Jerseyguy
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Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 2:37 pm

Looks like TTN is unstoppable, F9 is adding service to MKE, MSP, and STL.. Also according to the article looking at Destinations to start in next winter. Article also says Frontier is talking to TTN about "runway considerations" for launching service to DEN.

http://www.philly.com/philly/busines...e_nonstop_cities_from_Trenton.html

[Edited 2014-02-19 06:47:26]
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GentFromAlaska
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 2:56 pm

I'm sure BRRAM is jumping with joy. By the way we; or at least I haven't heard a peep from BRRAM across the last several months. The last was a Congressional of sorts. I assume all is not well in the TTN Frontier. I doubt they've raised the   

What connects TTN to MKE, MSP and STL? TTN-STL connect the JBMDL WRI aerial terminal with their parent HQ command at Scott AFB across the river in Illinois.
Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
 
Jerseyguy
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:09 pm

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 1):
By the way we; or at least I haven't heard a peep from BRRAM across the last several months. The last was a Congressional of sorts. I assume all is not well in the TTN Frontier. I doubt they've raised the

They made a peep on their facebook page about how F9 was operating illegally and get involved before its too late to stop the noise back on Jan 31 when UST was announced. But yes prior to that, we hadn't heard from them since mid november . I believe we will be hearing from the soon especially after the "runway considerations" quote.
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:15 pm

Looks like in addition to TTN, STL is also getting nonstops to PDX and SFO on F9, per their website. I wonder if F9 is going to be offering through flights to more distant points out of TTN? Might be something to consider....
Next up: STL-OAK-RNO-LAS-ICT-STL
 
GentFromAlaska
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:15 pm

Quoting Jerseyguy (Thread starter):
Looks like TTN is unstoppable, F9 is adding service to MKE, MSP, and STL..

According to the Facebook page they've also announced STL to PDX and SFO. But I'll leave that for the other thread
Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
 
sdoyon
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:27 pm

Not sure if someone has already mentioned this (there are 7 threads now for little old TTN...), but what is the max range off the 6006' runway? We know that DEN at ~1600 miles is too far, but what about DFW or IAH, both of which are about ~1350 miles. Just trying to figure out the next dots on the TTN map!
 
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:32 pm

If my count is correct this makes 17 destinations from the TTN focus city when all the service inaugurates. Because F9 is a P2P carrier if I was a hotel/motel chain near the TTN airport I might start to think of marketing a F9 RON rate for passengars who fly in and out with courtesy transportation to/from the airport. I can only guess the hotel(s) may not fully comprehend the ULCC model with limited or no connecting opportunities.

Given my competition is the Philly airport I might start a shuttle service to/from TTN to McGuire AFB. For the local military population assigned to the bases but also to those who fly in and out solely to use the aerial Space-A terminal which is a major gateway to both Europe and the U.S. I see a lot of seats being used on the terminal Facebook page and this is the slow season. Perhaps this is something the TTN airport might want to sponsor or even undertake. I see a valuable return on investment.

[Edited 2014-02-19 08:36:47]
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Frontier14
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:34 pm

Quoting sdoyon (Reply 5):
We know that DEN at ~1600 miles is too far

It will be interesting to see if F9 will consider a one-way DEN-TTN to get aircraft there as needed. We have already seen a couple of repositioning flights routed fot this purpose.

Frontier 14
 
Flytravel
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:39 pm

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 1):
What connects TTN to MKE, MSP and STL? TTN-STL connect the JBMDL WRI aerial terminal with their parent HQ command at Scott AFB across the river in Illinois.

Atleast for MSP and MKE, TTN can be used as a low fare alternative over the nonstops into PHL or EWR. Even the one-stops/connections flights from WN are expensive between PHL/EWR - MSP. F9 already services MKE, MSP and STL also.

F9 might have beat NK from launching PHL-MSP. NK's service pretty much caters to those who are desperate for a low fare when fares are very high elsewhere, but now that F9 will be offering MSP-TTN service, the potential demand for NK's offerings will be reduced.
 
