skipness1E
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L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:03 am

So is that it? With hardly a mention on here, 216 Sq ferried their last four active TriStars to Bruntingthorpe for scrapping. So is that game over for active TriStars?
 
9VSIO
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:12 am

There was mention on the *military* forum of airliners.net.....
Me: (Lining up on final) I shall now select an aiming point. || Instructor: Well, I hope it's the runway...
 
crownvic
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:51 am

Yes, but it really deserves mention on the civil section. These were all converted civil airliners and deserve mention on a civil forum. After all, this truly ends any fleet operation of the type. There are just a few flyable examples left now. Maybe two in the Middle East and the Orbital Science bird. Very surprised more have not discussed it here.
 
jetstar
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:52 am

I believe there is a FAA regulation that allows an airframe manufacturer when there are less than 10 of a certain model airplane left flying that they can end their support for the airplane and turn in the type certificate back to the FAA.

I would assume that Lockheed kept supporting the L-1011’s because of the RAF, but now they are in the process of being retired and scrapped I doubt that Lockheed will still maintain support for the remaining 1 or 2 active airframes.

JetStar
 
Aircellist
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 3:01 am

Had the pleasure of flying on AC's Tristars a few times between YMX and CDG, and then a few more times on TS' ex-AC, quite from the same place to the same place.

I was a teenager then; now there are traces of gray in my beard… It is not only aircraft that fly!
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ADent
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 3:08 am

The last one in service is the Orbital Science Co's carrier for the Pegasus rocket.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stargazer_%28aircraft%29
 
rwessel
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 4:40 am

Quoting ADent (Reply 5):
The last one in service is the Orbital Science Co's carrier for the Pegasus rocket.

As mentioned upthread, I think there are a few other examples flying. But Stargazer is not very busy. Only two satellite launches in the last six years, and a few test flights. A problem is that the market for such small payloads is small, and Vega is not that much more expensive (about 50%) while offering triple the payload to orbit (note that the published costs for Pegasus often don't include the hydrazine upper stage, HAPS, and if you need any finer orbit control or maneuvering, you need one - or you need to build the capability into your spacecraft, and that cuts into payload, the Vega AVUM is a standard part).
 
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RWA380
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 7:47 am

What about the Sands Corp L-1011?
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readytotaxi
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:49 am

you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
 
Btblue
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 7:16 pm

There are two TriStars in storage at Cambridge (CBG) and look to be slowly having their parts removed, which is sad. You can stand pretty close to them as they're parked close a car showroom.

In 2011 I got a super landing, in HD of an RAF TriStar. Quite a sight at a relatively small airport.

I for one will really miss this bird. A real beauty...

http://youtu.be/I3Gtv9uYBW8
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goosebayguy
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 7:35 pm

I have been lucky to fly these on Saudia, Gulf Air and BA. If you look carefully on Google Earth at the airport in the centre of Riyadh you will see a Saudia Tristar parked up alongside the highway. Think it is HZ-AHP?

I know the last 524 engine went through Rolls-Royce last September for the RAF end of an era.
 
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RJAF
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:09 pm

There will be a minimum of four active passenger carrying Tristars in the coming months! They will be doing football charters for the World Cup 2014 and beyond!
Chance favors the prepared mind
 
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cougar15
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:16 pm

Quoting crownvic (Reply 2):
Yes, but it really deserves mention on the civil section

totally agree, prettiest bird ever out there, thanks for posting - I did not know this - and am real sad! She was a mighty Girl! No punt intended, but if only RR got the ´21´s´ sorted earlier, where could she have gone.......?
some you lose, others you can´t win!
 
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readytotaxi
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:33 pm

Question,
If I had the money and wanted to fly the aircraft from A to B, where would I get the qualified crew, cabin/cockpit?  
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
 
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United_fan
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:37 pm

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 7):
What about the Sands Corp L-1011?



I thought I read that the insurance company was fixing the on that was flooded,even though the Sands didn't want them to.
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L-188
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:03 pm

Quoting jetstar (Reply 3):
one?

I don't believe there is any such formal requirement or maximum fleet size to surrender a TC.

