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KarelXWB
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MC-21 Development Thread

Mon Jun 06, 2016 11:49 am

Irkut Corporation plans to roll out the first MC-21 prototype later this week.

Quote:On June 8, 2016 Irkut Corporation (a member of UAC) will conduct the official ceremony of rollout of the first MC-21 aircraft designated for flight tests.

As Mr Oleg Demchenko, the President of Irkut Corporation emphasizes, “Construction of the first aircraft is the significant milestone of the MC-21 program. We are looking forward to greet at Irkutsk Aviation Plant delegations of our partners, current and prospective customers, representatives of federal and regional authorities.”
Press release
http://eng.irkut.com/press-centre/news/2142/
Last edited by atcsundevil on Sun May 28, 2017 6:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Thread title updated for ongoing discussion
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 1:14 pm

Contrats!

I like quite a bit of the MC-21 design.

I just do not get the weight... Someone please explain the MC-21s weight to me. IMHO, the MC-21s handicap.

Lightsaber
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 1:17 pm

What weight are we talking about?
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 1:21 pm

The video with the attached link was entertaining. I don't know if the costs will be lower since only five guys seem to be working on the assembly, or higher, since they will likely have to be cross-trained. Production may also be slower unless they hire more.

Joking aside, there are high costs are a significant barrier to entry in a tough market, and I personally hope for variety to keep all the manufacturers motivated to improve their product.

Cheers!

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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 1:25 pm

What are the chances of MC21 compete against Boeing and Airbus with CSeries not being far away from it as far as pax capacity is concerned?
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 1:47 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 2):
What weight are we talking about?

Empty weight.

Lightsaber
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 6:37 pm

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 5):
Empty weight.

Lightsaber

I don't think they've ever given one? I know in Bjorns Leeham.net analysis he used an estimate (2T less than an A320). I believe the factors stopping it from matching the A320NEO in fuel burn (it was close) were the low aspect ratio wing and the wider fuselage - the latter of which may be seen as a desirable insomuch as it reduces turnarounds. Goodness knows how it will fare in terms of overall operating costs though.
Down with that sort of thing!
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:03 pm

Interesting video. I must say I've not heard of this project before. I wish them the best!
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:09 pm

Wikipedia describes the MC-21 as a development of the YAK-42. Essentially, it is the realization of an old plan to create a twin-engine variant of the YAK-42. Does anybody know how much commonality this frame really has with the YAK?
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:31 pm

From a passenger's point of view, it looks attractive with its wider fuselage giving more space and/or a wider aisle, and large windows.
Sadly, such features won't sell planes!
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Matt6461
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:38 pm

Great news, hope this plane makes some inroads against the duopoly.

Does anyone know the status of the -400 stretch?
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:41 pm

Quoting redzeppelin (Reply 8):
Wikipedia describes the MC-21 as a development of the YAK-42.

Yeah, lots of places state that, it's weird. They have different nose sections, cockpits, exit arrangements, fuselage cross sections, wings, empennage and engine configuration. Apart from that they're exactly the same.
In all seriousness, I can believe the clean sheet design evolved out of an unworkable YAK-42 derivative proposal, but I bet there's more 767 DNA in a 777.
Down with that sort of thing!
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:45 pm

Quoting BaconButty (Reply 6):
were the low aspect ratio wing

I thought the wing is THE best part of this project. A few months back in another thread someone wrote about how it will be an example of Russian engineering and the first truly supercritical wing. Is Leeham more specific about that?

Really like the sizes they chose. the smallest is one row shorter than a A320 (like the 737-7.5???), one is as long as a 739 and the big one is only slightly shorter than the 752 (737-10MADMAX???). Perfect IMO.
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:48 pm

Quoting redzeppelin (Reply 8):
Does anybody know how much commonality this frame really has with the YAK?

Well since 42 divided by 2 is 21, I'd say 50%

*source just as valid as much of the stuff you can find on Wikipedia.
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Mon Jun 06, 2016 8:54 pm

The Irkut MS-21-300 baseline model, which flight trials with the . PW1431G-JM geared turbofan engines (fan diameter: 2.057,4 mm / 81,0 in; eng. architecture: F]G[3LPC-8HPC ^ 2HPT-3LPT), each 140,44 kN / 14.321 kgf / 31.572 lbf are slated for late this year, is designed to seat up to 211 passengers on services out to 5.900 km / 3.666 mi. In the standard two-class layout, the Irkut MS-21-300 will seat 163 passengers (16 in the business class - pitch: 36 in / 91,4 cm and 147 in the economy class - pitch: 32 in / 81,3 cm). The standard single-class layout will allow seating 181 passengers with the 32 in / 81,3 cm seat pitch. Max. number of the seats will be 211 (28-29 in pitch).

