TheBigOne
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2004 11:50 am

Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Sun Sep 05, 2004 1:24 am

I have often wondered about the number of windows on the upperdeck of early B747 aircraft. I can recall seeing photos of a number of early 747 (100 and 200 series) with only three windows on the upperdeck. Since then many of the same aircraft have got 10 windows on the upperdeck. Were these new windows added when the lounges were changed to regular seating? Did airline maintenance personnel cut new windows into the aircraft or were they always there, but just covered up?


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Frank Ebeling
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Frank C. Duarte Jr.




View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Kjell nilsson
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Konstantin Von Wedelstaedt



Look forward to the information pouring in!
Reach for the stars - they are closer than you think!
 
SATL382G
Posts: 2679
Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2004 12:02 am

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Sun Sep 05, 2004 2:00 am

The window modification was done by removing the old fuselage skin and replacing with a new section with the windows already built in.

This was very easy to see on NW 747-100s before they went to the bowling shoe scheme as the metal of the new section has a slightly different patina than the rest of the ship.

SATL382G


View Large View Medium

Photo © AirNikon



[Edited 2004-09-04 19:03:17]
"There’s nothing quite as exhilarating as being shot at and missed" --Winston Churchill
 
lorm
Posts: 377
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 4:31 am

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Sun Sep 05, 2004 3:12 am

Both the early 100 and 200 variants were produced with only 3 windows on each side. Eventually 10 became the standard on all production models, and some airlines even had modifications on early delivered aircraft, such as United and Continental.

Some carriers retained the 3 window standard and on later deliveries, TWA had seven windows plugged by Boeing with aluminum plates.

Interestingly and tragically TWA flight 800 (N93119) crash coverage on TV showed that some of these plugs were dislodged in the crash on the right side. Though left side covers remained in place.
Brick Windows
 
FTOHIST
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 2:20 pm

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Sun Sep 05, 2004 11:30 am

Our ex-Pan Am -121 (N747GE) has 3 windows on the left side, and only 2 windows on the right. What would be the forward-most window on the right is taken up by the upstairs galley.
 
miami1
Posts: 652
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2001 10:31 pm

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Sun Sep 05, 2004 7:59 pm

Qantas' first 747s (-200s) had 10 windows when delivered, even though the UD was used as a lounge - The "Captain Cook" Lounge. I remember reading the 10 windows were at QF's request, leading me to believe the were the first airline to have this option.
 
GDB
Posts: 12653
Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 6:25 pm

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Sun Sep 05, 2004 10:43 pm

BA's 747-136 aircraft were modded in the late 1970's.
 
Bofredrik
Posts: 1133
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 1999 4:17 pm

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Sun Sep 05, 2004 11:48 pm

I flew with a United B747-100 who had 10 windows but more rows so some seats did not have any other view than the wall... Not so nice for 8+ hours.
 
TheBigOne
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2004 11:50 am

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Mon Sep 06, 2004 9:52 am

Thank you for clearing that up. Its a question that has bugged me for many years! I have actually been to Air India's 747 crew training mock-up in Bombay, that still has a lounge on the upper deck. If only the lounges were still around today.....
Reach for the stars - they are closer than you think!
 
N1120A
Posts: 26467
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Mon Sep 06, 2004 2:49 pm

Hey, VS has bars on their aircraft. I don't think that any 742s were delivered with 3 windows, but then again does someone know any different
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
m404
Posts: 1875
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2003 4:43 pm

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Mon Sep 06, 2004 4:21 pm

If you ever see the #1 B747 (I don't know if it's at BFI museum or not any more) and interesting story about it went something like this.

Although it of course had the original 3 windows of the first -100s Boeing later painted in black the extra seven to be like the newer models (options) it was trying to sell.
Less sarcasm and more thought equal better understanding
 
tbear815
Posts: 689
Joined: Thu Jun 12, 2003 12:14 pm

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Mon Sep 06, 2004 4:35 pm

My first 747 take-off was in the old "Red Carpet Room" of UA's first 747. In the delivery model, there were ~7 gold fabric swivel chairs. Not a great arrangement as a lounge. After they retro'ed the -100's to the 10 window cabin, they created a terrific Polynesian style lounge with a circular sofa, card tables, a full service bar, and snacks for cocktails. Rarely did were any pax seated there - all the paxs were on the lower deck and would wander up to see and maybe have a drink. First class was first class then!

American never changed their few 747 aircraft. In fact, one of those old birds was flying SFO/HNL in '94. The UD had 16 business class seats and only three windows on each side. Comfortable, but sort of cramped.
 
feeble
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2004 1:28 am

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Mon Sep 06, 2004 5:53 pm

KLM just removed the plugs and put in windows Big grin


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Miguel Snoep

 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17092
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Mon Sep 06, 2004 11:37 pm

I don't think that any 742s were delivered with 3 windows, but then again does someone know any different

Yes there were. If nothing else, see Feeble's pic above.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
feeble
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2004 1:28 am

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Mon Sep 06, 2004 11:55 pm

Yes there were. If nothing else, see Feeble's pic above.
Yes indeed.

The first -200's were delivered with 3 windows each side.
The last -100's were delivered with 8 windows each side.
And most -100's nowadays are converted to 8 windows each side.
 
Vimanav
Posts: 1439
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 4:33 am

RE: Early 747 Upperdeck Windows

Tue Sep 07, 2004 1:32 am

AI's B742s currently have 8 windows on the UD port side and 10 on the starboard.

For those who still have doubts that some B742s were delivered with 3 windows on the UD...


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Mick Bajcar



rgds//Vimanav
Sarfaroshi kii tamannaa ab hamaare dil mein hai, Dekhnaa hai zor kitnaa baazu-e-qaatil mein hai

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests