Mr Spaceman
Topic Author
Posts: 2723
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2001 5:09 am

ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Fri Jun 03, 2005 11:24 pm

Hi guys.

While listening to the arrival controller for Toronto Intl (CYYZ) & pilots on my scanner the other day, after the pilots of Air Canada Flt# 923 (from Orlando, Florida) were instructed to set up for an approach to runway 06L, the one pilot said this after his instruction read-back .....

"That's great! We've got 90 people on a tight connection"

This statement by the pilot got me wondering about a question........

If a flight is arriving (especially if it's late) that has passengers onboard who need to get on another connecting flight, will the dispatchers of the arriving airline contact ATC services to make a request for the most suitable runway (closest to the gate) that will help speed up the taxi time & thus the connection?

Do ATC controllers get informed that an arriving flight has another aircraft waiting on the ramp for it's arrival/connection so that the controllers can try to help the two flights connect faster, if possible .... to keep passengers happy?

Because there's usually many computer screens around an ATC controller's post, other than the radar scopes, I'm just wondering if such info as tight connections might also be displayed?

Or, is a tight connection & an airline dispatcher's wishes, NEVER the concern of an ATC controller because they have much more important tasks to take care of?

>> Also, in the photo below on the left, you can see a computer monitor which appears to have 4 round gauges presented on it. Are these gauges for showing wind speed & direction in different quadrants of the airport property?

Thanks,

Chris  Smile


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Anders Presterud
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Markus Buttinger

"Just a minute while I re-invent myself"
 
CX Flyboy
Posts: 6026
Joined: Sun Dec 26, 1999 6:10 pm

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Fri Jun 03, 2005 11:33 pm

I know that here in HKG, they do try and put aircraft on a gate near to another plane if there are lots of connecting passengers. As for actually speeding up an aircrafts arrival because of it, I have never seen this happen.
 
Mr Spaceman
Topic Author
Posts: 2723
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2001 5:09 am

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Fri Jun 03, 2005 11:48 pm

Hello CX flyboy.

Thanks for your reply.

It's good to hear that ATC in HKG do try to help out connecting flights, as I suspect ATC does for many airports around the world.

Quoting CX flyboy (Reply 1):
As for actually speeding up an aircrafts arrival because of it, I have never seen this happen.

Just to clarify things here ......

I didn't mean speeding up an airliner's airspeed while flying during arrival (although that would be nice), I meant it would speed up the process of connecting with another flight if an airliner was cleared for the closest active runway to their arrival gate...... because of less taxiing time.

Chris

[Edited 2005-06-03 16:52:42]
"Just a minute while I re-invent myself"
 
727EMflyer
Posts: 538
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 3:22 am

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Sat Jun 04, 2005 7:54 am

If the pilot is familiar enough with the airport to know which runway will be best, he can always request it! Once on a UA flight i was on into LAX (listening Ch. 9 of course!  hyper  ) we were on a short final for 25R when an AA 767 on long final for 25L asked the tower if he could squeeze in behind us for 25R. There was enough spacing so the controller slid him on over. That isn't much improvement on getting to a gat, but a hundred yards and one less runway to hold short of can buy you a minute or two!
 
buckfifty
Posts: 1278
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2001 4:05 pm

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Sat Jun 04, 2005 8:46 am

We've requested a runway before that was closer to our gate in question (including a roll-through) just because we were late. Very rare at peak periods, but when there are no known problems with the associated approach, it can be done.
 
CX Flyboy
Posts: 6026
Joined: Sun Dec 26, 1999 6:10 pm

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Sat Jun 04, 2005 11:35 am

Buckfifty, are you on a basing? Your flag's changed!

We can actually speed up the aircraft if we have many connecting passengers. Normally if this is the case, the company tells us, and we can actually cruise at a faster speed. if they determine that it is worth spending the extra money on fuel, rather than deal with the disruption caused by missed connections, then we can speed up the aircraft. As Buckfifty says, in certain cases as pilots we can request different runways etc.... however I have never heard of ATC helping an aircraft without us asking. It's up to us to ask for a speedy arrival, but when it is busy they will definately not go out of their way to help us unless we have an emergency.
 
Contact_tower
Posts: 534
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2001 4:05 am

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Sat Jun 04, 2005 8:38 pm

Quote:
Also, in the photo below on the left, you can see a computer monitor which appears to have 4 round gauges presented on it. Are these gauges for showing wind speed & direction in different quadrants of the airport property?

You are allmost right!

The screen you mention is the ATC*ISS markeded by Terma, Denmark. It's a information display system used at Sola TWR/APP and Stavanger ATCC.

Of the 4 gauges, the bottom 3 are WDI's, the big one above is the VDF/UDF display unit.

Appart from this, the collauges at Sola kan retrieve MET info, charts, current ATIS info, Snowtams, you name it, from this screen.

