holzmann
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UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 12:13 pm

Yesterday I flew IAH-BWI on a "Continental" 737-800. It was the second time in as many weeks on two separate trips that I was put onto a "Continental" A/C. The previous one was a ORD-IAD flight.

What totally confuses me is that during the check-in process, UAL still asks you if you want to upgrade to Economy Plus, even if the A/C doesn't actually have Economy Plus. The case was even more blatant on the IAH-BWI flight yesterday as F/As were offering the E+ seats for upgrade during the boarding process! BUT "Continental" A/C DO NOT HAVE E+ SEATS!!! There is NO extra leg room! The only thing Premier Access buys me on a Continental A/C is (lowly) boarding group #3 and one (or two?) checked bag. NO extra leg room. Heck, there isn't even CHANNEL 9 on Continental A/C. I usually can sleep for hours to the sweet music of ATC calls going back and forth; it's how I track the flight without a map! Channel 9 is the best in-flight entertainment there is!!!

So how in the world does UAL sell Economy Plus on A/C where it does NOT exist? Don't they know this could be a class action lawsuit waiting to happen?

Finally, I thought it was über funny yesterday that the captain during his greetings referred to the crew SEVERAL times as a Houston-based, CONTINENTAL crew. Haha. Take that United! Quite the contrast to the cheery, BS welcome video played a few seconds later featuring Jeff Smisek.
 
United1
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 12:20 pm

Quoting holzmann (Thread starter):
BUT "Continental" A/C DO NOT HAVE E+ SEATS!!! There is NO extra leg room!

Actually about 185 of the PMCO aircraft do have Y+...
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mcdu
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 12:29 pm

As to the PA announcement, CO ALPA is telling pilots to say this and the lemmings are repeating the ALPA script. It only reminds me of flying an express flight where the crew takes great pleasure in saying "this flight is operated by Skywest". In effect CO pilots are putting themselves in the same bucket as outsourced labor. The pilot unions at both companies are led by certifiable lunatics.
 
eaglepower83
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 12:56 pm

Granted not all PMCO aircraft have E+. But UA should NOT be baiting and switching customers with E+ if the particular aircraft does not have it yet.
They better watch themselves.
 
MaverickM11
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 1:01 pm

Does exit row/bulkhead seating on non E+ equipped aircraft qualify as E+?
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
aloges
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 1:03 pm

Quoting EaglePower83 (Reply 4):
Granted not all PMCO aircraft have E+. But UA should NOT be baiting and switching customers with E+ if the particular aircraft does not have it yet.

How do you know that they are doing that?
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
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Polot
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 1:06 pm

Out of the 3 738s that operated IAH-BWI yesterday, 2 had economy plus installed (in fact so did the 739 that also flew the route). You spent all that time listening to the pilot announcements, watching the safety video and yet you apparently didn't notice that the plane had that seating?
 
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calpsafltskeds
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 1:16 pm

Quoting United1 (Reply 1):
Quoting holzmann (Thread starter):
BUT "Continental" A/C DO NOT HAVE E+ SEATS!!! There is NO extra leg room!

Actually about 185 of the PMCO aircraft do have Y+...

A law suit - come on!

Every mainline aircraft has E+. If the E+ mod has not been completed then the E+ section is the exit rows and some bulkhead rows. If you purchase the upgrade, you should get an exit row if you're able and agree to the terms of the exit row. Exit rows probably has more legroom than the average E+ seat on converted aircraft.

If an upgrade of E+ seats is offered when the exit seats are gone, now that's not right. My guess is that is not happening as the last seats usually assigned are the E+ exit rows.
If you are eligible to be upgraded to E+ by your status, then there are few E+ seats and obviously UA is working to modify its aircraft pretty quickly and you'll just have to wait or work of an exit row.

UA is rolling out E+ at a pretty good clip. The conversion requires FAA approval for each aircraft configuration and then movement of seats, cabling for IFE, passenger service units. 75% of domestic 738s are converted.

I love Channel 9, but some pilots won't turn it on - on a flight to Hawaii, they turned it off for the overwater portion of the flight anyway. It takes a while to covert aircraft after a merger. Things will be standardized but it takes time.
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IAHFLYR
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 1:21 pm

Quoting holzmann (Thread starter):
Heck, there isn't even CHANNEL 9 on Continental A/C



Again, you may want to check your facts before posting some of them do have Channel 9. Check the link:

http://ir.unitedcontinentalholdings....-newsArticle&ID=1631789&highlight=

Quoting holzmann (Thread starter):
F/As were offering the E seats for upgrade during the boarding process!



The flight attendants were offering E ? Really? I fly 4-6 flights a month and have not seen any flight attendants get close to being involved in that type of action. What would the process be for them to know what seats were available instantly? Did they tell the passengers to go back to the gate agent or what?

Quoting mcdu (Reply 3):
The pilot unions at both companies are led by certifiable lunatics.



Exactly what I've heard.

Quoting holzmann (Thread starter):
The only thing Premier Access buys me on a Continental A/C is (lowly) boarding group #3 and one (or two?) checked bag.



Then fly some other airline so maybe the next person in line will get the upgrade or have the chance to purchase an E+ when they buy their ticket.
Any views shared are strictly my own and do not a represent those of any former employer.
 
Rdh3e
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 1:43 pm

Quoting EaglePower83 (Reply 4):
Granted not all PMCO aircraft have E+. But UA should NOT be baiting and switching customers with E+ if the particular aircraft does not have it yet.
They better watch themselves.

Lol.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 5):
Does exit row/bulkhead seating on non E+ equipped aircraft qualify as E+?

Ding Ding Ding! We have a winner. The extra legroom seats on the PMCO aircraft are "economy plus" for all purposes, so why not sell them as such?
 
Goldenshield
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 2:22 pm

Quoting mcdu (Reply 3):
As to the PA announcement, CO ALPA is telling pilots to say this and the lemmings are repeating the ALPA script. It only reminds me of flying an express flight where the crew takes great pleasure in saying "this flight is operated by Skywest".

So, you would rather they be rude and indignant about it? Yeah, real professional there...
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phxa340
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 3:00 pm

Quoting holzmann (Thread starter):
So how in the world does UAL sell Economy Plus on A/C where it does NOT exist? Don't they know this could be a class action lawsuit waiting to happen?

This thread should be straight up deleted.

1. PMUA and PMCO have Economy + in most of the fleet so the poster is flat out wrong
2. This is just going to turn into another UA bashing thread ...
 
mogandoCI
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 3:05 pm

Quoting holzmann (Thread starter):
Yesterday I flew IAH-BWI on a "Continental" 737-800. It was the second time in as many weeks on two separate trips that I was put onto a "Continental" A/C. The previous one was a ORD-IAD flight.

What totally confuses me is that during the check-in process, UAL still asks you if you want to upgrade to Economy Plus, even if the A/C doesn't actually have Economy Plus. The case was even more blatant on the IAH-BWI flight yesterday as F/As were offering the E+ seats for upgrade during the boarding process! BUT "Continental" A/C DO NOT HAVE E+ SEATS!!! There is NO extra leg room! The only thing Premier Access buys me on a Continental A/C is (lowly) boarding group #3 and one (or two?) checked bag. NO extra leg room. Heck, there isn't even CHANNEL 9 on Continental A/C. I usually can sleep for hours to the sweet music of ATC calls going back and forth; it's how I track the flight without a map! Channel 9 is the best in-flight entertainment there is!!!

So how in the world does UAL sell Economy Plus on A/C where it does NOT exist? Don't they know this could be a class action lawsuit waiting to happen?

Finally, I thought it was über funny yesterday that the captain during his greetings referred to the crew SEVERAL times as a Houston-based, CONTINENTAL crew. Haha. Take that United! Quite the contrast to the cheery, BS welcome video played a few seconds later featuring Jeff Smisek.

Even on non-converted PMCO aircraft, the first row of econ and usually the emergency exit rows are marketed as Y+, since they have legroom anywhere between 36 and 38"
 
IAHFLYR
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 3:11 pm

Quoting PHXA340 (Reply 12):
This thread should be straight up deleted.



I second that idea, even though I'm done with my bashing of the airline, I'm just trying to make it work best for ME!  
Any views shared are strictly my own and do not a represent those of any former employer.
 
blueman87
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 3:33 pm

Quoting PHXA340 (Reply 12):
2. This is just going to turn into another UA bashing thread ...

After all United breaks Guiters and dont pay for them
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brilondon
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 3:41 pm

Quoting PHXA340 (Reply 12):
This thread should be straight up deleted.

1. PMUA and PMCO have Economy + in most of the fleet so the poster is flat out wrong
2. This is just going to turn into another UA bashing thread ...

Just because you don't agree with the poster, why should the entire thread be deleted. He may not have all his facts but that is why people come on these forums to educate themselves. So what if it is a United bashing thread, you don't have to respond to or read it.

Now I have been on UA flights to get back to YXU to visit my parents. It does suck when you pay for Y+ and they just stick you in an exit row or bulk head seat. I have paid for the up grade and yet they stick me in the exit row, and my seat mate was not impressed because he did not have an arm due to an accident and was not supposed to be in the exit row due to regulations stating that you must be physically able to open the emergency exit or assist people in the event of an emergency. I don't suppose that they make accommodation for him. I have no love loss for this airline and would rather have nothing to do with it but I don't have a viable option.
Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
 
IAHFLYR
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 4:43 pm

Quoting brilondon (Reply 15):
I have paid for the up grade and yet they stick me in the exit row



Okay call me stupid, but I just don't get it. When you buy the upgrade why don't you select the seat you want at that time?

