United Airline
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UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Wed Dec 27, 2000 10:48 pm

Hi fookies!

As you all know, UAL has converted a few of its initial B 747-400 orders to B 777-200ERs. Increasingly, there are more and more B 777-200ERs being used on United Airlines's routes.

What do you all think about this? Is UAL trying to replace B 747-400s position with its B 777-200ERs? I understand that B 777s have lower operating cost than B 744s.

Is there a chance for UAL's B 747-400s? Do you guys think UAL might go for some B 747-400s in the future?  

Just want to hear some ideas from more ppl though some of you have given me your opinion.

All ideas are welcome! Good luck!

 
 
SQA340
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Wed Dec 27, 2000 10:59 pm

Hey,

The main reason to this is that the 777s are used a lot in UA route structure. ER is used for mainly the trans atlantic/pacific routes. The 747 however is a big part of UAs fleet. UA wont phase them out. They are the foundation of UA's Asia market. Trans Pacific routes are very packed and the 747 fits them well. F/C class are full on HKG routes because of the business in HK so the 747-400 does these routes well and suites the pax with 84 in C and 12 in F.

Basicly UA is boeing reliable and they still favor the 747 for Asia but they still want the 777 to fly the trans atlantic routes.

So UA is buying the 777 more than the 747 because the 777 are more needed for TA routes and also TC routes.

The 747 has played a big role in UA's fleet. Don't expect them to go.

Rgds,
Mike (SQA340)
 
United Airline
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Wed Dec 27, 2000 11:09 pm

SQA340,


I agree with you. The B 747-400s are very important to UAL's Asian routes. It is also being used on some European routes as well.

I do see a future order of B 744s by UAL. What do you think Mike?


Best Regards:
Des
 
SQA340
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Thu Dec 28, 2000 12:07 am

Untied Airline,

I see an order of the 747X somtime in the future. The pacific flights are packed and the 747X have the stamina. Plus it will fit well in the maitenance ops here in the US. If UA ever gets an A3XX, It will have to go to another base with mechanics who know how to condition one. But the 747X should have the same ops as the 747classics so the mechs should'nt have a problem with the 747X.

Rgds,
Mike

 
ILUV767
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Thu Dec 28, 2000 12:58 am

You've all got to understand that the 777 is much more verstital. Since you dont have 300+ seats to sell, you can fill them easier. Operating twin engine planes is much more cost effective than operating four engines.

The 747-400 is not going to be leaving United's fleet anytime soon. United took delivery of its last 744 in August. With the 777, you can move them between markets, and where the loads arnt so good, a flight can be downgraded to a 777 from a 744, or a really packed, and very oversold 744, could become 2 777 flights.

The 777 is just a better product, because you are not limited to one market, but the 773ER competes with the 747. UA dosnt need more 744s at the moment, when they could use 777LRs.
 
ap305
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Thu Dec 28, 2000 2:17 am

The 777-200er(along with the a340)has extremley good all round economics.The seat/mile costs are almost on par with that of the 747-400.But the big advantage is that these seat mile costs can be achieved with 300 passengers and not 450 as is the case with the 747-400.The impications are obivious-an airline can make the same profits as with a 747-400 but at a much lower risk.Imho this trend of swapping 744's for 772's is going to continue not only with Ua but with other airlines as well.It would be interesting to see how the new genaration economics and passenger comfort of the a380 stack up against this trend.


ap305
 
RWally
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Thu Dec 28, 2000 2:24 am

UAL operates its 744s on LAX-MEL, LAX-SYD, SFO-SYD, LAX-HKG, SFO-HKG, LAX-NRT, SFO-NRT, etc. UAL ops the 747-400 on Pacific routes.
 
United Airline
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Thu Dec 28, 2000 3:44 am

I understand that the B 772 ER/773ER does play in important role in the airline industry and I do see a very large demand in the future. But I don't think it is going to replace the B 747-400 for UAL as well as for other airlines.

Nevertheless, the B 777-200ER is very flexible.

Any more idea on this issue?  
 
flyf15
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Thu Dec 28, 2000 3:57 am

For all who think that the 777 will be put on quite a few 747-400 routes to increase profits...why not just put a 767-200ER on them? Then you are carrying no coach pax at all, and with that number of pax, it would have the same range as the above two aircraft.
 
Guest

RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Thu Dec 28, 2000 5:01 am

I dont see anything wrong with UNITED using both Boeing 777s & Boeing 744s. They need both for operations, I agree on that 744 needs for Asian routes, B777 for some trans-pacific, Hawaiian market, and atlantic routes like UK....


Baec777xx  
 
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RayChuang
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Thu Dec 28, 2000 5:30 am

I doubt the UA 744's will be leaving that fleet anytime soon. I expect UA to continue flying the 744 till at least 2012, and don't be surprised that the UA 744's get a major "777" style interior upgrade and possibly be subject to a re-engining program in the 2004-2006 time frame to increase range.

If UA were to ever buy the A380 the first planes won't arrive on UA property until at least 2010.
 
United Airline
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Thu Dec 28, 2000 4:57 pm

Oh for sure they will not be leaving anytime soon. I do see a need in additional B 744s if the merger goes through.

I don't think UA is ever going to buy the A 380. They want an all Boeing fleet that is as big as or larger than the B 757.

 
 
airnewzealand
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Thu Dec 28, 2000 5:34 pm

They also use the 747-400 on the LAX-AKL route and the LAX-AKL-MEL route.

Has UA got PTV's yet?? I heard they were getting installed in the summer.

I also thought UA operated some A320. If so how can that be a all boeing fleet??

Does UA fly to SEL?? (Seoul)

Cheers
mikey
Haere RA (From NewZealand)
      AirNZ: The worlds warmest welcome!!      
 
ILUV767
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Thu Dec 28, 2000 6:12 pm

United Airlines operates a primarily Boeing fleet. They currently operate the 727, 737, 747, 757, 767, and the 777. The do however operate both the A319 and the A320.


In the fleet of 44 747-400s that UA operates, currently there are between 6 to 9 744s with the Personal Televisions in the main cabin. Other classes of service already have personal televisions.


90% of all transpacific flights that are operated by United are in the 744. There are about 5% of the Atlantic flights operated by a 744. There are a few domestic markets that get a 747.

The 747-400s will not be leaving the fleet. There are no-plans to get rid of them; mainly because they just got the last deliveries from Boeing, and they are getting major cabin work done. I expect that in 5 years, they will get new 777 style overhead bins.

I do expect that United will be the launch customer for the 747X. They need the extra capacity on some routes. Mainly to Asia. If this were to happen, thefirst routes to get the larger 747 would be JFK-NRT, ORD-HKG, and possibly SFO-NRT.

 
United Airline
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Thu Dec 28, 2000 6:13 pm

Airnewzealand:


An ALL BOEING FLEET for aircraft > or = to the B 757.

They have started installing PTVs on every Economy Seat. They have already installed PTVs on every Single First Class and Business Class seats.  

UAL does fly to SEL.


Regards:
Des
 
SQA340
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RE: Airnewzeland

Thu Dec 28, 2000 9:22 pm

UA SEL Routes:

LAX-SEL
SFO-SEL
 
FLY777UAL
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RE: UAL: B 747-400s VS B 777-200ERs

Sat Dec 30, 2000 2:18 pm

UA Seoul routes:

SFO-SEL (one daily)
SEL-NRT (three daily-to be four daily @ Summer)

F L Y 7 7 7 U A L

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