The other screens are (left to right):

1. ACAMS: Controls airfield lighting, lighting in the cab, sunblinds, etc
2. Touch input device for the NATCON air traffic system
3. TWR Garex 220 VCS
4. Natcon flightplan data display (FDD)
5. ATC*ISS
6. Natcon radar display (SDD)
7. Nova surface movement radar, contol panel flush in the desk
8. GND Garex 220 VCS

If I've got it wrong, I'll bet the phographer will call right away!
 
buckfifty
Posts: 1278
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2001 4:05 pm

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Sat Jun 04, 2005 10:31 pm

Quoting CX flyboy (Reply 5):
Buckfifty, are you on a basing? Your flag's changed!

I just think the HK flag's ugly.  Wink
 
Mr Spaceman
Topic Author
Posts: 2723
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2001 5:09 am

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Tue Jun 07, 2005 12:34 am

Hi guys.

I'm sorry for my late reply .... I suddenly got to busy to respond properly. I hate it when that happens!  banghead  I like to be constantly involved when I start a topic.

>> 727EMflyer.....

Quoting 727EMflyer (Reply 3):
If the pilot is familiar enough with the airport to know which runway will be best, he can always request it!

I understand that. I hear pilots making requests for certain runways at Toronto Intl (YYZ) all the time. So perhaps the airline dispatchers don't contact ATC with requests for the best arrival sequencing for the most favorable runway when they have a late arrival .... only the pilots will ask for that.

>> BuckFifty & CX flyboy, Thanks guys for your replies. OK, I understand that it's up to the pilots to make requests from ATC if they're running a little late (airline dispatchers don't get on the phone and start begging ATC for a favor), thus my wondering about computer screens near a controller that show him/her that a certain arriving flight has a connection and it's late .... doesn't exsist.

>> Contact_tower, Thank You for your specific explanation of what all the equipment in those photos are called. Several of the acronyms you used I don't understand though - of course! Big grin. I'm confident that "WDI's" are Wind Direction Indicators, but the ATC*ISS {ATC is obvious, but the ISS?}, VDF/UDF display unit, ACAMS, Garex 220 VCS, SDD {the DD would be for Data Display I guess}, went right over my head!

Anyhow, thanks again for your detailed info, and I have one more question for you because you're an Air Traffic Controller.

In Norway, do airline dispatchers ever contact your ATC services to make a request regarding a late flight of theirs that has a waiting connection, or do you only receive requests from pilots?

Chris  Smile
"Just a minute while I re-invent myself"
 
Contact_tower
Posts: 534
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2001 4:05 am

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:40 am

ATC*ISS is the name Terma have given their information system. http://www.terma.com/ (Click Air Traffic Management, then ATC*ISS)
VDF= VHF direction finder
UDF= UHF direction finder
ACAMS, company/product name. http://www.acams.no/
Garex 220 is the product name of the latest VCS from Park Air Systems http://www.parkairsystems.com/index.asp?id=295
VCS= Voice Comunications System
SDD= Situation Data Display
FDD= Flight Data display

Quote:
In Norway, do airline dispatchers ever contact your ATC services to make a request regarding a late flight of theirs that has a waiting connection, or do you only receive requests from pilots?

Not much of a problem where I work, where not a transit airport, just the final destination. However, dispatch, it be SAS or the Air Force, or any other company tend to call and nag about a lot of things.
 
Mr Spaceman
Topic Author
Posts: 2723
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2001 5:09 am

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:01 am

Hello Contact_tower.

WOW!!! Thank You Sir, for those excellent links. Now I've got some really neat reading to do.

Apparently, the 2 new control towers here in Toronto at YYZ (about three+ years old - and the whole ATC center on the airport) have the latest "state-of-the-art" equipment. So, I'm sure you'd be impressed and feel right at home up in one of the cabs or down below.

Thanks for explaining the acronyms. Big grin

Quoting Contact_tower (Reply 9):
SAS or the Air Force, or any other company tend to call and nag about a lot of things.

Now, there's some private conversations I'd like to listen to! Like a fly on the wall.  Silly

Chris  Smile
"Just a minute while I re-invent myself"
 
F1ISBEST
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2005 10:14 pm

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Thu Jun 16, 2005 4:44 am

Here in the US, we provide basically first come first serve. ATC does not get involved with those type of company request, nor have they ever called us for such a request. Could you imagine the conflict of interest that could put us in if they did. I am sure an American Airlines would gladly give way to a United aircraft so they could make a tight connection to make 200 United passengers happy , since the American Airlines does not have a tight connection. I think not.
 
LN-ATC
Posts: 60
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2001 2:54 am

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Thu Jun 16, 2005 7:41 am

Quoting Contact_tower (Reply 6):
If I've got it wrong, I'll bet the phographer will call right away!

You have done your homework very well, C_t!

No comments necessary from the photographer.  Smile
Anders Presterud, Stavanger, Norway
 
Mr Spaceman
Topic Author
Posts: 2723
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2001 5:09 am

RE: ATC Questions About Connecting Flts, Etc?

Thu Jun 16, 2005 11:16 pm

Hello F1ISBEST.

Thanks for your explanation of how the USA's ATC system works. Your words were ....well said! Big grin

>> LN-ATC, nice photo ....that's why I chose it.  Smile

Chris  Smile
"Just a minute while I re-invent myself"

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: zaphod42 and 12 guests