QXatFAT
Topic Author
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Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:30 am

So I am planning a trip to Europe, Spain and Portugal to be exact, and I am going on airline miles. I have 100,000 with AA and 100,000 with UA. I have come down to TAP, AA, and Iberia.

So my question is, what equipment is better for flying over the Atlantic? I have heard that the A340 has some problems with flying threw turbulance and gets pretty shaky. Is this true?

My options:

TAP: A330
Iberia: A340
AA: 777

What airframe is better for flying over the pond. Is there the trubulance flying over the Atlantic like there is over the Pacific?
Don't Tread On Me!
 
American777
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:35 am

Quoting QXatFAT (Thread starter):
AA: 777

 checkmark 

JOE.  Wink
 
gmcc
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:36 am

I personally like AA 777 but have not been on an A340 so I can't compare the models.
 
trijetfan1
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:49 am

Does AA fly to Lisbon?
Earned PPL June 26, 2007
 
jacobin777
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:50 am

If you had to choose between an A346 and 777, then it would be a tough choice,
as both have their "pros and cons"... but between an A343 and 777..not even close..

Of course for me, the choice is not even close either.... biggrin 
"Up the Irons!"
 
anax
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:51 am

Oooops... put your helmets on ladies and gentlemen!!!  white 
god is a spotter!!!
 
heavy747
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:52 am

I like the 777 and the A340.. Hard to say as long as its not a 767. I find the air too dry sometimes and it hurts my nose on boeings. Personally i love the A340's but i flew a 777 from JFK to GRU and it was great. For space i think the 777 will be better, but the 340 is also a really smooth flight, also nice and quiet. I would go for the one you have never flown before, or if you havent flown on either, I would go for the 777 because you have to experience the power of those engines.

Andrew
Aviation Enthusiast Extraordinaire - Airports visited so far in 2016: YVR-SFO-HNL-MAJ-KWA-KSA-PNI-TKK-GUM-MNL-NRT-IAH-CU
 
QXatFAT
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 12:20 pm

I have flown on an 777 before. It is my second favorite to the MD11.

Quoting TrijetFan1 (Reply 3):
Does AA fly to Lisbon?

I am not sure but I do not think so.

It would be JFK-LIS on TAP with the A330.

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 4):
If you had to choose between an A346 and 777, then it would be a tough choice,
as both have their "pros and cons"... but between an A343 and 777..not even close..

Here are the choices:

777 with AA from MIA - MAD
A330 with TAP from JFK - LIS
A343 with Iberia from MIA - MAD

So please explain with the A343 as that would be the aircraft. I have never flown that before. I have only flown the 777 and the A330 with US

I have a bit of a problem though, I do not like being on long flights with no room to move around. I will never fly US to LIS on the 757 or anywhere in Europe with an 757. So what one has the most room to move around in?

If all else fails, my other option is LH (747) from SFO - FRA and then LH down to MAD
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reins485
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 12:28 pm

Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 7):
777 with AA from MIA - MAD

AA doesn't use the 777 for their MIA-MAD flights, they only use 767-300 and I have heard it goes out packed most nights.


Alex
 
jacobin777
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 12:29 pm

Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 7):

777 with AA from MIA - MAD
A330 with TAP from JFK - LIS
A343 with Iberia from MIA - MAD

A343 I've found to be "underpowered".....the A330's are nice...but the 777 is quite the spacious plane...

AA's service isn't bad either...

The sound of the RR-Trent 892's are music to my ears... cloudnine 

I took this photo sitting on a window seat of AA's 777-200ER..... biggrin 

"Up the Irons!"
 
bongo
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 12:31 pm

Both 777 or 340 should be fine...believe me. Just compare the different options such as PTVs or seat pitch.
MDE: First airport in the Americas visited by the A380!
 
AzoresLover
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 12:35 pm

I've flown both the 343 and the 777. I've also made three trips on TAP, and I very much like that airline, excellent service. So I would be tempted to fly TAP to LIS. While I thought the 343 was very comfortable for the 12 1/2 hour wheels up to wheels down flight I took on one, (MNL-SFO), I much prefer the 777. You'll have plenty of room inside to move around. And AA is a good airline.

I've never flown IB so I can't comment on it.

All things considered, if I were making the trip it'd be on the AA 777 from MIA-MAD.
Those who want to do something will find a way; those who don't will find an excuse.
 
QXatFAT
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 12:42 pm

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 9):
I took this photo sitting on a window seat of AA's 777-200ER

Funny because the IB plane is right behind it haha. Thanks for the photo though!

Quoting Reins485 (Reply 8):
AA doesn't use the 777 for their MIA-MAD flights, they only use 767-300 and I have heard it goes out packed most nights.

Well when I looked at it on Orbitz a few days ago it said 777. Orbitz mush have had it wrong. And as of right now, both IB A343 and the AA 767 are both not even close to half full. But my trip is not till July but I would like to get my reservation in with my miles here soon. Myself and my friend would like to go for a 3 week trip and hop around Europe in Portugal, Germany, Italy, and France. Trip report will deffinatly be in the making

So how does the A343 handle in turbulance vs the 777. The A330 seems to do fine in what I have experianced.
Don't Tread On Me!
 
474218
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:05 pm

Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 7):
Here are the choices:

777 with AA from MIA - MAD
A330 with TAP from JFK - LIS
A343 with Iberia from MIA - MAD

TAP does not fly out of JFK. They use Newark.
 
waterpolodan
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:14 pm

I've never flown on an A340 or a 777, so I can't comment, but I can tell you that given the choice between IB and anyone else on a longhaul flight, go for the other carrier. I flew MIA-MAD on an Iberia 747-300 a couple years ago, it was great to fly on a classic jumbo but the crew was quite rude and the food and service were pretty poor.
 
Alibo5NGN
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:14 pm

Quoting QXatFAT (Thread starter):
What airframe is better for flying over the pond.

I fly regularly on 747s, 777s and A340-300s over the Atlantic and the Sahara Desert. I have not yet flown the Airbus A340-600. They all are similar when it comes to turbulence. The 747s are large enough to reduce the effects of small to medium turbulence. The 777 has power and structural strength. The A340s has size and stability from the long wing span and 4 engines.

The most important thing about turbulence is the time of year. In my experience, there is less turbulence flying over the Atlantic in winter than in summer. Pilot skills and experience are important factors on how a plane is handled and flown over an area of turbulence.

I can usually tell who is flying - the Captain or non Captain First Officer. The experience tends to be worse when a newbie Flight Officer is flying. If you hear that one of those hurricanes from the Caribbean is heading out to the Canadian seaboard after drenching New England with heavy rains then you must expect some turbulence. A lot of turbulence also occurs when the pilot breaks into the jet stream between Boston MA and NewFoundLand, Canada in order to get some tail wind.

In general there is far more turbulence over the Sahara desert than over the Atlantic.

Good luck.  bigthumbsup 
It takes knowledge to make a career. It takes wisdom to live a life.
 
Trvlr
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:14 pm

I can't speak to TAP, but Iberia's service in Business Class is leagues ahead of AA's.

If you have 100,000 miles and don't mind blowing 80K, go with Iberia.

Airframe won't really matter on this one. If it's between AA and IB, you'll have a much better experience on IB.

Aaron G.
 
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DesertFlyer
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:28 pm

Just a word of caution with your seat choice. My uncle and I flew AMS-MSP on a NW A333 and sat in near the back of the wing in the forward economy section and there was some weird vibration the whole flight. It got a little bit annoying and caused my uncle a headache by the end of the flight, although it didn't bother me as much. Just maybe don't pick seats that will be effected so greatly by engine vibration.

I loved my flight on a 777 JFK-LAX, but that was in F so it wasn't really comparable to the A330 flight I had. Just go with your gut and the one that interest you the most. 777s, A340s, and A330s will be around for many years and you'll most likely have a chance to ride on each.
 
QXatFAT
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:40 pm

Quoting Trvlr (Reply 16):
If you have 100,000 miles and don't mind blowing 80K, go with Iberia

I would rather not put down the 80,000 miles for the upgrade. I would have no problem paying for the upgrade though. How much do you think that would be? Miles just seem so precious to me. My father and I would like to go back to MAO and BVB (Boa Vista, Brasil) here soon and use some miles for that trip as well.

Quoting 474218 (Reply 13):
TAP does not fly out of JFK. They use Newark.

Sorry im just loosing it today. Thank you!

Quoting Alibo5NGN (Reply 15):

Thank you Alibo! Very informative. I am obveusly not a big fan of the turbulance. Expecially flying over large bodys of water. My flight on JAL to NRT was not the greatest of flights over the Pacific so I kind of always have that in my mind.
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Viscount724
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:59 pm

If you're claustrophobic, the 747 and 777 are both several feet wider than the A330/340, but I don't think that would be a major factor for most people.

One advantage both the 747 and 777 have over the Airbus types is that they're slightly faster, and the 747 is still the fastest of all current commercial types, although the difference vs. the 777 is minimal. On a 10 hour flight, a 747 or 777 will probably arrive about 30 minutes earlier than an A330/340 or B767, although on transatlantic routes ATC restrictions often require less than optimum speeds to avoid catching up to a slower aircraft on the same routing/altitude. I recall a flight 2 or 3 years ago LHR-IAD on a Virgin 747-400. Could see an A330 (US Airways) quite close but probably 2000 feet below, heading in the same direction. Over about 15 minutes the A330 went from being well ahead to dropping out of sight behind. The speed difference was very noticeable.

Personally I like the B767 when travelling economy although it doesn't break any speed records either. It's the narrowest of the widebodies but the resulting 2-3-2 seating gives you the lowest probability (1 in 7) of getting stuck in a middle seat on a full flight, vs 1 in 4 on an A330/340 with 2-4-2 seating, and 1 in 3 on a 777 with either 3-3-3 (most common) or 2-5-2 (ignoring the few carriers such as EK and TG with 10-abreast 3-4-3 seating on 777s). The 747 with 3-4-3 seating (and 10 abreast 777s) has the highest probability of a middle seat (1 in 2.25).

Another factor that offsets the slightly slower speed of a B767 or A330 is the smaller seating capacity which expedites boarding/deplaning. And with up to 200 fewer passengers than on one of the larger widebodies like the 747, 777-300 or A340-600, there's less baggage to unload so you may not have to wait quite as long at baggage claim. And obviously if you're the last one off a 425 seat 747 you're going to have a longer wait at customs/immigration than the last one off a 220 seat 767 or A330.
 
QXatFAT
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Tue Oct 31, 2006 3:55 pm

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 19):
Personally I like the B767

As do I. I use them when I fly down to GRU on DL getting a window seat.

So it sounds like a 777 is kind of my choice right now. I deffinatly would like to experiance the likes of IB though. I just feel so terrified of the A343! For some reason that bird just freaks me out!

Should I re-look at my bookings and try to fly from LAX or SFO all the way to Europe and get a connecting flight there? Or should I stick with flying out of SFO to MIA and going across there to MAD?
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Leskova
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:57 am

After flying FRA-ORD on one of UA's B777s last Thursday, I can only give you one single recommendation (which I would have given you before as well, but that flight pretty much reconfirmed my opinion)...

Take the A340.
Smile - it confuses people!
 
Leskova
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Wed Nov 01, 2006 5:20 am

Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 20):
I just feel so terrified of the A343! For some reason that bird just freaks me out!

I know that type of feeling (I've got the same thing with the B737 series) - I'm probably not telling you anything you don't already know: it's a safe, reliable, very quiet and (personal opinion follows) very comfortable plane.

Of course it's possible that you'll get off the flight and say "never again", but you just might come out of it liking the plane - only way to find out is giving it a try...  Wink

The one thing that seems to worry a (quite small) fraction of passengers is the slow takeoff the plane usually performs, but that doesn't mean it's not safe (and, believe me, if the plane doesn't take off with a Flex-T/O setting, it feels about like a normal takeoff on other planes - so there is power left for safety purposes). After those couple of minutes that worry some, it'll simply be a regular flight... just simply quite a bit quieter inside the plane than on most other aircraft...
Smile - it confuses people!
 
andaman
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Wed Nov 01, 2006 6:32 am

Using your AA miles you could also try Finnair and MD-11/A320  Smile JFK-HEL-MAD, BCN or LIS (next spring).
Chinese cookie in SFO: "You're doomed to a life of forever travelling abroad and to be able to afford it!"
 
QXatFAT
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Wed Nov 01, 2006 9:32 am

Quoting Andaman (Reply 23):
Using your AA miles you could also try Finnair and MD-11/A320

Yes I know this and I am highly thinking it. I could never go wrong with getting on an MD11! I have never flown Finnair as well.

This is a lot tougher choice then I thought it was going to be. IB vs AA. So hard! The deciding factor is going to be equipment I just know it. I just seem not to be a fan of any Airbus products except the A320.
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ThrottleHold
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Wed Nov 01, 2006 9:54 am

Quoting Alibo5NGN (Reply 15):
Pilot skills and experience are important factors on how a plane is handled and flown over an area of turbulence.

I can usually tell who is flying - the Captain or non Captain First Officer. The experience tends to be worse when a newbie Flight Officer is flying.

What utter bull. The autopilot is used in turbulence, and it doesn't care who is pressing it's buttons.
 
andaman
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Wed Nov 01, 2006 10:05 am

Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 24):

Yes I know this and I am highly thinking it. I could never go wrong with getting on an MD11! I have never flown Finnair as well.

MD11 sure is a great plane. About AY's service I would say their long haul product is rather avarage (better with the new A343, not flying to JFK), while their short haul product is among the best in Europe, they still offer the full service. And HEL is a nice hub.
Chinese cookie in SFO: "You're doomed to a life of forever travelling abroad and to be able to afford it!"
 
QXatFAT
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:31 pm

Wow you guys have put out so many options I do not know what to do now haha. Thank you everyone though for the information you have given me. Behond what I could have imagined for responses. Thank you!

So there is one last thing then I could ask to help with an conclution...vote! Haha I will put up the options that I am most thinking about and you guys take the poll and let me know.

SFO-EWR-LIS on Air Portugal A330
SFO-MIA-MAD on American Airlines 777
SFO-MIA-MAD on Iberia A343
SFO-FRA-MAD on Luftansa 744
SFO-HEL-MAD on Finnair MD11

Thanks everyone!
Don't Tread On Me!
 
andaman
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:48 pm

Well..  Smile the only one of those I have tried personally:

1. AY MD11/A320 (I suppose it would be SFO-JFK-HEL-MAD then?)

2. AA 777
3. Air Portugal 330
4. LH 747
5. IB A343

Iberia has rather bad reputation in Europe, not sure about their 343 product.
Anyway, I wish you a really good trip!
Chinese cookie in SFO: "You're doomed to a life of forever travelling abroad and to be able to afford it!"
 
TrijetsRMissed
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Sun Nov 05, 2006 2:53 pm

Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 7):
I have flown on an 777 before. It is my second favorite to the MD11.



Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 7):

If all else fails, my other option is LH (747) from SFO - FRA and then LH down to MAD

If flying out of SFO is part of the equation then fly KLM and get the best of both worlds! As far as I know they operate MD-11's out of SFO. Then you'll only have one connecting flight too compared to Finnair.
There's nothing quite like a trijet.
 
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LTU932
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Sun Nov 05, 2006 3:07 pm

Quoting TrijetsRMissed (Reply 29):
If flying out of SFO is part of the equation then fly KLM and get the best of both worlds! As far as I know they operate MD-11's out of SFO. Then you'll only have one connecting flight too compared to Finnair.

Plus you'd get to visit Schiphol and can do some quality spotting there.  Wink
 
LY777
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Sun Nov 05, 2006 7:41 pm

Even though I don't like AA, I would tell you to fly their 777.Indeed, an A340 over the pond is just terrible if you go through a turbulence area.Just my experience...
Flown:A3B2,A320,A321,A332,A343,A388,717,727,732,734,735,738,73W,742/744/748,752,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W,D8,D10,L
 
usair320
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Mon Nov 06, 2006 7:32 am

Quoting QXatFAT (Thread starter):
TAP: A330

 checkmark 

I love TAP and the A330. I flew EWR-LIS-EWR on one of there A310's and it was great. And the A330 is my Fav. A/C so im sure I would like the A330 better.
 
boeingfever777
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Mon Nov 06, 2006 8:14 am

Quoting TrijetFan1 (Reply 3):
Does AA fly to Lisbon?

No, only to MAD outa MIA.

Quoting QXatFAT (Thread starter):
AA: 777

Negative... AA does not fly T7 metal to MAD.

AA#68 departs MIA 1800 and arriving MAD @ 0830 on 763 metal.

Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 7):
777 with AA from MIA - MAD

Again AA only flys 777 metal to LHR, LGW, and FRA when heading to Europe.

I have only flown CO to LIS and the service was "ok".
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre.
 
ACDC8
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Wed Nov 15, 2006 3:21 am

Quoting QXatFAT (Reply 20):
I just feel so terrified of the A343! For some reason that bird just freaks me out!

Could you explain why? I can't understand how a certain type of a/c can freak someone out.

I haven't been on a T7 yet, but have flown most other types over the Atlantic. I agree with with Bongo (reply10), the type of a/c is usually irrelevant unless you start comparing cabin layouts and cabin noise level.

If you hit turbulence mid-flight, the plane will go up and down, side to side, no matter if it's an Airbus or a Boeing. Even though alot of people say that "Well I flew on a A340 and if was much rougher then when I was on a B777" or the other way around. That may be, but that person didn't fly through the same weather system on both flights, and weather changes (as does levels and effects of turbulence) constantly, so those arguments are irrelevant as well.

Bottom line, base your choice on cabin layout and product (airline), or choose the aircraft (or airline) you have not flown on yet.

Quoting Alibo5NGN (Reply 15):
I can usually tell who is flying - the Captain or non Captain First Officer. The experience tends to be worse when a newbie Flight Officer is flying.

 rotfl  Thanks for the laugh!
A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
 
buck3y3nut
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RE: Airbus Vs Boeing Over The Pond

Wed Nov 15, 2006 2:22 pm

I'll get to try out both early next month.
B744 to LHR from JFK
A346 to JFK from LHR

and A343 from LHR - BOM (but not really over a "pond")

Will see what exactly the differences are...

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