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STT757
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:04 pm

I think there's a merger in B6's future, but I'd don't think it's AS.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
jetero
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:06 pm

STT757 wrote:
I think there's a merger in B6's future, but I'd don't think it's AS.


If you're referring to a UA-B6 merger, that I do not see.

A very broad codeshare (similar to HP-CO or NW-CO) that could involve UA bringing token service back to JFK and turning over a good chunk of LAX to B6 that I could see. I forget about the restrictions on domestic codesharing in the pilot contract, however, but I guess it's up for renegotiation. Would be a pretty sweeping deal, though, if it did go through.
 
INFINITI329
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:07 pm

BWIAirport wrote:
Boy, 737s flying around with 'jetBlue' on the sides sure would be weird.


thats what it was to be initially, but it was a blessing in disguise for Jetblue I think to get shunned by Boeing and welcomed with open arms by Airbus.
 
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FA9295
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:14 pm

BoeingGuy wrote:
Unless I missed something this is a pointless article based only on circumstantial speculation. Both fly A320s. Both have a few similarities. Therefore they are going to merge.

That was most people's speculation of why VX and B6 would merge. Boy were they all wrong there...
No, "FA" in my username does not stand for "flight attendant"...
 
jns13
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:15 pm

nine4nine wrote:
We don’t need any more mergers. All this has done is reduce competition, raise fares, add fees, shrink seats galleys and lavs, and see who can race to the bottom first.

Makes me really miss the good ol’ pre 9/11 days when you had a multitude of airline choices to look up when searching for a fare. Ther prices were better, the planes more comfortable, the air rage rare, and the nostalgia still lived.


All of which resulted in a spate of bankruptcies throughout the 2000s. Plus, merged airlines are one thing, but reducing leg room etc. is another--more a result of peoples' (lack of) willingness to pay and the proliferation of ULCC options.
 
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rotating14
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:23 pm

BWIAirport wrote:
Boy, 737s flying around with 'jetBlue' on the sides sure would be weird.



Not that weird if there's validity to this article.

https://www.bizjournals.com/seattle/new ... -cuts.html


Since European rival Airbus won’t get the same tax cut, Boeing can use part of its savings to lower prices in future aircraft sales efforts, he said.Boeing teams are currently waging sales campaigns for several jet orders from major U.S. airlines, including JetBlue Airways and United. They're also working on deals with several airlines in Asia, including several China-based airlines.
 
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hOMSaR
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:24 pm

nine4nine wrote:
We don’t need any more mergers. All this has done is reduce competition, raise fares, add fees, shrink seats galleys and lavs, and see who can race to the bottom first.

Makes me really miss the good ol’ pre 9/11 days when you had a multitude of airline choices to look up when searching for a fare. Ther prices were better, the planes more comfortable, the air rage rare, and the nostalgia still lived.


There's a saying, "the past remembers better than it lived" (and another one, "the past is getting more like it used to be than it ever was before").

True, you had "more choices" in carriers, but the fares were definitely not better back then. I just flew Chicago to the west coast on a mainline carrier (not a basic economy fare) for under $130. I can often find first class seats to the west coast for under $500. What pre-9/11 fares (not even inflation adjusted) routinely were better?

True, economy doesn't have free meals, but everybody complained about how bad they were anyway. The buy on board stuff is better than the free stuff was, and adds, what, $10 to the cost of your flight? And I recall there being air rage back then, too, you just didn't have everybody with a cell phone camera recording every second of every incident from different angles and a bunch of "news" blogs posting about it everywhere.
The plural of Airbus is Airbuses. Airbii is not a word.
There is no 787-800, nor 787-900 or 747-800. It's 787-8, 787-9, and 747-8.
A321neoLR is also unnecessary. It's simply A321LR.
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BoeingGuy
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:29 pm

[threeid][/threeid]
INFINITI329 wrote:
BWIAirport wrote:
Boy, 737s flying around with 'jetBlue' on the sides sure would be weird.


thats what it was to be initially, but it was a blessing in disguise for Jetblue I think to get shunned by Boeing and welcomed with open arms by Airbus.


I wouldn’t call it a blessing for B6, but Boeing pissed away both the F9 and B6 campaigns. I mean B6’s original business plan called for 73Gs. How stupid could you be to lose that campaign. That was back in the darkest Condit/ Stoneciper era.
 
jplatts
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:30 pm

There is no real need for a AS-B6 merger, and there is already significant overlap between AS and B6 on JFK-West Coast, BOS-West Coast, and FLL-California. AS also has a hub at LAX and B6 also has a focus city at LGB, and most of the B6 nonstop routes out of LGB are already in competition with AS nonstop routes out of LAX.

