don
Topic Author
Posts: 251
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 4:44 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 8:41 pm

Emirates A380 operating EK 241 to Toronto just did a missed approach in Toronto due to wind shear and decided to divert to Ottawa. It commenced the diversion around 1630 local time.

CYYZ 012000Z 09017G25KT 12SM VCSH OVC007 13/12 A2964 RMK SF8 SLP040
TAF CYYZ 011739Z 0118/0224 09018G28KT 4SM -RA BR BKN006 OVC012
TEMPO 0118/0122 6SM -RA BR SCT006 OVC010
FM012200 11018G28KT 1SM RA BR BKN004 OVC008
TEMPO 0122/0124 3SM -RA BR SCT004 OVC008
PROB30 0122/0124 VRB25G35KT 1/2SM +TSRA BR BKN003 OVC008CB
FM020000 22015G25KT P6SM -SHRA BKN020
TEMPO 0200/0203 5SM -SHRA BR BKN006 OVC025
FM020300 22012KT P6SM BKN025
FM021500 22012G22KT P6SM BKN040
FM021700 23015G25KT P6SM BKN050
TEMPO 0223/0224 P6SM -SHRA
BECMG 0223/0224 22012KT RMK NXT FCST BY 012100Z
 
User avatar
longhauler
Posts: 4941
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:00 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 8:53 pm

Ottawa, now (and for the next 10 weeks) has only one runway for transport sized aircraft. I could see holding now if a bunch of diversions are headed there!
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
Viscount724
Posts: 18858
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 9:07 pm

Listening to Ottawa ATC on Liveatc.net, EK241 recently declared a Mayday, probably due to low fuel, and emergency vehicles were dispatched. However, they just cancelled the Mayday. I think they said they had 530 passengers and crew.
 
Viscount724
Posts: 18858
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 9:18 pm

EK241 just landed runway 14 at YOW.
 
don
Topic Author
Posts: 251
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 4:44 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 9:21 pm

From liveatc: EK 241 just landed in Ottawa R/W 14 and many discussions on the taxi route, Is this the first A380 in CYOW?
 
yellowtail
Posts: 3709
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 3:46 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 9:59 pm

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 2):
I think they said they had 530 passengers and crew.
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 3):
EK241 just landed runway 14 at YOW.

now what do they do. is there a crew on board with enough flyable time to refuel and get going to YYZ again?
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
User avatar
longhauler
Posts: 4941
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:00 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 11:08 pm

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 3):
EK241 just landed runway 14 at YOW.

I can't imagine an A380 doing a non-precision approach into an unfamiliar airport.
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
ssteve
Posts: 1133
Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2011 8:32 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 11:11 pm

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 5):
now what do they do. is there a crew on board with enough flyable time to refuel and get going to YYZ again?

Grab a beer, pop a slide, and hit the bars.
 
hiflyeras
Posts: 1467
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 6:48 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 11:18 pm

Geez....not enough fuel for even a single go-around? Granted I don't know if they were circling for a long time but it seems odd that they only made one approach before diverting.
 
Auchmithie
Posts: 149
Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2010 6:37 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 11:31 pm

http://www.theeksource.com reports aircraft as A6-EDD
 
Slarty
Posts: 302
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2005 5:23 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 11:33 pm

Flightaware shows the tracking ... zoom in around Toronto/Ottawa area.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/U...1/history/20120601/0555Z/OMDB/CYYZ
 
Viscount724
Posts: 18858
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 11:54 pm

Just took off from YOW Runway 14, about 2.5 hours after landing. Will mean about a 5 hour delay into YYZ, but weather is still a problem there.
 
kl692
Posts: 636
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 11:34 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Fri Jun 01, 2012 11:55 pm

Quoting HiFlyerAS (Reply 8):
Geez....not enough fuel for even a single go-around? Granted I don't know if they were circling for a long time but it seems odd that they only made one approach before diverting.

Yes they did a lot of circling along with LH but LH landed while EK was on it's way to CYOW.

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 11):
They just advised YOW Ground that they will be ready to start engines in 5 to 10 minutes to return to YYZ, and the controller said YYZ has advised that they will be given priority for landing due to the diversion. Apparently still a lot of delays to YYZ due to weather. If they do leave YOW in the next 15 or 20 minutes they will have spent about 2.5 hours there, and arrival YYZ will be around 5 hours late.

