Early Air
Topic Author
Posts: 624
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2001 6:53 am

Delta's New Narrow Seats

Fri Apr 06, 2001 11:07 pm

I do not know if all of you have heard, but Delta is not installing new NARROW seats on their 767-400's, these seats are more narrow than the normal coach seat of the 767-400. I think only one of the 767-400's have them now but much more will have them in the near future, and then all of them. Below are some pictures of the new Delta 767-400 economy class seat.

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Ryan Gaddis



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Ryan Gaddis



Why in the world would Delta make their seats narrower? What do they get out of this, they did not add in an extra seat abrest, they just made the seats narrower. Mabye this makes the asiles a little bit wider, but wode aisles do not make up for narrow seats. Os their anyone who knows more about this and why Delta has done this? What are all of your opinions?

Rgds,
Early Air
 
N312RC
Posts: 2584
Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2000 10:58 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Fri Apr 06, 2001 11:11 pm

Is Delta putting PTV's in coach in the 764s?
N/A
 
Early Air
Topic Author
Posts: 624
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2001 6:53 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Fri Apr 06, 2001 11:14 pm

I think they are going to in the future.

Rgds,
Early Air
 
ana767
Posts: 138
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2000 10:50 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Fri Apr 06, 2001 11:18 pm

The way I understand it, the seat cushions aren't narrower, the seat backs are. These slim-line seats give passengers a little more leg room without actually decreasing the number of seats in the plane. Has anyone actually sat in on of these seats? Can you tell the difference?
 
Early Air
Topic Author
Posts: 624
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2001 6:53 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Fri Apr 06, 2001 11:21 pm

So do you mean they made the seat back thinner?

Rgds,
Early Air
 
caetravlr
Posts: 856
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 8:19 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Fri Apr 06, 2001 11:24 pm

My understanding was that there was a lack of legroom because the seatback cushions were too thick. They also had to change out the way that the F/A call buttons were set into the armrest, because they kept getting hit by people's elbows all the time. I hope that the one that I am going on to HNL has the new seating installed. It is actually supposed to give you more personal space. There is no reason to go in and put narrower seats in if you are not adding one more abreast. I hope to God that the 767 never has more than 2-3-2 in coach!
A woman drove me to drink and I didn't have the decency to thank her. - W.C. Fields
 
DeltaSFO
Posts: 2407
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2000 11:22 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Fri Apr 06, 2001 11:27 pm

Why in the world would Delta make their seats narrower? What do they get out of this, they did not add in an extra seat abrest, they just made the seats narrower. Mabye this makes the asiles a little bit wider, but wode aisles do not make up for narrow seats. Os their anyone who knows more about this and why Delta has done this? What are all of your opinions?

Rgds,
Early Air


Help me Jesus.

DeltaSFO
It's a new day. Every moment matters. Now, more than ever.
 
EIPremier
Posts: 1462
Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2000 8:17 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Fri Apr 06, 2001 11:30 pm

The seats aren't narrower, at least not to my knowledge. However, the seatbacks are thinner. The main advantage to thin seats is that they are lighter in weight, which is beneficial for obvious reasons.

To be honest, I can't imagine most passengers will notice any more legroom with these new seats. They don't really look that much thinner than the old ones.

 
Bryston
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2001 5:46 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 12:02 am

I don`t know the thruth of this, but I heard that the FAA was thinking of changing the standards for seat width, because the average north-american is fatter.

Is it true? Does anybody heard that? I don`t even know for sure if there`s such a standard...

Bryston
I'd rather be flying...
 
N863DA
Posts: 1140
Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2004 6:36 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 12:16 am

People, PEOPLE!

The new 'narrower' seats have NOTHING to do with the width from side to side of the seats.

As described about a million times in the past and even in the captions for the photos, the seat BACK is narrower - or thinner if your english is limited - so that there is more space between seats, without having to readjust the seat-pitch. The new seats apparently are noticeably more comfortable.... not hard on the pitch on the 777.