GentFromAlaska
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:51 pm

Quoting Frontier14 (Reply 7):
We have already seen a couple of repositioning flights routed fot this purpose.

A wishlist of mine would be for F9 to fly BNA-ORD as a repositioning flight for Apple. It would be the only large jet service on the route. AA and UA fly regional jets between the two cities. It could be from TTN or any other city in the F9 system. WN flies the 73X between BNA-MDW.

I've flown AA puddle jumper service. It can get a bit cramped and bumpy if you find yourself in the midst of a Spring or Summer thunderstorm in the heartland.
Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
 
Jerseyguy
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 5:12 pm

Quoting Frontier14 (Reply 7):
It will be interesting to see if F9 will consider a one-way DEN-TTN to get aircraft there as needed. We have already seen a couple of repositioning flights routed fot this purpose.

Well according to the article about the new service that was announced today "Frontier is looking at adding more leisure destinations from Trenton next winter and is talking with Trenton and Mercer County officials about airspace and runway considerations to possibly begin flights to Denver, Shurz said, in a telephone interview."

Talking about "runway considerations", Dare I dream that means lengthening the runway? What other runway consideration could their be.
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point2point
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 5:27 pm

Since the DOT 2013 Q3 numbers have just been released..... I sorted through them for the TTN info, and it is as such..... just remember F9 is the only airline involved, so a dropped a lot of columns to show only basic info:

City …… Pax …… Av. Fare …… Miles

ATL …… 112 …… $126.21 ….. 701
CHI …… 143 …… $119.02 ….. 693
CMH …… 51 ….. $89.04 …... 428
DTW …… 99 ….. $98.62 …... 464
MCO …. 106 … $136.99 …... 896
RSW …. 48 ….. $132.10 ….. 1,028
FLL ……. 63 ….. $126.58 ….. 1,047
TPA …… 78 ….. $123.61 ….. 955
MSY …… 32 ….. $103.11 ….. 1,123
RDU …… 101 …… $91.52 ….. 373

I guess that we can see why F9 dropped both MSY and CMH, and the 3rd quarter isn't exactly Florida flying time. And from another site

http://aviationdb.net/aviationdb/F4SDetailQuery#SUBMIT

is showing TTN having 90% plus (up to 95% with MDW) load factors for July 2013.

Now, the big, big, validation of all of this..... when do the quarterly reports for F9 get released?

 

[Edited 2014-02-19 09:33:25]
 
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STT757
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:17 pm

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 6):

Given my competition is the Philly airport I might start a shuttle service to/from TTN to McGuire AFB. For the local military population assigned to the bases but also to those who fly in and out solely to use the aerial Space-A terminal which is a major gateway to both Europe and the U.S. I see a lot of seats being used on the terminal Facebook page and this is the slow season.

Gent, this is the company used by civilian and uniform personnel at MDL.

http://www.rapidrover.com/

They're a South Jersey Company, TTN might be outside of their territory.
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:17 pm

Quoting point2point (Reply 11):
Now, the big, big, validation of all of this..... when do the quarterly reports for F9 get released?

Will they be? Frontier is no longer a publicly listed company.

I suppose they'll be available somewhere, but I can't imagine what anyone is expecting. I mean, why does TTN need validating? It's Indigo's money.

mariner

[Edited 2014-02-19 10:33:10]
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point2point
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:37 pm

Quoting mariner (Reply 13):
Will they be? Frontier is no longer a publicly listed company.

Hmmmm.... good info here, I neglected to think that now they are a private company.

Quoting mariner (Reply 13):
I mean, I suppose they'll be available somewhere, but I can't imagine what anyone is expecting. I mean, why does TTN need validating?

I personally would just like to know (as if it's really my business, eh?) if F9 has finally found someplace that they could fly outside of DEN and actually be cash positive. This would be a milestone, if so, I think that we could agree on that point. Just better to actually see it in writing somehow, I guess.

Nonetheless, I think that we all know that in the past when F9 ventured beyond DEN it usually costs them some pretty pennies, and I also would want to see F9 do well, not just for my own convenience of having choice with local air service, but also for the employees. And maybe you can agree with me with this point that every time F9 has announced expansion ex-DEN, I've gotten shivers down my spine (well, a bit drastic, but) and hopefully the TTN expansion will finally be different in this manner.

However, with that, all of these new expansions ex-DEN and ex-TTN have me sorta in that above condition....... CLE-SEA/etc...... STL-SFO/etc......really? Hopefully this new Indigo F9 knows what they're doing with these, or that they haven't invested that much into this yet so that losses won't be that drastic (if these flights don't catch, eh?)

Anyways my friends.......

 
 
triangleGIS21
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:38 pm

Interesting numbers, point2point. BTW, where can I access the 3Q data? I actually need the numbers for a case study that I'm working on for UNC and RDU. Also, I'm pleasantly surprised about how well RDU-TTN is doing in terms of passenger numbers. Apparently the July load factor number was up to 94%, and considering how little advertising there has been in my area about the new service, it seems really encouraging to me.
 
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:54 pm

Quoting point2point (Reply 14):
I personally would just like to know (as if it's really my business, eh?) if F9 has finally found someplace that they could fly outside of DEN and actually be cash positive

I'm sure we'd all like to know, but it is, indeed, none of our business.

It's also dangerous.

People are notorious headline rapists and often don't read the fine print. Indigo is spending $30 million on the new slimline seats, for example, which will affect the bottom line. Now - you and I may understand it's a special charge, but not everyone will.

Quoting point2point (Reply 14):
And maybe you can agree with me with this point that every time F9 has announced expansion ex-DEN, I've gotten shivers down my spine (well, a bit drastic, but) and hopefully the TTN expansion will finally be different in this manner.

TTN has seen nothing but expansion since it began - just fifteen months ago - and that is surely different from most of the other non-DEN experiments. I assume it will take some time for that to pay off - we used to give routes two years to turn a buck, but that seems to be out the window these days.

As long as Indigo is happy, isn't that all that matters? No one is asking the public to invest in this.

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point2point
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:56 pm

Quoting trianglegis21 (Reply 15):

Interesting numbers, point2point. BTW, where can I access the 3Q data?

Here you go......

This site is the DOT site, and use Table 6 that lists all route pairs in the continental U.S. with at least an average of 10 to/from pax daily in the continental U.S. Just a couple of items here is that 1) routes are only listed once, for example you'll find DEN-BNA, and that will include info for both ways.... so then you won't find BNA-DEN. I actually don't know under which one you'll find this, but it will be listed only once, and 2) Table 1a is for metro areas such as NYC, Chicago, LA, D.C. and a few others are listed with multiple airports in this table. So if you see something like BNA-ONT will be the total all of the five (I think, LAX, BUR, LGB, SNA as well as ONT) airports involved here, so that information (listed once) will be for BNA to all of the (what the DOT considers) LA airports. There's a chart (or something) in all of this that explains what airports are involved in what metro areas. However, adding to this, if one pulls up Table 1A, this table gives you the breakdown of all of the metro area airports and other airports. The link is below, and may all of the above make sense.

http://www.dot.gov/policy/aviation-p...stic-airline-fares-consumer-report

I also like to use this site below, in that I'm sure the info is somewhere in the DOT figures (because I guess that from where this site gets the info) but it's broken down is such a way that makes it convenient for me.

http://aviationdb.net/aviationdb/F4SDetailQuery#HELP_SCREEN

May this answer the question, and feel free to ask any more questions. Have fun.

 





[Edited 2014-02-19 11:13:33]
 
triangleGIS21
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 7:07 pm

Is there any way that I can split the metro area data so that I can isolate traffic to certain airports? As an example, I'd like to see how many passengers are flying from RDU-SFO rather than RDU-San Francisco metro area.
 
point2point
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 7:11 pm

Quoting trianglegis21 (Reply 18):
Is there any way that I can split the metro area data so that I can isolate traffic to certain airports? As an example, I'd like to see how many passengers are flying from RDU-SFO rather than RDU-San Francisco metro area.

Use Table 1a.......