The Irkut MS-21-300 will have a MTOW of 79.250 kg / 174.716 lb, MLW of 69.100 kg / 152.339 lb. Its maximum payload is 22.600 kg / 49.824 lb and can take 20.400 kg / 44.974 lb of fuel. Aircraft length is 42,3 m / 138 ft 9 in, wingspan 35,9 m / 117 ft 9 in. Its fuselage width is 4,06 m / 13 ft 4 in (Airbus A320neo - 3,95 m / 13 ft 0 in; Boeing 737 MAX - 3,76 m / 12 ft 4 in), and the width of the cabin is 3,81 m / 12 ft 6 in (Airbus A320neo - 3,70 m / 12 ft 1 in; Boeing 737 MAX - 3,53 m / 11 ft 7 in).

In the late August 2015 Pratt & Whitney announced it had provided Irkut with the first PW1431G-JM engine for mounting on the Irkut MS-21-300 first flying prototype. The engine was brought to Irkutsk on 23. Aug 2015 following its assembly and testing by the manufacturer’s facility in West Palm Beach, Florida. The delivery of the second PW1431G-JM engine to fit the first MS-21-300 aircraft took place in October 2015.

.
Pratt & Whitney PW1400G-JM engine on the testbed

The United Engine Corporation for its part continues to develop and test Aviadvigatel PD-14, baseline engine for Irkut МS-21-300 aircraft prototypes, two-shaft turbofan (fan diameter: 1.900,0 mm - 74,8 in; eng. architecture: F+3LPC-8HPC ^ 2HPT-6LPT), rated at 137,29 kN / 14.000 kgf / 30.865 lbf. PD-14 engine prototype No. 100-07 started its flight trials on board the Ilyushin Il-76LL flying testbed last autumn, and the manufacture and delivery of the first two PD-14s for tests on board the Irkut MS-21 are scheduled for 2017. The MS-21-300’s certification and the launch of its delivery are planned for 2018–2019.

.
Aviadvigatel PD-14 engine on the wing of IL-76LL. Source: defendingrussia.ru


The latest certified engine of the . PW1000G engine family is PW1431G-JM engine:

.


Nice regards

mfranjic
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Tue Jun 07, 2016 9:14 am

Second MC-21 prototype in final assembly:


http://imagr.eu/up/HYkQ0_CkVol1aWYAAvINt.jpg
http://twitter.com/UAC_Russia/status/740107159246102528

[Edited 2016-06-07 02:52:09]
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Tue Jun 07, 2016 1:22 pm

Live broadcast @ June 8,6:30am Moscow Time

http://www.vesti.ru/broadcasts/show/id/39749/
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Tue Jun 07, 2016 5:26 pm

What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived.
 
mat66
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Tue Jun 07, 2016 6:20 pm

6:30am. That's 5:30am CET. Worst possible time. Looks like I will watch some Youtube at breakfast though  

Am I crazy or did they change the cockpit windows? Looks like 4 instead of 6.
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Tue Jun 07, 2016 7:17 pm

Quoting mfranjic (Reply 14):
The Irkut MS-21-300 baseline model, which flight trials with the . PW1431G-JM geared turbofan engines (fan diameter: 2.057,4 mm / 81,0 in; eng. architecture: F]G[3LPC-8HPC ^ 2HPT-3LPT), each 140,44 kN / 14.321 kgf / 31.572 lbf are slated for late this year, is designed to seat up to 211 passengers on services out to 5.900 km / 3.666 mi. In the standard two-class layout, the Irkut MS-21-300 will seat 163 passengers (16 in the business class - pitch: 36 in / 91,4 cm and 147 in the economy class - pitch: 32 in / 81,3 cm). The standard single-class layout will allow seating 181 passengers with the 32 in / 81,3 cm seat pitch. Max. number of the seats will be 211 (28-29 in pitch).

It seems to be a good replacement for the Boeing 757.   

Now, now don't laugh at me  
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Tue Jun 07, 2016 9:26 pm

Quoting mat66 (Reply 18):
Am I crazy or did they change the cockpit windows? Looks like 4 instead of 6.

Based on the production vs nose-on photos, I'd say that the two side-most windows just aren't visible in the last photo.

