Ezra
Topic Author
Posts: 474
Joined: Fri Mar 31, 2000 8:21 am

UA In MIA

Sun Mar 11, 2001 3:37 pm

Hi All,

I noticed on United's route map that they serve at least four major Latin American destinations from Miami: Buenos Aires, Sao Paulo, Rio, and Caracas. This is surprising to me, as I always believed that AA "owned" Latin American ops from MIA. How does UA do on these routes? Do they have a lot of feed into MIA, or are there enough O/D pax to justify the overlap with AA? MIA seems like an odd place for United to operate from as it is far removed from its hub structure.

Thanks for sharing your insights.

Ezra.
 
ILUV767
Posts: 3035
Joined: Mon May 29, 2000 2:21 pm

RE: UA In MIA

Sun Mar 11, 2001 4:31 pm

There is a lot of domestic feed into MIA on the United System. Most of those flights come from other hubs. At United, all of our South American destinations are served from MIA, so if you need to go to South America, you have a very very good chance of being routed through MIA.

Hope that helps.

flyU N I T E D
 
klwright69
Posts: 2313
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2000 4:22 am

RE: UA In MIA

Sun Mar 11, 2001 6:56 pm

These routes were acquired by UA from PA some years ago when PA operated them out of MIA. AA does pretty much "own" MIA, but these routes are strong enough and UA is big enough that their hubs provide good feed as ILUV767.

After the PA latin route acquisition, UA rivaled AA to South America. Since then however, CO and DL have come along and pushed UA to the role of a minor player in the region.

Yes, "all of them" are served from MIA. Unfortunately, compared with their competitors, "all of them" doesn't really mean that many. No BOG, LIM, UIO, etc. etc.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24519
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 2:27 am

DL does not serve that many Latin destinations, but the ones they do, all out of MIA, are the big ones (Sao Paulo, Rio, Santiago, and Caracas are the big ones). A new 28-gate United hub is being built at MIA. It will be for United domestic and international flights and StarAlliance partners. United has a "mini-hub" at MIA, that works sort of like Iberia's Miami hub. They fly passengers in for thier other major hubs(SFO, DEN, ORD, etc.; there are daily ORD and LAX flights on a 772) to all connect in MIA, the same way Iberia flies all it's passengers in Europe to MAD to connect to MIA were they connect to Latin destinations (Mexico and Central American only).
a.
 
chepos
Posts: 5932
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 9:40 am

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 2:37 am

Yes there is anyway sufficient O/D passenger traffis on the routes to Rio, Sao , Buenos Aires Santiago and Caracas . By the way Unitred a couple of years ago operated a SJU-MIA flight but they pushed out . I dont get it there is a big need for this flight as the moment were there loads bad on this flight?????
Chepos
Puerto Rico
Fly the Flag!!!!
 
nickofatlanta
Posts: 1272
Joined: Tue May 23, 2000 1:06 am

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 3:17 am

UA also operated to LIM up until a couple of years ago. CO and DL really will surpass UA in the region when they start their EZE flights later this year.

UA does have some non-hub feed flights into MIA: ATL, LGA to name but a few.
 
Guest

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 3:29 am

Mark, I believe you mean UA, not DL.
 
flyguy1
Posts: 1660
Joined: Wed Jun 23, 1999 9:45 am

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 3:37 am

UA also flies N/S from JFK, and ORD to EZE, GRU.
727, L1011, MD80, A300, 777-200, 737-300, 737-700, 747-400, 757-200, 737-800, A320. E190, E135, 767-200, CRJ9
 
imkeww
Posts: 676
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2001 1:48 am

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 5:41 am

UA is still significantly larger than DL to LatAm.
 