(sorry, good thing that you asked since I didn't list up above, but fixed now)

 

[Edited 2014-02-19 11:14:27]
 
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mariner
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 7:17 pm

Here's a fun one. The NJ.com is running a poll - where should Frontier fly to next from Trenton?

http://www.nj.com/mercer/index.ssf/2...xt_for_trenton-mercer_airport.html

"Poll: Where should Frontier Airlines fly next from Trenton-Mercer Airport?"

Understand they they may not know about the range restrictions at TTN, but what's mostly interesting is that DEN isn't the first choice in the popular vote, nor the second.  

mariner
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GentFromAlaska
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 7:27 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 12):
They're a South Jersey Company, TTN might be outside of their territory.

Yeah I was made aware of Rapid Rover on the MDL Facebook page. They are the option from the base(s) to PHL. As best I can tell there is nothing established between the base (MDL) and TTN. I'm also under the impression MDL does use their own government van for a periodic trip to PHL for new arrivals. I was lead to believe its a duty section run and not something scheduled.

Quoting point2point (Reply 17):
I also like to use this site below, in that I'm sure the info is somewhere in the DOT figures (because I guess that from where this site gets the info) but it's broken down is such a way that makes it convenient for me.

http://aviationdb.net/aviationdb/F4SDetailQuery#HELP_SCREEN

May this answer the question, and feel free to ask any more questions. Have fun.

The aviation-db site breaks service down to Domestic, International and Latin America. if you aren't careful you could corrupt your data. If you are looking solely for lower 48 flying. Alaska for some strange reason is considered international at least to F9. To borrow the Texas pun "It a whole other country I suppose"
Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
 
point2point
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 8:12 pm

Quoting mariner (Reply 20):
Understand they they may not know about the range restrictions at TTN, but what's mostly interesting is that DEN isn't the first choice in the popular vote, nor the second.

Maybe when all of the NJ potheads wake up and remember that they want to vote here in this, and if they do remember to do it, maybe DEN will get to the #1 position?

 
Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 21):
The aviation-db site breaks service down to Domestic, International and Latin America. if you aren't careful you could corrupt your data. If you are looking solely for lower 48 flying. Alaska for some strange reason is considered international at least to F9. To borrow the Texas pun "It a whole other country I suppose"

I do agree here in that somehow, this site's numbers and numbers from other sites aren't the same when they should be. However, I've usually found them close enough and there may be some reasons that I haven't figured out for the discrepancies (e.g. are non fare-paying pax counted, etc?), but again, I think that to a certain extent they give a good picture of the situation, even though they may somehow not be exactly in sync with other sources.



 
 
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 8:31 pm

How about Nassau, it has a US customs pre-clearence station.

Quoting mariner (Reply 20):
Here's a fun one. The NJ.com is running a poll - where should Frontier fly to next from Trenton?

I voted for Dallas.
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mariner
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 8:43 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 23):
How about Nassau, it has a US customs pre-clearence station.

Now you're talking. Not only does it have pre-clearance - but it is also within range.

I'd love to see it, especially remembering that Princeton is called Old Nassau, as is the Princeton song, and the first building is Nassau Hall - then there's Nassau Street and the Nassau Inn.

Hey, why not?  

mariner

[Edited 2014-02-19 12:44:32]
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GentFromAlaska
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 10:46 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 23):
How about Nassau,
Quoting mariner (Reply 24):
Now you're talking. Not only does it have pre-clearance - but it is also within range.

I realize new routes are ultimately up to the F9. If the TTN airport had any say-so in route selection I ponder if they might pullback some knowing the NAU would compete with that other N.J. gambling mecca in ACY. (Atlantic City) TTN-ACY is separated by a short 58 miles as a crow flies.

I haven't been to NAU in twenty years; the last time I was there there wasn't a lot to do except gamble on Paradise. island. I did rent a moped scooter and drove around. To this day I still remember the old Esso gas signs which hung in the U.S. yesteryear still hung in old town Nassau.