And for what it's worth, the UK charter airlines fly 767-300s & -200s with a 2-4-2 configuration....

FLY DELTA JETS and sail UNITED STATES LINES



N 8 6 3 D A
 
woodsboy
Posts: 899
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2000 5:59 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 1:04 am

The only experience I have had with these new "slimline" seats are on Alaska Airlines where they have them outfiteed on all new 737-700s and are retrofitting them to the -400s during c/d checks. Since Alaska jets dont have any in flight entertainment or stereo connections the armrests are much smaller and totally flimsy. The whole seat-back can flip forward and will at the slightest touch, the feel like the cheapest cardboard trash they could find which I am sure they were. These Delta seats look somewhat more substantial than the ones on Alaska.

One more thing, if they arent trying to add an additional seat, I can assure you the new seats arent any narrower- less bulky, yes! Narrower, no!
 
flashmeister
Posts: 2671
Joined: Fri Apr 28, 2000 4:32 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 1:10 am

CO had slimline seats in a 757 I flew on earlier this year... I found them less comfortable, not because they were any different in dimensions, but the cushions seemed cheap. I could easily feel the 'innards' of the seat. It wasn't awful, but it wasn't great, either...
 
RIX
Posts: 1589
Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2000 4:46 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 1:11 am

Well, I'm quite confused... The question was about NARROWER seats. Then it was said that only seatbacks are NARROWER, not the seats (still OK). Then suddenly a word THINNER appeared with the explanations about seat pitch, weight, ... It is OK too but it has NOTHING to do with NARROWER - my English is probably rather limited (at least it is not my native language), but "narrower" and "thinner" are different things! The first means "less WIDE", and that was the point of the topic, while the second means "less THICK", which was about legroom, ... So, OK, the seatbacks are THINNER, but are they NARROWER? And so, are the seats NARROWER? For me they look to be of the standard width while the seatbacks are narrower (nothing wrong for the passenger comfort), but it has nothing to do with legroom, seat pitch...
 
GOT
Posts: 1843
Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2000 6:44 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 1:13 am

With narrower seats the might squezze in a few more seats making more money.

GOT
Just like birdwatching - without having to be so damned quiet!
 
BostonBeau
Posts: 480
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2000 11:55 pm

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 1:15 am

Is it ALL the seats? I know the seats at the REAR of some B767 and B777 aircraft on some airlines are a bit narrower...so that the same number of seats across can be preserved for a few more rows as the fuselage begins to taper.
 
Guest

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 1:27 am

Delta must not care mutch about there passenger! I hope they do! They look like a good airline, they have a nice hub airport! (I have never flown Delta)
 
Guest

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 1:32 am

Dear Early Air,

Please be assured that we at Delta Air Lines take your comments seriously. We are continually striving to produce a more streamlined operation and to reduce our operating costs to 7.5.... oops, I didn't say that did I? Scratch that. Nope, definitely not me who said that. Whew.

As you may be aware, Delta Air Lines continues to transfer our remaining L-1011 Tristars to our newly formed, low cost "Delta Pacific" subsidiary to be based out of our new hubs in Mojave and Victorville. These aircraft continue to be replaced by the new Boeing 767-400 aircraft.

Early Air, in response to the overwhelming outpouring of concern over these developments, we at Delta Air Lines have decided to offer a service enchancement to our valued customers who travel on the Boeing 767-400. In keeping with the spirit of the Tristar, we will be installing traditional 9 abreast seating on these new aircraft in a standard 2-5-2 configuration. Our valued passengers on "L" and "U" fares are welcome to avail of this new expanded center section. This entire process will begin once the new narrower seats are installed.

