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DL European Flights From BOS

Tue Feb 27, 2001 5:13 am

With the start of BOS-LGW service, what's the next move for Delta? Will they start additional service to Europe? To where? Thanks.
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RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Tue Feb 27, 2001 6:02 am

They fly daily CDG-BOS on DL 8258 with a 767.
I hope they will expand their European route and bring the triple seven to BOS.

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RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Tue Feb 27, 2001 6:10 am

DL8258 is simply Delta code for a codeshare flight operated by Air France.

I don't think we're likely to see anything big in BOS in the future, except maybe BOS-CDG, also on the 767-300.

I do think it would be cool to see Delta start service to the CDG superhub on Delta equipment from all of the non-hub cities with major operations... i.e. MCO, LAX, SFO, BOS.

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RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Tue Feb 27, 2001 7:28 am

Delta has two daily flights to/from CDG, both opb Air France. I remember reading the Boston Globe a year ago that Delta would start with LGW, then go to CDG, FRA, FCO, DUB, and MAN from Boston.

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RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Tue Feb 27, 2001 7:34 am

After London, the European traffic from/to Boston falls off sharply. I would think Ireland might be worth a shot, having been on Aer Lingus' packed A330s a few times. Generally, however, there are no real obvious 'other' cities that could support daily nonstop service through the lean winter months. Paris, right now, has alot of lift with two AF 763s and American's one 763. I would like to think someday, some carrier will finally launch nonstop Boston-Narita service. There have been several abortive attempts at launching this route, but since it's pretty much a 'high-tech' run, the economy has to be going in the right direction for a route like that to work. It appears, though, that the economy is going the wrong way for that to happen.

The question I have is whether Delta will retain this Gatwick flight after the peak summer season. That really is the barometer. It's comparably easy to field a profitable European route in the summer months. This flight will be the continuation of existing DL 767-300 service between Boston and Los Angeles. But with all the nonstops between LAX-LHR, I'm not sure how many LAX-bound or LAX-originating people will opt for this service. Boston will have to carry this route on its own shoulders; connecting traffic from other cities with be slim.
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RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Tue Feb 27, 2001 8:31 am

I read in a news release several years ago that Delta is interested in serving Manchester, Frankfurt, Rome, Paris, Dublin, and Zurich from Boston. Several more domestic flights will be launched, too, probably to places like San Francisco and Denver.
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RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Tue Feb 27, 2001 8:43 am

Remember reading the same article. However, I would be surprised if they started MAN service from BOS considering they recently dropped it from JFK.
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RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Tue Feb 27, 2001 10:09 am

Delta should be careful operating the flight with the same plane LAX-BOS-LGW and return because it offers more chances for the flights to be delayed.

I remember NW used to run a DC10 from MSP-BOS-AMS and return as flight 38 but they stopped and just made two seperate flights because if 38 was delayed out of MSP it delayed the AMS flight to often. Typically there is more ground time when the plane comes in from Europe and goes back than when the plane continues on.
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RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Tue Feb 27, 2001 11:24 am

Yes, typical procedure I believe would be to empty out the arriving 767-300 from London at Terminal E (International Arrivals) and then tow the aircraft over to Delta's main gates for the departure to Los Angeles. This can be done easily, since there is at least a couple of hours between when the plane comes in from LGW and when it goes on to LAX. On the eastbound run, the plane from LAX can come in and then go on to LGW from the same Delta gate since no customs/immigration are needed. And since the flight from LAX to Boston is basically getting pushed by the jetstream, even a late departure from LAX can, to a degree, be made up along the way.
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RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Tue Feb 27, 2001 9:47 pm

Several US airlines have tried to make BOS a hub for European departures (Pan Am in the 70s, Braniff and Northwest in the 80s) and none have been really successful. Boston is too far from the center of the country to be a real hub throughout the entire day, and trying to hub just for a series of early evening European departures requires too much staffing for too little revenue. The local population is enough to sustain the services by the European airlines, but adding an additional Delta flight to each of those destinations would probably be difficult to fill except with deep discounting. I suppose Delta could try to drive the Europeans out by giving them some heavy competition, but that is against the idea of partnership. And as someone has pointed out, traffic falls off considerably after summer, and deep (almost rediculous) discounting takes over (the Boston-London fare has reached as low as < $100 the past couple of winters).
El Al 001
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RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Wed Feb 28, 2001 12:59 am

I dont remember when and where, but i saw something about DL opening a mini hub at BOS to start services to Europe with many 757 departures a day.
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RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Wed Feb 28, 2001 2:21 am

Well, El Al 001, I still don't see how they can succeed. I mean, Swissair, Lufthansa, Sabena, Aer Lingus, Alitalia, etc. all fly why would people be attracted by a DL757 (unless they are going for the miles)? I guess DL could be planning on cities that have no current service from BOS, but maybe there is a reason why the foreign airlines have not already initiated such services (i.e., not enough potential traffic). I just fear that DL will get into the same problem that Pan Am did: lots of flights to Europe, but very little revenue because of the low fare structure. When Pan Am sold its Pacific routes to United, I remember someone standing up at a stockholders' meeting and telling them they should have sold the Atlantic routes instead. I wish DL well, but I don't think such a move would be successful.

RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Wed Feb 28, 2001 2:35 am

Delta has no plans for Int'l 757's. Nice rumor though.

As far as service from BOS is concerned, think about it logically:

Delta is committed to the CDG hub. Any destinations from BOS need to be to destinations where connecting across CDG doesn't make sense.

For example, BOS to FCO doesn't seem viable when there is an easy connection via BOS-CDG-FCO.

However, markets like SNN, DUB, MAN and maybe even AMS make sense as no one wants to fly to CDG to connect backwards.

So, even though I don't know what Delta's plans are, I'm willing to bet that only a few Int'l cities ever see direct service by Delta from BOS.
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RE: DL European Flights From BOS

Wed Feb 28, 2001 2:54 am

Creating a mini-hub at Boston really doesn't seem to make much sense for Delta unless/until capacity at JFK has been maxed out. Remember that they have publicly committed to a large expansion of service at JFK and that they are the largest transatlantic carrier at JFK (I also believe they go to more destinations in Europe than CO from EWR, but I'm not sure who has more capacity... Setting up connections at BOS to Europe overflies the JFK hub which, to me, would seem counterproductive.

London is by far the largest European market from Boston, but I do wonder how they will manage to fill up those 767s in the off-season. They will probably get some Delta FF members which currently use UA, AA, BA, or VS, but is that enough to fill the plane? And I can't imagine that one-stop service via Boston to Gatwick is particularly appealing to passengers in Los Angeles unless they're hell-bent on picking up SkyMiles. Especially with the Terminal E to Terminal C shuffle (try it in February some time).

If they add a CDG flight, they'd be competing with AF (and potentially US/UA). Most of the other European markets are a *lot* smaller and I doubt there's room for two daily flights (DL and the European carrier). Maybe BRU if Sabena does go belly-up.

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