I can think of two cases were manufacturers did end support. Westland did it with a helicopter design back in the day, and Beech did it with the Starship.

I cant speak to how many of those Westlands were flying but there where closer to fifty of thoseStarships flying. a least one owner is still flying his having told Beech what to do with themselves when they asked if they could buy the airplane back.

edit: I shod add too that I believe all the drawings and tyoes for the WACO and Stintson were surrendered to the National archives.
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flywrite
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:04 pm

I was onboard the final 216 squadron sortie on Monday, aboard ZD950 and flying alongside ZD948 which was performing air-to-air refuelling. Report here http://www.airportspotting.com/lockheed-tristar-day-raf-operations/

Preparing a video of the day too, which I'll post later!
 
trijetsonly
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:30 pm

There are three active L1011 (2x -500, 1x-100, all ex ATA; msn 293A-1238, msn 193B-1230, msn 293A-1220) from Barq Aviation from Jordan, registered somewhere in South America. They are usually used for evacuation of refugees from civil war areas in central Africa.
I've seen them also for charter and wet lease for $7000/h.

Right now, there is one L1011-500 in the process of becoming airworthy again as a flying museum, as I understand it:
http://tristarhistory.org/l1011-n91011/

I hope that this most beautiful aircraft ever built won't die and there will still be at least one flying around.

It's a shame, there is a VIP L1011 stored in VCV, registred HZ-AB1, which has less than 5000h flown, so basically a new plane.

[Edited 2014-03-26 15:34:55]

[Edited 2014-03-26 15:37:30]
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deutronium
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:48 pm

I hope the RAF can save at least one from being scrapped if it's not too late. There has to be at least one museum that would take it off their hands.
 
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ATA L1011
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:18 pm

Wow good news and find Trijetsonly! i wonder if they looked at N723DA a former Delta -1 that is still intact at VCV and could be made into flying condition, Transatlantic an intended start up had it prepared to enter service in 06/07 but it fell through.
http://jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=7521834&nseq=0
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trijetsonly
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:25 pm

Quoting ATA L1011 (Reply 19):
Wow good news and find Trijetsonly! i wonder if they looked at N723DA a former Delta -1 that is still intact at VCV and could be made into flying condition, Transatlantic an intended start up had it prepared to enter service in 06/07 but it fell through.http://jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=7521834&nseq=0

According to http://www.eucomairlines.de/produktionsliste/msn/1150/index.html this plane is already broken up since April 2012, which is very sad.
Happy Landings
 
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ATA L1011
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:29 pm

Quoting Trijetsonly,reply=20According to http://www.eucomairlines.de/produktionsliste/msn/1150/index.html this plane is already broken up since April 2012, which is very sad. :

Indeed 
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cougar15
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:56 pm

Quoting Trijetsonly (Reply 20):
Quoting Trijetsonly,reply=20According to http://www.eucomairlines.de/produktionsliste/msn/1150/index.html this plane is already broken up since April 2012, which is very sad. : Indeed

... and sadly!! Guess that means another 3 Holer is finally bighting the dust! I am an ´old cook´ these days, retirement is around the Corner, but heck - this is one bird I will definetly miss (ass all of U I guess)!
some you lose, others you can´t win!
 
beechnut
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 12:55 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 15):
I can think of two cases were manufacturers did end support. Westland did it with a helicopter design back in the day, and Beech did it with the Starship.

Another one: Airbus and the Concorde.

Beech
 
UA444
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 3:53 am

Quoting Trijetsonly (Reply 17):

Is that plane going to ever fly out of VCV? What's the story behind it?

I sure hope it's at least being preserved for the hope that it will eventually find a new buyer.
 
BOACCunard
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 4:28 am

Quoting RJAF (Reply 11):
There will be a minimum of four active passenger carrying Tristars in the coming months!
Quoting Trijetsonly (Reply 17):
There are three active L1011 (2x -500, 1x-100, all ex ATA; msn 293A-1238, msn 193B-1230, msn 293A-1220) from Barq Aviation from Jordan, registered somewhere in South America. They are usually used for evacuation of refugees from civil war areas in central Africa.
I've seen them also for charter and wet lease for $7000/h.