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mfranjic
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 6:13 am

The Irkut MS-21-300 baseline model, which flight trials with the . PW1431G-JM geared turbofan engines (fan diameter: 2.057,4 mm / 81,0 in; eng. architecture: F]G[3LPC-8HPC ^ 2HPT-3LPT), each 140,44 kN / 14.321 kgf / 31.572 lbf are slated for late this year, is designed to seat up to 211 passengers on services out to 5.900 km / 3.666 mi. In the standard two-class layout, the Irkut MS-21-300 will seat 163 passengers (16 in the business class - pitch: 36 in / 91,4 cm and 147 in the economy class - pitch: 32 in / 81,3 cm). The standard single-class layout will allow seating 181 passengers with the 32 in / 81,3 cm seat pitch. Max. number of the seats will be 211 (28-29 in pitch).


.


http://imgup.io/images/2016/06/08/5ccd9085fdedef8058cc85760dc04019.jpg.
http://imgup.io/images/2016/06/08/178fd0fc1c4854d4866ec9f7c7f2163e.jpg.
http://vk.com/mc21_irkut


Nice regards

Mario
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 6:25 am

 
pipeafcr
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 6:32 am

Great news, wish the MC21 success both in China and the global market! Looks fresh
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columba
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:02 am

While the 787 nose reminds me on the mighty Caravelle the nose of the MC21 for me looks similar to the Trident or Bac 1-11
It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:03 am

Quoting columba (Reply 24):
While the 787 nose reminds me on the mighty Caravelle the nose of the MC21 for me looks similar to the Trident or Bac 1-11

I see an A350/787 mashup for the nose, and A300 for the rest of the fuselage.
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:26 am

Another angle of the nose:

http://imagr.eu/up/UUJUn_CkZ3Hq9WUAAklk8.jpg

Cockpit:

http://imagr.eu/up/MoQMw_CkZ3C5hWkAAuqym.jpg

Wing:

http://imagr.eu/up/cTAgf_CkZ3a2yWUAAdJ2l.jpg
http://twitter.com/FG_STrim

Cabin looks empty on the inside, supposedly not alle systems have been installed yet.

http://imagr.eu/up/iI4J1_CkZ3hG2W0AAmIlh.jpg
http://twitter.com/FG_STrim

http://imagr.eu/up/XBVzs_CkZ-q-0XAAIk0CN.jpg
http://twitter.com/Rogozin
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:01 am

Quoting columba (Reply 24):
While the 787 nose reminds me on the mighty Caravelle the nose of the MC21 for me looks similar to the Trident or Bac 1-11
Quoting TWA772LR (Reply 25):
I see an A350/787 mashup for the nose, and A300 for the rest of the fuselage.
Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 26):
Another angle of the nose:

The nose reminds me of the Vickers Vanguard


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Alberto Storti



Both, the B787 and the A350 have their nose below the centerline. The MC-21 has a "higher-nose-attitude", relatively... Strange, when will they find the optimum nose section form?
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:31 am

Thats it  
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Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Fyodor Borisov - TransportPhoto Images - Russian APT

 
anrec80
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 9:12 am

Quoting AirbusA6 (Reply 9):
Sadly, such features won't sell planes!

The plane has been designed to compete with A-320NEO and 737-MAX. It will have plenty of selling points. I am optimistic about it and can't wait to see more in the skies!
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 9:41 am

One more:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Fyodor Borisov - TransportPhoto Images - Russian APT

 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 10:07 am

It looks great.

Quoting anrec80 (Reply 29):
It will have plenty of selling points. I am optimistic about it and can't wait to see more in the skies!

I am not worried about the design or performance of the airplane. It will very probably do fine.
The main challenges for a company like Irkut and Co. will be on the marketing, after sales and production side of the project.

If anything, the hard part starts now...

By the way, when is the last time an airliner was ever designed without any sort of wingtip device?
A clean wing looks almost strange these days, but it's good to see.

[Edited 2016-06-08 03:08:43]
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bmibaby737
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 10:09 am

Does anyone know the serial number being used for this aircraft?
 
Amiga500
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 3:18 pm

Quoting Francoflier (Reply 31):
By the way, when is the last time an airliner was ever designed without any sort of wingtip device?
A clean wing looks almost strange these days, but it's good to see.

The superjet was the same - but I believe seeing somewhere they are going to be fitting winglets to it shortly.
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 3:42 pm

I like it. It is surely different with a nice Vanguard touch.
 
