FJWH
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What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Flight?

Fri Aug 20, 2004 6:09 pm

I know, there isn't much chance that the A380 will crash at the first test flight BUT what if it does....? Imagine, what would be the consequences for Airbus, the orders of the A380 etc?? I'm really curious at this. In how far Airbus will get a bad name? Will airliners cancel their orders? Etc.

Thanks

FJWH
FlightS in the next 3 months: MSP, PHX, MEM, NCE, TFS, BCN. All round trips from AMS
 
Catatonic
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 6:10 pm

As if, they are more likely tyo find out what caused it to crash and fix it, thats the purpose of a test flight
Equally Cursed and Blessed.
 
ZKSUJ
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 6:14 pm

Would passengers boycott the A380 saying it is like a 'jinxed' plane? Would they have to rename it like the A350 or something because of bad luck?
 
AngelAirways
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 6:18 pm

the A320 had a couple of bad crashes right after its entry into service...

look at it now!

 
rabenschlag
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 6:20 pm

an A330 crashed during a test flight. what did it do to the orders?

http://www.airdisaster.com/cgi_bin/view_details.cgi?date=06301994®=F-WWKH&airline=Airbus+Industrie

 
AngelAirways
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 6:31 pm

yep..

that 330 was an interesting one. it was testing for a low speed, low energy takeoff, but the auto flight control was not set appropriately and it crashed just after takeoff, within the airport perimeter. it was however a very extreme test case - low power, low speed, very steep climb angle etc...
 
L-188
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 6:33 pm

It would be bad, crashes are bad, hmmmm m-kay...

Ok enough of my Mr Garrison impression.

Despite the setback many programs have survived early crashs, the MD-80, A320 and the A330 all spring to mind.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
canberra
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 6:52 pm

there isn't much chance that the A380 will crash at the first test flight

Could we maybe use risk instead of chance  Confused

/Michael  Big grin
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UAXDXer
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 6:56 pm

It would be one huge smoking divit...................
It takes a bug to hit a windsheild but it takes guts to stick
 
AngelAirways
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 7:08 pm

if only you knew the amount of planning thats going into this...

thats why they havent announced a flight test date in fact... they dont want to be rushed. only when everything is ready and spotless. in fact such is the care and planning and perfection going into it that i think it would almost be boring...

these days you already see almost-real digital impressions way before the first flight, so the first flight is not such an awe striking event.
 
Blackbird1331
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 7:13 pm

Let's hope it doesn't. World affairs are in bad enough shape already. We need to go in the right direction in all of our endeavors.
Cameras shoot pictures. Guns shoot people. They have the guns.
 
BCAL
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 7:26 pm

A BAC 1-11 crashed during the early stage of test flights and yet it went on to become the most successful British jet.

MOL on SRB's latest attack at BA: "It's like a little Chihuahua barking at a dying Labrador. Nobody cares."
 
AZA330
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 8:12 pm

Hey, FJWH, what's happening today with you? You posted first a topic about if a plane is hijcked in a flight from London to New York, now you post this about if an A380 crashes in test flights....bad day at work?

Personally I guess that A380 will not crash in test flight  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
Ciao
 
LHR27C
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 8:20 pm

The amount of training done before the first flight, particularly on the simulator, is huge. If it were to happen, although extremely unlikely, I should think the project would still go ahead based on the amount of commitment for the A380 alone... and provided the cause of the crash was something that could easily be repaired.
Once you have tasted flight, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned forever skyward
 
mauriceb
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 8:21 pm

well we won't know what effect it will have , because note that the A330 was a pilot error....
 
MEA-707
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 8:26 pm

It mainly depends on how the crash will look and what the networks will make of it. A crash at the airport for all the invités to see and readily videod and broadcasted worldwide will be the ultimate PR nightmare. Video's of the burning Concorde and the graphic photos of the DC-10 at Chicago plus the story about the passengers seeing their own crash on the on board moviescreen basically killed further service or sales respectively of these aircraft. Also the widely broadcasted Sept. 11 and Airbus 320 crashes have made many people scared.
But if there is no clear or graphic footage of it widely available, like the A-330 testflight, and the problem is fixed, not many people will care.
nobody has ever died from hard work, but why take the risk?
 
mauriceb
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 8:29 pm

well you see how big succes the A330, DC-10, A320, MD-80 were/are






maurice
 
NIKV69
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 8:31 pm

It is not going to crash, just burn a lot of fuel and cost a ton to fly.
Hey that guy with the private jet can bail us out! Why? HE CAN AFFORD IT!
 
keesje
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 9:15 pm

No one will know what would happen then to the A380.

What if the 7e7 proto would have a hull failure during second flight ?