Are these the same aircraft?

If this information is correct it would mean the last passenger DC-10 flight (excluding MD-11) was before the last passenger L-1011 flight, which is very surprising to me.

And regardless, when was the last scheduled L-1011 passenger flight, and who operated it? I don't remember hearing about it at all. (Whereas, the recent end of scheduled DC-10 service on BG was a big deal, perhaps because it was also seemingly the end of all DC-10 passenger service.)
Getting There is Half the Fun!
 
timpdx
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 4:46 am

I had the pleasure of watching the Orbital Sciences Tristar do touch and gos right up close at Mohave recently. Pics are on another computer. Was great to see. Got a tour of the Tristar line in Palmdale as a kid in our Boy Scouts group. That was also great to see.
 
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RWA380
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 4:54 am

Quoting United_fan (Reply 14):

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 7):
What about the Sands Corp L-1011?



I thought I read that the insurance company was fixing the on that was flooded,even though the Sands didn't want them to.

There's a thread on a.net about America West Jets, that is a proposed start-up trying to buy the Ryan Cert, they were indicating they'd be taking a few M83s & L10's flying super odd routes like PPG-LAS, PPG-SBD, The Sands Corp was the stated supplier for the L-1011-500.

New Start Up: American West Jets - Buys Ryan Cert (by LAXintl Feb 26 2014 in Civil Aviation)
Next Flights: PDX-HNL-OGG-LIH-PDX On AS, WP & HA
 
bennett123
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 8:31 am

According to www.eucomairlines.de MSN 1190 HZ-AHP is in the Saudi Royal Flight Museum.

IMO, American West Jets is a non starter, (a view that was shared by others).

Regrettably the 2 RAF Tristars at Cambridge are probably beyond salvage, and the 1 at Kemble is already engineless.

I do not see any of them fly again, particularly given that most are tanker/transports, not passenger aircraft.
 
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RWA380
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 8:41 am

Quoting bennett123 (Reply 28):
IMO, American West Jets is a non starter, (a view that was shared by others).

I will have to agree that the chance of getting this ridiculous airline off the ground is about 1 in a million, but stranger things have happened. Somebody at America West Jets thought they could secure this aircraft for one reason or another.

If it is true that even though it was flooded, the insurance company did not write it off, but instead decided the best thing was to make this bird airworthy again. The Sands wanted the write off, so selling it, once it was refurbished is the next best option for the Sands corp to rid themselves of a jet they don't want, while it is still frsh and new in and out.
Next Flights: PDX-HNL-OGG-LIH-PDX On AS, WP & HA
 
AF185
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 8:59 am

Quoting bennett123 (Reply 28):
According to www.eucomairlines.de MSN 1190 HZ-AHP is in the Saudi Royal Flight Museum.

I was in Riyadh last year and saw it parked in the Military Aviation base not far from the city center.
Sorry about the picture quality

 
bennett123
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 9:02 am

You may wish to advise www.eucomairlines.de

There last report of this aircraft was in 2012.
 
flywrite
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 4:38 pm

Here's a video of Monday's final RAF TriStar sortie over the North Sea. Sorry this is military, but hopefully of interest to the thread.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cg4jT2HACVw

All four remaining aircraft flew to Bruntingthorpe the next day, and the official line from the RAF was that it's too expensive to maintain one outdoors at a museum (very unlikely to find an indoor spot), so they're to be scrapped unless the Cold War Jets collection purchase one.
 
trijetsonly
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 5:04 pm

Quoting flywrite (Reply 32):
All four remaining aircraft flew to Bruntingthorpe the next day, and the official line from the RAF was that it's too expensive to maintain one outdoors at a museum (very unlikely to find an indoor spot), so they're to be scrapped unless the Cold War Jets collection purchase one.

I'd really like to purchase one and put it in my garden as the ultimate pavilion.
Unfortunately I have neither enough space nor enough money.
Happy Landings
 
cornishsimon
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 5:15 pm

Such a shame that they have not got it to CAF @ NQY to be preserved along with the VC10.



cs
 
Yflyer
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 6:28 pm

Quoting BOACCunard (Reply 25):
And regardless, when was the last scheduled L-1011 passenger flight, and who operated it?

