gkirk
Posts: 23346
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2000 3:29 am

Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sat Apr 21, 2001 6:59 am

Ive wondered this for a while so does anyone know??
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
Rafabozzolla
Posts: 968
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2000 1:27 pm

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sat Apr 21, 2001 7:08 am

I'd like to also.
 
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boeingrulz
Posts: 521
Joined: Thu Sep 30, 1999 2:55 am

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sat Apr 21, 2001 7:16 am

Too busy serving WOMAN?

Carolyn
 
NAACREW
Posts: 167
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2001 3:05 pm

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sat Apr 21, 2001 7:37 am

LOL...Boeingrulz!
 
gkirk
Posts: 23346
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2000 3:29 am

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sat Apr 21, 2001 4:09 pm

Boeingrulz, I deserved that one, lol  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
So anyone know the reason why AZ dont serve Manchester???
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
philb
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 5:53 am

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sat Apr 21, 2001 8:53 pm

Alitalia have served MAN on and off over the years.

In 1948, SM95 served the airport via London for about 4 weeks.

In 1968 the service was restarted with Caravelles and lasted until 1973 when the oil crisis forced a withdrawal.

For the rest of the seventies and until BA was privatised, the service was a pool service using BA 1-11s.

Most of Manchester's scheduled routes are based on a double viability - enough regular traffic year round to guarantee an economic service and a reasonable amount of freight.

Manchester does not have the economic links with Italy that it has with some of the destinations in Northern Europe and the Italian population in the North West is not large enough to generate a regular VFR demand.
 
Rafabozzolla
Posts: 968
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2000 1:27 pm

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sat Apr 21, 2001 10:23 pm

PhilB,

OK I get your point but Iberia serves MAN and even Portugália. I cant believe there is less demand from Milan than Barcelona or Lisbon!
 
philb
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 5:53 am

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sat Apr 21, 2001 10:40 pm

A great deal of the traffic between the Iberian peninsula and Manchester is based on 3 factors:

1. The best connections ex MAN to South America

2 Non-charter market tourism

3. The trade between the North West and Oporto, particularly to do with textiles.
 
Demoose
Posts: 1891
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2001 8:06 am

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sun Apr 22, 2001 12:40 am

BA serve Milan and Rome from Manchester, and there are alot of charter airlines flying to Naples so there is demand I would have thought.
Take a ride...fly across the sky
 
servisair
Posts: 157
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2006 7:44 am

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sun Apr 22, 2001 12:40 am

The Portugalia flights go MAN-OPO-LIS so they can fill up the plane with pax for both destinations.
30 Yeras in the Biz...
 
gkirk
Posts: 23346
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2000 3:29 am

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sun Apr 22, 2001 12:44 am

BA fly to Rome AND Milan, sheesh there must be loads of money to be made there then
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
philb
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 5:53 am

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sun Apr 22, 2001 12:58 am

I'm getting tired of repeating myself...but here goes, again.

Air services are operated for a nunber of reasons, the most common of which is PROFIT.

Sometimes air services are operated for social reasons, e.g. Kerry-Dublin and are backed by government funding.

In the past, and sometimes still today in parts of the world, air services are operated to "fly the flag" or solely for propoganda/diplomatic reasons.

Just because BA flies to Milan and Rome from Manchester doesn't mean there is a lot of traffic or enough business for two carriers on the routes.

Alitalia has gone through some fairly traumatic restructuring of late and an aborted deal with KLM.

The airline will only operate services where real money can be made.

Whilst there will be some tourism on the BA flights, Italy isn't as popular as Spain and the charter flights that operate MAN-Italy will offer any spare capacity at dirt cheap rates.

There are no connections from Milan or Rome which cannot be bettered elsewhere in Europe ex MAN and the amount of commerce between the North West and Italy is far less than between the region and the Iberian Peninsula
 
gkirk
Posts: 23346
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2000 3:29 am

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sun Apr 22, 2001 1:08 am

I guess thats why KLM uk dropped the Milan route from MAN then.
BTW I hear that the Iberia flight from MAN now only goes to BCN , is that true? If it is, I guess BA must have growing pax numbers on the MAD route then, but its no real surprise if true as IB and BA are oneworld partners.
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
philb
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 5:53 am

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sun Apr 22, 2001 1:23 am

Exactly right in all respects
 
fax
Posts: 145
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2001 7:55 pm

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sun Apr 22, 2001 1:29 am

Iberia is now only to Barcelona, better connections to the islands and the south where tourists/ex pats want to go...plus BA now has two/three flights daily to Madrid.

Alitalia are rumoured to be looking at Rome - Manchester.
 
Pe@rson
Posts: 16003
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2001 6:29 pm

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sun Apr 22, 2001 1:30 am

Whilst I agree entirely with Phil's replies (I'm a business studies student), I am curious to establish why the low-fare airline Go has recently announced that it is to commence a daily 733-operated flight from BRS to Rome. Surely the various reasons identified as being potential contributing factors of why AZ doesn't serve MAN applies more so to BRS?

"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
johnboy
Posts: 2557
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 1999 9:09 pm

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sun Apr 22, 2001 1:31 am

Hmmm.....MAN OPO LIS....now THAT sounds like my kind of town!  Big grin
 
philb
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 5:53 am

RE: Why Do Alitalia Not Serve Man?

Sun Apr 22, 2001 1:58 am

Pe@rson,

Now there's a good question. 3i may have some plans for Go which include ties with charter operators which may give them a guarantee of seat sales on the route but there is no obvious reason.

As to Alitalia "looking" at Rome - Manchester, both Alitaliaand the Airport sales team will, no doubt, regularly revue possibilities but don't bank on anything happening.
 
pa121
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue May 25, 1999 7:15 am

BMI Will?

Tue Apr 24, 2001 6:06 am

Manchester to Milan used to be served twice daily by BA till 98, when KLM UK started a new (twice daily) service in codeshare with Alitalia (and with fairly more convenient schedule).
Alitalia withdrew from the code share after six months, much to disappointment of KLM UK (source: a flight attendant, maybe not reliable...).
The reply of BA was to introduce a third daily service, with an Embraer 145 (British Regional). Two weeks ago the service became a "full" BA one, with a 737-500.
The route seems to be quite profitable then, unless...it is a defence move against BMI, trying to feed the new Star hub of Manchester with passengers from Northern Italy, thus entering in this route.
The Milan route is very strong on business passengers (the service during week ends is much reduced), so who knows?!
 
Billy
Posts: 890
Joined: Sun Jul 23, 2000 11:18 pm

RE: BMI Will?

Tue Apr 24, 2001 5:32 pm

BA Milan - MAN route was one of their most profitable. The KLM UK flight ended not because of poor loads, but because KLM ended all non-AMS operations. KLM UK were carrying connections to latin America and Africa from MAN (no doubt, much to the annoyance of KLM).

BA were allowed to expand their Milan operations from MAN with the move to MXP.

As we all know, the yield is in Milan, but the volume is in Rome.

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