SInGAPORE_AIR
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Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Tue Jan 02, 2001 7:24 pm

This is stupid. Singapore Airlines should get priority as they have from the start. Here's a stupid little extract.

Airlines row over right to first flight of new jumbo
Canberra Times - Australasia; Jan 2, 2001
BY THE GUARDIAN



LONDON, Monday: Aircraft-maker Airbus has found itself in the middle of a row over the inauguration of the world's largest jumbo jet.

Airline Emirates, the first customer to order the renamed A380, formerly known as the A3XX, has protested to Airbus after it found it might not be the first airline to fly the aircraft commercially.

Industry sources said last night that Singapore Airlines would be the first, even though it ordered the A380 after Emirates. Singapore is a much larger airline and has been given priority by Airbus over its Middle East rival.

The row has not become public earlier because Emirates is still hoping the issue will be resolved by negotiation. But senior executives from the airline based in Dubai feel let down by Airbus, the European manufacturer with headquarters at Toulouse, to which France, Britain, Germany and Spain belong.

Emirates's senior managers have told Airbus they deserve better treatment because the company had been prepared to commit itself to the project when Airbus was concerned that it would not get the support it wanted and feared the project might collapse.

Emirates's commitment to the 565-seat aircraft produced a ripple effect throughout the world's airlines, among them Singapore, Air France and Qantas during last year.

Airbus has now been able to commit itself to the project, with the first commercial flight due in 2006.

Jubilant Emirates executives said that the first A380 would land at Heathrow but were shocked when they heard that the prestigious first flight would be offered to Singapore.

Airbus executives are working on a compromise acceptable to Emirates, which has placed 10 firm orders for the aircraft, valued at $US2.9 billion ($A5.2 billion). The most likely solution is a simultaneous launch of the plane by Emirates and Singapore, both landing at Heathrow. Since the distance between Dubai and London is shorter than that between Singapore and London, the Emirates flight would land first.

The airline would therefore be able to claim it as the inaugural commercial flight.

The launch of the A380 has been surrounded by a considerable marketing hype on its potential to bring about a revolution in flying. This is based on the extra space it will provide, with drawing-board plans for duty-free shops, sleeping cabins and pianists playing baby grands for first-class passengers.

The aircraft will bring a considerable increase in jobs throughout the industry. Britain will make the wings for the plane at plants in north Wales and at Filton near Bristol, where more than 20,000 new jobs will be created.


World Reporter All Material Subject to Copyright
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
VirginFlyer
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380

Tue Jan 02, 2001 7:47 pm

Yeah, the best deal would be to let SIA have the first Take-Off, but Ek have the first landing (i.e. The Emirates aircraft would leave Dubai after the Singapore one has left Singapore, but arrive in LHR before the SQ flight). Look out for me on that SQ flight!!!
"So powerful is the light of unity that it can illuminate the whole earth." - Bahá'u'lláh
 
watewate
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Tue Jan 02, 2001 7:54 pm

I guess Qantas and Virgin don't mind being left out of the glory? I bet SIA will get its way one way or another. They live on reputation of being cutting edge- being first operator of A380 would be a good PR move on their part.
 
The Ticketor
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Tue Jan 02, 2001 7:57 pm

What do you mean stupid? First come first served! If they ordered first, all logic dictates that they should get the acft first as well! Give it to Emirates!
 
Joni
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Tue Jan 02, 2001 7:59 pm


Ticketor:

Emirates and SIA were negotiating for production slots simultaneously, and it's impossible for an outsider to know all the details.
 
airnewzealand
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Tue Jan 02, 2001 8:08 pm

I think Qantas should be the launch customer of the A380. After all they have ordered the most!!

Cheers
mikey
Haere RA (From New Zealand)
      AirNZ: The worlds warmest welcome!!       

PS how many Flight Attendants are needed for a flight on the A380?? Thanks in advance.
 
The Ticketor
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Tue Jan 02, 2001 8:26 pm

Joni: You are correct; It's impossible for someone not involved in the process to know all the details. My comment was more regarding the principle that whoever orders first, should get the product first. There may be other circumstances and situations where there might be a good reason not to follow this logic, but as a principle I think I'm right.
 
gkirk
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Tue Jan 02, 2001 9:15 pm

Sounds like EK should have first flight as they ordered first. SQ are just behaving like kids if this is true. I don't know the insides so I am going on what Singapore_Air has said.
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
BA744
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Tue Jan 02, 2001 9:19 pm

Good news for LHR though!
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Tue Jan 02, 2001 9:40 pm

Airbus said from the start that if Singapore (Sexy) Airlines ordered. that they would be the first to fly. Now if EK has a problem with that too late.

Now from my point of view if EK doesn't back off quickly and maturely then I propse.

1)SIA leaves first, passes over Dubai, EK leaves, SIA slows down a bit, the two are parallel in flight (so to speak), eg: 12 noon at LHR, EK lined up on 27R, SIA lined on 27L, they circle till they both are at the same landing stage, both land. Hoorah!

2)SIA ges to be the first to fly and land the A380 like originally proposed.

3)Ek stop "behaving like kids"

I was angry at that stage so I said the idea of EK flying first was stupid.
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Tue Jan 02, 2001 10:08 pm

After seraching nearly the whole of cyberspace on your behalf. Voila!!

CNNFN: "Singapore Airlines, Asia's most profitable airline, said it will be the first carrier to operate the 500-seat"

FT: "Singapore Airlines is set to become the world's first airline to operate the Airbus A3XX "

Aviationnow.com:"SIA would also become the first carrier in the world to operate the all-new 555-seat aircraft, with deliveries slated to start in 2006. SIA was also the first non-U.S. carrier to operate the Boeing 747-400 (not sure about that though. I thought it was Cathay)"

SIA: "With the first delivery scheduled for early 2006, SIA will be the first airline in the world to accept and operate this revolutionary aircraft. (SIA was also the first airline, together with a US airline, to operate the Boeing 747-400).(not sure about that, I thought it was Cathay)"

So there. What's more. Oh I forgot, the offical Airbus word:

Airbus.com:"Singapore Airlines (SIA) is to become the first airline in the world to operate the all-new 555 seat A3XX, following the announcement by the carrier of its decision to purchase up to 25 aircraft. " "The first A3XX will be delivered to Singapore Airlines in the first quarter of 2006, with subsequent deliveries of the firm order aircraft continuing through to 2007. "
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
USAFHummer
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Tue Jan 02, 2001 10:25 pm

How can you argue with facts like that?

Greg
Chief A.net college football stadium self-pic guru
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Tue Jan 02, 2001 11:14 pm

Kudos to you Greg!!!!

I think Kudos mean praise :?

ANyway, yes who can argue. It was on Airbus.COM on 29 September, so EK did take a while didn't they!
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
eg777er
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 12:55 am

Well, usually those who order first get the inaugural flight - look at UA with the 777 for example. I don't think Emirates are behaving like kids - they took the leap of faith with Airbus whereas AF & SQ followed. If you ask me, SQ are the ones getting out of their pram - just because they have the largest order they can't ride rughshod over everyone else.

However, I think the idea of parallel landings at LHR is a good one.
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 2:56 am

Hello EG77ER: I see we have put our past quarrels behind us. Let me tell you 1 thing though: NEVER EVER DID SIA FOLLOW EK IN BUYING THE A380! (just for effect and shock). It has been well known that SIA wanted a VLA. Not sure about Emirates though and even so look at my previous post. Airbus.com put the "SIA will be 1st" release up on 29/09/00, well it is reported that EK went to Airbus Toulouse on 01/01/01. So what happenned in the 3 months. THey should have got up their arses and moved straight a way to complain. I just see this as EK just waking up to bad news for them.

NOw I've gotta go. My Dad won't go away.
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
Guest

RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 3:10 am

Anyone notice the little 'Emirates, which has 10 firm orders...'? When did this happen? I thought they only had orders for 7 (5 pâssenger + 2 freighters) + 5 options. When did they order the other 3? Or is this just a mistake?
 
ZRH
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 3:12 am

It is very easy: first order, first flight. In this case Emirates should have the first flight. There is no reason why Singapore should have the first flight.
 
Trvlr
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 3:25 am

Airbus is going to keep the prototype A3XX, right? If so, then:

AI paints (or more easily, decals) the prototype A3XX in a half Emirates, half Singapore scheme, like the half-and-half Concorde that BA and SQ shared back in the 80s. They do a "scheduled" flight, with both EK and SQ flight numbers, from Toulouse to LHR with press etc, and then continue it to Singapore via Dubai. If EK doesn't agree to this, then SQ gets the first flight. If SQ doesn't, then EK gets the first flight.

Aaron G.
 
Guest

RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 3:49 am

Hey, you have ALL forgot WHO was supposed to launch the 380 : AIR FRANCE !
 
Guest

RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 3:54 am

WHy should SIA be the first one ? Air France is much bigger than SIA and had intent and orders for the 380 before SIA !
And AF has folowed and participated to the whole program !
 
caetravlr
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 4:05 am

I am sure that guaranteeing SIA the launch customer and inaugural flight status was one of the many concessions that Airbus made to SIA to get them to order the planes. However, if Emirates really doesn't like it, then they don't have to keep their orders. I agree, first order, first flight. Just my humble opinion.
A woman drove me to drink and I didn't have the decency to thank her. - W.C. Fields
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 7:59 am

First of All, the connection to this site is frankly shit.

You have all voiced your opinions but let me put to you all this.

Airbus put the notice that SIA would be the 1st one to fly the A380 on 29 of September 2000. Now why has it taken EK so long to complain? And the plan about the Toulouse - LHR and dual color thing. I think it's stupid but if that's the final thing then it'll have todo.
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
widebody
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 9:18 am

When Emirates ordered the A380, it was stated in many reports that they would be the third airline to receive the aircraft....anyone know who the second was?
 
Guest

RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 9:31 am

This could get interesting. QF has a few aces up it's sleeve and would no doubt love to pip SIA at the finish line. No love lost between those carriers.

We've got a few years to wait though.

mb
 
Trvlr
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 10:54 am

Well the dual plan is stupid but it was just random speculation. I really think that if AI says SQ gets the first A380, then so be it.

Aaron G.
 
FLY777UAL
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Airnewzealand

Wed Jan 03, 2001 3:10 pm

ANZ-

To answer your question about the flight attendants, based upon current staffing standards, the A380 with 555 passengers, split up into Airbus' proposed 22F 102C 431Y would be as follows:

First Class 4 flight attendants
Business Class 8 flight attendants
Economy Class 14 flight attendants

For a grand total of 26 flight attendants.

FC ratio: 1:6
BC ratio: 1:12
YC ratio: 1:30

F L Y 7 7 7 U A L
 
v jet
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Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 9:04 am

RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 4:49 pm

There was an item on the tv news here in Sydney a few weeks about the A380 and it featured an interview with some exec from Airbus. He clearly stated that Qantas would be the first airline to take delivery. Now dont all squeal at me I'm just saying was this guy said!
 
watewate
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Joined: Sun Nov 12, 2000 6:00 am

RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 5:10 pm

Didn't Airbus think this over carefully before they signed everyone on? It's only obvious that any airline would want to be the launch customer for such a plane. It'd be gold to see some airline cancel order because they are pissed off... but I'm not holding my breath on that one.
 
gkirk
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RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 5:39 pm

Looks like Airbus have screwed up on this one! In my opinion, whoever ordered the a/c first should fly it first.
BTW, How many gates @ LHR are able to handle the A380? I know there isn't that many. Oh another thing, is the A380 bigger than the AN-225.
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
Posts: 11619
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2000 4:06 am

RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Wed Jan 03, 2001 6:26 pm

I am distressed about someone saying that Airbus said that QUANTAS would get the first flight. Unacceptable in my opinion.

When Singapore Airlines ordered the A380, they knew that they would get the first flight. Even if they didn't I would think they'd have paid extra just to get it! Airbus has said all along that SIA have got the 1st flight. And, sorry to EK, they took to long in complaining and now they should take it and eat some humble pie.

Now, that sounded nice didn't it?
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
airnewzealand
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V Jet, Fly777UAL And Singapore_Air

Wed Jan 03, 2001 6:31 pm

GOD, can't anyone spell QANTAS right. this is how it is spelt not QUANTAS. Go to the airport and look with your eyes and read the name given on the fuselage. (No Offence)

V Jet..... It was also reported here in NZ on TV one that QANTAS would be the launch customer.

Fly777UAL..... Thanks for that info. Hope airNZ order some so that they will hire more FA's.

Cheers
mikey
Haere RA (From NewZealand)
      AirNZ: The worlds warmest welcome!!      
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
Posts: 11619
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2000 4:06 am

RE: Airlines In Bitter Row Over 1st Flight Of A380!

Thu Jan 04, 2001 2:18 am

I think you'll find that Quantas is a launch customer but will not be the 1st one to fly the fat thing.
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.

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