I recall reading on this forum at the time that ATA scheduled their Tristars one of their Hawaii routes (LAX-HNL if I remember correctly) for a short time not long before they folded. So this probably would have been 2007 or 2008. They weren't regularly used on the route but they were scheduled ahead of time and not last minute subs, so that could count as the last scheduled service.
 
timpdx
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 6:41 pm

Orbital Science's L-1011

http://i59.tinypic.com/2vkj212.jpg

http://i60.tinypic.com/28w2kb9.jpg
 
L-188
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 7:51 pm

Anybody else weirded out by how these older types like the TriStar are view as inefficient but when I was a kid it was always portrayed as an efficient airplane?

MD-80's are an even better example of this.
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Viscount724
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 10:36 pm

Quoting timpdx (Reply 36):
Anybody else weirded out by how these older types like the TriStar are view as inefficient but when I was a kid it was always portrayed as an efficient airplane?

In 1972 when the L-1011 went into service the world crude oil price was around $3 a barrel (equivalent to about $17 today with inflation). Current price around $100 a barrel.
 
Yflyer
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Thu Mar 27, 2014 10:43 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 37):
Anybody else weirded out by how these older types like the TriStar are view as inefficient but when I was a kid it was always portrayed as an efficient airplane?

Well, I'm sure it was efficient compared to the 707 and DC-8. It's all a matter of perspective. In 20 years we'll probably be calling the 738 and A320 inefficient.
 
BOACCunard
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:39 am

Quoting Yflyer (Reply 35):
I recall reading on this forum at the time that ATA scheduled their Tristars one of their Hawaii routes (LAX-HNL if I remember correctly) for a short time not long before they folded. So this probably would have been 2007 or 2008. They weren't regularly used on the route but they were scheduled ahead of time and not last minute subs, so that could count as the last scheduled service.

Interesting. I had been thinking that it could be ATA since it did have L-1011s in its fleet until the end, but I figured they were most likely only used on charters.

I always though it a bit odd that ATA used DC-10s and L-1011s for an extended period of time. Lots of airlines had both, of course, but usually seemed to standardize on one or the other ASAP.
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UA444
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:28 am

Quoting Yflyer (Reply 35):

I believe they did use the L1011 and even the DC-10 to HI for scheduled for a few times during the Christmas 2007 season. I remember reading about it as well.
 
trijetsonly
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:36 am

EuroAtlantic Airways used the L1011 until early 2010 but not on regular service though.
So my guesses are also on ATA. Thai Sky Airlines also used them quite long on a regular scheduled service.
Happy Landings
 
twal1011727
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:05 pm

Quoting UA444 (Reply 24):
Is that plane going to ever fly out of VCV? What's the story behind it?

Heres the story from 1/30/2010 for display at Kansas City Downtown airport (KMKC)


From takeoff : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdyE3ckYj48

To landing : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjwhhfDDksI

KD
 
twal1011727
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:21 pm

Hmm...might not be the L1011 that I thought you were looking at. Different serial number

Sorry...KD
 
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TZTriStar500
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RE: L1011 Retired From RAF Service. Last Active?

Sat Mar 29, 2014 1:48 am

Quoting UA444 (Reply 41):
I believe they did use the L1011 and even the DC-10 to HI for scheduled for a few times during the Christmas 2007 season. I remember reading about it as well.
Quoting Trijetsonly (Reply 42):
EuroAtlantic Airways used the L1011 until early 2010 but not on regular service though.
So my guesses are also on ATA. Thai Sky Airlines also used them quite long on a regular scheduled service.

The last regular scheduled ATA L-1011 flights were probably winter 2005/2006 before all IND service was discontinued. It was regularly used on IND-LAS and IND-MCO/RSW. During Christmas 2007, the DC-10s were used on some LAX-HNL rotations. So, I think Thai Sky may have been the last scheduled operator.
35 years of American Trans Air/ATA Airlines, 1973-2008. A great little airline that will not be soon forgotten.