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UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:10 am

Flight 1603 IAH-SEA. Diverted to BOI.

http://www.kboi2.com/news/local/Flig...ot-has-heart-attack-225451542.html

Hopefully the pilot will be all right.   
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clickhappy
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:38 am

Hope the pilot is okay, Flightaware shows a pretty rapid decent. Must have been a wild ride.
 
747megatop
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:41 am

Hopefully the pilot is allright. Just a question though, if a pilot is hand flying the airplane and on final approach (very close to the runway) and this happens, is there enough time for the co-pilot to react and take over the controls? What is the process involved?
 
YXwatcherMKE
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 7:30 am

My prayers go out to the Captain and his Family! Hopefully he/she has a rapid recovery. I was surprised how quickly they had the plane back in the air. Do they have a pilots domicile in Sea that they could get a pilot down to BOI that fast?
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peterjohns
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 9:14 am

Quoting 747megatop (Reply 2):

I have heard (know of ) of several incidents in the last few years , where one of the pilots became incapacitated.
Usualy it is no problem for one pilot to continue the flight alone.
In case of a heart attack, it usualy doesn´t happen from one second to another, but gives a pre warning ( pain, numbness) a few seconds ahead.
But remember the LH 320 which upon Take-off had the faulty sidestick commands (bank left/right swapped)? The Co-pilot had to take over within less than seconds- and did it.
Thats when the training kicks in and the hundreds of Sim sessions (call out "80"- no response...as a classic example),
pay off.
 
petteri
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:41 am

Unfortunately it's now being reported that the pilot has in fact died. It's not yet know if he died at the scene, en route or at the hospital. Sad ending to thie story, although good news that the flight did land safely.

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?section=news/local&id=9263582
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TonyBurr
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:45 am

I have had two heart attacks and I never had ANY forewarning. Have you had a heart attack to say that? Or, are you a doctor?
 
COPolynesianPub
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:14 pm

My thoughts and prayers go out to our pilots family.
 
peterjohns
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:24 pm

Quoting TonyBurr (Reply 6):

Sorry to hear that. No, I have not had one, and I am not a MD. If you say there are no chest pains involved, then so be it.

I wanted to answer a question related to airliners (my line of work) and not start a medical discussion.
 
gegarrenton
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:36 pm

Condolences to family and friends of pilot.
 
rfields5421
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 1:10 pm

Quoting clickhappy (Reply 1):
Flightaware shows a pretty rapid decent. Must have been a wild ride.

It was an average of 2,000 FPM descent. A bit more than normal, but not uncommon in daily flights.

It took 17 minutes to get on the ground.

Quoting 747megatop (Reply 2):
if a pilot is hand flying the airplane and on final approach (very close to the runway) and this happens, is there enough time for the co-pilot to react and take over the controls? What is the process involved?

Most of the time, yes.

Given the number of times a perfectly healthy pilot makes mistakes and flies a plane into the ground before the runway or lands too long and is unable to stop by the end of the runway - I'd worry more about that than a possible heart attack in the cockpit on final.
 
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longhauler
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 2:01 pm

Quoting 747megatop (Reply 2):
if a pilot is hand flying the airplane and on final approach (very close to the runway) and this happens, is there enough time for the co-pilot to react and take over the controls? What is the process involved?

During critical phases of flight, there are challenge/response calls and procedures. Among other things, the purpose is also to detect a pilot incapacitation. If the other pilot detects a problem, he takes over control. This exercise is practised quite often in the simulator.

It may surprise one to note that while a heart attack is very "detectable", it is the subtle incapacitation that is more serious and harder to detect.

A few months ago, during a YVR-YYZ flight, we had a passenger suffer an apparent stroke. Fortunately, we had a physician on board. He suggested getting the patient as quickly as possible to more capable care. 11 minutes after that decision was made, we were at the gate in YQT. Two weeks ago, I received a letter from the woman's children (through our company flight operations) saying their mother was doing well and recovering. .... It's always worth the effort to land as soon as possible.
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clickhappy
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 2:52 pm

According to Flightaware they were descending at up to 7k per minute. Not sure where you are getting 2k from.
 
rfields5421
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:09 pm

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/U.../20130926/2227Z/KIAH/KSEA/tracklog

I see one momentary spike above 4K FPM, but the average is below 2,000 FPM descent.

I don't see anything near 7K.
 
flymd1976
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:23 pm

Quoting TonyBurr (Reply 6):

I'm a doctor and peterjohns is correct in what he said. Most patients do have warning symptoms before they actually have a heart attack. These symptoms can include nausea, vomiting, dizziness, left shoulder pain, jaw pain, abdominal pain that mimics heartburn, etc. The problem is that these symptoms are pretty non-specific and so when someone is having them they don't automatically put two and two together and seek out help before going into full on cardiac arrest. If you had no symptoms before your or during heart attacks then that is pretty atypical. But it is certainly possible as everyones pathology can present differently.
 
kkephart13
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:24 pm

CNN.com is reporting that the pilot has died. Condolences out to his family.
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FlyHossD
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:25 pm

Quoting YXwatcherMKE (Reply 3):
My prayers go out to the Captain and his Family! Hopefully he/she has a rapid recovery. I was surprised how quickly they had the plane back in the air. Do they have a pilots domicile in Sea that they could get a pilot down to BOI that fast?

According to my friends, a replacement captain was deadheaded in from SFO (maybe LAX?).

[Edited 2013-09-27 08:27:23]
My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
 
INNflyer
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:30 pm

@ TonyBurr

Quote: "I have had two heart attacks and I never had ANY forewarning. Have you had a heart attack to say that? Or, are you a doctor?"

I am a board certified anesthesiologist with many years experience in emergency medicine. A heart attack (in this case I presume, myocardial infarction) may present very differently. It could be obscure pain that gets projected on the shoulder or abdomen, but mostly it is chest pain. The more pain, usually the greater the problem- many patients report shortness of breath, fear for their life, cold sweat, and difficulty to speak. However, diabetes may render the entire process almost pain-free. Myocardial infarction may produce via cardiac rhythm problems instantaneous cardiac arrest with loss of consciousness within a few seconds, but again that is rare. If a myocardial infarction patient developes severe shock, mortality increases sharply. The aforementioned situation sounds as the situation worsened rapidly.
 
peterjohns
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:37 pm

Quoting flymd1976 (Reply 14):
I'm a doctor and peterjohns is correct in what he said.

Well, thanks a lot for that!!

The original question was if it is dangerous during landing for instance, and I wanted to point out- no, not really.
These situations are trained, and other than a husband driving a car who perhaps would not admit to feeling ill suddenly and continue- a pilot would (should) hand over immeadiatly if he senses something out of the ordinary.

Over the years we have had increasing numbers of medical emergancy diversions- meaning landing at the nearest suitable airport. Here with us (FRA ATC) we are at about one every two weeks. The reasons I can only guess- of course the more pax on a plane- the higher the risk. And I would suppose the average age of pax may have increased- and certainly will over time. (Population getting older)
 
crAAzy
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:41 pm

Quoting flymd1976 (Reply 14):

I'm a doctor and peterjohns is correct in what he said. Most patients do have warning symptoms before they actually have a heart attack. These symptoms can include nausea, vomiting, dizziness, left shoulder pain, jaw pain, abdominal pain that mimics heartburn, etc. The problem is that these symptoms are pretty non-specific and so when someone is having them they don't automatically put two and two together and seek out help before going into full on cardiac arrest. If you had no symptoms before your or during heart attacks then that is pretty atypical. But it is certainly possible as everyones pathology can present differently.

I'll add to that that those can be both symptoms of a heart attack and warning signs of an impending heart attack; especially if they occur during periods of stress, some form of physical exertion, exercise, or even sometimes after eating a heavy meal. These "warning signs" usually go away when the stressors mentioned above have decreased or stopped. They key for the warning symptoms is to recognize the patterns and seek advice from a doctor sooner than later.

People should be most concerned if and see their doctor if these symptoms occur with greater intensity and more frequently, otherwise known as "unstable angina". For example, If you would get left shoulder/jaw pain after walking 3 blocks for months and now you're getting the pain when you walk only 1 or 2 blocks then let your doctor know right away.

Either way it's a very sad/unfortunate situation with the UA pilot and awful for both the crew and the pilots family.
 
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cjg225
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:45 pm

Very unfortunate. My condolences to the pilot's family.

