Guest

Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sat Feb 24, 2001 9:43 am

Well... As Midwest Express Airlines is getting ready to choose between Boeing 717 and Airbus equipment, an incident with a TWA 717 at MKE might mean a new customer for Airbus Industries. It has been reported to me that a TWA 717 on take off out of MKE bound for STL. on Monday had a MAJOR PROBLEM and BARELY made it back to MKE. The THRUST REVERSERS opened on TAKEOFF! MidEx is very interested in this as you can imagine. What a blow for Boeing... Especially in the backyard of an airline that was strongly considering the aircraft. I know Airbus has had problems with the A320 family, and I am sure if it was an Airbus that had a major problem at MKE like that, MidEx would be looking towards the 717. This in my opinion is a bad break for Boeing. That impression might be the one that turns them away. I love the 717, and am not bashing it, I just think this happened at the wrong place at the wrong time and you can almost guarantee youll see MidEx colors on some Airbus int he near future. I may be wrong. This has been kept from the press in MKE, so if you havent heard about it, this might be why.
 
BlatantEcho
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Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2000 10:11 am

RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sat Feb 24, 2001 9:50 am

Just curious what your source is.

The 717 would be a snap choice for them if it was assured it would grow into the 713. Because that is not a sure bet, the 318 has the growth potential that they are looking for.

BlatantEcho
They're not handing trophies out today
 
Guest

RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sat Feb 24, 2001 10:19 am

an airline worker at BAX out of MKE told me. He got the scoop.

 
deltairlines
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RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sat Feb 24, 2001 11:07 am

I would think they would still go 717, as I feel it is better suited for their ops compared to an A318/A319.

Jeff
 
KALB
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RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sat Feb 24, 2001 11:13 am

And I don't think an airline is going to make a judgement based on one adverse event, even if it did occur in their back yard. The economics of the 717 are very good, so don't count it out.
 
CactusA319
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RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sat Feb 24, 2001 11:44 am


Don't jump to conclusions.

First an investigation will have to be conducted to see what made the thrust reversers deploy on that plane. If it is found to have been a flaw on that airplane, then an inspection will probably be made on all 717's to see if they have a similar problem that could compromise the aircraft's safety. My guess is that this is just an isolated even that MidEx is not going to jump on the Airbus bandwagon because of it. At least not until there is an explanation as to what happened. So for now nothing's guaranteed.

 
Guest

RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sat Feb 24, 2001 11:47 am

Cactus, thanks for the constructive comments. I figured out most of that myself. I was just stating that 1st impression is the important one. I dont think theyll base it alone on this, but, it might have an effect.
 
BlatantEcho
Posts: 1818
Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2000 10:11 am

RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sat Feb 24, 2001 12:33 pm

Thanks for the info 757fan, I think it is just one more piece of the crazy puzzle that will lead to a big order and boost for either the 717 or the A320 family.

cheers,
BlatantEcho
They're not handing trophies out today
 
Guest

RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sat Feb 24, 2001 1:03 pm

Please, this will have no effect on a 717 order. Small incidents like this do not turn away orders.
-Tom
 
Falcon Flyer
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RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sat Feb 24, 2001 2:00 pm

767 customers weren't detered when a Lauda -300 was lost over Thailand with an airborne TR deployment. Southwest wasn't detered with the well publicized 737 rudder issue. Isolated incidents do not make or break orders.
My definition of cool ? Not trying so hard to be cool.
 
Republic
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RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sat Feb 24, 2001 10:55 pm

Hi,

When is Midwest Express expected to announce their fleet decision?

Rgds,
Joe
 
Guest

RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sun Feb 25, 2001 6:47 am

You are reading entirely too much into an incident. In early 1994, a MIDEX -930 blew a reverser and lost an engine at V1 departing out of Stapleton. 3 minutes later the aircraft was able to land safely (albeit veering off the runway). During the subsequent 3 years, MIDEX dramatically increased its fleet size with numerous DC-930s--so an incident such as the one you are reporting will not have any effect.

Before I left the company last month, there was a huge rumor that Hoeksema had gone out and inked a deal for the 717. They were just waiting for the best time to make the announcement.

However, the issue has come up about the long term viability of the 717 and its stretch variant. While the 717 is the perfect replacement for the 10s/30s, without a replacement for the MD80s, the company could be left holding the bag. Expensive lessons were learned with the Skyway fiasco over the 428, and now they are looking to bring in the Jungle Jet.

A 320 was brought in last month to the MIDEX showroom lot with the 2*3 configuration. A focus group of frequent fliers was given a grip and grin/dog and pony session to find out how they liked the dreaded middle seat. That middle seat is going to be a risk, believe it or not, but the company will only fill the seat once they book above 80% and will fold down into a desk--which is a pretty good deal, if you ask me. The middle seat didn't turn off people like you might think.

The 318/319/320 could be the answer for long term growth. A lot of Jetways will have to be re-done as they won't reach right now. Once the announcement is made, the new planes will show up in 2003 if it's the airbus and sooner if the 717.

Interestingly, there has also been a lot of talk on the 717/MD80 being around. Before I left, MIDEX was supposedly going to purchase full motion sims and become an outsource for maintenance and training on the -9/md-80 much like DL has done with the L1011. And there could be some 717s showing up on the market (on the cheap) if TWA/AA goes through.

At any rate, it will be interesting to see what the decision is next month. Based on what my old friends are telling me, the Airbus has the inside track.
 
Guest

RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sun Feb 25, 2001 10:14 am

Well, you can downplay a reverser engagement shortly after takeoff if you want. If it was mechanical, I sure hope they figure out what caused it.

 
HlywdCatft
Posts: 5232
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2001 6:21 am

RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sun Feb 25, 2001 12:23 pm

Whose to say that MidEx isn't going to get a 737-600 or 700?
 
AeroGlobeAir7
Posts: 569
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RE: Boeing 717.. Prolly Not In Midex Fleet

Sun Feb 25, 2001 12:29 pm

I don't really mind which aircraft they choose either way. I would benefit from it if they chose 717 more though, because I'm DYING to get a 717 here at MCI. If Midwest Express bought 717s they would certainly be coming to MCI since we are a secondary hub for them. Although I wouldn't mind getting some Airbus shots finally  Smile. So either way it benefits me! Although I would have to say my favorite of the two is the 717!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy