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787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 5:12 pm

Link to previous thread 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 21 (by SA7700 Sep 29 2013 in Civil Aviation)
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 5:17 pm

Thank you United787!

Quoting United787 (Reply 260):
As always, thank you to All Things 787 (NYC777) and others for the information that is summarized here.

DELIVERED TO DATE: 95 Aircraft to 16 Airlines

DELIVERIES PRIOR TO OCTOBER
NH-23; JL-11; AI-8; QR-8; UA–7; ET-5; LO-5; BY-4; LA-4; BA-4; CZ-3; HU-3; DY-2; AM-1; JQ-1

OCTOBER DELIVERIES TO DATE
L/N 100 - B-2736 – 10/1/2013 – CZ #4
L/N 128 – V8-DLA - 10/1/2013 – BI #1
L/N 91 - VT-ANO – 10/3/2013 - AI #9
L/N 113 - CC-BBE - 10/9/2013 - LA #5 (FLY LEASING LIMITED)
L/N 43 - B-2727 – 10/9/2013 - CZ #5
L/N 109 - A7-BCF – 10/11/2013 - QR #9

AIRCRAFT THAT HAVE COMPLETED MAJOR ASSEMBLY & CHANGE INCORPORATION*
L/N 122 – N964AM - 10/xx/2013 - AM #2 (ILFC)
L/N 124 - N27908 - 10/xx/2013 - UA #8
L/N 20 – JA821J – 10/xx/2013 - JL #12
L/N 130 – V8-DLB - 10/xx/2013 – BI #2
L/N 127 – N965AM - 10/xx/2013 - AM #3 (ILFC)
L/N 125 – JA833J - 10/xx/2013 - JL #13
L/N 85 - B–2730 - 10/xx/2013 - HU #4
L/N 104 - B-2737 – xx/xx/2013 – CZ #6 or 7
L/N 36 - B-2726 – xx/xx/2013 – CZ #6 or 7
L/N 32 - VT-ANG – xx/xx/2013 - AI #10
L/N 134 – VH-VKB – xx/xx/2013 – JQ #2 Awaiting first flight
L/N 136 - EI-LNC - 11/xx/2013 - DY #3 Awaiting first flight
L/N 132 - JA824A - 11/xx/2013 - NH #24 Awaiting first flight
L/N 129 - A7-BCH – 11/xx/2013 - QR #10 Awaiting first flight
L/N 30 - VT-ANE – x/xx/2013 - AI #11 Awaiting first flight
L/N 79 - B-27?? – x/xx/2014 - HU #5 Awaiting first flight (Storage)
L/N 119 - B-2738 – x/xx/2014 – CZ #8 Awaiting first flight
L/N 131 - B-2731 – x/xx/2014 - HU #6 Awaiting first flight

*Not including the delivered aircraft and test aircraft (ZA001-006 & ZB001-002)
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 5:22 pm

I noticed at allthings787 that one test airframe is at the EMC? Finally done?
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 5:30 pm

As reported in the previous thread, the flight test equipment of ZA005 has been removed and the bird was towed to the EMC. I'm not sure if change incorporation inside the building itself will start immediately though, one would think the ones in storage will come first.

Here's a picture of ZA005 being towed to the EMC:

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BW4DovlCIAAGP1c.jpg:large

http://twitter.com/pdxlight/status/391254216271863809/photo/1

[Edited 2013-10-18 10:35:33]
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:19 pm

KarelXWB from thread:

Quote:
The engine maker will have to ramp up production first. ANA's first 787s were delivered with Package A despite Package B was certified.

I was under the assumption that only four ANA 787s were delivered with Package A and B was certified in December 2011 and the first package B 787 was delivered in January (5th ANA delivered January 14?).

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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:21 pm

Ln5 will probably be at EMC for a very long time. Ln6 has been at San antonio for as long as I can remember. Does anyone know where they are with it?
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:24 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 3):

As reported in the previous thread, the flight test equipment of ZA005 has been removed and the bird was towed to the EMC. I'm not sure if change incorporation inside the building itself will start immediately though, one would think the ones in storage will come first.

Wonder if it is destined to fly for a customer (VIP?) or if it will remain a Boeing flight test article...as I recall, Boeing once stated that they ate the cost of LN1-LN6 because they were too heavy and required too much modification to be sold to (airline) customers.
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:34 pm

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 6):
Wonder if it is destined to fly for a customer (VIP?) or if it will remain a Boeing flight test article...as I recall, Boeing once stated that they ate the cost of LN1-LN6 because they were too heavy and required too much modification to be sold to (airline) customers.

Nope that's only for LN 1 - LN 3. LN 4 - LN 6 and economically viable to be sold and I believe that this is still their intention.
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:42 pm

Looks like LN 85 is going up for the first time in over 3.5 months. Looks like they're making a push to deliver it this month.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE434
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:50 pm

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 6):
Wonder if it is destined to fly for a customer (VIP?) or if it will remain a Boeing flight test article...as I recall, Boeing once stated that they ate the cost of LN1-LN6 because they were too heavy and required too much modification to be sold to (airline) customers.

I expect LN4-6 to end up as VIP airplane. I don't think any airline wants them in the fleet because future maintenance will differ too much from the production units.

LN1-3 are special and very expensive to modify. Give them a honorable place in the museum   
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:53 pm

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 6):
as I recall, Boeing once stated that they ate the cost of LN1-LN6 because they were too heavy and required too much modification to be sold to (airline) customers.

Boeing moved LN1 through LN3 from inventory into R&D, effectively writing off the cost.

Boeing indicated that it would sell LN4 through LN6 to VIP customers after change incorporation. A long time ago, they indicated that change incorporation on LN6 would be complete in mid-2013. They currently have 3 BBJ orders on the books, plus some number of VIP orders which have been placed through leasing companies (the first two of these, LN141 and LN143, are now under construction). I don't know whether LN4 through LN6 are all accounted for in these orders.

[Edited 2013-10-18 11:53:38]
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 7:26 pm

Quoting seabosdca (Reply 10):
Boeing indicated that it would sell LN4 through LN6 to VIP customers after change incorporation. A long time ago, they indicated that change incorporation on LN6 would be complete in mid-2013. They currently have 3 BBJ orders on the books, plus some number of VIP orders which have been placed through leasing companies (the first two of these, LN141 and LN143, are now under construction). I don't know whether LN4 through LN6 are all accounted for in these orders.

Let us hope Line 4-6 find homes---it would be a tragedy to waste 6 frames---what a contrast to the 777 program where the prototype is still flying for Cathay Pacific!!
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 7:45 pm

Quoting n471wn (Reply 11):
Let us hope Line 4-6 find homes---it would be a tragedy to waste 6 frames---what a contrast to the 777 program where the prototype is still flying for Cathay Pacific!!

Boeing would not rework them without having a customer for each.
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:02 pm

ZA005 now at the EMC:

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BW4mzKbCMAAG3Ew.jpg:large

http://twitter.com/mattcawby/status/391294791184424960

[Edited 2013-10-18 13:12:43]
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:11 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 13):

This bird has the best GEnx engines available, PIP2s.
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:22 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 13):
ZA005 now at the EMC:

I believe ZB021 already has engines attached so it will be interesting to know what happens to these GEnx PIP 2 on ZA005. There is not another GE powered 787-9 on the immediate horizon so they could be sitting for a while. Again, I would think they would have made a call to KQ (LN 157) or some other coming new customer (AC may have too many too soon) to see if they wanted to upgrade.

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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:40 pm

From the previous thread:

Quote:
My understanding is that in May they were producing aircraft at 7/month with Charleston running at less than 2/month meaning that Everett was at more than 5/month. I don't believe that we know if all of the growth to 10/month will come from Charleston but I imagine that is not the case. I suspect the rate will be closer to 7/3 split between Everett/Charleston as it was speculated over a year ago
Quote:
However Charleston won't reach 3/month this year by their own admission (article here), so Everett will have to increase to at least a little beyond 7/month.