Must be quite a shock to the other crew.
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BoeingGuy
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:49 pm

Quoting peterjohns (Reply 4):
I have heard (know of ) of several incidents in the last few years , where one of the pilots became incapacitated.
Usualy it is no problem for one pilot to continue the flight alone.

I assume you mean one pilot continues the flight to the nearest suitable airport.

The training guidance when only one pilot is capable of flying is to declare an emergency and land at the nearest suitable airport. They can ask for help of a qualified pilot in the cabin at their discretion. It also advises to rely on automation as much as they can to reduce work load. Otherwise, modern airplanes are perfectly capable being flown safely to landing with only one pilot, if necessary. Some airlines specifically practice this during training, and some airlines teach the flight attendants how to come up front and assist with the QRH checklist. Not sure what UA's policies are on this.

Quoting longhauler (Reply 11):
During critical phases of flight, there are challenge/response calls and procedures. Among other things, the purpose is also to detect a pilot incapacitation. If the other pilot detects a problem, he takes over control. This exercise is practised quite often in the simulator.


The training guidance states that two unanswered inquiries to another pilot are grounds to suspect incapacitation, and to take over control.

The training manual also clearly states that if you don't feel well, say so and let the other person fly.
 
modesto2
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:49 pm

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 10):
It was an average of 2,000 FPM descent. A bit more than normal, but not uncommon in daily flights.

One point of clarification. A 2,000 fpm descent is NOT a bit more than normal. That's a very normal rate of descent and would not be cause for alarm. 4,000 fpm is a bit more than normal, but even that rate of descent would be well within the limitations of the aircraft.
 
daviation
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:14 pm

Quoting flymd1976 (Reply 14):
I'm a doctor and peterjohns is correct in what he said.

I have had two cardiac arrests (in 2000 and 2005) caused by ventricular tach. Admittedly, this is not the same as an infarction although most people confuse the terms heart attack and cardiac arrest.

Other than a general malaise, I had no warning signs at all, no sudden pain, none of the usual symptoms that warn of impending arrest. In the 2000 incident, I was driving and crashed my car into an underpass. The physicians said that this shock probably restarted my heart. I now of course have a defibrillator/pacemaker. Until recently, I always had to have a manual inspection at the airport because of the ICD and magnetism, but with the latest technology I can use the scatter-scan.
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INFINITI329
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:22 pm

In this situation do you explain fully whats going on to your pax or do you just say that the flight is diverting and explain later?
 
26point2
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:26 pm

I see no mention of an AED device. Aren't AEDs required on commercial aircraft? If not, they should be.
 
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Tugger
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:28 pm

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 21):
The training guidance states that two unanswered inquiries to another pilot are grounds to suspect incapacitation, and to take over control.

To this, is it required to report this if this is requested? Are the pilots supposed to report anything when a possibly medical issue arises for one of the pilots during the flight?

Incapacitation is of course something I would think must be reported but what level does "must" come into effect.

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JHwk
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:32 pm

Not to be morbid, but with security protocols today was the pilot SOL, as the copilot has to fly and can't open the door to let someone help the pilot? If the pilot is somehow moved out of the cockpit for CPR or a AED does one of the flight attendants take the vacated seat? Could a doctor go into the cockpit?
 
Flighty
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:43 pm

That why it is a two pilot cockpit, folks. Great that a safe landing was made, and care was given to the ill pilot.

Quoting 26point2 (Reply 25):
I see no mention of an AED device. Aren't AEDs required on commercial aircraft? If not, they should be.

Yes, but in the case of a pilot, how would that even work? Who does it? FA with the door open? It's almost like they would have to make an announcement and tell people exactly what's happening.
 
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longhauler
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 5:01 pm

Quoting Flighty (Reply 28):
Yes, but in the case of a pilot, how would that even work? Who does it? FA with the door open? It's almost like they would have to make an announcement and tell people exactly what's happening.

The Captain was removed from the cockpit, laid out in First Class, and CPR applied.

A request was made for on-board physicians, there were two. Likely the AED was used.
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AustrianZRH
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 6:06 pm

Quoting 26point2 (Reply 25):
I see no mention of an AED device. Aren't AEDs required on commercial aircraft? If not, they should be.

I see no mention if there was still fibrillation activity in the heart. If the pilot was already asystolic, there's nothing an AED can do.
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Passedv1
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 6:12 pm

Quoting 747megatop (Reply 2):
Just a question though, if a pilot is hand flying the airplane and on final approach (very close to the runway) and this happens, is there enough time for the co-pilot to react and take over the controls? What is the process involved?

It depends. How far off of stable does the airplane get before the FO takes over and then where are they at that point. The closer you get to the ground, the further out of stable you get before the takeover happens the chances of a bad ending increase greatly.

Quoting JHwk (Reply 27):
Not to be morbid, but with security protocols today was the pilot SOL, as the copilot has to fly and can't open the door to let someone help the pilot? If the pilot is somehow moved out of the cockpit for CPR or a AED does one of the flight attendants take the vacated seat? Could a doctor go into the cockpit?
Quoting Flighty (Reply 28):
Yes, but in the case of a pilot, how would that even work? Who does it? FA with the door open? It's almost like they would have to make an announcement and tell people exactly what's happening.

The only real question is how to get the door open...and without getting into it for "security reasons"...it's not a problem for the FA's to get into the cockpit under this scenario.

This is an emergency so any regulations including security protocols are optional at this point anyway. It would be difficult to treat a patient in the cockpit of any airliner forget about any narrowbody but as a practical matter the pilot would be removed. If for some reason the pilot could not be moved (maybe...suspected busted neck after turbulence encounter) the Captain could allow a doctor (or anybody else) in the cockpit. in this scenario as the FO...Chances are near 100% that there was a United pilot riding in the back...it's normal protocol for any non-rev pilots to have identified themselves to either the FA's and/or the pilots prior to departure. If no United pilots were on-board then the chances of an offline jumpseater being on-board is also very high. If all of that failed I would probably just go with the least needed flight attendant (for the medical emergency) in the jumpseat. Our airline doesn't allow our FAs to sit in the pilot seats normally, so having to supervise someone getting in and out of the Captains seat and then get the seat properly adjusted so they aren't going to obstruct the controls might not be worth the time.

PA - by PA I think you mean..."The Captain is incapacitated so now I, the FO are in charge and you will be fine...by the way are there any Private Pilots on board"...I think I would probably skip it. We've had a medical emergency on board...we need to divert to BOI to get the person help...sorry for your inconvenience. The passengers that are paying attention will know anyway...ignorance is bliss for the passengers sleeping in row 25. A non-airline pilot would probably not be much help in this situation because of the lack of time available.

There really isn't time to do a lot as far as the FO is concerned. Making a diversion of this sort for two pilots is busy. It's non-stop for a single pilot at night in the mountains to, in all likelihood, an unfamiliar airport. Anything not directly concerned with flying the airplane is pretty far down the to-do list. Getting a 2nd body in the cockpit takes time and that has to be weighed against how much help/liability that person will be once they get there.
 
Maverick623
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 7:08 pm

Quoting 26point2 (Reply 25):
I see no mention of an AED device. Aren't AEDs required on commercial aircraft? If not, they should be.
Quoting AustrianZRH (Reply 30):

I see no mention if there was still fibrillation activity in the heart. If the pilot was already asystolic, there's nothing an AED can do.

To put it into layman's terms, an AED is only useful when the heart is still beating, albeit at an irregular or spasmic rate (called fibrillation).

If the heart has stopped beating (asystolic or flat-lined), shocking it is useless. Basically, the point of an AED is to shock the nerves in the heart to stop beating temporarily, so as to let the body's natural process to restart a normal rhythm (or allow for chest compressions to be more effective).
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Jerseyguy
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 7:21 pm

Per CBS News and Fox News:

Ada County Coroner Erwin Sonnenberg identified the captain as 63-year-old Henry Skillern of Humble, Texas. Sonnenberg performed an autopsy on Skillern late Friday morning and confirmed that he died at a Boise hospital of a heart attack.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-...-makes-emergency-landing-in-boise/
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Flighty
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 7:40 pm

Quoting longhauler (Reply 29):
The Captain was removed from the cockpit, laid out in First Class, and CPR applied.

A request was made for on-board physicians, there were two. Likely the AED was used.

Sounds like took all available measures to help him. With these cases I am told, reviving people rarely works. It can help people stay alive, but it's not like television. This man may have been in a 1%-3% survival zone.
 
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clickhappy
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:02 pm

rfields - not sure why you are going out of your way to prove me wrong, especially in a thread like this, but, have a look at the link you have provided; several minutes show the plane descending at a very rapid clip, take a look at 6:47 for instance.

Condolences to the family and friends of the fallen Captain.
 
FlyHossD
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 9:38 pm

Quoting Flighty (Reply 28):
Yes, but in the case of a pilot, how would that even work? Who does it? FA with the door open? It's almost like they would have to make an announcement and tell people exactly what's happening.
Quoting PassedV1 (Reply 31):
PA - by PA I think you mean..."The Captain is incapacitated so now I, the FO are in charge and you will be fine...by the way are there any Private Pilots on board"...I think I would probably skip it.

As I recall, about 4 years ago, just that happened. The new Captain had a heart attack inflight and the Check Airman (supervising Captain) asked for assistance from any pilot - a private pilot was put to work in the flight deck.

The fallen Captain was laid out in First Class and CPR, etc., was performed there. IIRC, that Captain passed away, too.

I'm trying to remember the cities involved, but it seems like the diverted flight landed in McAllen, TX. Any one else remember this one?
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STT757
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 9:39 pm

Quoting JHwk (Reply 27):
Not to be morbid, but with security protocols today was the pilot SOL, as the copilot has to fly and can't open the door to let someone help the pilot? If the pilot is somehow moved out of the cockpit for CPR or a AED does one of the flight attendants take the vacated seat? Could a doctor go into the cockpit?

This is what's being reported now:

The Captain was taken out and laid in the First class galley, a call was made over the PA asking if a Doctor was on board. A female Doctor came forward and began compressions, she was assisted by two soldiers who were enroute to Joint Base Lewis-McChord. Also from NBC News:

Quote:
A passenger who trains Boeing 737 pilots aided the co-pilot as the plane made the emergency landing in Boise

Not sure if this was an off duty UA employee, a Boeing employee or what but the UA pilot did have assistance landing the aircraft.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013...ency-landing-at-boise-airport?lite
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F9Animal
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 9:53 pm

This story just breaks my heart, and I mean that! I want to give my thanks to those who gave a great explanation of heart attacks, and defib info. I had no idea that a defib could be useless, and never knew about asystolic. Can CPR still be effective if the heart is asystolic, and be saved? I read somewhere that the captain was about 300 pounds. Absolutely tragic, and really scares me! I mean, I fear to all hell of having a heart attack. This tragedy should shake a few of us, and maybe change some of our poor habits. Again, never ceases to amaze me at how many people here have such amazing knowledge in just about everything.  

Sounds like the flight crew and a few passengers gave it all they had to save him. RIP to the captain.  
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northstar80
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 9:58 pm

Condolences to the family..

The very first article in the post (kboi2) states that the pilot was a big man, over 300lbs. Is that normal for a pilot to be that big? Are there weight limitations to work as a pilot, or weight/height ratios? For an average sized man, say 6 ft, 300lbs is too much weight, it might be very uncomfortable for the pilot to fit the tight seat/cockpit.
 
wjcandee
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:33 pm

I'm curious. All the media say that UA flew in a "replacement pilot". Wouldn't it be typical to fly in a replacement crew -- at least a replacement flight-deck crew? While some folks would be okay watching their captain start to die in the seat next to them,, for most it would be a pretty traumatic experience. I would think that policy would dictate a complete 2-pilot crew change. Because you make policy based upon the right thing to do in the typical situation, and that would be to change the whole crew.
 
hivue
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Sat Sep 28, 2013 12:38 am

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 32):
I see no mention if there was still fibrillation activity in the heart. If the pilot was already asystolic, there's nothing an AED can do.
To put it into layman's terms, an AED is only useful when the heart is still beating, albeit at an irregular or spasmic rate (called fibrillation).

If the heart has stopped beating (asystolic or flat-lined), shocking it is useless.

