? I know VA did a bit of a corporate restructure to alleviate some of the foreign ownership limits, but surely NZ and SQ wouldn't be allowed to own 100% of VA ?  
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:12 am

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 18):
What are the rules surrounding foreign ownership limits on VA? I know VA did a bit of a corporate restructure to alleviate some of the foreign ownership limits, but surely NZ and SQ wouldn't be allowed to own 100% of VA ?  

I doubt they would need to own 100% and the separate foreign owners already own more than 50% - Air NZ 23%, Singapore 19% and Etihad 10% plus the rump Branson/Virgin holding - 12%? SMH says 22% but I thought it had gone down with the SQ buy.

I disagree with one or two of the conclusions in this article - I don't think it is entirely a defensive move by Air NZ - but it suggests some form of alliance rather than a take-over. Well, maybe:

http://www.businessspectator.com.au/...ion/dont-expect-tussle-over-virgin

It would be easy to see the movements on the Virgin Australia register as presaging an eventual contest for control between Singapore Airlines and Air NZ. While that can’t be completely ruled out it isn’t, however, the most likely rationale for Air NZ’s move. Its actions appear more defensive than offensive.

While Singapore might well like to control Virgin Australia, which has essentially inherited Ansett’s share of the Australian market, Air NZ clearly wants a major seat at the table to protect its own interest in maintaining access to the Australian market.

The lack of significant competing interests between Singapore Airlines and Air NZ would suggest, once they felt they had protected their own strategic interests in having a level of influence over Virgin to support their alliances, that they were more likely to co-operate than engage in a potentially destructive contest for control.

A tripartite alliance between Singapore Airlines, Air NZ and Virgin Australia – anchored in the joint interests in Virgin Australia, would seem to make some sense, particularly given the recent Qantas/Emirates alliance.


Given the above, it's Interesting that Etihad today suggested it doesn't want to increase its holding at this time.

mariner

[Edited 2013-06-06 03:21:52]
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:16 am

Quoting mariner (Reply 19):
Interesting that Etihad today suggested it doesn't want to increase its holding

To be honest, I think that it's become clear over the past 12 months that Etihad is the awkward third wheel in this relationship. In the longterm I could quite easily see that particular partnership be quietly dismantled.
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:21 am

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 20):
To be honest, I think that it's become clear over the past 12 months that Etihad is the awkward third wheel in this relationship. In the longterm I could quite easily see that particular partnership be quietly dismantled.

Mayhap. CEO Hogan suggested today it was because they saw more immediate potential return in their Jet Airways holding - which is a wee bit of a change of tune from him.

It's in The Australian but it's subscription, so I haven't linked.

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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:22 am

Quoting mariner (Reply 21):
CEO Hogan suggested today it was because they saw more immediate potential return in their Jet Airways holding - which is a wee bit of a change of tune from him.

I don't doubt you, and on the short term I'm sure that EY are still committed but I was thinking more about the 2020 timeframe
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:30 am

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 22):
I don't doubt you, and on the short term I'm sure that EY are still committed but I was thinking more about the 2020 timeframe

That may be about right.

Etihad went on a bit of a buying spree - holdings in five airlines? I suspect they are starting to focus now and the priorities may have shifted, with Jet Airways (24%?) as the leader of the pack.

mariner

[Edited 2013-06-06 03:32:23]
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:32 am

Quoting mariner (Reply 21):
Mayhap. CEO Hogan suggested today it was because they saw more immediate potential return in their Jet Airways holding - which is a wee bit of a change of tune from him.

That's probably because he knows he has missed the boat. Whatever he does, he will now always behind NZ/SQ. Perhaps VA is nearing Star Alliance after all.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:34 am

Quoting mariner (Reply 23):
Etihad went on a bit of a buying spree - holdings in five airlines? I suspect they are starting to focus now and the priorities may have shifted, with Jet Airways (24%?) as the leader of the pack.

What about AB? Curious if there is any light at the end of the tunnel for AB.

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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:46 am

Quoting EK413 (Reply 25):
What about AB? Curious if there is any light at the end of the tunnel for AB.

Dunno.

He's got a lot of balls in the air, as the actress said to the bishop - 29% of Air Berlin and I've no idea what he'll do about Aer Lingus (3%) if Ryanair is forced to to sell - Hogan says he is "happy to discuss it" with Ryanair.

