wingscrubber
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Taxiways

Sun Jul 14, 2002 8:00 am

Something which never occured to me before - How do pilots navigate the maze of taxiways at big international airports? How are collisions avoided etc?
Do they use a map of the airport? What is safe taxiing speed? A pilot friend of mine told me that an aircraft should taxi at no more than a fast walking pace, but whilst flying to houston in a continental 777 the flight information screen was registering our speed at about 30mph.

Pete
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XFSUgimpLB41X
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RE: Taxiways

Sun Jul 14, 2002 8:13 am

Usual taxispeed is limited to 25 knots... this is usally read out in the INS or FMS or GPS.... This equates to about 30 mph.

And yes.. you use a map. They are provided in the Jepp or NOS charts with all the taxiway letters and routes. Plus the airports are pretty clearly marked in most cases, so it isnt a problem finding your way if you have a map. We are told specifically by ground control who to follow, what runways/taxiways to hold short of and taxi on, and those instructions are read back to ground control. When pilots or controllers get complacent is when the collisions happen. You should clear left and right when crossing any taxiway or runway.
Chicks dig winglets.
 
jhooper
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RE: Taxiways

Sun Jul 14, 2002 8:40 am

A pilot friend of mine told me that an aircraft should taxi at no more than a fast walking pace

I know the books recommend this, but I don't know anyone who really taxies this slow.
Last year 1,944 New Yorkers saw something and said something.
 
Guest

RE: Taxiways

Sun Jul 14, 2002 9:55 am

I agree with Jhooper:

Even when I am taxiing in my little Piper Warrior 151, I doubt someone running could keep up with me (or any other GA pilot), I suppose I taxi around 15-20 mph (15 knots for sure).

It's simply not economical to waist time an fuel taxiing so slow. Most aircraft (even with idle thrust) won't saunter along at walking pace. My Warrior at 1000rpm (minimum smooth-running power) will roll much faster than a walking pace, I'd need to use brakes to keep it that slow.  Smile

Cameron
 
shaun3000
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RE: Taxiways

Sun Jul 14, 2002 3:43 pm

The taxi-no-faster-than-a-brisk-walk rule never made sense to me! If you taxied that slow then it'd take two hours to get across an airport the size of, say, DFW!!

I've yet to meet a pilot who acctually follows that rule. My instructors always made mention ofit, but it was always followed by a, "but, you know, if you wanna taxi faster, you know..." and they'd kinda trail off. Heh.
 
PW4084
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RE: Taxiways

Sun Jul 14, 2002 6:11 pm

Here's an example when the pilot would've probably done well to abide by the 'brisk walk' rule




http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001211X11355&key=1








 
shaun3000
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RE: Taxiways

Mon Jul 15, 2002 3:02 pm

Well, duh! If you even THINK you've experienced brake problems always go slow, ESPECIALLY when around terminals! And if you think you have a problem, why not TEST the brakes??? Maybe the above article should go under the "Stupid People" category.
 
Guest

RE: Taxiways

Mon Jul 15, 2002 3:46 pm

My airline's policy taxying 747 is 20 knots... 10 to 12 knots in turns... Going faster than that is not only dangerous, but builds trememendous heat on the tires and the brakes, for long taxis... we read speed on INS...
xxx
I am worldwide qualified, name it, Azerbaidjan to Zimbawe, and never get lost in the air... but on the ground it is not that easy, correct... since many of you are in the USA, I would say that one airport requiring extreme attention is ORD (Chicago O'Hare) where it is easy to confuse taxiways and where ground controllers have little patience...
xxx
My favorite airport is LHR (London Heathrow) where your taxiway route is indicated to you by switching taxiway centerlines lights to show the way you should proceed... turn left here, or go right there is clearly indicated...
xxx
Do not laugh about testing the brakes... some plane ended up once into the concourse with its nose because of a brake malfunction (anti skid release) at the old Denver Stapleton airport... for once they could deplane passengers fast, and not have to wait hours for someone semi-knowledgeable to position the passenger's jet way properly... or cleared to do so by his union contract.
(s) Skipper  Wink/being sarcastic
 
L-188
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RE: Taxiways

Mon Jul 15, 2002 4:18 pm

Actually PW4084 a bigger factor in that incident was the fact the Asiana skipper was ignoring wand signals from the marshaller.

He ignored instructions from the marshaller to slow down and was slow to start turning the aircraft into the gate. When he realized that he was going to over shoot he tried to force the aircraft around by goosing the outboard engine. All that did was swing him around and into the Aeroflot aircraft.

Heard that from several people who where working there that night.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
PW4084
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RE: Taxiways

Tue Jul 16, 2002 3:16 am

L-188, I figured that you'd know something about that incident  Smile I heard that the IL-62 sat for a long time up at the North Parking area before it was scrapped. Such a shame, huh. Luckily nobody was hurt. I've seen a good picture of the -400 winglet stuck in the stabilizer of the IL-62, but I couldn't find it when I posted earlier. The FDR really condemned that Captain regarding his statement about not adding thrust. I thought it was a good example of a taxiing mishap.

PW4084


 
PW4084
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RE: Taxiways

Tue Jul 16, 2002 7:14 am

Correction to my post above, there was one person hurt on the IL-62, thankfully it wasn't as bad as it could have been.
 
Whiskeyflyer
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RE: Taxiways

Tue Jul 16, 2002 7:17 pm

Related to taxiways and getting your way around on the ground (and getting lost) is actually a major safety issue with the FAA at present considering the runway incursion issue (Ref Singapore crash where wrong runway entered from a taxiway)

Click on http://www.faarsp.org
for the offical FAA perspective on the taxiway/runway issue and may help you understand how the aircraft get around on the ground.
Clicking on the ON THE GROUND section of the homepage of the site will give you good description of what the signs, lines mean etc.

Sometimes just the simple task of cutting the grass around the signs is a big help to finding way around.

Just a side thought.We once had a crew on our Freighter aircraft who where paid by Block Time who had a habit from time to time of taking, if possible, the scenic route around a certain large French airport adding extra time to their pay. Sometimes some people don't want the quickest taxi way home. Never knew if they split their extra drinking money with a tower person!
 
wingscrubber
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RE: Taxiways

Fri Jul 19, 2002 4:39 am

Fascinating, thanks for your input.

Pete
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VC-10
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RE: Taxiways

Fri Jul 19, 2002 5:17 am

My favorite airport is LHR (London Heathrow) where your taxiway route is indicated to you by switching taxiway centerlines lights to show the way you should proceed... turn left here, or go right there is clearly indicated...

I taxi around LHR, the c/l lights are only visible at night. During the day you have to navigate by taxiway blocks. That is to say all the taxiways and runways are divided into blocks and you are told to taxi to say..... block 57 and when you are either approaching the block or holding in the block you wi llbe further clearance to the next block

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