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TK787
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Turkish Aviation November 2013

Thu Oct 31, 2013 9:19 pm

Happy November, Happy Halloween folks;


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Mehmet Mustafa Celik - SpotTR



Let's continue things from where we left off;

-There were questions about when/if TK to fly to HAV, MEX, CCS, MIA....others
-TK Cargo Ops, how are things?
-TK IST-TLV demand and performance
-New Bilateral with Canada allows TK to fly 9 x weekly to Canada? Montreal?
-AC to start flying Toronto-Istanbul daily in June 2014
-Heavy discussions about TK to Sydney non-stop
-TK to Tokyo goes 2 x daily
-New Istanbul airport to be designed by a Norwegian firm, opening 2019?
-Rumors about TK flying to SEA nonstop
-TK looking to lease more 330/340s while still looking to buy more planes to enter the fleet by 2020-2023
-Heated debates about Ankara not getting enough international flights from TK or other big carriers
-Now the latest batch of A333s to join TK fleet, can we expect to see Comfort Class on 333/77W? Or, is Comfort on its way out?
-SAW is getting a second runway and TK has plans to base up to 100 planes there.
-TK is moving 5 A320s from AJet to TK?
-Onur air is looking for more 320/321 to lease?
-And great news...abducted TK pilots in Beirut finally back home  

and others....

I can't wait to get my Herpa Wings 1:500 scale model of TK 332F.

Please join us with your news, photos, views, rumors, rant and good old sense of humor.
Just a friendly reminder, Please refrain from personal attacks and political innuendos.
Thank you and Welcome,
TK787
 
HB-IWC
Posts: 4033
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2000 1:09 am

RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 1:40 am

The first A333 of the new batch, TC-JNS (c/n 1458), should deliver any moment now, with TC-JNT (c/n 1476) still in line for delivery this year. Also, the 3 former Gulf Air A332 frames, to be registered TC-JNU/V/Y, should come up for delivery.
 
LAXintl
Posts: 20183
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 2:25 am

Look for new and final Kobe commercial soon (unless they extend his agreement). Just finished shooting this week here in LA.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
leftyboarder
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 7:32 am

Thanks for the new thread!

I am still hoping for more international connectivity at secondary Turkish airports. Look at France, where in addition to Paris, Nice, Lyon, Toulouse, Bordeaux, Marseille all have good connections (even transatlantic). Look at the UK, where Manchester, Birmingham, Glasgow are all well connected. Or see Poland even, where Krakow, Katowice etc all are connected internationally. Here, other than Istanbul, all cities are suffering, thanks to TK's policy of a single hub.
 
bycac
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 8:50 am

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 1):

A photo of TC-JNS during normaly is last flight test !




And also i ha post this comment in last topic but it's close now :


Hello , i have read in french web site that TK thinking of opening a second daily flight between IST and TLS, do you have any information about that ?
Many thanks in advance !
 
SCQ83
Posts: 2768
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 10:48 am

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 3):
I am still hoping for more international connectivity at secondary Turkish airports. Look at France, where in addition to Paris, Nice, Lyon, Toulouse, Bordeaux, Marseille all have good connections (even transatlantic). Look at the UK, where Manchester, Birmingham, Glasgow are all well connected. Or see Poland even, where Krakow, Katowice etc all are connected internationally. Here, other than Istanbul, all cities are suffering, thanks to TK's policy of a single hub.

You cannot compare the economics and purchase power of Turkey with those of France or the UK. You better look at countries like Russia, Brazil or Mexico... which are the international connections and transatlantic services in other cities except Moscow, Sao Paulo / Rio de Janeiro and Mexico DF?

[Edited 2013-11-01 03:52:10]
 
TK105
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 11:27 am

For our meeting at DXB, a colleague of mine will join from AMS. We studied different routing options but surprised to see price of KL. I have difficulty to explain this price, looks like EK is killing KL by A388. There may be lessons for TK to be learned:

EK AMS-DXB Y A388 : 1330 Euro
KL AMS-DXB Y B772 : 425 Euro
TK AMS-IST-DXB Y A321/A333 : 1213 Euro
 
ptahturan88
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 12:10 pm

Thanks for the nice thread.
How do you think Pegasus will be affected from the heated competition at SAW? TK is flying only international there, and most routes are overlapping, even the departure hours are quite close.
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 12:26 pm

Quoting ptahturan88 (Reply 7):
How do you think Pegasus will be affected from the heated competition at SAW?