Every time I am offered an upgrade, whether buying the flexible fare or the full fare Y ticket I select my seat at the time of purchase. Even when I am provided the upgrade via the premium services upgrade program I'll change the seat if I don't particularly like what I was assigned.
Any views shared are strictly my own and do not a represent those of any former employer.
 
holzmann
Topic Author
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 4:57 pm

Last week, I flew DCA-IAD on a US A320. I sat in E+. I had extra legroom. I had channel 9. Yesterday, I flew IAH-BWI on a CO 737-800. I did not have extra legroom. I did not have channel 9. None of seats had the stickers advertising Economy Plus, YET I was given the option during check-in to select E+ seating. Additionally, the F/As offered "Economy Plus" seats to those wanting to pay the upgrade fee.

These are the facts.
 
aloges
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 5:04 pm

Quoting holzmann (Reply 17):
Last week, I flew DCA-IAD on a US A320.

You did what?    If that is one of

Quoting holzmann (Reply 17):
the facts

I'm inclined to believe that your account of them may have some more holes in it elsewhere.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
IAHFLYR
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 5:04 pm

Quoting holzmann (Reply 17):
These are the facts



But they are disputed!   

And you've stated them previously, now how about answering some of the questions I asked?
Any views shared are strictly my own and do not a represent those of any former employer.
 
RushmoreAir
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 9:43 pm

Quoting www.united.com:

Want more space for your trip?

Enjoy more room to work and relax on your next flight. Economy Plus seating gives more legroom near the front of the economy cabin.
http://www.united.com/CMS/en-US/prod...velproducts/Pages/EconomyPlus.aspx



Bulkhead seats and exit row seats both offer more legroom than regular economy and are both (on average) further forward on the aircraft. It is completely legitimate for United to market these "better" seats as Y+, by United's own definition of Economy Plus. It's not their problem that you expect "stickers advertising Economy Plus" or the standard Y+ section.

See the ERJ-145 seat map for example. Both the bulkhead seats and the exit row seats are marked as Economy Plus.

http://www.united.com/web/en-US/cont...light/aircraft/emb145/default.aspx

Or the 738 version 2 - (which may be exactly what you flew on) - both bulkhead and exit row seats are marked as Y+.

http://www.united.com/web/en-US/cont.../inflight/aircraft/737/800/v2.aspx

Whether it is a good business decision to market a slightly different product as Y+ is debatable, but it is certainly within United's right to do so.
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777ord
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 10:38 pm

You seem to be REALLY upset by this experience. As a UNITED employee, I am sorry to hear that your experience wasn't up to your expectations.

However, as has been mentioned previously. the "Sub-Continental" part of United is really working hard to adjust their fleet. Streamline service and announcements as well as numerous other items. If you consider the magnitude of the operation. That is, merging two massive airlines into one, does take time. Unless United Said "no more flying til we're fully merged" yea, they wouldn't exist anymore.

Yesterday, and today I flew on UA from IAH-MEX and even the 735 that operated both legs offered Y+. Please be aware that the United side normally displays "ECONOMY PLUS" quite openly in those particular seats, whereas Continental simply labels it on the seat tray table, and, overhead bin signage.
 
holzmann
Topic Author
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Tue May 08, 2012 11:46 pm

@Aloges:

Ich muss mich für meinen Tippfehler entschuldigen. Ich meinte UA A320!

But okay. I stand corrected, and I now see MY error.

When I checked in and selected my seats, I was under the impression that ALL the seats in the blue-ish shaded area were Economy Plus and NOT just the bulkhead and Emergency seats highlighted in blue. Blue shaded area vs. blue-shaded seats. I just glanced at the map, saw the shaded area, selected two seats within it and thought I was getting Economy Plus. And then the F/As were advertising E+ upgrades over the PA, they must have meant seats only available in these specific rows only.

I used Photoshop/Stroke to highlight the area in question:

http://i46.tinypic.com/n6xnxw.jpg

I stand corrected! Vielen Dank!
 
RyanairGuru
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RE: UAL E+ Class Action Lawsuit?

Wed May 09, 2012 2:23 am

Quoting holzmann (Reply 22):
Blue shaded area vs. blue-shaded seats. I just glanced at the map, saw the shaded area, selected two seats within it and thought I was getting Economy Plus. And then the F/As were advertising E+ upgrades over the PA, they must have meant seats only available in these specific rows only.

OK, I know what you mean. That is a UA-CO confusion which hasn't been straightened out yet.

On CO the seats forward of the wing were reserved for elites, but were standard seats - very similar to US "Choice" seats and whatever it is AA call the green seats on their seat maps. On CO seats maps this area was shaded blue (as you can see on your link). On non-converted PMCO aircraft this still applies.

I realise that this is somewhat confusing, but only blue seats are Y+. On the new PMCO-United.com this applies to all seat maps regards of whether the frame is PMUA or PMCO. Blue seats = Y+

I know the blue shading is confusing (maybe deceiving if you aren't aware) but this will be done away with in time once the Y+ mods are completed.


I hope that makes sense, and I really hope you enjoy your future PMCO flights!
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