IndianicWorld
Topic Author
Posts: 2799
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2001 11:32 am

Secondary Paris Airports: Future?

Sun Jul 21, 2013 1:05 pm

While looking up information relating to the current situation with Beauvais and Vatry, I was curious to see what people feel will be the future for secondary airports in the Paris area.

With airlines like Ryanair and Wizzair becoming more and more inclined to look at the major airports these days, will they still look to use Beauvais as their main Paris gateway? Vatry is down to a few destinations only for FR and with little else year round for anything else there so it will be interesting to see what can be done there.

Are there any other options around Paris for airlines to look at?

Any thoughts?
 
SCQ83
Posts: 2724
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

RE: Secondary Paris Airports: Future?

Sun Jul 21, 2013 2:04 pm

I don't know what you mean by FR inclined to look at major airports. I can't remember a single city where they have moved to the "main" airport (other than WAW with the issues in the new Modlin airport, and BCN yet they are still big in GRO)... they are still in STN/LTN, CRL, BVA, CIA, TSF, NYO, BGY, RYG, PSA...

In fact they have cancelled most of their flights out of LGW, and a bunch of them out of MAD.

So it seems that Ryanair is fine when they are the king of the airport, and they can do whatever they want (tax breaks, no jet-bridges, put in practice their luggage policies and "controls" as pleased...)... I doubt that would ever happen in CDG or ORY that are part of Aeroports de Paris, where the major stakeholder is the French government (so in which interest they would give Ryanair any advantage???). Very different for Beauvais or Vatry which are small airports operated by regional governments happy to have someone flying there.

As for their future... Vatry is down to Porto and Marrakech from what I see... Moroccan and Portuguese communities are huge in France (Ryanair flies out of Porto to every other town in France) so no doubt those are VFR for people living in that area (Reims is not far) happy not to drive 150 km. to ORY or CDG (and not the other way around).

Beauvais... I now live in Paris and my feeling is that FR is not near as big as it is in London or Brussels (where I have lived as well). I guess there are a few reasons. First, you have plenty of low-cost operators out of CDG (even with their "low cost" T3) and ORY, notably Easyjet, Transavia and Vueling, and their holiday operators like Air Mediterranee or Europe Airpost. Even Air France with their new operator (HOP) and fare structures (one-way only, basic fares) have surprisingly good prices.

Secondly, BVA is literally in the middle of nowhere. STN or LTN have a catchment area of their own, which is not the case for Paris.

And thirdly (maybe that is a very personal opinion), with the two above combined, I don't see many French (or Parisian) people in general as interested to get the cheapest price at any cost and take the hassle to take the bus or drive to BVA and then put up with Ryanair and their practices. Most people I know here would never ever consider flying from BVA and/or FR, while in London for the "good" price, more people would consider STN or LTN with FR and be treated like cattle if it is cheap enough to save a few £££ (again, personal feeling), which I think it doesn't match up that well with French mentality.

So my feeling as that things will stay as they are... it will be just interesting if Ryanair ever sets a base in BVA... I think it is their biggest airport without base... I can imagine it has to do with French job regulations and whether they would be able to operate with Irish contracts out of France (even if the EU regulations would allow it, I doubt French unions would do   ).

[Edited 2013-07-21 07:08:31]
 
okapi
Posts: 161
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2006 11:15 pm

RE: Secondary Paris Airports: Future?

Sun Jul 21, 2013 11:53 pm

Quoting SCQ83 (Reply 1):

The perfect explanation. Add to that the excellent railway network available from Paris with both high-speed and classic trains and you understand why FR does not grow as much as in other countries.
Most businesses around Paris are really too far away from BVS for that airport to be attractive enough while you do find lots of business people on easyJet flights in and out of ORY/CDG.

My opionion is that both Beauvais and Vatry will never grow more than what they are today.
 
yenne09
Posts: 682
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2010 12:02 am

RE: Secondary Paris Airports: Future?

Mon Jul 22, 2013 3:09 am

Beauvais has a long history of low cost air travel and they recently improve the ILS and other navaids equipements. the shuttle bus from Porte Mailhot takes about 1h15 min to go to Beauvais. So it depends from which part of the city you are starting your trip versud CDG or Orly. For example it is not so far from La Defense area. So, it is always a personnal choice depending on your destination and your budget.
 
IndianicWorld
Topic Author
Posts: 2799
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2001 11:32 am

RE: Secondary Paris Airports: Future?

Mon Jul 22, 2013 7:23 am

Overall I agree that there seems a limited market for the secondary airports in Paris at this stage, unlike London in particular.

Vatry in particular seems very quiet on the pax side of things but is doing fairly well in cargo atleast.

Quoting SCQ83 (Reply 1):
I don't know what you mean by FR inclined to look at major airports. I can't remember a single city where they have moved to the "main" airport (other than WAW with the issues in the new Modlin airport, and BCN yet they are still big in GRO)... they are still in STN/LTN, CRL, BVA, CIA, TSF, NYO, BGY, RYG, PSA...

I was also talking about Wizzair, who have moved flights to WAW and also GLA from their secondary alternatives.

The examples of FR moving into BCN and MAD were also a departure from their usual airport choices at the time. To maintain their expectedgrowth it will have to continue looking at many options though which will be interesting.
 
r2rho
Posts: 2439
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 10:13 pm

RE: Secondary Paris Airports: Future?

Mon Jul 22, 2013 11:21 am

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 4):
there seems a limited market for the secondary airports in Paris at this stage, unlike London in particular.

The main differences between Paris and London being of course a)much higher airport capacity at CDG-ORY than at LHR-LGW, and much better rail network, in particular high speed rail, limiting the chances of Beauvais and Vatry.
Nevertheless, although there growth potential is limited, I believe there is future for these airports, at least Beauvais; Paris is a huge metropolitan area with a large O&D market, there is a market for them, even if a limited one.

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