I have an inkling if NAU happens it will be from UST.
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GentFromAlaska
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 11:19 pm

point2point posted an article in the other F9 thread (thank you). As it relates to TTN this part caught my attention specifically the last sentence

"Despite the decrease in capacity, a total of 18 new routes are scheduled to be launched in the first half of 2014. Nonetheless, five services have already been inaugurated so far this year, with the most recent additions being the three services from Trenton to Charlotte, Cincinnati and Cleveland added during the course of this week. Taking into consideration the domestic market that is increasingly important for Frontier’s network strategy, 16 services will be launched between US domestic destinations, with Trenton seeing the addition of nine routes".

Have all nine of the new additions out of TTN been announced or are more new cities yet to come? By my count there should be four more at TTN.
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mariner
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 11:37 pm

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 26):
"Despite the decrease in capacity, a total of 18 new routes are scheduled to be launched in the first half of 2014. Nonetheless, five services have already been inaugurated so far this year, with the most recent additions being the three services from Trenton to Charlotte, Cincinnati and Cleveland added during the course of this week. Taking into consideration the domestic market that is increasingly important for Frontier’s network strategy, 16 services will be launched between US domestic destinations, with Trenton seeing the addition of nine routes".

That article may be one of the most confusing I have ever read - Frontier is shrinking and growing at the same time?   

But - to your question:

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 26):
Have all nine of the new additions out of TTN been announced or are more new cities yet to come?

So far this year Frontier has announced or opened the following routes from TTN this year:

CLT, CLE, CVG, BNA, IND, UST, STL, MSP and MKE.

That's the nine they mean, I guess. But I;m only guessing because I found it all so confusing. Let's ignore the part about the "domestic market being increasingly important to Frontier." It's always been important - the lifeblood.

mariner
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Jerseyguy
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Wed Feb 19, 2014 11:37 pm

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 26):
Have all nine of the new additions out of TTN been announced or are more new cities yet to come? By my count there should be four more at TTN.

I believe they have because I believe they mean will start service not necessarily be announced.
1. CLE 2.CVG 3. CLT 4.UST 5.IND 6.BNA 7. MKE 8 MSP 9 STL.

Doesn't mean more couldn't start in the second half of the year (Jun 15th-Dec 31st)
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GentFromAlaska
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:15 am

Quoting mariner (Reply 27):
That article may be one of the most confusing I have ever read - Frontier is shrinking and growing at the same time?


Courtesy poster point2point: If you look at the third chart here http://www.anna.aero/2014/02/19/fron...er-airlines-turns-20-this-february F9 has pulled 17.6% of their capacity out of PDX and SEA from DEN. It looks like the capacity is being added back in from other city pairs citing today's new STL-PDX announcement and the CLE-SEA service announcement a few days ago.

By my number crunching two routes do not equale 17.6% Perhaps there is more to come for SEA and PDX from other locations.

If memory serves me Bill Franke told us his intentions were to downsize DEN some. I believe what you are seeing is just that. I for one anticipated more SEA service from somewhere as SEA has been one of F9 stronger markets. I find it hard to believe they would remove capacity and not add it back in elsewhere. If I were to speculate I could see STL-SEA still to come. It would be a good West to East red-eye.

I also think there is some more to come for ATL. WN has announced their intent to de-hub ATL. I read some U.S. housing stats a couple of days ago which indicated ATL is the strongest growing housing market in the U.S. today. The California central valley is second and LAS is third in a top five list of U.S. markets.

I am surprised they picked STL-SFO today and not somewhere in the California central valley.
Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
 
Jerseyguy
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Thu Feb 20, 2014 4:09 am

STL flight times are interesting TTN 1005pm STL 1120pm. Guess they really are trying for more utilization of the plane.
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Jerseyguy
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Fri Feb 21, 2014 3:34 am

Quoting Trenton Times article reply=30:
Shurz said Frontier is working with the county to remove trees and cell towers aligned with runway O6, so that planes can take off at lower angles and conserve fuel for longer distance flights. Planes currently have to take off at a higher than normal angle. Frontier wants to travel to cities farther west from Trenton such as Denver — Frontier’s base of operations — Dallas and Houston. The county is in the process of hiring a firm to conduct a runway obstruction study, spokeswoman Julie Willmot said.