Willie Walsh has stuck his oar in and said Aer Lingus would be better off with Ryanair - LOL.

http://www.independent.ie/business/i...ir-says-willie-walsh-29314956.html

Aer Lingus better off being owned by Ryanair, says Willie Walsh

"If somebody thought Etihad is a better shareholder than Ryanair, I'd love for them to explain why and how that would be the case," Mr Walsh told the Irish Independent.

"I see it as quite the opposite. Ryanair wants Ireland and, whatever you say about Michael O'Leary, he's proud to be an Irishman, lives here and has created one of the most valuable airlines in the world.How is that less attractive to Ireland than Abu Dhabi?"


Perhaps this recent change in circumstances at Aer Lingus has caused a decrease in his interest in Virgin Australia?

mariner

[Edited 2013-06-06 03:56:22]
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Thu Jun 06, 2013 12:40 pm

Quoting mariner (Reply 26):
Quoting EK413 (Reply 25):
What about AB? Curious if there is any light at the end of the tunnel for AB.

Dunno.

He's got a lot of balls in the air, as the actress said to the bishop - 29% of Air Berlin and I've no idea what he'll do about Aer Lingus (3%) if Ryanair is forced to to sell - Hogan says he is "happy to discuss it" with Ryanair.

You got that right. Seems as though EY have gone on a shopping spree & didn't do their homework. Far to much money and than sense.

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CXfirst
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Fri Jun 07, 2013 6:14 am

http://www.ausbt.com.au/virgin-austr...sydney-perth-a330-only-on-weekdays

VA will go all-A330 on weekday PER-SYD flights in October.

From the article, it says this will made possible by Virgin's purchase of a 7th A330. Now, this is what confuses me. I wasn't aware of any more A330's purchased, and according to Airbus' order and delivery spreadsheet, Virgin don't have any on order (but it was also showing that they never had any on order just 6 in operation, so I'm guessing any order for them would be shown under the company they lease from).

So, are they expecting another A330 from CIT (or another lessor), and will it be a new-build? When is it going to be delivered?

Also, an additional A330 should give more capacity than just making that last 737 service an A330 (only one departure each way), where else will they use it? Capacity on MEL-SYD perhaps? One Asian destination?

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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Fri Jun 07, 2013 9:41 am

Quoting SYDSpotter (Reply 18):

There is nothing to stop NZ, SQ and EY sharing 100% of VA amongst themselves. In fact it is quite likely and there are significant savings to be had from delisting . The structure of the separated Int'l and domestic divisions has already made this possible and the stock is fairly lightly traded with many small holders willing sellers having been gifted unmarketable parcels of shares by Toll several years ago.

Already there is significant speculation that the 3 airlines are already working on a power sharing arrangement. Borghetti would remain CEO with a much surer supply of capital as well as the need for short-term gains removed as the airlines would be more patient that the stock market . The interesting times continue.
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Sat Jun 08, 2013 8:31 am

I didn't see the need to start a new thread so thought I'll bring this up. Qantas accepted delivery of A332 VH-EBS not to long ago and whilst browsing the photos I noticed (photographer too) the Airbus A330 titles are displayed by door 2 opposed to aft the wing. Safe to say this was an error???


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Darren Koch

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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Mon Jun 10, 2013 7:48 am

Australian Aviation has gone a little quiet so thought I'll share a photo of diversions at BNE due to fog in SYD 28th May 2013.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y10/wezza/965240_532345106822885_448576770_o_zpsa6ba28b1.jpg
Pic by Adam @ YBBN Spotters Group on Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...865.436699993054064&type=1&theater

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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:22 am

Quoting EK413 (Reply 30):

I think it looks better just aft of the wing. It's a little cluttered where that is now. And also, how many Qantas airplanes has the Airbus paint shop painted? Surely they would of remembered or at least thought "somethings different".  

Bring on the QF/JQ B787!
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:20 am

Quoting A36001 (Reply 32):
I think it looks better just aft of the wing. It's a little cluttered where that is now. And also, how many Qantas airplanes has the Airbus paint shop painted? Surely they would of remembered or at least thought "somethings different".

Certainly looks awkward in the new spot if you ask my opinion.

BEFORE


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ken Chen



AFTER


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Darren Koch



Now had they applied titles similar to EK I wouldn't be complaining.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Gustavo Bertran - Iberian Spotters



The recently delivered A332 VH-EBS and many more to follow will be repainted in MNL.

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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:54 am

Quoting EK413 (Reply 33):

Really?   I've never really been a fan of Emirates putting the aircraft model in bold on the nose..... 

