flyabunch
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Smoky 717's On Take-off

Tue Dec 06, 2005 11:06 am

I did a search to see if I could find anything on this topic and didn't come up with anything.

Anyway, this morning I was at LAS waiting to fly to Denver. I was watching take-offs and noticed that two Air Tran 717's in a row left quite a smoke trail. It reminded me of the old days with the 707's and DC-8's. I watched all the other types that took off after that, including an old 732 and none had any noticible smoke. Only the near new 717's.

Is there something specific in that RR/BMW engine that might cause this result?

Mike
 
September11
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RE: Smoky 717's On Take-off

Tue Dec 06, 2005 12:57 pm

Ummm ... it could be the freezing & cold morning "smoke" (first flight of the day)?


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airportugal310
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RE: Smoky 717's On Take-off

Tue Dec 06, 2005 2:39 pm

Whether you actually see it or not, its there on all airplanes...

Ive seen them on everything from a CRJ to a 777....airplane pollution is a way of life....for now.
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flyabunch
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RE: Smoky 717's On Take-off

Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:55 pm

What I saw was definitely black soot on climb out, not the cold start stuff. It was only "visible" on the two 717's. I was in the terminal, looking west with the sun behind me so if there was smoke, it was easy to see. The only other jet that looked like there might be some trace of smoke was a WN 737-700. Even the 732 was clean by comparison.

Mike
 
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lightsaber
Crew
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RE: Smoky 717's On Take-off

Wed Dec 07, 2005 8:54 pm

Quoting Flyabunch (Thread starter):
Is there something specific in that RR/BMW engine that might cause this result?

Yep, the Talon (old Pratt) style fuel injectors!  duck 

Actually, I'm serious. This style of fuel injectors is pretty smoky. I can even tell you the old mentor of mine who almost got sued for transferring the technology to BMW. Recall, all smoke is created in the combustor.

Lightsaber
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HAWK21M
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RE: Smoky 717's On Take-off

Wed Dec 07, 2005 9:13 pm

Quoting September11 (Reply 1):
Ummm ... it could be the freezing & cold morning "smoke" (first flight of the day)?

Unlikely as it was seen on T/O.More so to do with the Combustion.Probably Fuel Injectors.
BTW what type Combustion chamber is used on the B717.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
liedetectors
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RE: Smoky 717's On Take-off

Wed Dec 14, 2005 11:03 am

A quote from the Rolls-Royce book "The Jet Engine" :

"Environmental impact is an undesirable by-product of the gas turbine. Performance is its prime function."
If it was said by us, then it must be true.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Smoky 717's On Take-off

Wed Dec 14, 2005 3:25 pm

Quoting Liedetectors (Reply 6):
Environmental impact is an undesirable by-product of the gas turbine. Performance is its prime function."

True.But excess & extra qty of the former could lead to other complications in the long run  Smile
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)

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