a380
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AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 3:04 am

At what time will AC receive A340-500s?

I believe they only ordered two of them.
I personally hope they will be solely used in the YYZ-HKG route nonstop. I am looking for double Aeroplan miles when they launched this route! (Now there is a stop at ANC when flying westbound)
 
slawko
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 3:07 am

I think the stop is in YVR, AC does not stop at ANC....The 345's I think there will be 5 of them will be used on all the long haul stuff like YYZ-hkg
"Clive Beddoe says he favours competition, but his actions do not support that idea." Robert Milton - CEO Air Canada
 
a380
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 3:07 am

Sorry. My mistake. Mixed up with the CX flight.
 
ap305
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 3:18 am

I think ac converted some if not all it's a346 to a345.Hence they may be getting a lot more than the oriiginal no(2?) of a345 they orderd.


ap305
 
kLm-Md-11
Posts: 131
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Vancouver Feeding Traffic

Fri Jan 05, 2001 3:56 am

What I'm worried about now, is that alot of the flights to Asian cities are originated from Vancouver. With the new long range aircraft coming in, I'm afraid they might cut some of the flights that originates from Vancouver in favor for some that originates in Toronto. I'm afraid YVR will lose her glamour and glory!

My two cents.

 
AC_A340
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 5:33 am

I believe they want to use one for YVR-SYD. That's the rumor I've heard. But that won't be possible until Air Canada has that route as opposed to Canadian. I'm sure they'll find an ultra-long route for it.

Maybe they'll start exploring the idea of polar routes. But my guess is they'll expand in Southeast Asia.
 
polaris
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 6:07 am

Air Canada has 5 x A340-500 on order. Deliveries are scheduled to begin in 2002.
 
Red Panda
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 6:09 am

I don't think AC's A345 would stop over at YVR since A345 are supposed to fly long range non-stop, for example, YYZ to HKG. IF they stop at YVR, there is no need to buy long range A345. AC may also launch some other long range flights from YYZ to other SE Asian countries as well such as SIN and TPE. Maybe some to India as well.

REgards,
R Panda
 
johnnybgoode
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 7:16 am

as far as i know, ac has three a-345s and two a-346s on order. in addition it´s got several options on both types.
i don´t think they´d give up routes from vancouver because yvr´s got a big market regarding asian routes, as well as toronto, but the vancouver market is well established. i´d say they will definitely increase services from toronto, but won´t skip any from yvr.
now that they swallowed canadian it should be easy for them to get the rights to serve syd.
how does canadian serve syd???? i´m not sure if the 744 has the range to do yvr-syd. i know it´s able to go from sfo/lax to syd, but from yvr???
i know that canadian used to have/still has services to hnl and nadi.
in 1999, i saw a canada 3000 757!!!! in sydney. quite a journey for such a small plane! suppose they went via hnl and nadi.
indeed, air canada is supposedly interested in serving india nonstop, as one of you already pointed out.

daniel
If only pure sweetness was offered, why's this bitter taste left in my mouth.
 
Guest

RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 7:25 am

It doesn't really matter whether it's Canadian or Air Canada operating the YVR-SYD route now anyway, does it? I mean, AC can put a CP flight number on it and say "operated by Air Canada". Doesn't really make much of a difference. They are pretty much one and the same now anyway...correct me if I'm wrong.
 
cba
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 7:40 am

The 744 and A343 both have the range to fly YUL-HKG and YVR-SYD.
 
polaris
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 8:14 am

Air Canada's order for the A340-600 was converted to an order for A340-500. They now have 5 x A340-500 on order and no firm A340-600 orders.

Flyboy767: Legally, it does matter who operates a particular route because operations are subject to international agreements and licences. Once the agreements are re-negotiated, then the "new " carrier can assume the rights.

Johnnybgoode: Canadian currently serves Sydney daily with a B-767-300 on a routing of Vancouver - Honolulu - Sydney. Canada 3000 serves Brisbane and Sydney with a 757-200.

 
slawko
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 8:59 am

OK First of all Air Canada and Canadian are now exactly the same airline....As of Jan 1st 2001 their operating certificates were merged (As far as I know, if not yet then at the end of this month) Anyway AC could buy the routes from candian for $1 and it would be theirs.

Secondly YVR will not loose out on anything, infact this could mean more flights from YVR, to places in Europe, as well as India, the south Pacific and south america. If ac wanted to run a YYZ-HKG route non stop then they could with a 744 or 340 just like CX, accross the north pole, the two problems that exist there are poor ATC services in Siberia, and the contract that they have with their flight attendants does not allow them to work that long without a stop. The existing YYZ-HKG route was going to be non stop until the Union got involved.

"Clive Beddoe says he favours competition, but his actions do not support that idea." Robert Milton - CEO Air Canada
 
polaris
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 9:12 am

Slawko, yes, the operating certificates were merged effective January 1st. Air Canada legally assumed Canadian's rights.
 
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RayChuang
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 9:27 am

I think once AC gets the A345 they will fly YYZ-HKG non-stop on this plane. After all, the plane has the range to pull it off with no problems.

I believe that the 744's that AC inherited from Canadian Airlines will be used for YVR-HKG non-stops.
 
slawko
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 9:33 am

The 744 is already flying YVR-HKG as well as the A340. I think that what people have to get used to is that there is no longer a need to refer to Canadian, it is all Air Canada and now it is official....I know it will be a hard habbit to break but from now on everything is Air Canada, and Canadian is no longer a company...the only thing reall now, is that some planes have yet to be re-painted...which reminds me, i have heard that there will be no more transitional livery planes painted, they will all be full Air Canada colours....
"Clive Beddoe says he favours competition, but his actions do not support that idea." Robert Milton - CEO Air Canada
 
WorldVoyager
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 10:11 am

Having flown CX829/828 YYZ-HKG/HKG-YYZ, I can say that, unless the polar non-stop route cuts down a significant amount of time off the flight, the stop in Anchorage is preferable on this route.

Picture 20 hours in a coach seat without being able to move! Economy syndrome indeed!

The Anchorage stop lets passengers walk around and stretch. It is a necessity!
 
AC_A340
Posts: 2196
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 11:06 am

Yes this is a difficult time. We must break the habit of Canadian. I wasn't aware that their operating certificates had been merged though. Interesting to say the least. At least I got a model of a CP 737 proud wings to remember the days past.

Second, I thought that an airline can not just sell it's rights to a route, but rather put it up for sale and the interested buyer must obtain regulatory approval before the route is actually purchased. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
 
slawko
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AC_A340

Fri Jan 05, 2001 11:16 am

No I don't think so..remember before the Air Canada deal to buy Canadian Airlines was finalized and approved Air Canada bought CDN001 YYZ-NRT this provided CP with enough money so that it could continue operating until AC bought it.
"Clive Beddoe says he favours competition, but his actions do not support that idea." Robert Milton - CEO Air Canada
 
AC183
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 11:32 am

Route authorities can't actually be sold... they are assigned by the government, so technically they could be reassigned to whoever they like. That said, however, what really happens in the industry is that airlines mutually agree to have routes transferred in exchange for compensation by other carriers... which is essentially selling routes, but isn't quite, strictly speaking, defined as such, at least in legal terms. Or at least that's the explanation I got on the topic.

On the topic of CP's operating certificate, I believe it's technically still in effect... I'd heard that it won't be merged with AC's until spring (April was when I've heard). Can anyone clarify this for sure? If it means anything, it's seems to still be shown as valid on Transport Canada's online databases, so I'm guessing it's not quite gone yet...
 
caribb
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 12:03 pm

Worldvoyager - The new polar Routes are suppose to cut about 3 to 3.1/2 hours of flying time on flights to Asia from Eastern North America (presumably New York, Chicago, Toronto). The result will be less fuel used and less cost to fly the run. Air Fares are predicted to drop as well but who knows?

Air Canada announced it would replace YVR with YYZ as it's Asian hub once this new routes are up and running full swing in a few years.. it will likely take some flights away from YVR and AC will concentrate even more on YYZ as it's focal point.
 
Rai
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 2:02 pm

Vancouver has too big an Asian population to reduce its flights to the Pacific Rim. That'll never happen. Furthermore, the polar will also cut time by a few hours from YVR as well. YVR-HKG would be about nine hours using the polar route instead of the current twelve and a half.

From what I've heard, the A345 will be used for YYZ-HKG, YVR-SIN, YVR/YYZ-DEL and possibly YYZ-JHB.
 
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RayChuang
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RE: AC's 345

Fri Jan 05, 2001 9:31 pm

I think by the middle of 2003, we may see the following routings to HKG by AC:

YVR-HKG--year-round 744 non-stop service.

YYZ-HKG--switching between A345 and 744 depending on season for non-stop flights. Ex-CP 744 will be modified with more fuel capacity as safety margin to fly YYZ-HKG non-stop on new polar route.
 
a380
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Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2000 11:51 pm

RE: AC's 345

Sat Jan 06, 2001 12:37 am

I fully agree with RayChuang.

Currently AC's YYZ-HKG route stops at YVR, a 20-hour trip on a slower A340-300! (westbound).

I want the air time to be as little as possible rather than one stop or two.
 
aca320
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RE: AC's 345

Sat Jan 06, 2001 1:39 am

Just a note on the schedule for single AOC is april 01 at which time the cdn airlines a/c will be repainted and Canadian Airlines International will cease to exsist ! it will be No More. as for the 340-500 I will check res 111 when I'm work tomorrow (supposed to have Jet Blue in for phase check) to check delivery dates and fin # it will be used yyz to hng and tokyo as much for increased cargo ability as anything else.
 
flyyul
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RE: AC's 345

Sat Jan 06, 2001 4:35 am

It appears as though there are only two cities in Canada..WHAT ABOUT YUL. I also think you all overestimate AC's performance on their YYZ-ASIA runs...Toronto-Tokyo leaves half empty all the time.

Cheers,
FLYYUL
 
slawko
Posts: 3742
Joined: Tue May 25, 1999 7:40 am

RE: AC's 345

Sat Jan 06, 2001 4:45 am

Air Canada 001 first of all does not leave half empty, but yes you are right it does not leave full from YYZ ever...there is a good reason for that, ACA001 is weight restricted....the cargo takes preferance over people. There is a lot more money to be made by shipping a few tonnes of fresh lobster. Yes YUL exists, but don't hold your breath to see AC launch a YUL-HKG or NRT if anything I would say that the A340-500 will be seen in YUL on maybe flights to Africa or India, but it will be a long time....like the 747-400 the A340-500 will be seen prdominantly in Toronto and Vancouver.
"Clive Beddoe says he favours competition, but his actions do not support that idea." Robert Milton - CEO Air Canada
 
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RayChuang
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RE: AC's 345

Sat Jan 06, 2001 4:53 am

Slawko,

I think the reason why AC chose the A345 is because this will allow AC to fly YYZ-HKG non-stop year-round with a pretty full load (remember the A345 has a LONG, LONG range). AC could fly YYZ-HKG with a full load on an A343 but that would require a technical stop in ANC for fuel.
 
slawko
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Joined: Tue May 25, 1999 7:40 am

Raychauang

Sat Jan 06, 2001 7:10 am

I was talking about FLYYUL's post about ACA001 YYZ-NRT. Not ACA009 YYZ-HKG.
"Clive Beddoe says he favours competition, but his actions do not support that idea." Robert Milton - CEO Air Canada

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