ANITIX87
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APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Thu Jul 14, 2005 10:53 pm

In this photo, we are looking right into the exhaust system for the APU of the 742.


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Photo © Klaas Reinder Sluijs



I always thought the APU was electrically powered. What is there that needs to be released if that's the case? Or am I just completely wrong? Haha.

TIS
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SATL382G
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Thu Jul 14, 2005 11:07 pm

Quoting ANITIX87 (Thread starter):
I always thought the APU was electrically powered

Close. The APU provides electrical power amongst other things. It burns fuel to spin a turbine that then turns a generator.

Where did you think the electricity came from?
"There’s nothing quite as exhilarating as being shot at and missed" --Winston Churchill
 
SlamClick
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Thu Jul 14, 2005 11:07 pm

The APU is powered by jet fuel. It is a little gas turbine engine.
It produces electricity.

Now if you could invent a unit that ran on electricity and produced jet fuel, and you need startup capital, well, talk to me.
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
 
aeroweanie
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Thu Jul 14, 2005 11:47 pm

Quoting SATL382G (Reply 1):
The APU provides electrical power amongst other things. It burns fuel to spin a turbine that then turns a generator.

The APU is also connected to a "load compressor", which provides compressed air to aircraft systems.
 
gearup
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 12:15 am

Looking at that photograph, I think the APU is missing. I can see the titanium enclosure forward of the APU but that's all there is plus the exhaust system as was mentioned above. Very interesting photo.

GU
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SATL382G
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 12:38 am

Quoting Gearup (Reply 4):
Looking at that photograph, I think the APU is missing. I can see the titanium enclosure forward of the APU but that's all there is plus the exhaust system as was mentioned above. Very interesting photo

Aircraft is on static display at a museum. Also missing (last I checked) 2 engines, flaps, and the upper deck lav!!.
"There’s nothing quite as exhilarating as being shot at and missed" --Winston Churchill
 
ANITIX87
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 2:14 am

I thought it was the engine that provided electricity to the APU which powered the systems when they were needed. I thought the fuel turbine was on the engine and powered the APU...I just said the same thing two different ways, haha. Thanks for correcting me, and I'll contact you about the startup capital when I get my Ph.D. in Aeronautical Engineering in 8 years!

TIS
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Mr Spaceman
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 3:18 am

Hi guys.

Quoting SlamClick (Reply 2):
The APU is powered by jet fuel. It is a little gas turbine engine.
It produces electricity.



Quoting AeroWeanie (Reply 3):
The APU is also connected to a "load compressor", which provides compressed air to aircraft systems.

>> ANITIX87, have you ever been close enough to a parked airliner to see that it's jet engines are not running, however you can still hear the sound of a jet engine coming from the aircraft, & if you're downwind of it you may even smell the exhaust from a jet engine? If so, what you are hearing & smelling is the APU that's running in the airliner's tailcone. Big grin

Before the pilots start the airliner's jet engines, the APU's generator provides the needed electricity for the aircraft's systems (in the cockpit, the cabin, etc, etc) as mentioned by SlamClick. (Note: A ground cart/GPU {Ground Power Unit}, can also provide electricity instead of the APU).

When the pilots start the first jet engine, compressed air - as mentioned by AeroWeanie (also called Bleed Air) - is ducted from the APU in the tail forward to the starter motor on the jet engine. This compressed air spins a turbine inside the starter, which causes a series of gears in the starter's gearbox to turn. These gears are connected to the jet engine's main centre shaft and as as result ....... the jet engine's large intake fan & compressors start to turn, which begins the engine's starting sequence. (Note: compressed air for the starter can also be provided by a ground cart if needed).

Most modern jet airliners these days use pnuematic starter motors that require compressed air to turn them ..... unlike the starter motor in a car which uses electricity from a battery.

I hope this BASIC (very un-detailed) info about an APU gives you an idea of what they're used for.

>> Question ......

Is an APU also able to provide pressure for the airliner's hydraulic systems if needed?

Chris  Smile
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jetset7e7
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 3:32 am

We have alot of APU faults at MAN, with aircraft especially ZB A320's, they come on stand, set the parking brake, and cut one engine, until a GPU is connected.

When they are ready for departure an ASU (Air Start Unit) is required, along with Ground Power, this pumps air and helps start the engine, if need be it will do a cross-feed start on stand, where it powers up one engine to help start the other.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I just work on the ramp.

Mark
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David L
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 3:51 am

The caption on the photo says "Did you ever have a look in the a... of a Jumbo ? (APU exhaust)". I wonder how many wristwatches have been lost in there.
 
Matt72033
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 5:08 am

Quoting Mr Spaceman (Reply 7):
>> Question ......

