jgore
Posts: 518
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2002 2:41 am

Average Engine Working Percentaje During Takeoff?

Sun Jun 09, 2002 4:41 pm

Hi everyone
Does anyone know what is the average percentage the engines are working during takeoff ? could it be 90-93 percent ?.
Thanks in advance

jgore  Smile
 
rmm
Posts: 518
Joined: Sun Feb 04, 2001 10:34 am

RE: Average Engine Working Percentage During Takeoff?

Sun Jun 09, 2002 5:59 pm

Are you talking about overall performance or N1 speed at T/O?

Rmm
 
ismangun
Posts: 115
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 6:35 pm

RE: Average Engine Working Percentaje During Takeoff?

Sun Jun 09, 2002 11:40 pm

Well, with average T/O weight of 48 metric tons (around 106.000 lbs), our planes (737-200s with JT8D-17) requires around 95% N1. But T/O with full reduction (1.94EPR or 93%N1 with OAT 31 deg centigrade) is not unusual if the A/C is not so heavy and the runway conditions not restricting.
If it's an Airbus, I'll take the bus
 
Guest

RE: Average Engine Working Percentaje During Takeoff?

Sun Jun 09, 2002 11:40 pm

Hola Javier,
As always, there are several correct answers to your question.

Generally speaking, when it comes to turbofan and turbojet engines, you want to use 100% of an engine's "rated" thrust for takeoff. It must be remembered that (in very simplistic terms) turbine engines are not supercharged, but rather normally aspirated - in other words, they lose power with altitude just like a Cessna 152. The percentage of N1 (on most turbofans) or EPR (many turbojets) required to obtain the engine's full rated thrust will vary significantly depending upon airport elevation and outside air temperature. For example, on the aircraft that I fly, on a cool day at a sea level airport the engines will develop their maximum rated thrust with an N1 somewhere in the upper 80's say for example 88.7%. Go to a higher elevation airport on a warm day and the N1 will be higher, for example 93.4%. (As I type this, I'm looking at the Static Takeoff Thrust Setting Chart for our aircraft. Depending on the airport elevation and outside air temperature, the N1 settings vary from a low of 84.2% to a high of 96.1%.) These numbers will, of course, vary from engine to engine, but you get my point. On most older generation engines, the flightcrew is required to come up with a takeoff power setting from a set of charts or tables. In later generation engines with DEECs (Digital Electronic Engine Controllers) or FADECs, the pilots only have to set the powerlevers into the takeoff detent and monitor things while the computer takes care of the rest.

Just to make things a bit more interesting, some aircraft have larger engines installed than they were designed for. These engines are "Flat-Rated" back down to what the airframe was designed to handle. In other words, say for example, an airplane was designed to use 10,000 LB thrust engines, the aircraft designers might specify 12,000 LB thrust engines and limit their thrust to 10,000 LBS. Why would they want to do this? Simple, remember that turbine engines are "normally aspirated" and start loosing power the moment they start to climb. By using a larger engine, the aircraft can operate at higher altitudes or temperatures before it runs out of power. (Gee, I hope I said that right - it seems awkward. Oh well, there are others who are better qualified than me to clarify this.)

On many turbojet aircraft, flight crews are also allowed to perform Reduced Power Takeoffs. This method would also result in reduced N1 or EPR indications. There are several reasons why a flight crew might want to do this and a couple of methods that they can use to do it. I don't have the time to go into this in any detail now; but if you're interested I recommend that you search the archives, I'm sure this topic has been discussed before.

Turboprop engines are similar, only instead of N1 or EPR, they usually measure their power output in Percent Torque. For those guys it's a bit simpler, they simply advance the power levers until the engines reach either their torque limit or their temperature limit.

Jetguy
 
ismangun
Posts: 115
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 6:35 pm

RE: Average Engine Working Percentaje During Takeoff?

Thu Jun 13, 2002 11:43 am

Just to add little piece of info to Jetguy's explanation, T/O thrust is reduced when applicable to prolong service-life, noise reduction, and probably some other reasons I don't quite understand.  Smile
If it's an Airbus, I'll take the bus
 
Metwrench
Posts: 715
Joined: Fri Aug 17, 2001 11:25 am

RE: Average Engine Working Percentage During Takeoff?

Fri Jun 14, 2002 2:43 pm

What do the Performance charts say?

Engine performance is based on "sea level, average day '70 F temp".

Performance charts are based on these ref's. The charts will compensate for say, 6,000 Ft altitude and 100 F. It might say that 93% is the target torque. In that case, 93% is in reality 100%.

Just remember that all performance figures are based on a "Standard Day". 100% doesn't necessarily mean 100%.

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