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N328KF
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 3:43 pm

Quoting anrec80 (Reply 29):
The plane has been designed to compete with A-320NEO and 737-MAX. It will have plenty of selling points. I am optimistic about it and can't wait to see more in the skies!

It will more effectively compete with the C919 worldwide than the A320/B727 directly. However, in the CIS, it will sell well for domestic traffic.

The wild card here will be what happens with the issue of Western suppliers.
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redzeppelin
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 4:25 pm

For those interested, the script written below the cockpit windows is A. S. Yakovlev, founder of the Yakovlev Design Bureau:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Sergeyevich_Yakovlev

This article from last year gives a nice overview of the ambitions of the project. They say that even 10-15% of the narrowbody market would be a worthy accomplishment. I wish them luck.
http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...t-sets-out-mc-21-ambitions-413204/

[Edited 2016-06-08 09:27:35]
 
sovietjet
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 6:13 pm

New aircraft type designed to compete with the 737/A320 rolls out, and not much interest on a.net . An airline announces a new route, or picks up a few more gates - threads blows up. Logic not found  
 
neutronstar73
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 6:31 pm

Quoting sovietjet (Reply 37):
New aircraft type designed to compete with the 737/A320 rolls out, and not much interest on a.net . An airline announces a new route, or picks up a few more gates - threads blows up. Logic not found

I find the aircraft quite interesting, actually. I think the reason for the lack of discussion is the fact that the aircraft's development appears to have been shrouded in secrecy. Only thing I remember about the aircraft was a snazzy video advert on the internet and then POOF!! Nothing.

Interest will pick up, I think.
 
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pylon101
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 6:56 pm

We were are happy that roll-out occurred. Now waiting for ground tests and the first flight.

Everyone interested in the matter perfectly knows that MS-21 allows two pax passing by each other.
It would be great for any airline with tough turn-around limits.

Width - finally! - will make possible to serve meals while pax moving.

All that was possible due to TSAGI world-leading know-how.
And TSAGI (for some reason) never bothers with winglets.
This is their belief that a good aerodynamics doesn't need winglets.
I am on EK 231/232. The rest is just jet lag.
 
by738
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:23 pm

wheres any wingtip device? It doesnt look like any sort of raked or 787 style wing
 
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:32 pm

Quoting pylon101 (Reply 39):
Everyone interested in the matter perfectly knows that MS-21 allows two pax passing by each other.

Then why not configure it twin-aisle 2-2-2 instead of one very wide aisle and 3-3?

A350
 
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N328KF
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:48 pm

Quoting pylon101 (Reply 39):
And TSAGI (for some reason) never bothers with winglets.
This is their belief that a good aerodynamics doesn't need winglets.

View Large View Medium
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Photo © Misael Ocasio
View Large View Medium
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Photo © Artyom Kuzhlev

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lostsound
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:03 pm

I find it rather unattractive tbh. But that doesn't matter, hope it sells!
 
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kelvin933
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:08 pm

Quoting A350 (Reply 41):
Then why not configure it twin-aisle 2-2-2 instead of one very wide aisle and 3-3?

It is only 6 inches wider than an A320, not likely to make 2 aisles out of 25-30 inches
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Gasman
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:17 pm

Has it really taken them this long to steal the plans for the 757?
 
SANChaser
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:29 pm

Kudos to the Irkut team. I actually really like the look of the nose = maybe I am bored with the A320 and B737s  
 
Vanguard
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:30 pm

Quoting FYODOR (Reply 28):
The nose reminds me of the Vickers Vanguard

I've always been proud of my profile  
 
JoeCanuck
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:38 pm

Quoting Francoflier (Reply 31):
By the way, when is the last time an airliner was ever designed without any sort of wingtip device?
A clean wing looks almost strange these days, but it's good to see.

The Russian aerodynamicists know what they are doing but they are definitely the odd man out when it comes to wing tip devices.

Quoting Gasman (Reply 45):

They stole those plans for the Tu204.
What the...?
 
L0VE2FLY
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RE: MC-21 To Roll Out On June 8

Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:49 pm

Cool bird, let's see what John Leahy nicknames her!  He probably won't bother until a Western carrier shows some interest!


Quoting N14AZ (Reply 27):
The nose reminds me of the Vickers Vanguard

   I thought the nose section looked familiar.


Quoting lostsound (Reply 43):
I find it rather unattractive tbh. But that doesn't matter, hope it sells!

Except for the lack of winglets, I don't see anything wrong with her look.

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