Is an APU also able to provide pressure for the airliner's hydraulic systems if needed?

from what i understand.......only through supplying Electrical power to electric motor hydraulic pumps.....but i would have thought this was more in the case of an emergency!

they dont have a hydraulic pump on them! (that ive ever heard of anyway!) please correct me if i'm wrong anybody

[Edited 2005-07-14 22:08:44]
 
Euclid
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 5:30 am

If I may also ask a question, what is that little thingy sticking out of the panel right at the top?
 
A/c train
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 7:03 am

When we say that the APU provides pressure for the hydraulic systems, what we mean is that the APU bleed air is tapped into the top of the hydraulic reservoirs too provide a head of pressure on top of the fluid, this pressure is usually around 50 psi. All this does is provide a positive feed of fluid too the hydraulic pumps too prevent cavitation.
As has already been said, the APU is just a small gas turbine with a load compressor which delivers air too pneumatic systems and an A.C generator mounted on the APU gearbox which provides a.c power on the ground and as a standby in certain failure conditions. It runs on fuel from the aircrafts fuel tanks.
Regards a/c
 
kl671
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 8:57 am

The APU on the 747-400 series is a P&WC 901A. Read all about it at

http://www.pwc.ca/en/3_0/3_0_2/3_0_2_5_1.asp
 
aloges
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 9:08 am

Quoting Euclid (Reply 11):
If I may also ask a question, what is that little thingy sticking out of the panel right at the top?

Might be a strobe.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
AR1300
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 9:22 am

Quoting SATL382G (Reply 1):
Where did you think the electricity came from?

There is a hamster on a wheel in the cargo bay.From there.

mike
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troubleshooter
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 9:59 am

Quoting Matt72033 (Reply 10):
Quoting Mr Spaceman (Reply 7):
>> Question ......

Is an APU also able to provide pressure for the airliner's hydraulic systems if needed?

from what i understand.......only through supplying Electrical power to electric motor hydraulic pumps.....but i would have thought this was more in the case of an emergency!

they dont have a hydraulic pump on them! (that ive ever heard of anyway!) please correct me if i'm wrong anybody

The APU on the C-160 Transall drives a generator and a hydraulic pump (red system) which can supply the majority of hydraulic systems.

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Photo © Achim Stemmer

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corey07850
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 10:47 am

Quoting Mr Spaceman (Reply 7):
Before the pilots start the airliner's jet engines, the APU's generator provides the needed electricity for the aircraft's systems (in the cockpit, the cabin, etc, etc) as mentioned by SlamClick.

And these are the times when King Air pilots miss their wheels-up times because they can't monitor gate hold  Wink
 
kaddyuk
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 10:48 am

On a B744, expect the APU to burn about 500kg/s of fuel per hour...
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IFIXCF6
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 12:57 pm

Regarding the thread question:
The APU drives the electrics, not the other way around. The APU is also capable of pneumatic (compressed air) power in all airliners that I've worked.

Speaking of hydraulics...
In some A/C, only electric (i.e. "AUX") pumps are energized by the APU, in others you may have air-driven pumps (ADP's) as an option...or mandatory for that system. It gets complex when speaking of the many airliner designs, but an APU can power all of this. But, other than starting, an APU does not receive power. The hole is for jet turbine exhaust, it burns JET-A (usually).

Mike
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 2:03 pm

Quoting Euclid (Reply 11):
If I may also ask a question, what is that little thingy sticking out of the panel right at the top



Quoting Aloges (Reply 14):
Quoting Euclid (Reply 11):
If I may also ask a question, what is that little thingy sticking out of the panel right at the top?

Might be a strobe.

It looks more like a Position Light.The Strobe is the Rectangular one located at the Bottom.
BTW the APU is missing.Whats visable is the Exhaust Duct.

APU or Auxiliary Power Unit is a Constant speed Centrifugal Gas Turbine Engine,located "mostly" at the Aft section of the Aircraft & used to supply Electric,Pneumatics for Air-Conditioning,Engine Start with the help of Generator mounted on the APU Gearbox & Thru a bleed valve to provide bleed thru the Pneumatic duct resp.

Also Why are the Inbd corners of the Elevator having that chipped off shape on both sides.


regds
MEL

[Edited 2005-07-15 07:19:51]
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
jimpop
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 2:08 pm

Starting at the exhaust port and moving downwards, what are the shiny metal items? lights?
 
danman
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 6:33 pm

Jimpop,
Two tail position lights (navigation lights) side by side, the rectangular unit below is the tail strobe light.
 
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Jetlagged
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Fri Jul 15, 2005 10:42 pm

Quoting AeroWeanie (Reply 3):
The APU is also connected to a "load compressor", which provides compressed air to aircraft systems.