Useless discussions, no one knows..
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
FJWH
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 9:19 pm

AZA330:

No, just 2 more weeks vacation  Smile/happy/getting dizzy.
But of course I also think that the plane isn't going to crash but I just wanted to know what's going to happen IF it does.

How many days or weeks before do they announce when the first flight is? I want to go to TLS for sure to see it fly!

FJWH
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flightuk
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 10:15 pm

I think in the case of the 380 it is quite different to aircraft that have gone before. This is because of the increasing debate about the aircrafts size with so many passengers lives potentially at risk. Good question
 
Danny
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 10:24 pm

Rabenschlag - the reson for this crash was "Pilor error, misunderstanding of auto-flight systems"
 
MidnightMike
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 10:31 pm


During test flights, anything could go wrong, with any aircraft, that is why they are test flights. If something were to go wrong with the A380 (God forbid), Airbus would find the problem, correct the problem, & there would be no impact on aircraft sales, passengers have short term memories of aircraft incidents & even shorter memories if there is a sale on airline tickets.

LHR27C

Simulator time prior to a test flight would do nothing if there is an electrical problem or a computer failure...
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Starlionblue
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Fri Aug 20, 2004 10:40 pm

As has been mentioned, several aircraft which went on to sell well crashed during the test program. Less dramatic problems are more common. The 727 #2 engine surged on rotation during the first test flight, and the 727 still has this problem sometimes, although it's occurence has been minimized by careful shaping of the S-duct. The problem was not revelaed to the public until well after the first flight though.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
EZEIZA
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 12:26 am

Yes, there have been problems on other test flights in the past, but with people being so paranoid after 9/11, and with the publicity the 380 is having, I think a crash would definitly have impact on the future sales of the 380.
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burnsie28
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 12:32 am

thats why they havent announced a flight test date in fact... they dont want to be rushed. only when everything is ready and spotless. in fact such is the care and planning and perfection going into it that i think it would almost be boring...

Could have sworn they announced mid Jan.
 
BR715-A1-30
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 12:47 am

If the A380 crashed during its first flight, I would make sure it never flew again.

Ok, All Joking aside. I'm sure Airbus would launch an investigation focusing on key parts of the aircraft. I'm sure they would look at the Fly-By-Wire first thing. There would be questions such as "Is FBW designed for a plane that big?" Blah Blah Blah. Since this is supposed to be the new king of the skies, a simple test flight crash may not only hurt the program, but could shy the airlines away. Hopefully though, this will NOT happen. I'm pretty sure they will run all systems on the ground THOROUGHLY before launching that beast into the air.
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N6376M
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 1:00 am

The water from the on-board swimming pool would quickly extinguish the fire.

 
bohica
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 1:03 am

Don't forget that the prototype CRJ crashed during testing and look at how successful that program is.
 
CaptOveur
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 1:11 am

What if god and superman fought?

I normally don't call a topic stupid, but this one really is.
Things were better when it was two guys in a dorm room.
 
AZjetgeek
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 1:19 am

This thread is a waste of space, but I just had to toss in my two cents.

As one poster already mentioned, this is why there are test flights. Pick up a copy of "Safety Last" by Charles Power-Waters. He goes into considerable detail about the certification process for new airliners. There are still aircraft that have had accidents during test flights, allegedly corrected by the manufacturer, only to experience similar failures and other problems once the airplane entered commercial service.

The Boeing 727 is an example, as is the DC-9 and DC-10, and the Lockheed L-188 Electra. The Electra was grounded for a time because of a faulty wing spar and problems with rotation and pitching of propeller blades. Manufacturers, especially the two "big boys", are under considerable pressure to get their aircraft into service and a great deal of that pressure is generated by their own hype as well as that generated by the trade media. The greatest single source of pressure to go airborne and into service is MONEY!

Boeing took a financial nose dive when the SST (Boeing 2707) never got placed into service. Billions were poured into this project, and yet it was still canned. Imagine if that were to happen with their 7E7 or with Airbus' A380? Considering the subsidies Airbus receives for developing the A380, it seems highly unlikely that a crash during a test flight would shelve the project.

Long live the RJ!
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 1:21 am

Ok enough of my Mr Garrison impression

...actually, that'd be Mr. Mackey





As far as the topic at hand: I'd say it could be pretty bad; the A380 will be the most publically-hyped airplane since the days of Concorde & the 747... some'in goes wrong, and everyone and their grandmother will hear about it.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 1:22 am

What's stupid about this topic apart from the silly detractors? Everyone seems to have something to say about it.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
Sinlock
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 1:26 am

From Post #9
if only you knew the amount of planning thats going into this...

that's why they havent announced a flight test date in fact... they dont want to be rushed. only when everything is ready and spotless. in fact such is the care and planning and perfection going into it that i think it would almost be boring...

these days you already see almost-real digital impressions way before the first flight, so the first flight is not such an awe striking event.


This is for the most part true, but even in these days supriseing results can happen. The PW6000 engine for the A-318 is one good example, after a 3 year R&D period the engine landed up missing it's fuel burn target by 11%. It resulted with the CFM56 being offered for the 318 and all but killed the PW6000.
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 1:29 am

after a 3 year R&D period the engine landed up missing it's fuel burn target by 11%.

Ouch! That just proves that fluid dynamics are still very hard to model.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 1:41 am

Pretty much the same thing happened for the PW4098... a derivative of a proven model that turned out to offer such horrible economics that all prospective customers bailed, and PW had to essentially give the b!tch to the only operator it has ever (and likely will ever) see.

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SLUAviator
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 1:47 am

I don't like airplanes where the pilot can fly only with the permission of a computer. The A380 is a waste. Its to big, it weighs to much (Airbus did just announce it weighs 5% more then predicted--almost 32,000 pounds), and is built by Airbus. They will learn their mistake as they watch as the 7E7 dominates.
What do I know? I just fly 'em.......
 
777236ER
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 1:56 am

I don't like airplanes where the pilot can fly only with the permission of a computer. The A380 is a waste. Its to big, it weighs to much (Airbus did just announce it weighs 5% more then predicted--almost 32,000 pounds), and is built by Airbus

Completly pointless post.

They will learn their mistake as they watch as the 7E7 dominates.

Which has the most orders?
Your bone's got a little machine
 
whitehatter
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:00 am

They will learn their mistake as they watch as the 7E7 dominates.

Another idiotic comment.

Thirty ton trucks and double decker buses don't sell as many as five seat family cars. Is the reasoning for that beyond you too?

If they aren't in the same class, you can't compare like for like

Jeez...
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FJWH
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:03 am

Eh.... what is your problem Captoveur, N754PR (and KEESJE)?

Really!! WTF is wrong with my question?? Yes a hypothetical question but what's wrong with that. I'm just really curious what possible consequences of this crash could be!

Further: if you don't like the thread, fine(!), but don't bother me or anyone else here who wants to give a normal reply!

FJWH!
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Starlionblue
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:06 am

I don't like airplanes where the pilot can fly only with the permission of a computer.

Like the 777?

Jokes aside, you don't quite seem to understand the design. The Airbus flight control system does not control the pilot. It helps the pilot fly the plane. The pilot is always in charge.

As for the rest of your post, 100+ orders say otherwise.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
warren747sp
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:08 am

It is not as damaging as if some unfortunate accident should occur on its first commercial flight. A few test pilots as compared to over 500 passengers and crew not to mention the reputation of the manufacture and possibly the airline.
747SP
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:10 am

Agree wholeheartedly with Warren747sp. The first test flight will be rather gentle and not push the envelope. Most of the media attention will be focused here. Once they get into the trickier stuff, the A380 will have been forgotten by the mainstream media until entry into service. 2-6 test personnel killed is nothing compared to 500 pax.

"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:17 am

Like the 777?

...not quite sure from whence you're deriving this one
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:19 am

It was a joke. The 777 has quite a bit of computer control.
.
.




[Edited 2004-08-20 19:23:29]
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
gigneil
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:27 am

...and the 7E7 will have even more.

N
 
bmacleod
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:27 am

Yes. I'm sure 747 fans would LOVE to see the 380 crash as it would be a fatal blow to Airbus and Boeing would gain a global monopoly.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Realistically this won't happen. Airbus has tirelessly gone over the specifications and checked every possible flaw that may develop, one exception being that the final weight may exceed the original estimate.
The engine is the heart of an airplane, but the pilot is its soul.
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:29 am

Accidents do happen, but it is doubtful we will see the loss of the airframe. IIRC an early 747 flight suffered a stuck flap section. No biggie really but enough to make the flight test interesting.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
Tom in NO
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:34 am

well you see how big succes the A330, DC-10, A320, MD-80 were/are

Kind of an oxymoron when one realizes that the best, most pilot-friendly, safe, and well-respected airliners ever built, was also unfortunately one of the worst sellers.....that being the L-1011.

Tom at MSY
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Blackbird1331
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RE: What If The A380 Crashes During First Test Fli

Sat Aug 21, 2004 2:46 am

How many people on board the first flight? I guess it will be modified with escape hatches and everyone on board wears parachutes? If so, how many flights do they fly before they stop wearing the parachutes?
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