Welcome to a.net  
I raised the same question last months thread and LAXintl ( fellow a.net member) suggested Pegasus becoming less dependent on SAW and branching out to other hubs;

"Remember Pegasus said they would likely open a 5th base next summer. Ankara could very well be it after current SAW, ADB, AYT and ADA bases."

And for some of us living on the Asian side close to SAW, in the years ahead when the new airport opens up, SAW could become our home airport. If there were to be a JFK-SAW flight in the future, I will have no need to go to the bigger airport in Istanbul. Recently, I have been looking at JFK-IST one-stop and KL partnering with Pegasus comes up as the best fare and option with JFK-AMS on KL, and AMS-SAW on Pegasus.
 
umit
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 2:06 pm

I flew TK012 from NYC to Istanbul Tuesday. I think timing of this flight is excellent . Business and comfort class were full maybe few seats were available in Y. I am not impressed with the J cabin of 777 (with no wifi) , I think A 333 has a better J class . Maybe because of timing neither the dinner nor the breakfast were not even average . İt really seems that cooks (there were two) were really hard working since most services performed by them .
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 2:44 pm

Quoting umit (Reply 9):
I flew TK012 from NYC to Istanbul Tuesday.

I agree. Most people are tired and want to sleep and there is the food service. Everyone is a bit grumpy. Recently, I try to omit one of those meals (mostly the second one) and try to sleep.
Next time you are in NY, let me know, maybe we'll get a drink or something.
 
ptahturan88
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 3:15 pm

Hi back  

I did not think of the code-sharing agreement with KLM. It should def help LF also. Nice. I keep track of flights offered at SAW by Pegasus and THY on different routes, like SAW-Dusseldof, SAW- AMS. I notice that the price difference favors for Pegasus, not surprisingly, yet it's almost negligible. Pegasus managed to post an increase in yields in 2Q13, we'll see how they'll do in the third quarter.
 
ptahturan88
Posts: 17
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 3:20 pm

I was also thinking of the to-be-implemented price-ceiling on domestic air fares. Ineffective, but still not very good for the sentiment.
 
LAXintl
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 3:47 pm

As we move into November, I just ran across and analysis that OAG did a frequency and seat capacity forecast extrapolation of busiest airports in the world by 2017, and amazing Istanbul comes in # 3 !

Per OAG the Top-10 forecast airports in 2017 in seat-capacity.

1. Beijing
2. Atlanta
3. Istanbul
4. Dubai
5. Jakarta
6. Los Angeles
7. Haneda
8. Heathrow
9. Singapore
10.Hong Kong

Also looking back 10-years, available seat-capacity at Istanbul Ataturk has grown from under 1.8-million to over 5-million per month.
THY has a 76% market share at IST as of April 2013.


Also OAG forecast the Turkish domestic market will become 6th largest domestic air market in the world, with about 54% of the market being served by LCCs. (today LCCs are 43% of domestic seats in Turkey)

For reference the largest forecast domestic air markets.
1. USA
2. Brazil
3. China
4. India
5. Indonesia
6. Turkey
7. Mexico
8. Philippines
9. Japan
10.Spain
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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OA260
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 4:08 pm

Thanks for a new thread .

TK had wanted to start an extra flight IST-SKG but it has been turned down by the CAA because for the last 4 years an application by A3 for one slot pair has been turned down by its counterparts. Hopefully they can come to an arrangement as both cities mayors/tourism chiefs want to see an increase between the two cities.
 
LAXintl
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Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 4:32 pm

Quoting OA260 (Reply 14):
TK had wanted to start an extra flight IST-SKG but it has been turned down by the CAA because for the last 4 years an application by A3 for one slot pair has been turned down by its counterparts. Hopefully they can come to an arrangement as both cities mayors/tourism chiefs want to see an increase between the two cities.

Too bad the Greek CAA links two unrelated things. A route right to an airport slot issue.

Unfortunately IST slots are very hard to come by. A3 either needs to look at changes in time to less crowded part of the day, or needs to make a deal to acquire someones slots.

Too bad for SKG. I know several communities in Greece have been lobbying strongly for increased air service. For example officials in both Corfu and some other town whose name escapes me in Western Greece met with TK officials this year seeking service.

Politics I guess....
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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OA260
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 4:42 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 15):

Its always the same but if A3 wants to serve SKG-ATH then they should be offered whats available even if its not their ideal timings. To solve the issue TK and A3 should look at two flights one each and codeshares on both. Being two Star members its not that hard . Regards the Islands both Pegasus and TK have expressed interest.
 
northstar80
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:17 pm

I am on TK 9 to LAX in comfort class. I do not know about the J or Y but the comfort class is almost full. I think there are two empty seats. Whenever i am on CC, it is always almost full.