Older, single shaft APUs have an oversized compressor which provides excess air for the pnematic system.

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 20):
Also Why are the Inbd corners of the Elevator having that chipped off shape on both sides.

May have been damaged in transit when the aircraft was moved to the museum?
The glass isn't half empty, or half full, it's twice as big as it needs to be.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Sat Jul 16, 2005 12:26 am

Quoting Jetlagged (Reply 23):
May have been damaged in transit when the aircraft was moved to the museum

Could it be Aerodynamic Damage painted over rather than Impact Damage.Because the Paint does not look peeled.seems its an old damage.
Any Pic of similiar Angle.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
Tod
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Sat Jul 16, 2005 12:29 am

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 20):
APU or Auxiliary Power Unit is a Constant speed Centrifugal Gas Turbine Engine,located "mostly" at the Aft section of the Aircraft & used to supply Electric,Pneumatics for Air-Conditioning,Engine Start with the help of Generator mounted on the APU Gearbox & Thru a bleed valve to provide bleed thru the Pneumatic duct resp.

The bleed air can also be used pressurize the potable water system such as on 747.
 
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Bruce
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Mon Jul 18, 2005 8:33 am

Speaking of APU's, what is the purpose of the light as seen in the above photo....right below the exhaust?

bruce
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Starlionblue
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Mon Jul 18, 2005 11:50 am

Quoting SlamClick (Reply 2):

Now if you could invent a unit that ran on electricity and produced jet fuel, and you need startup capital, well, talk to me.

Talk to me first Big grin
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Mon Jul 18, 2005 7:19 pm

Even if the APU was installed, you wouldn't see it in the picture. The exhaust duct is about 2-3 meters long and pitch dark on the inside. You'll need a good light to see the turbine of the APU.

Jan
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air2gxs
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Mon Jul 18, 2005 8:13 pm

Quoting Bruce (Reply 26):
Speaking of APU's, what is the purpose of the light as seen in the above photo....right below the exhaust?

The upper pair of lights are the white navigation lights. The lower light is the stobe light.
 
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Bruce
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Tue Jul 19, 2005 1:39 am

Ok, sorry if its a stupid question but what purpose does the nav light serve? Is it only so that other planes can see you:?

bruce
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oly720man
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Tue Jul 19, 2005 2:13 am

For those who've never seen an APU in the flesh, here are some photos of one we have at our lab. It used to be in a Trident, so it's rather old, and we got it of an aircraft dealer at Southend Airport who had a shed full of Trident bits. We wanted to use it for a jet engine experiment, but health and safety objected. It's damned noisy - 127dB.



View from the rear showing the exhaust and the high pressure area. The flanged pipe is connected to the bleed air exit.




View from the front. The green bit is the end cover for the generator that's connected to the main shaft of the APU.




View up the tailpipe showing the turbine and various instruments used to measure temperature. When the bleed air valve is opened the turbine blades glow red. Quite an impressive sight.




The air intake on the underside, as mounted here.
wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Tue Jul 19, 2005 4:06 am

Looks like an old Garrett APU. What were they objecting to? The noise? You've got to build yourself a noise proof test cell with built in fire extinguishers and a control panel on the outside.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
aviopic
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Tue Jul 19, 2005 8:44 am

Quoting Gearup (Reply 4):
Looking at that photograph, I think the APU is missing.

Yes the APU is indeed missing, not that you can see it but as I spend many hours in the APU compartment I know it isn't there. Big grin

Quoting SATL382G (Reply 5):
Aircraft is on static display at a museum. Also missing (last I checked) 2 engines, flaps, and the upper deck lav!!.

Yup, The Dutch Aviation Theme Park Aviodrome is the place.
We recently got 2 engines and we do have the flaps as well, flap tracks are in the process of installing and although we don't want to have hydraulic pressure on the machine we planned to move the flaps electrically by means of the alternate system, should be nice for the public.

The upper deck lav. was not missing but removed see:

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Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Willem Honders



Maybe nice to watch, I constructed a photoalbum about the PH-BUK.
http://www.airliners.net/search/phot...PH-BUK+story&album_creator=Aviopic

Of course a visit at my website might give you some extra inside info.

Willem
Aviodrome crew
The truth lives in one’s mind, it doesn’t really exist
 
oly720man
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Tue Jul 19, 2005 7:50 pm

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 32):
What were they objecting to? The noise?

