Golfhaus
Topic Author
Posts: 131
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AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 1:13 am

From our local paper:

FLIGHT MAKES EMERGENCY LANDING

By Troy Graham and Judith Malveaux
Daily Press

NEWPORT NEWS - A plane that took off from the Newport News-Williamsburg International Airport Sunday night had to turn around and make an emergency landing a short time later after passengers smelled smoke in the back of the jet. There was no fire on board and the plane's captain suspected the smell came from an overheated coffee warmer, said Jim Brown, the director of corporate communications for the airline Air Tran.

The Air Tran jet was supposed to land in Philadelphia earlier in the afternoon, but was diverted to Newport News due to bad weather and low fuel, passengers said. After refueling, the plane took off from Newport News.

"In a matter of five minutes there was some kind of smoke or fire in the back of the plane," said John Flick, a Delaware man on his way home. "I was asleep when we landed. I thought we were in Philadelphia."

A mechanic was called in to check the plane.

Passengers from the flight crowded the lobby of the airport Sunday night, contemplating whether to try another flight or take the airline's offer of pizza and a hotel room. After experiencing an emergency landing, many were unsure about flying again Sunday. No one was injured, but many of the 100 passengers on Flight 338 spent the night in Newport News.

"I know there's a lot of people who would rather stay in a hotel than go back up there," Flick said.

---

Scary moment for us at US Airways Express, as our last Philadelphia flight was delayed, and once AirTran found out, wanted to fill up our plane with their people after we had sent everyone home. The last thing we wanted was three of us to go and take 37 AirTran passengers on OUR plane. Luckily, they decided instead to take their terminator for the night, and have it run PHF-PHL-PHF. Kinda feel sorry for the ground crew, though... there were probably still there when the morning crew came in this morning.
 
NUAir
Posts: 1144
Joined: Thu Jun 08, 2000 4:24 am

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 1:19 am

It looks like the good old Value Jet I used to know is back at it. The FAA will love that one "we think it was a coffee warmer." More like the number two caught fire and fell off.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy Well safety was never Value Jet's forte let's see if they will pass on the legacy! But this little incident will cost them big time. Since now, if not already, the FAA will be all over them.

NUair
"How Many Assholes we got on this ship?" - Lord Helmet
 
Golfhaus
Topic Author
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Aug 15, 2000 2:18 pm

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 1:41 am

The sad thing was, it was not ten minutes before I climbed up into another one of their planes to have a look around, and commented that FL's Nines are better looking on the inside than US's are. I guess that would be expected, since theirs are still the mainstay of the fleet and ours are out the door, but still... guess you can't judge the quality of a plane by the seats.  Smile

What annoys me is that a plane making an emergency landing only warranted a small bit on the second page of the Local section of the paper. Grrrr.
 
Guest

RE: NUair

Tue Feb 27, 2001 1:58 am

So should the FAA be all over United because they have an emergency landing? Or is it just when an airline that used to be 'unsafe'?

How will it cost them 'big time'? It was an emergency landing. Not an accident. But as you live in the Netherlands, you should know FL more than I do. Big grin
 
AgnusBymaster
Posts: 620
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2001 8:11 am

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 2:00 am

Air Tran has the most DC-9 irregular operations of any airline. I don't believe they are safe, and would rather put up with Delta's delays than Air Tran's danger. Shut em down now!
 
Dazed767
Posts: 4967
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 11:55 am

AgnusBymaster

Tue Feb 27, 2001 2:43 am

"I don't believe they are safe"

I think they are safe, I've flown on them 6 times, and never a problem. What about them do you think isn't safe?? True, the aircraft are old, but those are being replaced anyways. Have you flown them before? Probably not, so don't knock something you haven't tried yet. I wouldn't hesitate to fly them again. People make a big deal out of little things because they've had problems in the past. What if it was a Continental jet that make the emergency landing? Nobody would make a big deal out of that.
 
User avatar
LN-MOW
Posts: 1684
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RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 3:48 am

Agnusbystander: Here speaketh the ignorant one...

Any airline bragging of flying around without having to make 'emergency landings' (I hate this expression - it is mostly as dramatic as pulling into the next service station on the freeway) are scaring me to death. It would mean that they are flying around with a lot of defective equipment.
Every airline of a major size have technical diversions daily. It's routine and a proof that they are following the safety procedures.
- I am LN-MOW, and I approve this message.
 
Guest

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 3:53 am

Hark - the teenage safety experts have spoken.
 