Just got home from the airport and no show for EK
A310, A330,A346,B73H, B747,B772,B77W,CRJ
 
Viscount724
Posts: 18858
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:08 am

YOW newspaper website item, with photo, on the A380's visit to YOW.
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/News/Ca...g%20in%20Ottawa/6716968/story.html
 
don
Topic Author
Posts: 251
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 4:44 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:27 am

Return flight to YYZ came on the Toronto East Radar frequency and was told to hold again at Imeba fix near Lake Simcoe. But the hold was cancelled after one orbit and now being given radar vectors. Also advised that windshear is still being reported at YYZ.
 
KeKeKumba
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Jul 18, 2010 1:34 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:38 am

Words cannot describe the feeling of joy I got when I heard this was coming in.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8007/7317447322_8855ab9564_b.jpg

Lots of spotters, some news crews, and just generally curious people lingering around while I was there.
 
PHX787
Posts: 7877
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 7:46 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:40 am

How far is it flying time between YYZ and YOW ?
Follow me on twitter: www.twitter.com/phx787
 
pliersinsight
Posts: 212
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 6:06 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:43 am

Quoting SSTeve (Reply 7):
Quoting yellowtail (Reply 5):now what do they do. is there a crew on board with enough flyable time to refuel and get going to YYZ again?
Grab a beer, pop a slide, and hit the bars.

The quote of the week, if not the month!
 
KeKeKumba
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Jul 18, 2010 1:34 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:44 am

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 17):

40 minutes.
 
Viscount724
Posts: 18858
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:46 am

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 17):
How far is it flying time between YYZ and YOW ?

About 45 minutes, block time 1 hour, 197 nm.
 
don
Topic Author
Posts: 251
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 4:44 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:54 am

EK 241 just landed on R/W 15R. Long long day for the crew and the pax. Luckily this is the long layover for the crew; 3 nights instead of the 2 nights on MON/WED flights.
 
canoeguy
Posts: 9
Joined: Sat Aug 06, 2005 9:14 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 3:07 am

Just happened to be standing at the right place at the right time for this shaky 16 second feature....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5jroLwhNHg&feature=youtu.be
 
PHX787
Posts: 7877
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 7:46 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 3:43 am

Quoting canoeguy (Reply 22):

THAT is beautiful! thanks for sharing!
Follow me on twitter: www.twitter.com/phx787
 
Thenoflyzone
Posts: 2284
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 4:42 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 3:58 am

YOW is the official alternate airport for EK's A380 flight to YYZ, ahead of YUL.

Quoting longhauler (Reply 6):
I can't imagine an A380 doing a non-precision approach into an unfamiliar airport.

Dont know if they flew the VOR-DME 14 approach, but runway 14 is now equipped with a RNAV Approach with an LPV minimum (DH of 253 ft AGL). Thus making it a precision approach capable runway for aircraft that are able to fly the LPV.

Thenoflyzone

[Edited 2012-06-01 21:07:35]
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
YYZatcboy
Posts: 1001
Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2005 2:15 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 4:12 am

No RNAV or RNP approach is a precision aproach especially for alternate minimums. That being said since YOW is likely a diversion airport they probably had all of the RNP and RNAV approaches in their database.

Did anyone else divert?
DHC1/3/4 MD11/88 L1011 A319/20/21/30 B727 735/6/7/8/9 762/3 E175/90 CRJ/700/705 CC150. J/S DH8D 736/7/8
 
Cyanide72
Posts: 23
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2011 8:40 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 4:25 am

I am so terribly disappointed I missed this! Had it not been for a commitment with someone else, I'd have definitely gone to YOW and grabbed a bunch of pictures.
 
don
Topic Author
Posts: 251
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 4:44 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 4:32 am

I just realized that all this excitement happened on the 3rd anniversary of the first Emirates A380 flight to Toronto.
 
katanapilot
Posts: 157
Joined: Fri Oct 01, 2004 2:25 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 4:46 am

i have never been so angry in my life!!!! (ok maybe that's an exaggeration but i'm very bitter). I was out of town tonight and come back to find out there was an A380 in Ottawa! That's probably the last one we'll see until 2025 when we have daily flights to Dubai hahha.
 
sstsomeday
Posts: 821
Joined: Thu Oct 26, 2006 2:32 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 5:36 am

Most of my flying experience has been in Ottawa, and at that time runway 14, and Runway 17 in the North Field (for smaller A/C) were the least-used. Landing on 14 meant the 380 approached on final over the most populous area around the airport, and flew low over the city. I wonder how much of a show it put on for those on the ground (considering the low cloud cover.)
I come in peace
 
76er
Posts: 446
Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2007 8:04 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 6:55 am

Quoting HiFlyerAS (Reply 8):
Geez....not enough fuel for even a single go-around? Granted I don't know if they were circling for a long time but it seems odd that they only made one approach before diverting.