The production rate hit 7 per month in May but was reduced to 5 again when the first 787-9 entered final assembly. This allowed Boeing to clear its big inventory (due to the grounding), but they now have 2.5 months left to increase that figure to 10. Looking at nyc777's table, Boeing will load 6 frames in the assembly bays this month: 4 in Everett and 2 in Charleston. Given the lead time of 4-5 weeks, we should see them rolling out at 6 per month from next month.
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sat Oct 19, 2013 3:57 am

Any word on who will get the 100th delivered 787?
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sat Oct 19, 2013 6:16 am

Quoting AeroplaneFreak (Reply 17):
Any word on who will get the 100th delivered 787?

No word from Boeing yet on identity or timing. It will be one of the following: Air India (VT-ANG), Royal Brunei (V8-DLB), ILFC/Aeromexico (N964AM & N965AM), JAL (JA-821J), China Southern (B-2726 & B-2737), Hainan Air (B-2730) or United (N27908). Perhaps #100 as a thank you to ILFC for being the largest customer of 787s or to JAL as a gesture of goodwill following the 350 purchase... In reality i'm sure there is no plan in place, it will simply to go whomever is ready to receive their frame at that specific time.
A
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sat Oct 19, 2013 6:35 am

When you have an order book of 1,000 aircraft I am not sure 100 is a big milestone. Deinitely news release worthy but i a, not picturing any ceremony. I think production at 10/month is bigger. At that rate they will hit 200 deliveries by this time next year  

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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sat Oct 19, 2013 2:30 pm

The finest Dreamliner 787-8 livery to date !


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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sat Oct 19, 2013 4:09 pm

Quoting tortugamon (Reply 19):
When you have an order book of 1,000 aircraft I am not sure 100 is a big milestone. Deinitely news release worthy but i a, not picturing any ceremony. I think production at 10/month is bigger. At that rate they will hit 200 deliveries by this time next year

By August/september of next year, we should be celebrating 250!

And by years end, there should be more 787's than A380's flying around.
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sat Oct 19, 2013 4:23 pm

Quoting flightsimer (Reply 21):
And by years end, there should be more 787's than A380's flying around.

It will be close but I expect it to happen early next year as another 10 A380s will be delivered before years end.
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sat Oct 19, 2013 4:30 pm

Quoting hkcanadaexpat (Reply 18):
Quoting flightsimer (Reply 21):
By August/september of next year, we should be celebrating 250!

that might be a little ambitious. A year from now they probably would have delivered about 200 - 210. Delivery rates lags behind the output rate so when Boeing starts loading at 10/month the deliveries of those aircraft at that rate won't rise to 10/month for a month or so.
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sat Oct 19, 2013 5:10 pm

Does anyone know when BA's next 787 is due into production?
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sat Oct 19, 2013 6:38 pm

Quoting Johnwaynebobbet (Reply 24):
Does anyone know when BA's next 787 is due into production?

LN 173 probably won't enter final assembly until February. Delivery around March 2014 I think.
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:27 pm

Quoting pdxswa (Reply 20):

I beg to differ....

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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:15 pm

Quoting flightsimer (Reply 21):
By August/september of next year, we should be celebrating 250!

I cannot see how to get to 250 by October without a production rate increase which I don't see happening in the near future. LN 158 is the first at 10/month which should enter FAL in December and they could deliver by February. If we assume 10/month being delivered from that point on it would take less than 10 being delivered out of the EMC to make 200 in September 2014. So ~210 by this time next year as NYC777 mentioned.

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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:17 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 22):
another 10 A380s will be delivered before years end.

Wow, that is some year end push.

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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sun Oct 20, 2013 12:06 am

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 22):
It will be close but I expect it to happen early next year as another 10 A380s will be delivered before years end.

I'll believe it when February rolls around. (isn't that when the Airbus 13 month calendar ends?)   
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sun Oct 20, 2013 6:06 am

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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sun Oct 20, 2013 11:15 am

Quoting kanban (Reply 29):
I'll believe it when February rolls around. (isn't that when the Airbus 13 month calendar ends?)

January 13th I believe.