Sincerely,
Your Friendly Uncle Leo
 
exusair
Posts: 658
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2000 12:15 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 2:50 am

Thank you Uncle Leo, and by the way excellent choice of colors for our new uniforms. The paper mache material that you selected for our shirts make it impossible for me to launder these shirts and forces me to use the dry cleaners to make the shirts at least presentable. After all our goal is to be #1 in the eyes of our customers, and I can't do that in a wrinkled shirt!

Also Uncle Leo, thanks for removing my $15.00 a month dry cleaning allotment. Since I get paid a meager pittance for my job, losing an extra $15.00 has surely impacted my budget. I find I cannot pay union dues and pay for dry cleaning if a union were indeed voted in by my peers. I vote no because I can't afford extra starch on my shirts and feed myself within my budget.

As for the seats, I have sat in them and there is a difference that is noticeble. First of all the "gong show" that we have experienced on the flights where the call light button was on the armrest drastically dissapears with the new seats. The seats are slimmer, but there is no compromise in inseat comfort. They are doing this because of the numerous complaints by passengers. Months of input by flight crews had nothing to do with the seating changes.

The seats are not slim enough to provide for extra rows of seats. There are already enough people crammed into that airplane.

P.S. Uncle Leo, I look forward to DL stock hitting $35.00 a share so that any Johnny come lately with $3 billion can buy us out and you can finally escape this nasty airline business and go back to utilities with the money you and your executive friends have looted from the company coffers.
 
Guest

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 2:53 am

I hope they fly it to LHR.

Nigel
 
Logos
Posts: 606
Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2000 10:47 pm

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 3:39 am

Thank you, Uncle Leo, for bringing sanity to this rather hysterical thread.

DeltaSFO, you have my empathy.

Cheers,
Dave in Berlin
Too many types flown to list
 
Early Air
Topic Author
Posts: 624
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2001 6:53 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 5:10 am

I am sorry for the spelling errors DeltaSFO. I was in a rush at the time.

I think the armrest thing is a good idea on the behalf of Delta. However, I think makeing the seatback thinner is a waste of money. No one will even notice the difference.

Rgds,
Early Air
 
Guest

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 5:16 am

Hey DeltaSFO - I think his new response is beyond even Jesus. Maybe a Sk***am-type alliance of Jesus, Allah and the Buddha might work though, with some of the Hindu gods thrown in as codeshare partners.  Smile
 
caetravlr
Posts: 856
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 8:19 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 5:46 am

Early Air,

Did you not look at the larger image, and read the caption by the author of the picture? He said himself that it felt like more legroom. Even an inch or so can make a pretty decent difference. I was actually glad that someone posted something that brought my attention to a picture of the new seats in coach. I wanted to see them, as I will be sitting in the coach cabin of a 764 for a very long time later this month. As far as how the word "narrower" was used, it is all Semantics. A seatback that takes up less space leaves more room, a little math and physics lesson for you guys. As well, that little bit across that many seats, does save a little fuel burn, I promise.

As for the disgruntled employee and Uncle Leo posts going back and forth, I have one question. Why? This is a post about seats on an aircraft, nothing more.
A woman drove me to drink and I didn't have the decency to thank her. - W.C. Fields
 
mikeymike
Posts: 402
Joined: Thu May 18, 2000 6:52 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 6:05 am

Delta slimmed the seat back by three inches, rotated the PCU (Passenger Control Unit) from top-mounted to side mounted which in turn narrowed the armrest and gave back a half inch of width to each pax place, re-orientated the AVU box underneath the seat to give back more underseat stowage and increased the pitch in 12 seat locations by 1".

There are currently 8 aircraft retrofitted.

Any questions?

Ciao,
Mikeymike
 
imkeww
Posts: 676
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2001 1:48 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 7:36 am

These look awesome and comfy, unlike AA's new recaro slimline seats which are terribly flimsy and feel like 1" cardboard!

