2H4
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"Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Tue Jan 25, 2005 1:29 pm

Awhile back, a friend of mine picked up my FAR/AIM, thumbed through it, and asked me why the term "certificated" is used. I didn't have an answer for him. How is the meaning any different from "certified"?


2H4


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flyf15
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Tue Jan 25, 2005 1:47 pm

Although I, by no means, am sure on this...I am going to guess that "certificated" refers directly to "a holder of an FAA certificate" whereas certified may be more ambigous.

But then again, I am only a certificated certified flight instructor  Big thumbs up

[Edited 2005-01-25 05:48:07]
 
SlamClick
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Tue Jan 25, 2005 2:13 pm

I believe it to be grammatically correct.

certificated meaning "posessing a certificate"

whereas certified means something more like "endorsed authoritatively"

Anyway, the FAA tells me they don't certify anything, they issue certificates.

Pretty fine point, but that is the word they use.
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2H4
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Tue Jan 25, 2005 2:50 pm

Anyway, the FAA tells me they don't certify anything, they issue certificates.


Ha, so no pilots are actually certified to fly airplanes....nor are the airplanes themselves certified to carry passengers. You could win some bar bets with flying buddies with that...


2H4
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Arrow
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Tue Jan 25, 2005 2:51 pm

It's just another mindless butchery of the English language. The word is certified, and if you're certified you have a certificate. Certificated is one of those non-words that someone started using because it sounds more important -- and now it's become accepted usage and probably shows up in dictionaries. Sort of like discombobulated -- that's what happens to you when you get decertified.
Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
 
air2gxs
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Tue Jan 25, 2005 10:43 pm

Actually Arrow, I believe it is a transitive verb

In common usage:

I am a certificated airframe and powerplant mechanic.

I am certified to maintain aircraft because I have an airframe and powerplant certificate.
 
SPREE34
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Wed Jan 26, 2005 12:28 am

You certify used cars and chicken.

You certificate airmen.
I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
 
Ralgha
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Wed Jan 26, 2005 2:35 am

a, so no pilots are actually certified to fly airplanes....nor are the airplanes themselves certified to carry passengers. You could win some bar bets with flying buddies with that...


Dangit you just ruined my lucrative career, now I have to go back to earning money above the table.
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Arrow
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Wed Jan 26, 2005 7:54 am

OK --

Air2GXS, you're right. Collins English Dictionary does have "certificate" as a Tr. verb, meaning "to authorize by or present with an official document." It's the third of 3 meanings for certificate, and its an old French usage from the middle ages. I did say it was probably in a dictionary -- but I thought it would be a modern vernacular usage, not old French.

Certify is by far the more common usage, and there is no example of "certificate" as a verb where certify doesn't work better, is simpler, has fewer letters -- all that stuff.

SPREE34 -- sorry, but you certify airmen, and mechanics, and all manner of certifiable folks. Whether you fly jets or farm chickens, you get certified.

One final note -- why in god's name would you say certificated when certified does the trick. The other one that drives me nuts is endorsation instead of endorsement. Where is Shakespeare when we need him.

Having gone through all that, I do believe I'm now certifiable. My wife has thought so for years.
Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
 
SPREE34
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Wed Jan 26, 2005 9:46 am

Arrow....."Having gone through all that, I do believe I'm now certifiable. My wife has thought so for years."

You're in good company.  Smile
I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
 
airplay
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Wed Jan 26, 2005 10:15 am

In the context of aircraft certification, if an airplane is "certificated" it means that a type certificate has been issued. If something is "certified" it means that it has been proven to meet the airworthiness standards associated with aircraft and documented in the type certificate and an appropriate docuement (often another "certificate") has been issued.

Its not exactly the best use of the terms, but it has been generally used and accepted in aircraft certification circles.

The Airbus A380 has not yet been "certificated" by any airworthiness authority.

 
videns
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Wed Jan 26, 2005 2:57 pm

It probably has to do with wording in case "something" happens. Lawyers are quite good at finding (And creating) loopholes... if the "proper" terminology is in use, there's "supposed" to be no confusion, and it makes all matters "clear".
it's probably just "Lawyer", "Attorney", "Judge", or "Whatever you want to call them" issues. And it seems to be becoming a more widespread issue as well...
The US is quite good at finding those loopholes. It's not such a "Lawsuit Happy" country for Nothing after all...
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avioniker
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Tue Feb 01, 2005 2:58 am

I'd be betting it goes to the pumping up or dumbing down of the language by someone who wanted to sound more important.
Sort of like the word "orient" being corrupted into "orientate" by so many in the military during my illustrious career.
While the word is technically being correctly used the proper usage would be "certify". The issuance of a certificate has no bearing on the application of the verb.
More fodder for the Human Factors empire builders...
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gigneil
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RE: "Certified" Vs. "Certificated"

Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:17 am

cer·tif·i·cate Audio pronunciation of "certificated" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (sr-tf-kt)
n.

1. A document testifying to the truth of something: a certificate of birth.
2. A document issued to a person completing a course of study not leading to a diploma.
3. A document certifying that a person may officially practice in certain professions.
4. A document certifying ownership.


tr.v. cer·tif·i·cat·ed, cer·tif·i·cat·ing, cer·tif·i·cates (-kt)

To furnish with, testify to, or authorize by a certificate.


cer·ti·fyv. cer·ti·fied, cer·ti·fy·ing, cer·ti·fies
v. tr.

1.
1. To confirm formally as true, accurate, or genuine.
2. To guarantee as meeting a standard: butter that was certified Grade A. See Synonyms at approve.
2. To acknowledge in writing on the face of (a check) that the signature of the maker is genuine and that there are sufficient funds on deposit for its payment.
3. To issue a license or certificate to.
4. To declare to be in need of psychiatric treatment or confinement.
5. Archaic. To inform positively; assure.

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