[Edited 2013-10-20 04:54:57]
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Sun Oct 20, 2013 5:58 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 31):
Quoting kanban (Reply 29):
I'll believe it when February rolls around. (isn't that when the Airbus 13 month calendar ends?)

January 13th I believe.

[Edited 2013-10-20 04:54:57]

That was sarcasm..
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Mon Oct 21, 2013 3:23 am

Its driving me nuts wondering if we'll break a hundred 787 deliveries in October 2013. I think we shall... but I wonder.
Now for production to fully hit swing (10 airframes per month) so that the 'economy of scale' can build.

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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:34 pm

Close, but no cigar http://vine.co/v/OjqeYWWpVWK
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:47 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 34):
First 787-8 BBJ is almost complete.

I assume this is LN 141 for the UAE, now in final assembly.
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:48 pm

Quoting seabosdca (Reply 35):
I assume this is LN 141 for the UAE, now in final assembly.

Either LN141 or LN6.
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Mon Oct 21, 2013 6:35 pm

Quoting seabosdca (Reply 35):
I assume this is LN 141 for the UAE, now in final assembly.

LN 141 isn't a BBJ. It's ILFC. Remember BBJ is the customer and they sell the aircraft to the end user after taking delivery. While ILFC may have end customers who are business jet users they are not BBJ. This might be LN 6. LN 149 is a BBJ aircraft that will enter assembly in early November.
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Mon Oct 21, 2013 6:41 pm

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 37):
LN 141 isn't a BBJ. It's ILFC. Remember BBJ is the customer and they sell the aircraft to the end user after taking delivery. While ILFC may have end customers who are business jet users they are not BBJ.

Very good point, although I don't know whether Jon is being that precise in his usage or not. "BBJ" might just mean "VIP-configured aircraft."
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Mon Oct 21, 2013 7:14 pm

AIN ZA235 (32) filed for a C-1 later today:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE235
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Mon Oct 21, 2013 7:28 pm

Quoting 7BOEING7 (Reply 39):
AIN ZA235 (32) filed for a C-1 later today:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE235

There's ben quite a bit of fog around the Puget Sound region as of late. I hope it gets off today. Boeing is certainly hoping to get a few out the door over the next 10 days.
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:07 pm

Looks like the fog cleared up enough for ZA175 to go out on a B-3 or C-1 flight.

Though it's still pretty foggy out there.

[Edited 2013-10-21 13:09:00]

[Edited 2013-10-21 13:16:22]
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Mon Oct 21, 2013 9:12 pm

Looks like ZA175 landed at Boeing Field. the fog is still pretty bad out at Everett.
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7BOEING7
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Mon Oct 21, 2013 9:19 pm

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 41):
Looks like the fog cleared up enough for ZA175 to go out on a B-3 or C-1 flight.

Though it's still pretty foggy out there


Definitely not a C-1, wrong profile -- B-3 is the answer. So foggy, missed approach at PAE and on to BFI.
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Mon Oct 21, 2013 10:44 pm

Looks like ZA292 finished it's C-1 flight.
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Tue Oct 22, 2013 2:04 am

Tomarrow Aeromexico second 787 according to a company tweet:
https://twitter.com/aeromexico_com/status/392467434751287296
Only in spanish but basicly says that "tomarrow our second 787 will arrive to the AICM (Mexico City Intl. Airport) stay tune for more details."

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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Tue Oct 22, 2013 2:22 am

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 44):
Looks like ZA292 finished it's C-1 flight.

But no flight today for ZA235 (AI LN32). Oh well.
 
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Tue Oct 22, 2013 2:50 pm

 
NYC777
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Tue Oct 22, 2013 2:50 pm

Everett is still socked in with heavy fog...

http://www.airliners.net/uf/view.file?id=8680&filename=phpkT51Z3.jpeg

Don't know if they'll get any 787 flight off today though Aeromexico's delivery flight is scheduled for this afternoon:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/AMX8500
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RE: 787 Production/Delivery Thread Part 22

Tue Oct 22, 2013 2:56 pm

Quoting seabosdca (Reply 47):
ZA386 (CZ LN104) up, on what looks like a B-3:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/B.../KCHS

Or B-4.