AS and B6 can negotiate a codeshare agreement that allows AS to connect its passengers onto B6 flights to destinations in the Northeast, the Caribbean, Central America, and South America that AS does not serve and that also allows B6 to connect its passengers onto AS flights to destinations in Alaska, Hawaii, the Pacific Northwest, and Western Canada that B6 does not serve.
 
jordanh
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:33 pm

FA9295 wrote:
BoeingGuy wrote:
Unless I missed something this is a pointless article based only on circumstantial speculation. Both fly A320s. Both have a few similarities. Therefore they are going to merge.

That was most people's speculation of why VX and B6 would merge. Boy were they all wrong there...

I believe most unbiased observers think a VX/B6 merger would have been easier - and more successful - than a VX/AS merger (or takeover, more correctly). However AS saw that a combined VX/B6 would thwart any plans they might have to expand eastward, and pose a real threat to them on the west coast. Thus they "bit the bullet" and spend an exorbitant amount of money to acquire VX.

They are obviously struggling to make it work - just look at how their stock price has fallen in the past year, notwithstanding the recent plunge in the US markets, and how arguments continue about how the integration of the airlines might work. Most of the highly-touted, but often less-profitable, VX perks are gone.

If a B6/AS merger were to come along, it would be interesting to see if the airline stayed with the B6 model - which is much more akin to VX than to AS's stripped-down service - or carried-over the AS system. It would be interesting to watch.
 
LupineChemist
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:36 pm

FA9295 wrote:
BoeingGuy wrote:
Unless I missed something this is a pointless article based only on circumstantial speculation. Both fly A320s. Both have a few similarities. Therefore they are going to merge.

That was most people's speculation of why VX and B6 would merge. Boy were they all wrong there...


There was every indication that they were going to merge and that speculation wasn't necessarily wrong. VX was too weak to stand on its own and had to go somewhere.

B6 made it so AS had to throw down a lot money money than they would have liked to play defense and not have such a strong competitor.
 
TWA1985
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:42 pm

Okay, am I the only one thinking this is a bit premature?!?! The AS/VX merger isn’t even complete yet!
Be Young. Be Wild. Be Free.
 
ShinyAndChrome
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:04 pm

I beat this horse to death on yesterday’s thread, but I’d like to add one new point since the article specifically cited the HP/US merger: When HP/US explored their merger, the competitive landscape in the US was much different. The industry was still suffering from the aftereffects of 9/11 And was significantly more fragmented between a large number of smaller, weaker airlines.

As hard as it might have been at the time, going through the whole set of inorganic growing pains in that environment would probably be a lot easier than doing so now, when the legacy competition is miles stronger than before, ULCCs are fast growing and boast the bigger cost advantage, and even Southwest is a lot larger.
 
wnflyguy
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:08 pm

My personal view if B6 ever comes up for sale WN would out bid AS 2 to 1 for that HUGE BOS,JFK,FLL and Caribbean marketshare.

Flyguy
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
tphuang
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:11 pm

This is a duplicate of viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1385737

which is linked basically to the same article
 
F27500
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:26 pm

Why is everyone on here so hot to pimp JetBlue out to someone else? Leave B6 alone ! :)
 
evank516
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:27 pm

TWA1985 wrote:
Okay, am I the only one thinking this is a bit premature?!?! The AS/VX merger isn’t even complete yet!


No, I agree with you.

IF (and I'm sorry, it's still a big IF) this merger were to happen I can bet you that jetBlue would be the surviving carrier, and I'm also betting that they would keep their HDQ where it is. Between SFO, SEA, and NYC, there really isn't much of a price advantage to moving since SEA and SFO are both relatively expensive places themselves.
 
lostsound
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:28 pm

I believe B6 is around for the long-haul without a merger. They've made a profit almost pretty much every year they've existed, they're beloved in the east with a great reputation, and they're looking at Europe flights and considering wide-bodies. Doesn't sound like struggling carrier in need of a merger or buy out imo. It's too bad they didn't gobble up VX though, that would have been pretty exciting.
 
capitalflyer
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:30 pm

Mods,

Fine with combining with viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1385737 if deemed in the "national interest"
 
Jetmarc
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:37 pm

IF this was to happen... rather than Alaska or JetBlue, the combined airline should be named Jet America!
"Sucka, I'm gonna send you out on Knuckle Airlines. Fist Class!!" ~ Mr. T
 
Tailwinds
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:11 pm

jordanh wrote:
They are obviously struggling to make it work - just look at how their stock price has fallen in the past year, notwithstanding the recent plunge in the US markets, and how arguments continue about how the integration of the airlines might work.


I'm scratching my head at how many people are saying the integration is struggling. They've made or beat the timelines they set for major milestones, maintained operational reliability, resolved most of their union contracts, and opened up a ton of new routes. They said at the outset that many of the network benefits wouldn't happen until after PSS switchover (which has been moved forward 1Q to 2Q18), after which they'll be able to redeploy their two fleets as desired. They're solidly in the middle of the highest-cost/lowest-benefit portion of the merger which is surely annoying the stock market, but that doesn't seem to be anything unexpected, or evidence of failure. This summer will be the first real chance to see the single PSS and massively expanded route network in action, and that will be the evidence of success or failure.
 
tphuang
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:13 pm

Tailwinds wrote:
jordanh wrote:
They are obviously struggling to make it work - just look at how their stock price has fallen in the past year, notwithstanding the recent plunge in the US markets, and how arguments continue about how the integration of the airlines might work.


I'm scratching my head at how many people are saying the integration is struggling. They've made or beat the timelines they set for major milestones, maintained operational reliability, resolved most of their union contracts, and opened up a ton of new routes. They said at the outset that many of the network benefits wouldn't happen until after PSS switchover (which has been moved forward 1Q to 2Q18), after which they'll be able to redeploy their two fleets as desired. They're solidly in the middle of the highest-cost/lowest-benefit portion of the merger which is surely annoying the stock market, but that doesn't seem to be anything unexpected, or evidence of failure. This summer will be the first real chance to see the single PSS and massively expanded route network in action, and that will be the evidence of success or failure.


you mean other than finding out that legacy VX network doesn't make any money?
 
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FA9295
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:36 pm

LupineChemist wrote:
FA9295 wrote:
BoeingGuy wrote:
Unless I missed something this is a pointless article based only on circumstantial speculation. Both fly A320s. Both have a few similarities. Therefore they are going to merge.

That was most people's speculation of why VX and B6 would merge. Boy were they all wrong there...


There was every indication that they were going to merge and that speculation wasn't necessarily wrong. VX was too weak to stand on its own and had to go somewhere.

B6 made it so AS had to throw down a lot money money than they would have liked to play defense and not have such a strong competitor.

I wasn't saying that a VX/B6 merger was wrong to speculate about, I was just saying that the outcome came to be much different than what most had expected at the time...
No, "FA" in my username does not stand for "flight attendant"...
 
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FA9295
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 6:37 pm

STT757 wrote:
I think there's a merger in B6's future, but I'd don't think it's AS.

IDK who else it would be other than AS. Certainly not any of the 3 U.S. legacy airlines/carriers.
No, "FA" in my username does not stand for "flight attendant"...
 
SWADawg
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:02 pm

FA9295 wrote:
STT757 wrote:
I think there's a merger in B6's future, but I'd don't think it's AS.

IDK who else it would be other than AS. Certainly not any of the 3 U.S. legacy airlines/carriers.

I would guess WN is the carrier he’s thinking of, but I could be mistaken.
My posts are my opinion only and do not reflect the views of Southwest Airlines
 
jordanh
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:12 pm

SWADawg wrote:
FA9295 wrote:
STT757 wrote:
I think there's a merger in B6's future, but I'd don't think it's AS.

IDK who else it would be other than AS. Certainly not any of the 3 U.S. legacy airlines/carriers.

I would guess WN is the carrier he’s thinking of, but I could be mistaken.

Or Hawaiian... everyone seems to think HA should be airline-X, -Y, or -Z's next prom queen...
 
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FA9295
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Re: Forbes: New Indicators of JetBlue-Alaska Merger

Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:14 pm

jordanh wrote:
SWADawg wrote:
FA9295 wrote:
IDK who else it would be other than AS. Certainly not any of the 3 U.S. legacy airlines/carriers.

I would guess WN is the carrier he’s thinking of, but I could be mistaken.

Or Hawaiian... everyone seems to think HA should be airline-X, -Y, or -Z's next prom queen...

Hawaiian, maybe. Southwest, not a chance.
No, "FA" in my username does not stand for "flight attendant"...
 
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rotating14
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Re: Possible Alaska+JetBlue combination

Tue Feb 06, 2018 8:49 pm

The last time I checked, Boeing does not manufacture the A320.

https://www.bizjournals.com/seattle/new ... -cuts.html


Since European rival Airbus won’t get the same tax cut, Boeing can use part of its savings to lower prices in future aircraft sales efforts, he said.

Boeing teams are currently waging sales campaigns for several jet orders from major U.S. airlines, including JetBlue Airways and United. They're also working on deals with several airlines in Asia, including several China-based airlines.
 
evank516
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Re: Possible Alaska+JetBlue combination

Wed Feb 07, 2018 6:56 pm

fastmover wrote:
vadodara wrote:
Perhaps, it is a bit early. However, the signs of AS becoming a cash generating machine are evident.

Jet Blue somehow seem to be having a little issue on that front; if they try and improve their finances, how do they differentiate in the crowded transcontinental market? Seems like Wall St might push them to discuss a merger with AS.



How is jetblue having an issue making money?
Also thanks to MINT they pretty much changed the transcon market. What is ALK going to do is the better question.


I was going to say. Isn't MINT essentially printing them money?

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