This is great news for Trenton as it really opens up alot of flights that wouldn't have been possible and it addition to that will save fuel costs on all flights Though I'm sure the NIMBYs will be thrilled that they are going over their house at an even lower altitude (though the NIMBYs affected are the Hopewell NIMBYs who are less vocal).

So I guess we have DEN, IAH and DFW as possibilities LAS is always a good tourist destination. As of June when the latest 3 cities start, there will be 73 weekly flights or a little over 10 flights a day. Wondering even with expansion of the waiting area, how many more flights could be added? 3 more cities could easily add another 10 weekly flights.
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GentFromAlaska
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Fri Feb 21, 2014 1:10 pm

http://skyvector.com/airport/TTN/Trenton-Mercer-Airport shows potential obstacles at least on the airport property. If there are cell or utility towers they are not listed and could be further down line.

"Obstacles: 87 ft Tree 2120 ft from runway, 790 ft right of center RWY 06; 185 FT Lighted pole: 100 FT From threshold 500 FT R. 72 ft Tree 1610 ft from runway, 350 ft left of center"

Trees do grow over time. I'm not sure how often the airport the sends someone out to measure monitor tree growth and report it accordingly.
Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
 
masseybrown
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Fri Feb 21, 2014 2:26 pm

Quoting mariner (Reply 13):
Will they be? Frontier is no longer a publicly listed company.

DoT requires quarterly financial reports from all airlines with revenues over $20 million, whether privately owned or not. Frontier will be filing just as when they were publically owned. As usual, the Dot report is nowhere near as timely as the reports filed with SEC-registered companies, but it will appear about four months after the end of the quarter. The good thing about the DoT report is that it focuses nicely on the airline's health. This DoT report is how people guage how Virgin America, for example, is doing.

The data base is called P-1.2 and can be found at the BTS/RITA government site.

http://www.transtats.bts.gov/DL_Sele...asp?Table_ID=295&DB_Short_Name=Air Carrier Financial



[Edited 2014-02-21 07:04:17]
 
point2point
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Fri Feb 21, 2014 3:35 pm

Quoting Jerseyguy (Reply 31):
As of June when the latest 3 cities start, there will be 73 weekly flights or a little over 10 flights a day. Wondering even with expansion of the waiting area, how many more flights could be added? 3 more cities could easily add another 10 weekly flights.

From the F9 fact sheet,

http://news.flyfrontier.com/sites/fr...ss_kit/file/Fact_Sheet_12-4-13.pdf

it states the F9 operates more than 200 daily flights. Can we say that it's 207 (unless someone has a more accurate number) daily flights system-wide just for fun? Now, with TTN up to about 11 daily flights, that's still only about 3% or so total in the F9 system. With DEN being responsible for about 90% activity for F9 (pax, flights, ets.) that puts about 276 daily flights from there.

The reason that I want to bring this up is that F9 is going to have to build TTN, and then ILG, and others, quite a bit more before DEN becomes anywhere near decentralized for F9's operations. At the same time, as per several sources, F9's NEOs orders will not start arriving until 2016, at the earliest. I would assume that the early deliveries will not immediately be replacing aircraft, although I would think that a lot of these NEOs will be to replace current fleet.

Yes, F9 may be getting a new bird here and there between now and 2016, but it would seem that any buildup of ex-DEN routes would be either from increasing current aircraft flying, or maybe moving routes away from DEN that could be producing better $$$$$ results elsewhere than remaining with the DEN status quo.

So for a while, it seems that DEN will be around 90% of F9's system, at least for the next couple of years. And until 2016 at the earliest will F9 begin to be able to take some serious steps as to reducing its dependence on DEN without reducing what is a given at DEN and moving aircraft elsewhere to take a chance. Can there be enough time in the day to reduce the percentage of F9's DEN dependence any significant amount (let's say even 10%) solely by increasing aircraft flying time?

 
 
masseybrown
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Fri Feb 21, 2014 3:53 pm

Quoting point2point (Reply 34):
Can there be enough time in the day to reduce the percentage of F9's DEN dependence any significant amount (let's say even 10%) solely by increasing aircraft flying time?

F9 might try bringing back "night coach" flying on the East Coast. It used to be fairly popular on north-south routes After-9PM (in some cities, 10PM in others) departures were purely airframe utilization flying, so the revenue needed only to exceed variable costs of the trip plus some maintenance overhead to be considered a winner. A third off the daytime fare was typical.
 
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mariner
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Fri Feb 21, 2014 6:06 pm

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 33):
DoT requires quarterly financial reports from all airlines with revenues over $20 million, whether privately owned or not.

To the DOT, yes, but because there is no public money involved they don't have to make them available to the public - unless they want to - they don't have to publish them to the media. The public can find it, sure, but it isn't handed on a plate.

It's already begun at Frontier - I haven't seen a monthly traffic report in the media since Indigo took over.

Quoting point2point (Reply 34):
At the same time, as per several sources, F9's NEOs orders will not start arriving until 2016, at the earliest.

Ah - last I heard it was a quarter earlier than 2016 and I assume they'll find a few more aircraft before then, a couple at least.

There's another A320 in April - N223FR.

The tricky part is to balance out the length of leases of used aircraft against the scheduled arrivals of the Neo, and to get aircraft at decent prices but reduced lease time. Lessors often charge more money for less length.

Quoting point2point (Reply 34):
Can there be enough time in the day to reduce the percentage of F9's DEN dependence any significant amount (let's say even 10%) solely by increasing aircraft flying time?

I don't think it is a priority at the moment. It's still possible they'll announce more DEN stuff for the summer.

The good news is that Indigo seems to have embraced TTN and - even better - embraced p2p's between major cities.

But the other good news is that Frontier is still embracing DEN - even if the Denver Post seems to have almost forgotten Frontier's existence.

Who knew about Frontier, Denver - and lacrosse, 'coz I surely didn't.

http://www.goairforcefalcons.com/spo...s/m-lacros/spec-rel/022014aab.html

"Air Force Heads to Frontier Airlines Face-Off Classic"

mariner
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Fri Feb 21, 2014 6:20 pm

Quoting mariner (Reply 36):
It's still possible they'll announce more DEN stuff for the summer.

That was quick - LOL:

Frontier To Announce 4 New Routes From Denver (by UNITED91 Feb 21 2014 in Civil Aviation)

 

mariner
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Frontier14
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Fri Feb 21, 2014 7:33 pm

Quoting point2point (Reply 34):
http://news.flyfrontier.com/sites/fr...ss_kit/file/Fact_Sheet_12-4-13.pdf

it states the F9 operates more than 200 daily flights. Can we say that it's 207 (unless someone has a more accurate number) daily flights system-wide just for fun?

You are probably in the ball park. F9 as of recent has run as many as 240+ flights during certain weekdays and on Saturdays sometimes in the 160s.

Frontier 14
 
GentFromAlaska
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Sat Feb 22, 2014 12:19 am

For aviation fans around the greater TTN area the Trenton airport has posted the following invitation to thier Facebook page.

Tomorrow - February 22nd 2014 at 8AM there is a FREE McGuire Base Tour at 7:45AM to 1pm hosted by Skies as well. Want to come to either? Contact us via Private Message on this airport Page for details and we hope to see you there.

Meet up point for Base Tour is at Thunderbird Lanes parking lot at 7:45AM.

McGuire Tour Includes:
*Close Up and Cockpit Tours of a C17, KC-135 & a KC-10
*McGuire Tower Operations (Watch 2 Aircraft Takeoff also)
*Full Motion Training Simulator Tour
*RAPCON - Radar Tour
*Up Close to a Fully Working Military Base
*Talk to Military Personnel about future careers
Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
 
Frontier14
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Sat Feb 22, 2014 7:43 pm

Does anyone know if Frontier has their own mechanics at TTN or is it contract? I have been unsuccessful in finding an answer so far. Thanks

Frontier 14
 
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mariner
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Sun Feb 23, 2014 3:48 am

Here's a nice wee surprise.

