PITrules
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UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Wed Jul 24, 2013 10:08 pm

The General Civil Aviation Authority of the UAE released its final report today on the crash of UPS 6.

http://www.gcaa.gov.ae/en/ePublicati...571UP%20-%20Report%2013%202010.pdf
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golfradio
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Wed Jul 24, 2013 11:11 pm

Very chilling to read the report. As the report mentions diverting to DOH only had very marginal benefits mainly being able to use the same frequency. The odds were stacked very high against the crew. May they rest in peace.
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crownvic
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 4:12 am

Thank you for posting...I do have to say, a very interesting read, if one has the time. I wish others would post these sort of articles instead of some the topics that people must dream up on these forums!
 
jetblueguy22
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 4:31 am

Wow that was a tough read. The timing of the release is kind of weird personally. I work at UPS and was talking about the accident with coworkers the other night. We had a package come through labeled as containing lithium trying to go Next Day Air. Needless to say I caught it and ran it over to my Supervisor to make sure it was safe to go air. Which it wasn't. Be safe people! We may just carry boxes, but our pilots all want to go home at the end of the trip! Hopefully this accident is a big time learning experience for the industry and we can make transportation safer.
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FlyMKG
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 4:47 am

Read the condensed version over on APC. It's a terrible tragedy and a shame it didn't receive more coverage at the time of the accident. The two pilots fought like crazy until the end to get the crippled bird on the ground. Although HAZMAT can be a danger to all aircraft if improperly handled, it poses an even greater threat to cargo aircraft due to the larger amounts permitted. Hopefully UPS 6 & Asiana 991 will shed light on the different standards between passenger and cargo flights and lead to some standardization in the industry. May these two pilots forever experience tail winds and RIP.

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simairlinenet
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 1:53 pm

Very close accident to me personally...my brother flew N571UP into DXB the day before, and flew Flight 6 to CGN the following day. I was working in dangerous goods cargo safety myself at the time.
 
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 3:23 pm

A hard read indeed, and very interesting timing given the nature of the discussion about Li-ion batteries these days....
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planespotting
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 5:04 pm

Chilling indeed - but it is truly amazing how the F/O was able to pretty much fly it all the way back to the runway in the single crew member/smoky environment ... almost.

The toxicology report didn't find any inidications of fire-induced airborne toxins in his blood either, so he was most likely alive at the time of the crash, which is very impressive considering the amount of smoke in the cockpit throughout the emergency. Had he been able to see out the cockpit window (he was not able to because of the smoke) he might have made it.

Hopefully the findings from this accident are able to ensure this type of cargo fire doesn't ever happen again.
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huxrules
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 6:34 pm

So if they would have left pack 1 on would they have been able to see to the landing?
 
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golfradio
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 6:36 pm

Quoting planespotting (Reply 7):
Had he been able to see out the cockpit window (he was not able to because of the smoke) he might have made it.

There were too many issues due to the fire that it seems almost impossible to have had a survivable landing. The FO had very little elevator authority left; he could not see the radios, so was unable to tune to DXB ATC. That made it even more difficult for him to get situational awareness as all comms were relayed from other aircraft. There problems with speed brakes. That's what makes it sad. The pilots had almost nothing in their favor.

In my layman's opinion, HAZMAT and flying do not mix. "Ship" it.
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ghifty
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:12 pm

Thanks for posting.

Quoting jetblueguy22 (Reply 3):
Needless to say I caught it and ran it over to my Supervisor to make sure it was safe to go air. Which it wasn't.

We can't? UPS University has some new modules and it seems like we can handle packages with lithium ion batteries, albeit in very definitive quantities and with specific label information.

[Edited 2013-07-25 12:13:00]
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HPRamper
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 7:27 pm

Quoting golfradio (Reply 9):
In my layman's opinion, HAZMAT and flying do not mix. "Ship" it.

If packaged properly there is quite little danger involved. The vast majority of accidents involving haz are the result of undeclared shipments and the resultant lack of special handling. Besides, with the urgency generally related to hazardous materials, slow shipment by ground or sea is often not feasible.

Quoting ghifty (Reply 10):
We can't? UPS University has some new modules and it seems like we can handle packages with lithium ion batteries, albeit in very definitive quantities and with specific label information.

With lithium, it's all about quantity. Things here at FX changed immediately after the UPS crash. There is a lot more careful documentation and inspection involved.
 
747megatop
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:02 pm

Are similar shipments (similar to the one that caught fire) allowed in the cargo hold of passenger airliners? Chilling to think what would have happened if this was a passenger 747 or A380 instead. I think it is humanly impossible to inspect and verify each and every piece of cargo so i am wondering and trying to understand what measures are taken on passenger airliners to keep the passengers safe from such cargo.
 
SuseJ772
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:07 pm

I didn't realize that there was so much time from the fire to the crash. I really thought it was more instantaneous than that.

It kind of surprises me there isn't a system, even an air pressure differential or something that pulls smoke out of the cockpit.

The FO might not have had much elevator control, but he had enough to descend from FL32 to 4,500 feet so I think with enough setup and clear site, he would have made it. I am not sure how dark it is in there, but it almost speaks for something like night vision goggles or something else attached to the oxygen mask that would give just some basic flight information (speed, heading, altitude, frequencies, ILS glide scope).
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:21 pm

Also thinking, should there not be an auto-pilot button that coordinates with RNAV/GPS / ILS to take the plane to the nearest airport with ILS and then perform an auto-land. So that even if visibility is completely gone, there is at least some hope. So the first item in the fire checklist could be to program or select "FIRE" mode in the GPS so that they can manually fly the aircraft until they can no longer see and then do something on the control column that would activate this mode.
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jetblueguy22
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:21 pm

Quoting ghifty (Reply 10):
We can't? UPS University has some new modules and it seems like we can handle packages with lithium ion batteries, albeit in very definitive quantities and with specific label information.

The package was really heavy and marked as having lithium but was going next day air. It was over the limit. Customer ended up having to send it ground.

Quoting 747megatop (Reply 12):
Are similar shipments (similar to the one that caught fire) allowed in the cargo hold of passenger airliners?

They are more restrictive of what can be shipped on passenger aircraft.

Quoting suseJ772 (Reply 13):
It kind of surprises me there isn't a system, even an air pressure differential or something that pulls smoke out of the cockpit.

It sounds like if Pack 1 was still running they would have had more vision in the cockpit but for some reason it was shut down.
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planespotting
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:22 pm

Quoting suseJ772 (Reply 13):
It kind of surprises me there isn't a system, even an air pressure differential or something that pulls smoke out of the cockpit.

Well, according to the report, there is - but it's run by Pack 1 (and it should be able to keep the cockpit pressure greater than the pressure in the cabin outside), but it was reset and not working for some reason after the fire warnings appeared.
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TheRedBaron
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:25 pm

Even if they sucked out the oxygen in the cargo hold those pesky little devils will still burn and produce smoke like crazy ...

Poor guys, they fought a lost battle because once those burn, they are almost impossible to put out..

May they rest in peace.

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cjg225
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:09 pm

Thanks for the post. There's no way I can understand all of that or get through it, but I skimmed some of it. Amazing what they were able to accomplish... Rest in Peace...
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Fri Jul 26, 2013 3:30 am

I did a short pass through of the report and is it very through, very well done and answers most of questions we have about what happened with this flight. In reading the timeline and the words of the pilots, it must have been a terrifying experience. Fortunately, UPS 6 ended up crash landing in a place that meant no one killed on the ground.

I noted a significant part of the report discusses a lot of the research and testing done as to what failed lithium batteries can do in an aircraft, hopefully it confirms the need to make changes (some have already happened), as to high risk cargo. I also hope it causes improvements in cargo fire safety for crews, including better ways to reduce smoke intrusion into the cockpit, better mask systems and improved procedures if a fire condition exists.

I would note that the day this report was noted here, July 25, is the date in 2000 that saw the loss of the Concorde at CDG.
 
PITrules
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Sun Jul 28, 2013 1:18 am

132 aviation incidents involving batteries over a 20 year period, the vast majority involving lithium batteries.

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/...o/media/Battery_incident_chart.pdf

IMHO this is the greatest danger involving cargo ops.
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777way
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Tue Jul 30, 2013 12:34 pm

Why didn't they land at nearest Airport rather than continue to Dubai, isn't that the norm since Swissair accident, or is it only for passenger flights?
 
737tdi
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:01 pm

Quoting suseJ772 (Reply 14):
Also thinking, should there not be an auto-pilot button that coordinates with RNAV/GPS / ILS to take the plane to the nearest airport with ILS and then perform an auto-land.




This is possible but the PF could not even see the MCDU to input an airport according to the report.

What is being skirted here is why wasn't the #1 pack running? It was mentioned earlier in the report that it tripped but was able to be reset. No mention after that??? Did it trip again?

For the 747 guys, can the #1 pack be put on MEL? I know we can on the 737, I would think that if the design is such to keep smoke out of the cockpit/safety it couldn't be.
 
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RE: UPS Flight 6 Final Report

Tue Jul 30, 2013 10:21 pm

Having read the report i am afraid that regulations would not have changed a thing in this case. Pages 206-211 give an oversight of shipments which were investigated further.

Three shipments were not identified as restricted materials while they should have been. These and a few other shipments also had other problems with supporting documentation not matching up to supposed content and batteries not having been tested as per UN standards. You can bet on it that these shipments were probably also incorrectly packaged for air transport leaving the door open for anything to happen which in this case likely turned into a worst scenario case. Deliberate or not, i have a hard time not calling this kind of negligence criminal.

Quoting 777way (Reply 21):
Why didn't they land at nearest airport rather than continue to Dubai ?

The report touches on that fact pointing out that the crew was not familiar with DOH and did not have the charts & ILS frequency for DOH immediately available so setting up for that would have taken them some more time. At the very best they would have made it into DOH 4 minutes earlier, of course that's with 20/20 hindsight. In any case it would not have changed much since the cockpit was already filled with smoke early on so the outcome would probably have been the same except for the difficulties in communication with ATC.

If you have a little bit of time i recommend reading it, it is very interesting. The sound analysis study part i did practically skip.
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