Boiler Special
Posts: 133
Joined: Sun Aug 20, 2000 8:23 am

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 4:24 am

Good Lord guys. Everytime AirTran makes an "emergency landing" everybody gets all over it and cries safety issues. This was just an overheated coffee warmer. No big deal!

 
CactusA319
Posts: 2821
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2000 1:51 am

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 4:26 am


Here we go again.... Insane

CactusA319
Fan of AirTran

 
Guest

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 5:37 am

My God, people, you're acting as if AirTran's entire fleet fell out of the sky at once! I hate FL as much as anyone can, and even I don't go on rants like these.

You vultures that sit out there and wait for an FL incident of any kind need to grow up and/or get a life. I don't see any of you posting things like "it'll hurt them big time" and "now they're finished" when UA or DL have emergency landings. The media needs a black sheep for the U.S. airline industry, and what better than the former ValuJet (which they so often and so unfairly refer to it as)?
 
Western737
Posts: 465
Joined: Fri May 12, 2000 5:45 am

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 6:26 am

Well, you know, there are quite numbers of people tend to get freak out over a little tiny cute thing. I guess that these kind of people need to be educated and learn what's not so bad about flying DC-3 nowday even though it has the highest numbers of crashes. Count me in with the side of people who see Valujet/AirTran as safe enough to fly.
 
BlueJet
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RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 7:52 am

I have flown AirTran, and it was fine, although I do not really like them. But all in all I would definately fly one of those old DC-9's again. 5 or 6 "emergency landings" wont scare me. They are fine...
 
KCLE
Posts: 673
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RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 10:39 am

I agree with most people on this subject. AirTran's a good airline, except they need better food, I went from CAK-MCO via ATL and they gave us Coca-Cola and little bags of party mix with the inevitable peanuts in it. If I remember, the worst problems were when the storm over Tennesee knocked the radome off the DC-9, and the other was when their prehistoric 737-200 lost hydralic pressure on the rwy. at ATL and flopped off the runway. Nobody was hurt in either accident. Even the more recent problems, people didn't get hurt. Besides, they're going to have all 717s in a few years.
 
Golfhaus
Topic Author
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Aug 15, 2000 2:18 pm

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 3:27 pm

Eh... I dunno. I still have a rather strong dislike for AirTran. Doesn't really matter to me WHAT the real vs. perceived safety record is, their staff at my station leaves a LOT to be desired. And I've heard similar stories from encounters with their staff elsewhere, too.
 
wilcharl
Posts: 1151
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2000 11:19 am

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 3:40 pm

I had an awsome flight on friday and sunday on airtran, and the friday and sunday before that and the one before that, as a matter of fact i have had wonderful flights every week on airtran for the past 3 months. Best flight attendents, landings are always greesers.
 
wilcharl
Posts: 1151
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2000 11:19 am

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 3:45 pm

An air return is not an accident...

These are accidents :

(all in the past 7 days)


NORTHWEST AIRLINES DC-9 TURNED OFF RWY 9 TO TAXIWAY B AND SLID OFF
TAXIWAY INTO THE MUD, 70 PAX ON BOARD, FLINT, MI

UNITED 1763, N302UA, BOEING 737, ON FLIGHT FROM ATLANTA TO DENVER
STRUCK TAIL ON LANDING RWY 17R, SUBSTANTIAL DAMAGE, NO INJURIES,
DENVER, CO
PAN AMERICAN AIRWAYS BOEING 727 ON FERRY FLIGHT SUFFERED LEFT WING
DAMAGE AFTER A MISSED APPROACH, ORLANDO, FL
 
exusair
Posts: 658
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2000 12:15 am

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 4:04 pm

Pizza and a hotel room....hmmm...Throw in some peperoni and mushrooms and you've got a repeat customer! This is at least the 2nd FL smoke incident this year. The first one burned a hole in the side of a DC-9 and it's still sitting on the south ramp at ATL, right next to the 737-200 that ran off the runway and has been picked apart. They are either in the midst of a string of bad luck ( a la USAir through the late 80's and early 90's) or there is something seriously wrong with their DC-9 fleet.
 
Guest

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 7:30 pm

uh Exusair, that incident was the first this year, as the last accident was back in Oct/Nov.

And Golfhaus: I remember being treated like sh*t a couple years ago on a Piedmont(USX) flight. So does that mean they have a bad safety record?

>>Doesn't really matter to me WHAT the real vs. perceived safety record is, their staff at my station leaves a LOT to be desired. <<
 
NUAir
Posts: 1144
Joined: Thu Jun 08, 2000 4:24 am

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 9:22 pm

OK my original comment was meant to be aimed at the shady company they were subcontracting to to do maintenance work that failed to meet FAA standards. And as far as the DC-9's my friend works maintenance over at MEH and can back me up when I say the FAA is very cautious on the DC-9's because of recent issues do to decaying wires, and other such problems (I'm no expert, but you can check the FAA and look at DC-9 info). Anyway the DC-9's are getting a lot of attention (is it deserved? I don't know) but this incident with AirTran won't help the situation and will only make it worse for them (more so the maintenance company) until they get the 717's. I did fly Value jet frequently when I was living in the states but have never had the chance to fly AirTran, so Golfhaus you are right I have nothing to complain about. But I wouldn't call smoke on bored a routine safety matter, it didn't take much more to bring the Valuejet flight into the everglades.

And of course every airline has it's problems. Just the other week we had some KLM ramp agents drive a staircase right into the wing of a 737, needless to say the fire squad had to be called in to make sure the plane didn't explode when they pulled it out, but it was a good 2 feet in and ruptured the main fuel tank.
But when your the FAA and you have two airlines one, let's say United, who flys a few thousand flights a day and has a few incidents and one, Airtran who flys like 50-100 flights a day? , and has a few incidents. Who are you going to check more carefully? And add to it the fact that the second airline is charging less then Grayhound and is using equipment just as old.

NUair
"How Many Assholes we got on this ship?" - Lord Helmet
 
Guest

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Tue Feb 27, 2001 9:27 pm

AirTran has 2158 flights/week NU air, which is about 309/day, not 50-100.
 
nwa747-400
Posts: 1325
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2000 2:54 am

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Wed Feb 28, 2001 12:44 am

As per the NTSB, an accident is defined as when:

An aircraft receives substantial damage
Occupants (passengers or crew) are seriously injured or killed

 
Golfhaus
Topic Author
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Aug 15, 2000 2:18 pm

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Wed Feb 28, 2001 2:02 am

Lowfareair, I'm not trying to draw a correlation between the lack of professionalism of the staff and a safety record. I'm just saying I don't like AirTran, period, for a number of reasons. I don't like the color of their planes. I don't like how their agents yell so loud you can hear them 50 feet down the terminal. I don't like how their passengers always assume that all airlines are the same and they can come to my counter to check in because they don't want to wait in the AirTran line. I don't like how AirTran doesn't provide luggage ID tags so they all come over to try to take ours.

AirTran is the next door neighbor that doesn't cut their grass and lets their kids play in your front yard without asking.
 
wilcharl
Posts: 1151
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2000 11:19 am

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Wed Feb 28, 2001 4:50 am

I dont like USAir..... I dont like how the last time i flew them, a loose inspection plate on the wing was ratteling loose the entire light and i was brushed off when i told the agent (i did not see mx or the flt crew anywhere) I dont like the color of their planes, blue-black ick and metrojet red ick) I dont like the way they treat their customers in ATL, they seam to have a no care attitude, my 85 year old grandmother flew them, and I went to the customer service counter and went to inform them that she would be on the plane and she would need a wheel chair etc.... he brushed it off and said im sure its been taken care of and was rude about it... Ive always beleived in treating other airline employees as they were your own, but I didnt even get the resepct i would think any customer deserved. I love Airtran's orlando terminal, I love the setup with the digital signs, the art work the marble floors, I love the professionalism of their agents etc... My point? i guess i dont have one, other then everyone is entitled to their opinon Golfhaus has a right to not liking FL and I have one to not liking US anyways

 
Frostbite
Posts: 213
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2001 4:31 am

RE: Damaged FL 737 In ATL

Wed Feb 28, 2001 6:24 am

FYI for any of you living/travelling through ATL. The Air Tran 737 that slid off the runway awhile back can be seen collecting rust between the Northwest Airlines hangar and South Cargo buildings on the south side of the airport. It's no longer in Air Tran colors, just an anonymous hulk minus quite a few parts. Last I saw it one of the rear cabin doors was wide open to the weather. I doubt it will ever fly again.
 
me
Posts: 220
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2000 4:57 am

RE: Damaged FL 737 In ATL

Wed Feb 28, 2001 6:50 am

The damaged 737 is now the insurance companys problem. Boeing looked it over and declared it a total loss.

I fly AirTran DC-9's more than anyone in this forum (I'm a Captain based in ATL). If I thought my job was the least bit unsafe I'd quit tomorrow to do something safer, like maybe become a smoke jumper or offshore fisherman.