It's a University. They were objecting more to the thought of a large fuel tank, but the noise did come into it.
wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
 
Matt72033
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Sat Jul 30, 2005 6:41 am

Quoting Oly720man (Reply 31):
It used to be in a Trident, so it's rather old, and we got it of an aircraft dealer at Southend Airport who had a shed full of Trident bits

didnt the tridents have thrusting APU's?
apparently they thought of this for the 777 at one point! but decided against it! (only for take off mind)
 
lorm
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Sat Jul 30, 2005 12:54 pm

I found these somewhere awhile ago, probably last year, on the net, and just recently while searching through my backup external HD. 777 APU pictures.

View from below looking up through APU access doors



Exhaust --- | --- Fuel and Oil Locations



Brick Windows
 
David L
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Sun Jul 31, 2005 1:02 am

Quoting Matt72033 (Reply 35):
didnt the tridents have thrusting APU's?

Good question. I know the Trident 3s had a small fourth engine for take-off but I never thought whether they had a separate APU or that was it.
 
David L
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Sun Jul 31, 2005 1:11 am

This is the best info I can find. Erm... it's from a die-cast aircraft forum so it's not exactly technical confirmation:

http://www.diecastaircraftforum.org/showthread.php?t=8940

"When they built the Trident 3 the joke was it was the worlds first five engine jet airliner as it had three engines plus a boost engine and the APU, there's more jet exhausts at the back of a Trident 3 than you can shake a stick at!!"
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Sun Jul 31, 2005 4:59 am

Quoting Kaddyuk (Reply 18):
On a B744, expect the APU to burn about 500kg/s of fuel per hour...

Also, the 747 APU is more powerful than both the engines on a Twin Otter.

Another fun fact: The BAe-146/Avro RJ is powered by a model of jet enginewhich started life as an APU. IIRC the same model is used on the 767.

Quoting David L (Reply 37):
Good question. I know the Trident 3s had a small fourth engine for take-off but I never thought whether they had a separate APU or that was it.

As David L says, yes the fourth engine (and was that ever a duct tape and chewing gum solution to a problem...) was separate from the APU.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
David L
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Sun Jul 31, 2005 7:23 am

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 39):
As David L says

More accurately, as a die-cast metal aircraft enthusiast says.  Smile

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 39):
and was that ever a duct tape and chewing gum solution to a problem

Yes, but it was a bit more elegant than a RATO job! And it was quite cool to feel it shutting down during the climb (as long as you knew why).

Actually, was it shut down during flight or was it idled or "something"? I've just got hold of potentially quite a good Trident 3 for FS2004 so I might have yet more amateur misinformation and questions to share later. You have all been warned.
 
Matt72033
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Sun Jul 31, 2005 5:45 pm

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 39):
As David L says, yes the fourth engine (and was that ever a duct tape and chewing gum solution to a problem...) was separate from the APU

ahhh ok....fair enough!
 
bio15
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Tue Aug 02, 2005 6:00 am

Quoting AeroWeanie (Reply 3):
The APU is also connected to a "load compressor", which provides compressed air to aircraft systems.

I always thought that APU's pneumatic supply came from some compressor stage bleed. Is the load compressor another way of saying this, or it's a separate compressor electrically driven by the APU? If so, are there any APUs that supply pneumatics by direct bleed off? Thanks in advance


Alfredo
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Tue Aug 02, 2005 8:13 pm

Quoting Bio15 (Reply 42):
If so, are there any APUs that supply pneumatics by direct bleed off

The GTCP on the B737s do.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Wed Aug 03, 2005 10:39 pm

Quoting David L (Reply 40):
Actually, was it shut down during flight or was it idled or "something"? I've just got hold of potentially quite a good Trident 3 for FS2004 so I might have yet more amateur misinformation and questions to share later. You have all been warned.

It was shut down in flight. Consider us warned Big grin
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
David L
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Wed Aug 03, 2005 11:52 pm

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 44):
It was shut down in flight

Much as I suspected - thanks.

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 44):
Consider us warned

I think you're OK. (Un)fortunately, an even better 747-400 model has just been released. The Trident might not get a look in for a while and there's much more info available on the 747.
 
SlamClick
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Thu Aug 04, 2005 12:01 am

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 39):
Another fun fact: The BAe-146/Avro RJ is powered by a model of jet enginewhich started life as an APU. IIRC the same model is used on the 767.

The same Avco-Lycoming engine core as on these aircraft:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Dennis Wong
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Michael Baldock


Which predate the 767 by a long time. Initial design of this engine was in 1954, before airliners even had APUs.
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
 
David L
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RE: APU Exhaust (Pic Of The Day)

Thu Aug 04, 2005 12:12 am

Quoting SlamClick (Reply 46):
The same Avco-Lycoming engine core as on these aircraft

The same core in a turboprop, turboshaft and turbofan. Is that fairly common or is it unusual?

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