TTN-CLE was announced as 2 x weekly, to go 4 x weekly in late May.

TTN-BNA was announced as 3 x weekly - Monday, Wednesday, Friday - that was it.

Now, according to the website, it - TTN-BNA - goes to 4 x weekly with the addition of a Sunday flight from mid-June.  

mariner

[Edited 2014-02-22 19:52:23]
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GentFromAlaska
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:02 pm

Quoting mariner (Reply 41):
TTN-BNA - goes to 4 x weekly with the addition of a Sunday flight from mid-June.

And a 1000 (10:00 A.M.) departure to boot. If the equipment allows they might want to back the new Sunday flight two weeks earlier to Sunday June 1 to support to two music festivals in Nashville CMA the week of June 5-8 and Bonnaroo in Manchester, TN the following week Thur-Sun. The Wednesdays prior and Mondays after each of two festivals are said to be BNA four busiest travel days of the year. You have quite a few straggler pax coming in the weekend prior. I see F9 has already priced the TTN-BNA-TTN flights strartegically on Wednesday June 4 and Monday June 9.
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Jerseyguy
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:58 pm

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 42):
And a 1000 (10:00 A.M.) departure to boot.

And they moved the 630 and 730 am departures on Mon/Wed/Fri to 815am, I guess they did get my emails  
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GentFromAlaska
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Sun Feb 23, 2014 8:49 pm

Quoting Jerseyguy (Reply 43):
I guess they did get my emails

Who says suggestions don't work.   
Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
 
Jerseyguy
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:45 am

As of June 13th there are atleast 10 flights a day with 11 on Wed/Fri/Sun, better get the parking and the terminal expansion going.

[Edited 2014-02-23 21:46:26]
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Flytravel
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:06 pm

Quoting Jerseyguy (Reply 45):

As of June 13th there are atleast 10 flights a day with 11 on Wed/Fri/Sun, better get the parking and the terminal expansion going.

I wonder if F9 at TTN will surpass NK at ACY? In destinations served year-round, I'm sure, but NK has more frequencies to esp. to markets like FLL. I think NK keeps about 10 departures out of ACY.

[Edited 2014-02-24 09:07:43]
 
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mariner
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Mon Feb 24, 2014 8:35 pm

I think this is a first - Frontier is having a two day open house to recruit f/a's in the Trenton area:

http://planetprinceton.com/2014/02/2...ines-recruiting-flight-attendants/

"Frontier Airlines Recruiting Flight Attendants

Frontier Airlines will host two flight attendant recruiting seminars on March 7 and March 8 in West Windsor."


It doesn't say much for the rumours of a crew base at TTN because applicants must be prepared to relocate. It may be nothing more than bit of bright employment news for the young people of Trenton.

It would be interesting to know what attendance is like.

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GentFromAlaska
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:09 am

Quoting mariner (Reply 47):
It would be interesting to know what attendance is like.

The passport requirement will be the show stopper for many. It can take 4-6 weeks to receive a passport through normal channels. Unfortunately March 3 is not going to cut it. F9 or the agency they hired to run the hiring/recruitment event should have planned a little better. Young folk don't buy passports unless they live near Canada or Mexico and TTN is not exactly close to either.
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Jerseyguy
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RE: Frontier TTN Thread Part 7

Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:43 am

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 48):
The passport requirement will be the show stopper for many. It can take 4-6 weeks to receive a passport through normal channels. Unfortunately March 3 is not going to cut it. F9 or the agency they hired to run the hiring/recruitment event should have planned a little better. Young folk don't buy passports unless they live near Canada or Mexico and TTN is not exactly close to either.

Your right, most young people don't get passports as they don't travel much outside the country. I know I let my passport lapse and I'm not even in the age range your talking about. In the 10 years I had it I used it twice, once to go to London (thats why I got it) and then once to go to Vancouver to board an Alaskian cruise. Its possible its been on job boards and possibly advertised on the MCCC campus, they do have an avation program that trains at TTN, so they probably have contacts for the airport.
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