Get real folks, if you don't like AirTran, don't fly AirTran. Just be ready for the 600% fare increase when we drop that market.
 
travatl
Posts: 1943
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2001 4:57 pm

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Sat Mar 03, 2001 6:54 pm

As an AirTran employee (working on my 6th year there), I must adamantly defend the safety of this carrier. The airline and it's employees are dedicated to operating a safe operation, every flight, every day.

That said, I must agree with Golfhaus's following statement:

'AirTran is the next door neighbor that doesn't cut their grass and lets their kids play in your front yard without asking.'

When our airline runs well, we offer a great product at a great rate. But unfortunately, management has simply not set the carrier up to run in the face of operational adversity. If any variable is changed (i.e. weather, maintenance, over bookings, gate congestion)...we do unfortunately fall on our face, and a huge disservice is done to the passenger. Luckily, we have an excellent "Customer Recovery" team in our customer relations department.

AirTran's management, however, must understand, you can only aggravate a bad situation so long, before people quit forgetting. I have time and time again watched as our ground crews have raced around in out stations to borrow ground equipment and other "basic" tools needed to meet the expectations of the company and it's passengers when faced with irregular ops. Blame our management.

But understand, the bulk of this carrier is comprised of 4,000 professionals committed to providing a quality product at the highest levels of safety. It is for that reason (despite our management) that this carrier, in a year that has seen almost every other airline's revenues slow, weaken, or fall, consistenly posted load factors and revenues that were all-time highs in our history. Obviously, people are not afraid to fly AirTran.
 
Golfhaus
Topic Author
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Aug 15, 2000 2:18 pm

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 04, 2001 1:13 am

Travatl,

How interesting to see an AirTran employee agree with my statement, when so many of the folks here accuse any critic of FL as being a Delta crony. Perhaps part of my lenghty list of gripes comes from the fact that I see the "operational adveristy" occur so often. I suppose a lot of that adversity comes from hubbing in ATL, where the congestion causes frequent problems, especially during thunderstorm season.

Just the other day, the afternoon flight to Atlanta was delayed, and I heard an announcement about it while I was in the restaurant getting lunch. The gist of the announcement was, "This flight is delayed. There is an air traffic hold into Atlanta, and we're not allowed to leave until 4:00. We have checked the connections and they are secure, all the flights out of Atlanta are delayed, too. Please do not approach the gate area. We will keep you informed." The first few times I heard them say "please do not approach the gate," I was beside myself. But it's become routine.

I can also vouch for FL borrowing equipment. We have a set of air stairs to take jets, although the only time we would take them is as a diversion and we haven't had one since November 1999. AirTran has one gate, one jetway, and no air stairs. So in those situations where they have two aircraft on the ground (as they did the night of the emergency landing), they either rely on the built in stairs, or if those aren't working, grab our air stairs. It's a simple case of an unexpected occurance - two DC-9s on the ground simultaneously - and they're unprepared to handle it.

Does AirTran still offer a free ONE-WAY ticket to passengers who volunteer to give up their seat in the event of an oversale? What's up with that?

To their credit, the seats in the DC9 I saw looked brand new, and I saw the flight attendants doing a lot more to prepare their plane for passengers than our FAs do. And I accept that maybe our station is an exception. But all it takes is one incident to forever change one's perception about an airline, and I've seen a lot of little things about our next door neighbor.
 
Guest

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 04, 2001 2:03 am

My airline flys brand new CRJs (worthless piece of metal from north of the border). From time to time we have diversions because of mechanical malfunctions. It is not out of the norm. I don't think its fair to say that Air Tran is unsafe because they decide to divert. I think rather the actions of the crew shows safety is paramount. I have jumpseated in Air Tran and the crew on that flight was very experienced (Capt was ex Eastern, FO was Capt from Comair). I think Air Tran really took a beating, more than majors because of their low cost image. It is not fair to harp on Air Tran constantly for things that happens to any other airline. With 717s I think they will one day be on par with Southwest.
 
travatl
Posts: 1943
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2001 4:57 pm

RE: AirTran AC Makes Emergency Landing

Sun Mar 04, 2001 1:34 pm

Golfhaus -

I know....I know....I know. Trust me the frustrations at the PHF station are beyond reproach. (One reason I don't fly there anymore - that and I work the 717 only these days). It used to be a great station for us....but when the local management changed, it really went to gunk. Despite what you've seen at the local level there, be assured the majority of us really do strive meet industry standard.

Thanks for your honest comments.

Travis