WTG Delta! Woohoo
 
jaysit
Posts: 10186
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2000 11:50 pm

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 9:07 am

Look...
Do you want more legroom or do you want plush fat seats? Jesus, this is coach in the year 2001. The hysteria surrounding seats that to you appear "flimsy and like cardboard" is mindboggling. Those seats have been designed to withstand the weight of a 200 lb+ man's butt for 12 hours - multiple times. They're not flimsy and theyre not made of cardboard.
If you want a plush seat that looks like something Marie Antoinette slouched in and ate cake, fly First Class.
Atheism is Myth Understood.
 
chepos
Posts: 5932
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 9:40 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 9:26 am

In my opinion these seats look very comfortable . Especially the leather headrest part . And apparently a little more legroom is offered and belive me an 1" does make a difference.
Chepos
Puerto Rico
Fly the Flag!!!!
 
DeltaSFO
Posts: 2407
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2000 11:22 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 9:39 am

These look awesome and comfy, unlike AA's new recaro slimline seats which are terribly flimsy and feel like 1" cardboard!

WTG Delta! Woohoo


Well, we must be doing something right, since we've carried more passengers than any airline in the world for quite awhile.

Take that!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

DeltaSFO
It's a new day. Every moment matters. Now, more than ever.
 
MD-90
Posts: 7835
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2000 12:45 pm

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 11:55 am

Comair's CRJ seats seem to be thinner than the mainline Delta seats (older 737s and MD-88s). I thought they were more comfortable than even the MD-88's seats.
 
CVG777
Posts: 1211
Joined: Tue May 02, 2000 6:42 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 12:37 pm

Last week I think I was on an aircraft with the thinner seats. I am certain of this because the interior looked very new and clean like it had just recently been in for some upkeep. It was a 767-300, but I didn't get the reg number.

Anyways, I sat down in the seat and it seemed like there was more legroom than other Delta 767's I had been on. The seats also did look thinner than the ones on the 762 I was on 4 days before. To conclude, I DID notice extra legroom in every row that I sat in.(There were only 25 people in coach so I got to try out different rows.) The rows also looked like they had more legroom.

Overall I was very comfortable, and the seat WAS very comfortable, even with a thinner seat back.

CVG777
 
caetravlr
Posts: 856
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 8:19 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 1:01 pm

Thank you Mikeymike, for an informative, and educated post. We can always use more of those. Now that 8 of them are retrofitted so far, I certainly hope that the ones they use on the haul to HNL are the ones that are retrofitted, at least the day that I go!
A woman drove me to drink and I didn't have the decency to thank her. - W.C. Fields
 
DeltaSFO
Posts: 2407
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2000 11:22 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 1:02 pm

CAETravlr....
Are you going through SFO or LAX?

DeltaSFO
It's a new day. Every moment matters. Now, more than ever.
 
AgnusBymaster
Posts: 620
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2001 8:11 am

RE: Woodsboy

Sat Apr 07, 2001 1:26 pm

I flew on Alaska a few weeks ago, and I guess the plane had the new seats with adjustable headrests that you are referring to. Anyway, I though the seats were very supportive and much more comfortable than the seats on Delta. Also, there was more legroom.

The seats seemed substantial enough to me. In fact they were almost a little stiff, and I had to give it a good push to get it to recline.
 
caetravlr
Posts: 856
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 8:19 am

RE: Delta's New Narrow Seats

Sat Apr 07, 2001 2:49 pm

Hi DeltaSFO,

I was going to try to go through SFO, but the way my travel agent booked it, I ended up with the flight that is listed as ATL - HNL, meaning, one stop in LAX. The next time I go, if I have a little more latitude in making my travel arrangements, I want to try and get a few hours in SFO. Would be great to stop and chat with you if you are there that day, as well, I want to see if any of my old friends are working in the Crown Room.

I had also looked into going UAL through ORD and SFO, but it was more expensive. My travel agent thought I was nuts. She did not realize that I actually LIKE flying... LOL

CAETravlr
A woman drove me to drink and I didn't have the decency to thank her. - W.C. Fields

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