flight
Posts: 357
Joined: Sat Oct 15, 2005 6:41 am

Boeing 747-400 Engines

Sat May 29, 1999 1:51 am

I have a question about the boeing 747-400 engines i believe there is two types the pw4056 and cf6-80c2b1f the pw engine looks very similar to the cf6 but it has a opening on the side of the engine kinda like a line= like this on the side of the exhaust but the cf6 is the same except it has no opening on the side .But now searching throught the gallery of 747-400 i noticed that a 747-400 klm has engines named in its fleet cf6 but one of the pictutrees shown in the gallery the ph-bfi has engines which are pw-4056 but in the fleet list it says that this planes engines are the cf6-80c2b1f and quesswhat i searched another pictures of the klm boeing 747-400 with the same registration and the engines where diffrent again they were cf6-80c2b1f how do you answer that??
 
CX747
Posts: 5566
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 2:54 am

RE: Boeing 747-400 Engines

Sat May 29, 1999 2:03 am

I can't really answer that particular question but I am sure that someone here knows the answer. What I do know is that all of KLM's B747-400 series aircraft are powered by GE CF6-80C2s. I can also tell you that there are 3 choices of engines for airlines to choose from when ordering a B747-400. Pratt & Whitney's PW 4056. General Electric's CF6-80C2 and Rolls Royce's RB211-524G/H. The Rolls Royce has been updated within the last year with technology from the Trent 700 series. It is called the RB211-524G-T or H-T.
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
flight
Posts: 357
Joined: Sat Oct 15, 2005 6:41 am

RE: Boeing 747-400 Engines

Sat May 29, 1999 2:13 am

hi cx747 but you know what i mean about the opening on the side of the engine right??
 
Lufthansa
Posts: 2303
Joined: Thu May 20, 1999 6:04 am

And The Answer Is

Sat May 29, 1999 8:26 pm

Well, like my friend Cathay747 said, there are 3 engine choices. Now about the little slits, well, both GE and PW engines have them. The difference is, the side of the engine they have them on. Was that KLM picture, by any chance a shot looking at the starboard side? The reason i say this, is because the GE engine has the little
= slits things on the right hand side (starboard so there is no confusion about which direction we are looking from), and, the PW engine has the little slits on the port side. This is true for 767s too. (which uses the same engines in many cases) The other way to tell is that the GE engine seems to be totally flat on its metalic exhaused, maintaining the same angle of decline, where the PW engine sort of changes just a little where the metal texture and colour changes. Also, the PW engine casing seems slightly smaller than the GE.
You can see here in this Qantas 767-300ER, which is CF6 powered, the slits on the starboard side. (the qantas 767-200s are PW JT9D powered, and the 767-300s are General Electric powered. I haven't a clue why the changed engines types between the two types. They seem to like the GE ones though. Ansett's and Air New Zealands 767s are all GE powered.


To compare engines, i just thought i would put a picture of the United 747-400 with PW4056 engines here. As you can clearly now see, both engine types have the slits, just on opposite sides. Thanks to United for operating the 747-400. (i want cheap economy tickets to stay, lets keep flying the 747-400s and not downsize to 300 seaters when the demand is there because its easier to sell the more expensive economy tickets to business travelers). Of course, the best engine of all is the rolls royce one in my opinion. It stick a picture here but it would take too long to download on some peoples interent connections.
 
Spud
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 5:15 pm

RE: And The Answer Is

Sat May 29, 1999 11:05 pm

RR's are heavier. By about 7000kgs over the GE's. = less payload = less profit
 
cedarjet
Posts: 8101
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 1:12 am

RE: Boeing 747-400 Engines

Sat May 29, 1999 11:22 pm

The RR may be a little heavier but they're the most fuel-efficient and light on maintenence. Apparently the GE is a maintenance nightmare, the least reliable of the three by a wide margin. BA, a long-standing customer for RR on the 747, 757 and 767 bought GE-powered 777s. Not a very smart move for commonality, but I think it had something to do with BA selling GE their Cardiff engine maintenence base. GE probably did a reciprocal deal re. overhauls if BA bought a few of their engines, but BA's engineering staff are not happy and are trying to find a way to get rid of the troublesome and unfamiliar engine and do what any smart person would have from the beginning, to get Trent-powered 777s.
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
Spud
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 5:15 pm

RE: Boeing 747-400 Engines

Sat May 29, 1999 11:56 pm

True they do drink less. But its much , much more common to be weight limited than range limited. For us anyway. We operate both GE and RR. So far the RR's have given more probs. We also really need the extra KG's out of the GE's. And thats what pays the bills.
 
flight
Posts: 357
Joined: Sat Oct 15, 2005 6:41 am

RE: Boeing 747-400 Engines

Sun May 30, 1999 4:08 am

This is to LufthansA the opening on that klm engine with registration ph-bfi was on the same side as on the 747-400 u have shown of united airlines.
 
B747
Posts: 259
Joined: Wed May 19, 1999 10:08 pm

RE: Boeing 747-400 Engines

Sun May 30, 1999 7:52 am

If the CF6-80C2 engines cause more problems, then why do most operators order them? Price?
At Pope, where not happy, until you're not happy!
 
CX747
Posts: 5566
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 2:54 am

B747 And SpUd.

Sun May 30, 1999 8:29 am

B747: The reason that their are more GE powered 747-400s than the other two options is due to the fact that a few airlines order an enormous amount of 747s with that engine. So, technically in numbers you have more GE fleets. Lufthansa, Japan Airlines, and KLM all operate the GE.

SpUd: Amen on operating the 747. I was thinking the same thing about ticket prices and what it has done for us. 300 seaters hurt OUR wallets!
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
IL76
Posts: 2237
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:43 am

GE-RR-PW...

Thu Jun 03, 1999 10:33 pm

First of all:
KLM doesn't operate ANY aircraft with PW-engines. The last ones were the DC-9's they disposed of more than a decade ago.

Second: Has anyboy ever noticed that PW's smoke a lot more than GE's or RR's. Even the ones on 777's smoke like a Russian Soloviev-engine!! In Holland Martinair operated PW-MD11's and KLM GE-MD11's... Those Martinair ones really smoke like a chimney compared to the KLM MD11's!!!!
That's not very good, Pratt & Whitney!!

BTW, I think the RR's look best on any aircraft, with the full-length cowling...

Ed

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