Let me make a PSA for AEDs. If someone falls out with a possible heart attack and an AED is available, it MUST be used. The AED will decide whether a shock(s) needs to be delivered. You can't just look at someone and decide if they're asystolic or in v-fib. Even taking a pulse won't tell you that.
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777ord
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Sat Sep 28, 2013 12:47 am

Quoting wjcandee (Reply 41):
I'm curious. All the media say that UA flew in a "replacement pilot". Wouldn't it be typical to fly in a replacement crew -- at least a replacement flight-deck crew? While some folks would be okay watching their captain start to die in the seat next to them,, for most it would be a pretty traumatic experience. I would think that policy would dictate a complete 2-pilot crew change. Because you make policy based upon the right thing to do in the typical situation, and that would be to change the whole crew.

It's at crew discretion. I can assure you this: He/they agreed to fly as far as SFO, then go home. Or go to the hotel and pick up his pairing the following day after rest. Also consider that there may not be a full crew legally available for THAT flight. 30/7, 100cal/MO type violations come to mind at this time of month.

As I no longer work in sCO scheduling, I am not at liberty to discuss the actual events that occured, or share his name (even if it may be public by now. not sure).
 
wjcandee
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Sat Sep 28, 2013 12:53 am

It shouldn't be at crew discretion. That's the point of hav8ng an ironclad procedure.
 
rfields5421
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Sat Sep 28, 2013 1:32 am

Quoting wjcandee (Reply 41):
All the media say that UA flew in a "replacement pilot". Wouldn't it be typical to fly in a replacement crew -- at least a replacement flight-deck crew?

While the media says a replacement pilot was flown in - we don't know if it was just one pilot, or a flight deck crew, or an entire crew including FAs.

Someone who works for United will have to let us know exactly who was flown in.

Quoting 777ord (Reply 43):
He/they agreed to fly as far as SFO, then go home. Or go to the hotel and pick up his pairing the following day after rest.

The crew might have been based in SEA, or had plans for SEA or possible plans for ANC. Getting off and waiting in BOI was not a good option. They had to go to SEA - both the remaining pilot and cabin crew.

Quoting wjcandee (Reply 44):
That's the point of hav8ng an ironclad procedure.

I'm sure UA has a procedure, and it was followed. We just don't know the details of exaclty what happened or the procedure.
 
CONTACREW
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Sat Sep 28, 2013 1:37 am

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 45):
While the media says a replacement pilot was flown in - we don't know if it was just one pilot, or a flight deck crew, or an entire crew including FAs.

Believe it was just a pilot who was flown in from SFO the rest of the crew stayed onboard to continue to SEA.

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 45):

It's an sCO crew based in IAH that I believe were overnighting SEA and returning to IAH today.
Flight Attendants prepare doors for departure, cross check verify straps standby for all call
 
rising
Posts: 166
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:59 pm

RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Sat Sep 28, 2013 1:51 am

An unfortunate situation.

Our of curiosity, if there is another commercial pilot aboard who works for another carrier, are they allowed to assist the remaining pilot?
If it doesn't make sense, it's because it's not true.
 
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glideslope
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:03 am

Godspeed Henry. Thoughts and prayers to the loved ones.
To know your Enemy, you must become your Enemy.” Sun Tzu
 
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Schweigend
Posts: 473
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2010 8:47 am

RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Sat Sep 28, 2013 5:18 am

A horrible occurrence.

After his Captain dying right next to him, the F.O. then had to fly the diversion to BOI and land the plane by himself.... Gosh, how are the checklists done in a situation like that? Would a cabin crew member have been in the cockpit with him for support?

This is part of why I'm in awe of flight deck crew, their even tempers and iron nerves, being able to get the job done when other people would turn into a quivering pile of jelly!

Cheers and thanks to you, unnamed First Officer!

Godspeed and condolences to the family and friends of the Captain from Humble.

Scottie
 
Max Q
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RE: UA Pilot Suffers Heart Attack Mid-flight

Sat Sep 28, 2013 5:42 am

Quoting modesto2 (Reply 22):

One point of clarification. A 2,000 fpm descent is NOT a bit more than normal. That's a very normal rate of descent and would not be cause for alarm. 4,000 fpm is a bit more than normal, but even that rate of descent would be well within the limitations of the aircraft.

Exactly right, couldn't agree more.


My sincere condolences to the Captain and his family. A great loss.
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.

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