OMG is anyone watching SBS1? Remote control crash of a B727! Very very interesting...almost astounding! By the looks of the cabin after impact, I'm glad I don't travel in the pointy end!
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:27 am

Quoting EK413 (Reply 31):
Pic by Adam @ YBBN Spotters Group on Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...865.436699993054064&type=1&theater

Thanks for Sharing my group.  

L.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Tue Jun 11, 2013 11:20 am

Quoting zkokq (Reply 35):
Thanks for Sharing my group.

Your welcome. Perhaps I should've asked for your permission but that's why I included the link  EK8413
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Boof
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:12 am

Quoting EK413 (Reply 30):
I didn't see the need to start a new thread so thought I'll bring this up. Qantas accepted delivery of A332 VH-EBS not to long ago and whilst browsing the photos I noticed (photographer too) the Airbus A330 titles are displayed by door 2 opposed to aft the wing. Safe to say this was an error???

This is just a guess but I'd say this isn't a mistake and was meant to be like this.

Given how much VA market the fact that Coast to Coast services are on A330's, and that QF are ramping up services to/from the west with A330's, I would guess that QF have moved the aircraft type next to door 2 so that when boarding from the jetbridge passengers notice the aircraft type.

It's a little way of saying "hey we have them too!" and if you believe what has been said the QF interior will be better than VA's in the coming future so perhaps this is the start of a marketing and brand recognition campaign around the A330 service?

Cheers,

Boof.
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:24 am

Quoting Boof (Reply 37):
Given how much VA market the fact that Coast to Coast services are on A330's, and that QF are ramping up services to/from the west with A330's, I would guess that QF have moved the aircraft type next to door 2 so that when boarding from the jetbridge passengers notice the aircraft type.

Valid point & you might be right on the mark. Marketing the East - West A330 services probably in the pipeline and this is just beginning of what's to come.

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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 2:38 am

http://www.news.com.au/travel/news/o...em-in/story-e6frfq80-1226662257623

I've also seen some rather large pax in my time but hadn't really considered this in the context of a regional airline with more limited flying schedules.

Having said that, is it really discriminating to say to over-weight people that an airline literally cannot fit them into a flight? I wouldn't have thought so.
 
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RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 4:11 am

Quoting sydscott (Reply 39):
I've also seen some rather large pax in my time but hadn't really considered this in the context of a regional airline with more limited flying schedules.

Having said that, is it really discriminating to say to over-weight people that an airline literally cannot fit them into a flight? I wouldn't have thought so

Its a tricky one, what is even more tricky is in the context of wheelchair customers who are overweight - where airline staff are expected to lift them into their seats and on regional aircraft or narrowbody aircraft this usually means without the assistance of a mechanical aid!
 
CXfirst
Posts: 2954
Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 8:13 pm

RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:02 am

I was on a Skywest Flight (F50) from GET to PER last year, and there was a seriously overweight miner (maybe not miner, but obviously a FIFO worker of some kind), he was big and tall. There was physically no way the lady with the seat next to him could sit. Not saying it would be uncomfortable, but physically couldn't. Luckily, there was one spare seat on the plane, and she could move there. I don't know what they would have done if that seat had been booked. The miner did however seem a bit worried as the flight was filling up, almost like he had been offloaded before.

-CXfirst
 
qf002
Posts: 3155
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2011 11:14 am

RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:18 am

Quoting EK413 (Reply 30):
Safe to say this was an error???

It certainly looks strange. I guess we'll find out if it was deliberate when the next JQ plane gets repainted.

Quoting EK413 (Reply 33):
EK8413

Sorry to go so wildly off course, but what's with the new signature?

Quoting Boof (Reply 37):

Sounds plausible, except for the fact that it'll be virtually impossible to see the aircraft type in this position whenever there's a bridge attached to D2, both from the bridge and from the terminal (except in some unusual cases where the plane is parked alongside/on an angle to the terminal).

Quoting sydscott (Reply 39):
Having said that, is it really discriminating to say to over-weight people that an airline literally cannot fit them into a flight? I wouldn't have thought so

I agree, but the airlines need to do more to make the necessary information clear in the booking process rather than burying it elsewhere on their website or relying on PR statements and assuming that the public is aware.

Ideally, I'd like to see a note somewhere in the booking process (perhaps in the same step as the Terms of Carriage), which indicates the size of the seats and recommends the best course of action for larger passengers. The major issue is that many passengers just aren't aware of the problems they might cause,
 
Sydscott
Posts: 3137
Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2003 11:50 am

RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:22 am

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 40):
Its a tricky one, what is even more tricky is in the context of wheelchair customers who are overweight

Leaving aside the overweight part, I thought it was a requirement that a disabled passenger, depending on the level of disability, travel with someone so that if there was an emergency there was someone there to assist them?

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 41):
The miner did however seem a bit worried as the flight was filling up, almost like he had been offloaded before.

I'll bet! It's certainly a tricky one and even more so on regional flights which have smaller planes and less space to begin with.
 
RyanairGuru
Posts: 6559
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:59 am

RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 6:18 am

Quoting qf002 (Reply 42):
Ideally, I'd like to see a note somewhere in the booking process (perhaps in the same step as the Terms of Carriage), which indicates the size of the seats and recommends the best course of action for larger passengers

I guess that would be the best scenario, although (and I don't want to come over in any discriminatory when I say this) but would most larger individuals (especially if they've flown before) be aware of the size limitations of a Y seat?

One of the better policies out there is WN, who forces larger passengers to pay for a second seat (at checkin, if they haven't already done so) but then refund the second fair if the flight isn't full (i.e. they wouldn't have got any revenue for that seat anyway)

Quoting qf002 (Reply 42):
Sorry to go so wildly off course, but what's with the new signature?

Implied secondary meaning, i.e. QF413

I think it's kind of clever!
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
smi0006
Posts: 1058
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2008 7:45 am

RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 6:27 am

Quoting sydscott (Reply 43):
Leaving aside the overweight part, I thought it was a requirement that a disabled passenger, depending on the level of disability, travel with someone so that if there was an emergency there was someone there to assist them?

It varies from airline to airline, I can't recall the specific policy at QF or VA. Foreign airlines generally only requires that the person traveling with the passenger is able to assist them with their toilet and food requirements, they crew maybe required to assist them to and from the lavatory but not in the lavatory.

The only exception is the US flights where the passenger maybe required to have a safety assistant, but under US law this is not grounds for deny the passenger boarding; if the customer is not traveling with a safety assistance, then they are required to provide one it may simply be a passenger sitting next to the passenger, or if no suitable passenger can be found it would have to an airline employee. Again under US law there is no mention of the requirement for the passenger to be able to move themselves between any wheelchair and the seat, thats up to the crew or ground-staff...

On a side note seems CZ is slowly getting serious; Upgrading its MEL and SYD flights to the much superior hard product offered to BNE currently.

http://www.ausbt.com.au/china-southe...=flipper&utm_campaign=home-flipper

How is the soft product on CZ these days? I always thought it was a shame the idea of having one Aussie crew didn't really get off the ground. CZ staff struggle with English and even one native speaker to preform PAs would have helped. I think the SYD base is still open, but MEL never opened as far as I know.
 
RyanairGuru
Posts: 6559
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:59 am

RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 6:43 am

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 45):
How is the soft product on CZ these days?
The Canton Route To Australia: China Southern In J (by palmjet Apr 14 2013 in Trip Reports)

Palmjet recently flew CZ AMS-BNE. The soft product looks surprisingly good. To be honest between that trip report and the new lie flat seats, I would definitely consider CZ J if I was in the market for Y+

The biggest issue, unfortunately, still appears to be language
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
User avatar
eta unknown
Posts: 1806
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2001 5:03 am

RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 7:09 am

From what I've heard, premium economy on CZ leaves a lot to be desired.

CZ have spent a lot of money on advertising the Canton Route on TV/billboards/cabs. The BNE & PER-Europe sales figures are quite low- not sure about SYD/MEL.
 
thegeek
Posts: 1334
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2007 7:20 am

RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 8:55 am

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 47):
CZ have spent a lot of money on advertising the Canton Route on TV/billboards/cabs. The BNE & PER-Europe sales figures are quite low- not sure about SYD/MEL.

The former is surprising because the alternative services to Europe from BNE are pretty lacking. Half the EK flights to BNE require a stop in SIN, last I checked.
 
CXfirst
Posts: 2954
Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 8:13 pm

RE: Australian Aviation Thread # 74

Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:00 am

Quoting eta unknown (Reply 47):
The BNE & PER-Europe sales figures are quite low- not sure about SYD/MEL.

PER was always going to be a bit hard. A flight to Europe through CAN is quite a bit longer than through SIN/KUL/BKK/DXB/DOH. Same reason CX doesn't carry all that many Europe bound pax (IIRC, they carry more Asia bound traffic and US bound traffic from PER).

The price would have to be very low to get PER people to fly the longer route, with the not-too-great transfer time in CAN.

-CXfirst

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