Completely normal in todays world of >100$ a barrol oil, even for EK.
 
aeroflop
Posts: 53
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:12 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 7:16 am

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 23):
Dont know if they flew the VOR-DME 14 approach, but runway 14 is now equipped with a RNAV Approach with an LPV minimum (DH of 253 ft AGL). Thus making it a precision approach capable runway for aircraft that are able to fly the LPV.

So they had to manually land the aircraft???  Wow!  Wow!
I heard its autoland only   
 
boeingorbust
Posts: 164
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2011 3:44 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 7:31 am

Low fuel? Are they not required to have enough fuel to provide one go around and enough to divert to alternate and land?
 
76er
Posts: 446
Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2007 8:04 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 8:32 am

Yes. but that's not what HiFlyerAS implied. Although fuel polocies are different per airline/country, if you have used up your so-called 'route reserve fuel' (or 'contingency fuel') upon arrival at your destination and you didn't upload anything extra prior to departure, and you feel it's neccesary to divert, there's fuel for a single go-around. In this manner you'll arrive at your alternate airport with 'final reserve fuel' remaining, usually 30 minutes worth. Anyting less than that's means mayday.

[Edited 2012-06-02 01:34:07]
 
migair54
Posts: 2101
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2007 4:24 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:28 pm

Quoting boeingorbust (Reply 31):
Low fuel? Are they not required to have enough fuel to provide one go around and enough to divert to alternate and land?

Yes, but then if you arrive Ottawa and they tell you, You are number 10 for APP becuase many diversion, then Declare a MAYDAY is the action require to jump the cue and don´t play with fire.

Carrying extra fuel is carrying extra weigh so burning more fuel and If the plane was full out Dubai I don´t think they were able to carry much extra fuel.
 
falkerker
Posts: 162
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:53 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 12:48 pm

Quoting 76er (Reply 29):
Completely normal in todays world of >100$ a barrol oil, even for EK

Correct me if Im wrong, but carrying extra fuel means burning half of it just getting to your destination. If they were to take fuel from DXB for a long standby, they would have to take twice as much as they´d need for that standby. At right-testicle-per-barrel prices that´s a big no-no for airlines.
 
71Zulu
Posts: 1605
Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2006 12:42 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 1:00 pm

Flight track from Flightaware

Clickable links only please!
 
ltbewr
Posts: 12362
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 1:15 pm

Wind shear is a very serious issue and EK made the right call. I think the AF A340 that crash landed and went off the runway at YYZ during a storm a few years ago that probalbly should have diverted may have encourage the decision here. While diversions have their own issues from additional fuel use, crew time outs, more risks with another takeoff and landing cycle, it is far better than trying to land in potentially dangerous conditions. It was kinda cool for those around or at YOW to see the A380.
 
User avatar
lightsaber
Crew
Posts: 11747
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 2:35 pm

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 36):

Wind shear is a very serious issue and EK made the right call.

I would say a good call from the safety side. Doesn't EK only sit on the ground for 2 hours at YYZ? This would have quite an impact on the return flight...

So much for a shortage of A380 ready airports...  

Lightsaber
"They did not know it was impossible, so they did it!" - Mark Twain
 
User avatar
longhauler
Posts: 4941
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:00 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 2:52 pm

Quoting thenoflyzone (Reply 23):
Dont know if they flew the VOR-DME 14 approach, but runway 14 is now equipped with a RNAV Approach with an LPV minimum (DH of 253 ft AGL). Thus making it a precision approach capable runway for aircraft that are able to fly the LPV.

You must have access to different approaches into YOW. The best I have in my books is the RNAV (GNSS) Rwy 14, with an MDA of 373'AGL + the required 50' for an MDA of 423'.

But really what I was referring to was doing an uncommon approach type, to an airport they have not likely seen before in stressful conditions as now they are looking at an arrival fuel estimate below that they are used to.

