AC_A340
Topic Author
Posts: 2196
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 1999 12:01 pm

Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Thu Dec 07, 2000 10:52 pm

I just heard on the news this morning that two Air Canada pilots were removed from their DC-9 in St Johns before a flight to Halifax. Apparently, somebody smelt Alcohol on their breath.

That's what I heard, I hope it's not true. If anybody finds any news articles on that issue let me know please.
 
Pilot1113
Posts: 2276
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 1999 1:42 pm

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 2:17 am

Yes! They're freeing up seniority slots for me!

Oh... wait, I'm not Canadian.  

- Neil Harrison
 
AC_B777
Posts: 731
Joined: Sat Aug 19, 2000 5:15 am

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 3:35 am

Hi,
Unfortunatly, it is true. An AC agent smelled alcohol on one of the pilots (not sure if it was the Captain or F/O).
It was then reported to a supervisor who also smelled alcohol on his breath.
The local AC manager came to check it out. Eventually and obviously the flight was cancelled.
The pilot told the manager that he had drank alcohol, but it was 7:00pm the night before (this may be true, but the smell would'nt stay on his breath that long). The flight was scheduled to leave YYT at 0645 to YHZ and YWG.
It is too bad that this had to happen. When are pilots going to learn that you can't consume alcohol before flying. This seems to be a worsening trend among the pilot community.
Any thoughts from anyone?

AC_B777
In life, some days you are the bug..... some days you are the windshield!
 
PILOTALLEN
Posts: 634
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 1999 11:01 am

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 4:00 am

im just wondering, will they be able to fly for them again or another airline? and does anyone know the minimum time u can drink before flying? im 17 so i dont have to worry about this but just wondering thanks
Thats not flying, thats falling with style -Woody
 
Guest

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 4:00 am

"When are pilots going to learn that you can't consume alcohol
before flying. This seems to be a worsening trend among the pilot community."

Airlines have an eight hour "bottle to throttle" (Midway's is 12) rule. To violate that rule in any way shape or form is professional suicide. period. As far as worsening trend, I would be interested in knowing what pilot community it is that you are referring to.
 
AC_B777
Posts: 731
Joined: Sat Aug 19, 2000 5:15 am

RE: DC-9CAPT

Fri Dec 08, 2000 4:27 am

Sorry,
I did'nt mean anything personal. It just seems like every fews weeks, you hear about pilots flying will under the influence.
To me, it is a scarry thought to wonder if the plane you are flying on is being flown by a pilot(s) who are intoxicated.
I am an AC employee and this is the first time I have heard of any of our pilots boarding one of our planes to fly it while under the influence. It strikes close to home when it's a person who works for the same company as you and is flying out of your home base.
It's bad enough when you hear of people driving cars while intoxicated, but when your strapped to the nose of a plane, I think the whole topic of being under the influence while operating machinery is taken up to a higher level of concern.
Again, sorry. I did not mean anything personal. I know there are many (the vast mojority) pilots who would'nt even think about flying a plane with alcohol in his/her system.
To pilotallen, AC's policy is 12 hours.
AC_B777
In life, some days you are the bug..... some days you are the windshield!
 
Guest

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 4:57 am

AC,

I didn't take it as a personal attack. I was just wondering if you had seen any more recent activity of this nature--because they're hasn't been anything like this in the US since the early 90s . Thankfully, these cases are few and far between. When they do happen, the press jumps all over them.
 
Lubicon
Posts: 201
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 5:13 am

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 5:03 am

AC policy is apparently 12 hrs 'bottle to throttle'.
 
Pilot1113
Posts: 2276
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 1999 1:42 pm

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 5:46 am

Seriously though, this is a very serious offense. However, many pilots believe it an honor to be pushing those big birds around and wouldn't dream of doing something like this.

Also, who would want to give up a job that pays a 6 figure income for doing virtually nothing and getting all the time off that you could want?

I could see being at an backyard barbacue and having "a few" with the guys. Then dispatch calls...

However, the pilot must turn down that flight.

- Neil Harrison
 
AC_A340
Topic Author
Posts: 2196
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 1999 12:01 pm

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 7:16 am

Taken from The Telegram, Local paper in St. John's
At least only 10 passengers were inconvenienced.

By BRIAN CALLAHAN
The Telegram

and The Canadian Press


An Air Canada pilot was removed from a DC-9 jet on the tarmac at St. John’s International Airport Tuesday morning after an airline employee told a supervisor he was concerned the pilot might not be fit to fly.

Reports late Wednesday indicated two pilots were under suspicion.

But an Air Canada spokeswoman told The Telegram only one of the two men was being investigated.

“The other was taken to the home base (in Toronto) because he was with the pilot who was said to be unfit,” Michelle Meier said from Montreal.

“That would simply help with the investigation.”

Another airline spokeswoman confirmed the two pilots were later taken to Toronto where Air Canada and Transport Canada were investigating.

Nicole Couture-Simard couldn’t confirm reports the pilot had alcohol on his breath as the aircraft was preparing to leave for Halifax from St. John’s.

“The flight crew has been recalled to home base for investigation,” Couture-Simard said from Air Canada’s head office in Montreal.

“In our procedures we encourage our employees to voice their concerns should they come in contact with any employee they believe could be unfit to work.”

Flight 623 was cancelled, and its 10 passengers were put on another flight to Halifax about 90 minutes later, said Meier.

She would not reveal the name, age or home town of the pilot, adding it would be inappropriate to release more details because the allegations haven’t been proven.

“We won’t speculate on any scenario … until a medical exam and technical investigation are complete.”

Air Canada regulations prohibit crews from consuming alcohol within 12 hours of a flight.
 
Guest

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 8:06 am

Sad story, its a real shame. I'm glad someone took the risk and said something...
 
Guest

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 11:26 am

The fact that this happened just sickens me...putting other people's live's in danger, I don't think that's right, when you fly for the airlines you have a huge responsiblility on your back and to abuse that privilege is just wrong.

Secondly, why would any self-respecting pilot put their whole career on the line just to enjoy a couple of drinks? I could not take a huge risk like that, the possiblity of it ending my career would completely turn me off drinking anywhere near the time I had to fly. Although I feel sorry for those pilot's, if the allegations are true then I think they deserve severe punishment.

As for the person who spoke up about them, good for them. I'm glad that they had the sense to stop that plane from leaving the ground. Totally sober pilot's are very important in a job that requires full attention to perform it properly.
 
Guest

Guilty Until Proven Innocent

Fri Dec 08, 2000 1:35 pm

Do we know for sure that these guys (or gals?) were "under the influence?" Y'all have to remember that just becuase some yo-yo says he thinks the crew is wasted doesn't mean they are. Heck, that passenger could very well have smelled breath mints or lav cleaner (did he shove his nose in the crews faces? I would have punched him!).

If a passenger alleges that he/she smells booze on the crew than the only responsible thing for the crew to do is get off the airplane and handle it responsibly through channels (get tested to prove your innocence). I know there are some hard core ALPA and APA guys out there who would tell me to take a leap on that one, but by avoiding even the appearence of impropriety, you are covering your butt if something does happen during the flight... IMHO. Face it, the public doesn't trust us to be pros! Oh by the way guys... I'm not bowing before management here. I too where my union pin with pride!

Anyway, give these guys the benefit of the doubt. The vast majority of us are professionals who take the rules seriously, and it is a dubious proposition that these AC pilots were any different.
 
Guest

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 1:46 pm

Guess what ATR? It wasn't a pax, it was a coworker. Followed by a second coworker.

The two pilots were men not women.

 
Tom in NO
Posts: 6725
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 1999 10:10 am

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 2:37 pm

Seems to me I recall this same type of thing happening once at Northwest maybe 4 or 5 years ago, except in that case, the crew actually flew an aircraft from Minot/Bismarck? to MSP, and got detained there. Both pilots were subsequently canned.

Tom in NO (at MSY)
"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
 
runway
Posts: 65
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:37 am

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 5:43 pm

St. John's NFLD, what a spot. If you have ever been there you can understand why someone would want to get drunk. George St is one of the most interesting and aluring places on the planet, thats where all the bars are. The people are friendly, the beer is great and the women are, well, nice.

This is still no excuse for a flight crew to intend fly while under the influence, not that this is a proven fact.

Runway
 
OE-LDA
Posts: 207
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2000 5:29 pm

RE: Pilots Removed From Aircraft

Fri Dec 08, 2000 5:53 pm

If it is correct that only one of the pilots was under the influence of alcohol, then it surprises me that the other pilot did not notice, when even the gate agent did. Or is there a code of honor forbidding to blame another crew member?

Regards, OE-LDA
I am totally missing basics and clueless about airline flying!

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