DL WIDGET HEAD
Posts: 1469
Joined: Wed Apr 12, 2000 8:18 am

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 6:50 am

I don't think UA is significantly bigger than DL to South America maybe only just if even.
As of April 1, 2001 DL has the following nonstops to South America:
ATL-EZE--MD11
ATL-GIG--767-300ER
ATL-GRU--MD11
ATL-SCL--767-300ER
ATL-LIM--757
ATL-CCS--737-800
ATL-BOG--757
And if you consider Panama part of South America (some do)
ATL-PTY--737-800
That's quite a lot of lift. What nonstops and how many does UA offer to South America?
 
ishky15
Posts: 706
Joined: Tue May 30, 2000 12:02 am

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 6:55 am

United flies the following routes to South America, all daily:
Miami-Buenos Aires 777-200
New York- Buenos Aires 767-300
Chicago-Buenos Aires-Montevideo 767-300
Miami-Rio de Janeiro 767-300
Chicago-Sao Paulo 767-300
New York-Sao Paulo-Rio de Janeiro 767-300
Miami-Sao Paulo 777-200
Miami-Santiago 767-300/777-200
Miami-Caracas Airbus 320

 
MAH4546
Posts: 24519
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 7:15 am

It should be noted that UA's five MIA Latin routes are also the BIG FIVE. Sao Paulo, Rio, Caracas, Santiago, and Buenos Aires are the five big Latin destinations. Very popular routes with a lot of compietion. MIA-CCS alone is served with 8 dailies (and 69 weekly) on AA, LA, UA, VC, and VH. I always though of DL as a larger operater to LA, though. The big advantage that UA has is it's hub at MIA. As much as ATL and Delta and IAH and Continental try, no airport or airline will ever replace MIA and American as the Gateway to Latin America and the Airline of Latin America. I wonder if UA will expand thier operations when thier new Miami terminal is complete.
a.
 
DL WIDGET HEAD
Posts: 1469
Joined: Wed Apr 12, 2000 8:18 am

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 7:19 am

What MIA terminal are you talking about? I have not heard that UA and their partners are building a new 28 gate terminal at MIA. Where on the airport is it being built? Is it going to be Concourse J?
 
klwright69
Posts: 2313
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2000 4:22 am

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 9:42 am

Mah4546, since UA has such a big advantage over DL and CO due to their "MIA hub," why did UA pull out of LIM? PTY (long ago)? That's an ingenious strategy, ignore an entire continent except for five cities and let the competition make inroads everywhere else.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24519
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 12:35 pm

DL, yes, it is Concourse J I believe. 28 gates. All will be used exclusively by United and Star Alliance partners, while the new 58 gate American Airlines/Iberia hub is for AA, Americna Eagle, IB, and OneWorld partners (although there probably won't be enough room for all OneWorld flights to depart from the AA terminal).

Klm UA pulled out of LIM and PTY because they grew too fast. You can't just say "Okay, we're starting a Latin hub in Miami, let's go". They expanded too fast for thier own good. They were not established in the Latin market like American Airlines, Iberia Airlines of Spain, and LanChile (which also serves routes to Ecuador and Peru from Miami, and they used to codeshare with QA on MIA-SCL-SYD, but I think that QA now does it only with AA on MIA-LAX-SYD). As time goes on, they can become an established airline to Latin America from MIA. Things take time, and any airline fan should know that.
a.
 
Ezra
Topic Author
Posts: 474
Joined: Fri Mar 31, 2000 8:21 am

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 1:07 pm

Thanks for all the responses, guys!
Ezra.
 
doug
Posts: 699
Joined: Thu Jul 22, 1999 8:54 am

RE: UA In MIA

Mon Mar 12, 2001 4:01 pm

DL,UA and CO will not overtake AA on the Latin and South American routes.CO is the 2nd major player but AA dominates the market.The United (and partners)concourse will be concourse J in Miami with 17 gates.
 
dfw-man
Posts: 166
Joined: Tue Jul 27, 1999 5:19 am

Nickofatlanta

Tue Mar 13, 2001 12:21 am

NickofAtlanta says that CO and DL will surpass AA in the region,,,,,are you joking or what?How did you come up with that theory?AA has more flights to the region and carries more pax to the region than any other airline to Latin and South America.
 
nickofatlanta
Posts: 1272
Joined: Tue May 23, 2000 1:06 am

RE: Dfw-Man

Tue Mar 13, 2001 12:26 am

DFW-man:

You may want to reread my post. I said that CO and DL may pass UNITED in the region.
 
dfw-man
Posts: 166
Joined: Tue Jul 27, 1999 5:19 am

RE: UA In MIA

Tue Mar 13, 2001 12:41 am

No problem,,,,just misinterpeted what you said NickofAtlanta.

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