Quoting migair54 (Reply 33):
Yes, but then if you arrive Ottawa and they tell you, You are number 10 for APP becuase many diversion, then Declare a MAYDAY is the action require to jump the cue and don´t play with fire.

Fine as long as the 9 in front of you have not done the same thing for the same reason. (Happened to me once in SFO)!

Quoting falkerker (Reply 34):
Correct me if Im wrong, but carrying extra fuel means burning half of it just getting to your destination. If they were to take fuel from DXB for a long standby, they would have to take twice as much as they´d need for that standby. At right-testicle-per-barrel prices that´s a big no-no for airlines.

The concept is "protected" fuel, or "unprotected" fuel. If you are carrying extra fuel, you have to consider the reason. For example if you required 2000 kgs of extra fuel for the possibility of de-icing at your departure point, that would be "unprotected" as once you are airborne, it is no longer needed. But, if you required 2000 kgs of extra fuel for the possibility of holding for CBs at your destination, that would be "protected" fuel. Namely, enough is boarded so that you would have 2000 kgs extra at destination, and the flight planner would calculate how much is required so as to arrive with 2000 kgs extra.

If extra fuel is required, it is required ... no-no or not. It's a cost of doing business.
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
Flightsimboy
Posts: 1408
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2005 12:49 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 3:53 pm

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 37):
Doesn't EK only sit on the ground for 2 hours at YYZ?

EK 241 Arr 1545 Actual 2108
EK 242 Dep 2140 Actual 2337

EK is on the ground in YYZ for 5 hour 55 minutes.
 
User avatar
lightsaber
Crew
Posts: 11747
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 5:26 pm

Quoting flightsimboy (Reply 39):
EK is on the ground in YYZ for 5 hour 55 minutes.

Thank you. I'm always happy to see correct facts. However, a 2 hour delay will still impact connections.   Oh well, I bet there were nice hotels made available.  

Lightsaber
"They did not know it was impossible, so they did it!" - Mark Twain
 
bmacleod
Posts: 2453
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2001 3:10 am

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 5:34 pm

When did YOW get clearance/upgraded for A380 operations? Then again it serviced 747s so doesn't that clear it for the A380?
The engine is the heart of an airplane, but the pilot is its soul.
 
cptspeaking
Posts: 567
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 2:49 pm

Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 5:55 pm

Quoting longhauler (Reply 38):
But really what I was referring to was doing an uncommon approach type, to an airport they have not likely seen before in stressful conditions as now they are looking at an arrival fuel estimate below that they are used to.

Not an issue for experienced pilots. I fly corporate jets and rarely a month goes by when I don't visit at least 3 or 4 airports I've never been to before. It doesn't add to the stress level or create any safety hazards. Approaches are briefed well in advance and while the specific MDA/DH numbers and frequencies and courses might be different, for the most part one approach is flown the same as the next, no matter what airport's runway you end up landing on.

I see the 380 in YYZ pretty often when I'm there - it's always a spectacle for me, so I can't imagine how cool it must be for people at an airport that doesn't expect to see it!
...and don't call me Shirley!!
 
71Zulu
Posts: 1605
Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2006 12:42 am

RE: Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 10:22 pm

Quoting bmacleod (Reply 41):
When did YOW get clearance/upgraded for A380 operations?

It didn't. Av Herald says after it landed on 14, it had to u-turn on the runway and then backtrack to the ramp turnoff.

http://avherald.com/h?article=45083bf7&opt=0

http://www.gcmap.com/diagrams/pdf/CYOW.pdf
Clickable links only please!
 
Viscount724
Posts: 18858
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 11:36 pm

Since the aircraft finally landed at YYZ about 19 hours after departure from DXB, how do crew duty day limitations work for both the pilots and cabin crew? Seems like a very long day, over 20 hours considering when they would have had to report at DXB prior to the flight.

I assume the extra relief crew carried are a factor. How many cockpit crew would there be on that flight? What would the cutoff point be in terms of duty day where the flight would have to be cancelled and passengers put up in hotels for the night?
 
emirates202
Posts: 237
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:13 am

RE: Emirates 380 Diverted To Ottawa On June 1

Sat Jun 02, 2012 11:50 pm

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 37):

It ended up leaving at 11:37pm. About 2 hours behind schedule.
Fly Emirates, Hello Tomorrow

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests