Tiger119
Topic Author
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Differences In Local ATC Positions

Sun Jan 25, 2004 1:05 pm

Do local controllers at airports change positions occasionally? Are they cross trained so they might work APP/DEP one day, Ground Control the next and Clearance Delivery the third for example? Or do controllers train initially for one specific position and stay there? I found several previous threads concerning controllers but I could not find one with this topic. Thank you.
Flying is the second greatest thrill known to mankind, landing is the first!
 
goboeing
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Sun Jan 25, 2004 1:15 pm

In small towers, like Class D for example, they only work at the tower position. In a slightly larger operation, such as a Class C airport, at least one that I know of rotates positions. One shift might be clearance delivery, then approach, then ground, then departure, then tower, etc. At the extremely large level, like a Class B TRACON or a high altitude center I would imagine that they only work that particular duty.

Nick
 
socalatc
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Sun Jan 25, 2004 6:15 pm

Controllers here in southern CA do not do Radar. However, We do switch positions from Local to ground, to Clearance, to Cab assist, back to ground ect...We do not spend too much time on one position. Towers that have an up-stairs and down stairs (tower and radar in one) IM not sure, I've never worked in that kind of place. I would imagine they would since the longest you can spend on one position is 2 hours.

So in response to your post, yes we are all checked out on all positions in the tower, and we do switch off throughout the day.
 
modesto2
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Mon Jan 26, 2004 4:01 am

I know for Bay Area class B, C airports like SFO, OAK and SJC, the NorCal TRACON is located somewhere near Sacramento. Therefore, these controllers don't have the opportunity to work DEP/APP.
 
socalatc
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Mon Jan 26, 2004 6:11 am

That's correct. Same as Southern California where all approaches/DEP's are done in San Diego at Socal TRACON. Seems to work much better.
 
flightsimfreak
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Mon Jan 26, 2004 7:56 am

In the case of a tower with the Tracon building below, they switch. My old home airport, Tri-cities international (KPSC), you would often here controllers switch.
 
BMAbound
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:35 am

The guy at FCA is both twr and gnd. Fun when he tells you to switch to gnd only to keep talking to you on that freq...  Big grin

No, as you figured, not a very busy airport, but I bet there's two of them there at times and someone for clearance del. and so on.

johan
Altitude is Insurance - Get Insured
 
socalatc
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Tue Jan 27, 2004 2:47 am

You are supposed to have a tower and ground controller at all times, however it gets very slow sometimes and one controller will end up working Ground/Tower. IM not sure what the rules are for contract towers, but this is actually a no-no at some FAA towers and you can get in big trouble.
 
goboeing
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Tue Jan 27, 2004 3:00 am

You are supposed to have a tower and ground controller at all times, however it gets very slow sometimes and one controller will end up working Ground/Tower. IM not sure what the rules are for contract towers, but this is actually a no-no at some FAA towers and you can get in big trouble.


I'm sure this must be allowed at contract towers because the one where I fly at is always down to one person in the non-busy times and ground and tower are combined. I don't see what the problem is at 9PM for example, when there's only likely to be one plane in the pattern at the most and there's not a whole lot of inbound or outbound traffic either.

Nick
 
ShyFlyer
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Tue Jan 27, 2004 3:41 am

At ABQ, Controllers rotate between Tower, Ground, and Clearance Delivery. I'm not too sure about App/Dep. Late nights, there is one (maybe two) in the Tower handling it all: App/Dep, Tower, Ground, Clearance Delivery. On a night flight (about 10:30/11:00 p.m.) from Socorro (ONM) to Double Eagle II (AEG) my instructor and I were handed off Center to ABQ Approach but given the Tower Freq. A few seconds of monitoring the freq and we knew why. That guy sounded like an auctioneer!
I lift things up and put them down.
 
socalatc
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Tue Jan 27, 2004 4:35 am

Goboeing,

I have also flown at a airport where one controller is working, It has been as early as 5PM and the local/ground is combined as one. I think contract towers are less strict about having a one person tower. Ill find out forsure.
 
InnocuousFox
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Tue Jan 27, 2004 4:40 am

Socal... you don't happen to work LAX TWR/GND do you?
Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
 
socalatc
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:41 pm

No.. However I have friends that do work there. I work at another airport in So.California.
 
ATM
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Sat Apr 03, 2004 8:47 am

Maybe I can answer the question since I manage a contract tower.

When it' slow ground control and local control (tower) will generally be combined. If it unexpectedly gets busy we will open ground control (split the positions.) During historically busy times, such as on the weekends, both ground an local will be open before traffic increases.

Rotation between positions will generally be every two hours.

Hope that helps.
 
baw2198
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Sat Apr 03, 2004 2:21 pm


Generally we work with ground and local (tower) staffed. We rotate through the positions when somebody gets close to 2 hrs. on. So you might start the day on ground-break-local-break-radar-break and then maybe back on ground. Also the rotation depends on staffing and training needs.

Generally though, ground and local being worked separatly.


Cheers,
Baw2198
"And remember, Keep your stick on the ice"--->Red Green
 
Tiger119
Topic Author
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Sat Apr 03, 2004 2:33 pm

This may have already been answered, but what the heck, I'll ask it anyway. 8 hour shifts, 10 hour shifts or 12 hours shifts? Does it make a difference if it is a contract tower or do the standards for duty time cover all towers and tracons? What about ARTCCs?
Flying is the second greatest thrill known to mankind, landing is the first!
 
baw2198
Posts: 587
Joined: Wed Dec 24, 2003 11:20 am

RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Sat Apr 03, 2004 2:47 pm

As far as the FAA goes, 8 hr shifts. You can go up to 10 hrs. in one day. No more than 6 days a week. Normally if you work up to 10 hrs/day its either OT or credit time after 8hrs.

Baw2198
"And remember, Keep your stick on the ice"--->Red Green
 
fspilot747
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RE: Differences In Local ATC Positions

Sat Apr 03, 2004 2:54 pm

In the airport I flew out of in SoCal (KFUL), I used to hear this alot: "Cessna XXXX, contact me on ground..." or vice versa.




FSP

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