Now, the price and buying the ticket is a different story. The cc price was actually CHEAPER than economy price ??!! No wonder they are not making money.

Additionally, reservation systems will not give you a ticket on CC if the connecting onward flight is also not premium economy. They wont combine cc + y. Not in my case anyways. I had this before and this time too. The travel agent bent over backwords to get me a cc+y combination. Imagine the amount of passengers and revenue lost just because of this.

About the flight: afteer the food service the FAs got lost and never came around again. They dont walk around the cabin and they dont enforce the closing of the window blinds. It was like a daytime in the cabin halfway through the flight until i asked the FA twice to tell people to close the blinds.

Food keeps getting worse in CC. Today it was almost like a normal economy meal with fancy plates.

The passport control at IST is crazy (on departure). Not enough police controllers. More than half the booths were empty. I had to wait around 20 minutes in the line on an average friday midday. The line for foreign nationals were even longer, going outside the queueing lanes into the terminal. IST is a circus!
 
LAXintl
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Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:30 pm

Quoting Northstar80 (Reply 17):
Now, the price and buying the ticket is a different story. The cc price was actually CHEAPER than economy price ??!! No wonder they are not making money.

Yes this can happen.

CC has depending on the route has 2 or 3 fare pricing buckets, while economy itself can have many dozen fare buckets. Its quite possible the higher fare Y bucket becomes more expensive then a discount CC buckets.

Same things happens, other places. For example for work we sent and employee to Texas recently, and it was cheaper to book them a F class seat then full fare Y on AA.

Quoting Northstar80 (Reply 17):
Additionally, reservation systems will not give you a ticket on CC if the connecting onward flight is also not premium economy. They wont combine cc + y. Not in my case anyways. I had this before and this time too. The travel agent bent over backwords to get me a cc+y combination. Imagine the amount of passengers and revenue lost just because of this.

This is on purpose to keep customers happy. Too many complained about flying CC and then being stuck in regular economy.

So now its harder to combine CC with non CC segments.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
Steelyman
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Sat Nov 02, 2013 12:28 pm

Quoting Northstar80 (Reply 17):
Now, the price and buying the ticket is a different story. The cc price was actually CHEAPER than economy price ??!! No wonder they are not making money.

It is actually not that simple... What if that seat you took was the only one at that price?
BRGDS, Mike
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Sat Nov 02, 2013 2:41 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 13):
busiest airports in the world by 2017, and amazing Istanbul comes in # 3 !

Amazing numbers!!

Quoting Northstar80 (Reply 17):
The cc price was actually CHEAPER than economy price

Sometimes it doesn't make sense. In January, I went on a cruise and 6 days out I was able to get a suite-room cheaper than a regular room with a balcony. Doesn't happen all the time, I'll take it when I can.
 
MeCe
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Joined: Sun Oct 04, 2009 9:19 am

RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Sat Nov 02, 2013 7:16 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 13):
Per OAG the Top-10 forecast airports in 2017 in seat-capacity.

1. Beijing
2. Atlanta
3. Istanbul

With the new mega airport planned for the Istanbul market due to be operational in 2017, Turkish Airlines’ intentions are very clear. - See more at: http://www.oag.com/OAG-Blog/Insight-...ks?country=GB#sthash.XjvVk1Yy.dpuf


This seems to me too optimistic. OAG counts new airport operable in 2017, but there is no spesific date about this. An article about this (Turkish only)

http://www.airporthaber.com/kose-yaz...ak--ve-gundemden-satirbaslari.html
 
LX1800
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Sun Nov 03, 2013 11:30 am

I saw that in the october 2013 thread OA260 and TK105 asked for more info on which aircraft are fitted with the PTV-new-interior.

737-900 fleet
TC-JYA - TC-JYJ (whole fleet)

737-800 fleet
TC-JHK - TC-JHU (10 aircraft)

A321 fleet
TC-JRM - TC-JSL (23 aircraft)

In addition to that there is one A320 whick is configured with dedicated business class seats but not in the style of the new TK interior. There are also 4 737-700 aircraft (TC-JKJ - TC-JKO) which are configured with dedicated seats but also not in the style of the new TK interior. One of the airbus A321's is configured with a cabin that does not have dedicated business class seats nor PTV's but the seats and cabin are in the same colours as the new TK interior.

Hope this provides some clarity.
 
LAXintl
Posts: 20183
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Sun Nov 03, 2013 5:20 pm

Here is the latest fleet listing for TK - current as of October 11th.

Legend is.

Registration - Type - DVS Type - MSN - Seats

TC-JDJ A340-311 340 23 270
TC-JDK A340-312 342 25 270
TC-JDL A340-311 340 57 270
TC-JDM A340-311 340 115 270
TC-JDN A340-313 343 180 270
TC-JIH A340-313 343 270 270
TC-JII A340-313 343 331 270
TC-JNA A330-203 332 697 250
TC-JNB A330-203 332 704 250
TC-JNC A330-203 332 742 250
TC-JND A330-203 332 754 250
TC-JNE A330-203 332 774 250
TC-JNF A330-203 33Q 463 281
TC-JNG A330-203 33Q 504 281
TC-JNH A330-343 333 1150 289
TC-JNI A330-343 333 1160 289
TC-JNJ A330-343 333 1170 289
TC-JNK A330-343 333 1172 289
TC-JNL A330-343 333 1204 289
TC-JNM A330-343 333 1212 289
TC-JNN A330-343 333 1228 289
TC-JNO A330-343 333 1298 289
TC-JNP A330-343 333 1307 289
TC-JNR A330-343 333 1311 289
TC-JDO A330-243F 33X 1004 Freighter
TC-JDP A330-243F 33X 1092 Freighter
TC-JDR A330-243F 33X 1344 Freighter
TC-JDS A330-243F 33X 1418 Freighter
TC-JCI A330-243F 33X 1442 Freighter
TC-JCT A310-304F 31Y 502 Freighter
TC-JCY A310-304F 31Y 478 Freighter
TC-JCZ A310-304F 31Y 480 Freighter
TC-JLM A319-132 319 2738 132
TC-JLN A319-132 319 2739 132
TC-JLO A319-132 315 2631 132
TC-JLP A319-132 315 2655 132
TC-JLR A319-132 31D 3142 138
TC-JLS A319-132 316 4629 132
TC-JLT A319-132 316 4665 132
TC-JLU A319-132 316 4695 132
TC-JLV A319-132 316 4755 132
TC-JLY A319-132 316 4774 132
TC-JLZ A319-132 316 4790 132
TC-JUA A319-132 31E 2404 132
TC-JUB A319-132 31E 2414 132
TC-JUD A319-132 31E 2452 132
TC-JLJ A320-232 32L 1856 162
TC-JLK A320-232 32L 1909 162
TC-JLL A320-232 32E 1996 167
TC-JPA A320-232 320 2609 159
TC-JPB A320-232 320 2626 159
TC-JPC A320-232 320 2928 159
TC-JPD A320-232 320 2934 159
TC-JPE A320-232 320 2941 159
TC-JPF A320-232 320 2984 159
TC-JPG A320-232 320 3010 159
TC-JPH A320-232 320 3185 159
TC-JPI A320-232 320 3208 159
TC-JPJ A320-232 320 3239 159
TC-JPK A320-232 320 3257 159
TC-JPL A320-232 320 3303 159
TC-JPM A320-232 320 3341 159
TC-JPN A320-232 320 3558 159
TC-JPO A320-232 320 3567 159
TC-JPP A320-232 320 3603 159
TC-JPR A320-232 320 3654 159
TC-JPS A320-232 320 3718 159
TC-JPT A320-232 320 3719 159
TC-JPU A320-214 32C 3896 150
TC-JPV A320-214 32C 3931 150
TC-JPY A320-214 32C 3949 150
TC-JAI A320-232 32G 3259 150
TC-JBI A320-232 32G 3308 150
TC-JUE A320-232 B32 2156 180
TC-JUF A320-232 B32 2164 180
TC-JUG A320-232 B32 2395 180
TC-JUI A320-232 B32 2401 180
TC-JUJ A320-232 32D 2522 150
TC-JUK A320-232 B32 2602 180
TC-JRA A321-231 321 2823 194
TC-JRB A321-231 321 2868 194
TC-JRC A321-231 321 2999 194
TC-JRD A321-231 321 3015 194
TC-JRE A321-231 321 3126 194
TC-JRF A321-231 321 3207 194
TC-JRG A321-231 321 3283 194
TC-JRH A321-231 321 3350 194
TC-JRI A321-231 321 3405 194
TC-JRJ A321-231 321 3429 194
TC-JRK A321-231 321 3525 194
TC-JRL A321-231 321 3539 194
TC-JRM A321-231 32R 4643 180
TC-JRN A321-231 32R 4654 180
TC-JRO A321-231 32R 4682 180
TC-JRP A321-231 32R 4698 180
TC-JRR A321-231 32R 4706 180
TC-JRS A321-231 32R 4761 180
TC-JRT A321-231 32R 4779 180
TC-JRU A321-231 32R 4788 180
TC-JRV A321-231 32R 5077 180
TC-JRY A321-231 32R 5083 180
TC-JRZ A321-231 32R 5118 180
TC-JSA A321-231 32R 5154 180
TC-JSB A321-231 32R 5205 180
TC-JSC A321-231 32R 5254 180
TC-JSD A321-231 32R 5388 180
TC-JSE A321-231 32R 5450 180
TC-JSF A321-231 32R 5465 180
TC-JSG A321-231 32R 5490 180
TC-JSH A321-231 32R 5546 180
TC-JSI A321-231 32R 5584 180
TC-JSJ A321-231 32R 5633 180
TC-JSK A321-231 32R 5663 180
TC-JSL A321-231 32R 5667 180
TC-JSM A321-231 32R 5689 180
TC-JMH A321-232 32N 3637 178
TC-JMI A321-232 32N 3673 178
TC-JMJ A321-232 32N 3688 178
TC-JMK A321-232 32N 3738 178
TC-JML A321-231 32J 3382 194
TC-JFH B737-800W 738 29770 165
TC-JFI B737-800W 738 29771 165
TC-JFJ B737-800W 738 29772 165
TC-JFK B737-800W 738 29773 165
TC-JFN B737-800W 738 29776 165
TC-JFO B737-800W 738 29777 165
TC-JFR B737-800W 738 29779 165
TC-JFT B737-800W 738 29780 165
TC-JFU B737-800W 738 29781 165
TC-JFZ B737-800W 738 29784 165
TC-JGA B737-800W 738 29785 165
TC-JGB B737-800W 738 29786 165
TC-JGC B737-800W 738 29787 165
TC-JGD B737-800W 738 29788 165
TC-JGF B737-800W 738 29790 165
TC-JGG B737-800W 738 34405 165
TC-JGH B737-800W 738 34406 165
TC-JGI B737-800W 738 34407 165
TC-JGJ B737-800W 738 34408 165
TC-JGK B737-800W 738 34409 165
TC-JGL B737-800W 738 34410 165
TC-JGM B737-800W 738 34411 165
TC-JGN B737-800W 738 34412 165
TC-JGO B737-800W 738 34413 165
TC-JGP B737-800W 738 34414 165
TC-JGR B737-800W 738 34415 165
TC-JGS B737-800W 738 34416 165
TC-JGT B737-800W 738 34417 165
TC-JGU B737-800W 738 34418 165
TC-JGV B737-800W 738 34419 165
TC-JGY B737-800WSFP 738 35738 165
TC-JGZ B737-800WSFP 738 35739 165
TC-JHA B737-800WSFP 738 35740 165
TC-JHB B737-800WSFP 738 35741 165
TC-JHC B737-800WSFP 738 35742 165
TC-JHD B737-800WSFP 738 35743 165
TC-JHE B737-800WSFP 738 35744 165
TC-JHF B737-800WSFP 738 35745 165
TC-JHK B737-800WSFP 78D 40975 151
TC-JHL B737-800WSFP 78D 40976 151
TC-JHM B737-800WSFP 78D 40980 151
TC-JHN B737-800WSFP 78D 40981 151
TC-JHO B737-800WSFP 78D 40987 151
TC-JHP B737-800WSFP 78D 42000 151
TC-JHR B737-800WSFP 78D 40989 151
TC-JHS B737-800WSFP 78D 40991 151
TC-JHT B737-800WSFP 78D 42001 151
TC-JHU B737-800WSFP 78D 42002 151
TC-JYA B737-900ER 79B 40973 151
TC-JYB B737-900ER 79B 40974 151
TC-JYC B737-900ER 79B 40977 151
TC-JYD B737-900ER 79B 40978 151
TC-JYE B737-900ER 79B 40979 151
TC-JYF B737-900ER 79B 40982 151
TC-JYG B737-900ER 79B 40983 151
TC-JYH B737-900ER 79B 40984 151
TC-JYI B737-900ER 79B 40985 151
TC-JYJ B737-900ER 79B 40986 151
TC-JKJ B737-700W 73W 34297 124
TC-JKK B737-700W 73W 34298 124
TC-JKN B737-700W 73W 34299 124
TC-JKO B737-700W 73W 34300 124
TC-JJE B777-300ER 77C 40707 337
TC-JJF B777-300ER 77C 40708 337
TC-JJG B777-300ER 77C 40791 337
TC-JJH B777-300ER 77C 40792 337
TC-JJI B777-300ER 77C 40709 337
TC-JJJ B777-300ER 77C 40710 337
TC-JJK B777-300ER 77C 40711 337
TC-JJL B777-300ER 77C 40793 337
TC-JJM B777-300ER 77C 40794 337
TC-JJN B777-300ER 77C 40795 337
TC-JJO B777-300ER 77C 40796 337
TC-JJP B777-300ER 77C 40797 337

=
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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OA260
Posts: 21144
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 8:50 pm

RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Mon Nov 04, 2013 7:15 pm

Quoting LX1800 (Reply 22):

Thanks a lot much appreciated  
 
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lightsaber
Crew
Posts: 11866
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Mon Nov 04, 2013 7:56 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 13):
and amazing Istanbul comes in # 3 !

Per OAG the Top-10 forecast airports in 2017 in seat-capacity.

1. Beijing
2. Atlanta
3. Istanbul
4. Dubai
5. Jakarta
6. Los Angeles
7. Haneda
8. Heathrow
9. Singapore
10.Hong Kong

IMHO, this list requires the new 'mega-IST.' Due to the fleet mix, this is unlikely to happen otherwise. Or does this include SAW? I assume, due to the lack of any New York city airports, it is by airport and not by city.

I agree Heathrow will fall quickly. Not enough growth for too long with strict curfews (someone mitigated by the noise control allowing night landings... but not really).

Ack! My home airport of LAX is plummeting in the ranking!  

Otherwise, a very reasonable listing.

Lightsaber
"They did not know it was impossible, so they did it!" - Mark Twain
 
LAXintl
Posts: 20183
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Mon Nov 04, 2013 9:23 pm

I read TK cargo will move to from DXB to new DWC.

They will also increase freighter services to Dubai and plan 5x weekly A330F by March.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
B747forever
Posts: 12855
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:24 pm

Hi guys,

What would the connection process be like at IST if I am flying BCN-IST-LAX-IST-ARN all on TK? Will I have to clear customs and enter the country like in the US, or is there just a simple passport/boarding pass check similar to what they have at LHR?
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LAXintl
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Mon Nov 04, 2013 11:53 pm

Similar to London. Follows signs to transit, clear security, and you will be in departure gate area.
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TK105
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:17 am

This article is under discussion in Turkey for a while now:

http://gulfnews.com/gn-focus/turkey/...next-global-aviation-hub-1.1247630

In short it says that Turkey may not realize its targets for becoming a world hub as Turkey is unstable. Only way for Turkey to become a world hub is to be part of EU as it will stabilize the country.

I'm not in the same opinion. Of course joining EU will help stabilizing Turkey. However Turkey created this market already in this "destabilized" country (as they see it). Even TAV was started during deadliest economical crises of Turkey in early 2000s. So we are used to it.

But in current status, based on customs union agreement and EU bilateral agreements, TK and Pegasus is free to fly any point within EU and transfer passengers. However EU carriers can not fly within Turkey or to 3rd countries. This creates a habitat for our carriers to grow in a protected market while benefiting others. So later the joining EU, better for our national carriers.

Some say that, if we are part of EU, then for example TK can buy out LOT, etc. Come on! What is the benefit of buying LOT or similar carriers. It will only result in loss of money and synergy. We are fine here while benefiting transfer passengers from these countries without limitation and enjoying our protected market.
 
LAXintl
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Tue Nov 05, 2013 4:16 pm

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 25):
IMHO, this list requires the new 'mega-IST.' Due to the fleet mix, this is unlikely to happen otherwise. Or does this include SAW? I assume, due to the lack of any New York city airports, it is by airport and not by city.

Its single airport, not metro area.

Whether it happens in 2017, 2018, or 2019, I think the trajectory is there. Certainly an Istanbul airport will be up close to the top soon.

IMF even says Turkey's GDP will be in the global Top-10 in the next two decade.

Quoting TK105 (Reply 29):
In short it says that Turkey may not realize its targets for becoming a world hub as Turkey is unstable.

The article seems to think key to growth is TK using location as transit traffic, but the key is really the large home market even with fortuitous geographic location Turkey has.

The ME3 combined have smaller home markets than Turkey does, and today international transits traffic only makes up 23% of TK enplanements. That means 77% of the traffic is built around its home market demand.

Yes there might be economic ups and downs (which Turkey has navigated before), I don't see Turkey anymore unstable then other regions.
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TK105
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Wed Nov 06, 2013 10:07 am

DHMI published passenger numbers for Oct13. As expected results for October are very good. Some significant figures are as follows:

- IST Dom +13% and Int +15%
- SAW Dom +20% and Int +31%
- ESB Dom +21%
- ADB Dom +11%
- AYT Dom +12% and Int +7%

All Turkey Dom +17% and Int +11.6%

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 30):
The ME3 combined have smaller home markets than Turkey does, and today international transits traffic only makes up 23% of TK enplanements. That means 77% of the traffic is built around its home market demand.

  
 
Tupolev160
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Wed Nov 06, 2013 11:55 am

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 3):

Better make sure what you are talking about. Besides Paris and NCE, all the other airports are pretty useless to take you anywhere outside France or closest surroundings. France is really not an example, Germany is, or Ukranie (for the other side of Europe). France is a highly (if not the most) centralized country in Europe, together with Russia i would say.
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act."
 
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Alsatian
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Wed Nov 06, 2013 1:00 pm

Quoting Tupolev160 (Reply 32):
Better make sure what you are talking about. Besides Paris and NCE, all the other airports are pretty useless to take you anywhere outside France or closest surroundings. France is really not an example, Germany is, or Ukranie (for the other side of Europe). France is a highly (if not the most) centralized country in Europe, together with Russia i would say.

That is true. Even the second french city, Lyons, has not been able to maintain a direct service to NYC.
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leftyboarder
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Wed Nov 06, 2013 2:13 pm

Quoting TK105 (Reply 6):
Quoting Tupolev160 (Reply 32):

Here you come with that attitide again... ESB is linked directly to around 50 points, more than half being in Turkey. LYS is connected to 115 destinations according to their website, only 30 or so being in France. I know what I am talking about, thank you very much.
 
LAXintl
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Wed Nov 06, 2013 6:06 pm

And here it is -- Montreal

Starts June 3rd, 2014 - 3x weekly (Tue/Fri/Sun) using A330s.

TK35 IST-YUL 1400-1720
TK36 YUL-IST 2340-1600

=
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B747forever
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Wed Nov 06, 2013 6:12 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 28):
Similar to London. Follows signs to transit, clear security, and you will be in departure gate area.

Thanks!
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TurkishSky
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Wed Nov 06, 2013 7:02 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 35):

And YYZ goes 6 weekly...
Flown 4I 9U AA AB AF AZ BA BD BR CA CU CX EI FR HV JK JP JU KK KL KM LH LX MA ME MS NG OA OK QR OS RJ RO SA SK SQ SR SU
 
ASA
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Wed Nov 06, 2013 7:35 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 35):

And here it is -- Montreal

Starts June 3rd, 2014 - 3x weekly (Tue/Fri/Sun) using A330s.

TK35 IST-YUL 1400-1720
TK36 YUL-IST 2340-1600
Quoting TurkishSky (Reply 37):
And YYZ goes 6 weekly...

awesome - that's what we have been talking about   

YYZ 6x weekly and YUL 3x weekly - is a good foothold in Canada. Similar to EK and QR combined in terms of seat capacity. I'm pretty sure soon YUL will be upgraded to 77Ws.
 
ek604
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Wed Nov 06, 2013 7:45 pm

PK set to wet lease 2 737-800s from XC . Speculated aircraft are TC-TJL and TC-TJJ
 
radiopolitic
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Thu Nov 07, 2013 12:09 am

I remember someone posting a leaked schedule of which routes would be starting by which dates at some point.

Have all of those been fulfilled?

Can anyone pull that up from somewhere again?
 
ankaraflyjet
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Thu Nov 07, 2013 12:27 am

Quoting TK105 (Reply 31):

ESB pax volume for Jan-Oct 2013 is 9,133,166 so ESB will reach 10,000,000 category for the first time this year end of December and I think ADB will also perform the same as ADB stands of at 8,764,869 pax as of end of October.

In 2014 Turkey will have 5 airports in more than 10,000,000 pax per annum range,

IST, AYT, SAW, ESB, ADB,

Turkey is definitely on the map as an aviation hub with this development, more than TK we should congratulate TAV for providing the infrastructure for this growth, if those modern state of the art terminals were not built, there is noway TK or others would be able to expand as much, we all know how terrible the Turkish airports were before 10 years ago not too long, we were stuck with 50'ies infrastructure, so delayed growht for sure, but better late than never.

Compare old termainl at ESB to the current one that was elected the best airport in Europe in 2008 in its category, the old one was so bad that it was a shame for the entire country as the capitals gateway to the world.
 
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lightsaber
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Thu Nov 07, 2013 5:00 am

Quoting TK105 (Reply 29):
So later the joining EU, better for our national carriers.

Agreed. But Turkey also needs to make certain laws more investor friendly. But that transition is so far in the future, it isn't worth worrying about today.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 30):
Whether it happens in 2017, 2018, or 2019, I think the trajectory is there. Certainly an Istanbul airport will be up close to the top soon.

   No doubt the 'mega-IST' will get there. Its just when will the 'mega-IST' open?   

Quoting ankaraflyjet (Reply 41):
In 2014 Turkey will have 5 airports in more than 10,000,000 pax per annum range,

IST, AYT, SAW, ESB, ADB,

What is the status of the 2nd runway at SAW? I've heard nothing but planning studies... IMHO, the 2nd runway at SAW is required to aid TK growth while waiting for the new-IST airport.

I'm amazed at the growth of Turkish aviation. I didn't notice it until it had been underway for years!

Lightsaber
"They did not know it was impossible, so they did it!" - Mark Twain
 
LAXintl
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Thu Nov 07, 2013 6:10 am

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 42):
What is the status of the 2nd runway at SAW?

It was approved - 3500m x 60m and A380 capable. Approx $600mil project along with other airfield improvements including a new control tower (one of the worlds tallest), new ARFF facility, cargo warehouse, expanded fuel farm and additional parking aprons.

With 2nd runway, SAW annual capacity will increase to around 50mil, while there are studies to further terminal expansion which could raise capacity to 70mil.

Completion timeline I saw was for late 2015.
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Yakamoz
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Thu Nov 07, 2013 7:24 am

Hello everyone

Is there a newer presentation by TK?
The last one was that of June '13.

http://www.turkishairlines.com/downl...ations/presentations_june_2013.pdf

Thanks a lot!

Quoting radiopolitic (Reply 40):
I remember someone posting a leaked schedule of which routes would be starting by which dates at some point.

Have all of those been fulfilled?

Can anyone pull that up from somewhere again?


What I found is;

19.11.2013 Mazar-i-Sharif
27.11.2013 Lahore
12.12.2013 Kano - N'Djamena
04.03.2014 Rotterdam
12.05.2014 Boston
03.06.2014 Montreal

[Edited 2013-11-06 23:37:40]
 
TK105
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Thu Nov 07, 2013 10:35 am

Quoting ankaraflyjet (Reply 41):
In 2014 Turkey will have 5 airports in more than 10,000,000 pax per annum range

In Europe only Germany has 6 airports with 10M+/annum passenger range (considering that STR will probably pass 10M by end of 2013). All other countries in Europe have 4 or less such airports.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 43):
With 2nd runway, SAW annual capacity will increase to around 50mil, while there are studies to further terminal expansion which could raise capacity to 70mil.

If I were owner of Pegasus, I would consider having my own terminal in place of old terminal buildings at SAW. This investment will provide a lot of prestige and cost a fraction of the fleet Pegasus has on order.
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Thu Nov 07, 2013 12:29 pm

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 42):
What is the status of the 2nd runway at SAW?

Here is an illustration of the future SAW.
Do I see a new terminal and runway built over the highway?
http://www.arup.com/~/media/Images/P...kçen_900x600.ashx?mh=800&mw=1000
 
BNAOWB
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Thu Nov 07, 2013 2:31 pm

Does anyone have a guess regarding the percentage of TK's arriving passengers from North America that connect beyond IST?

And, of the total TK arriving passengers from North America that connect at IST, what are the rough percentages that connect to the following regions?:
Turkey (domestic)
Eastern Europe
Middle East
Central Asia
South Asia
Africa
East Asia
 
Tkfan
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Thu Nov 07, 2013 2:53 pm

Quoting TK787 (Reply 46):

Do you know from when this illustration is?? I think its not very accurate, I dont think HABOM will be demolished shortly befor its completition  
 
TK105
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RE: Turkish Aviation November 2013

Thu Nov 07, 2013 3:16 pm

Quoting TK787 (Reply 46):
Do I see a new terminal and runway built over the highway?

I do not know about the terminal but there is certainly a motorway tunnel under the new run way since my company contributed to the traffic design of this tunnel (we also happened to provide traffic systems of airport tunnel under DXB runway extension, aka Beirut Road Tunnel, back in 2005). This new tunnel is positioned on the existing motorway which connects SAW, TEM Motorway and E-5.