julesmusician
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Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Sat Feb 11, 2006 8:02 pm

Recently on a flight the cockpit door came open on rotation at take off. Amazingly the cabin crew immediately took off their belts and attempted to shut the door with difficulty as the aircraft had started a steep climb. Any pilots like to comment on what the procedure is if this happens? I was surprised as I thought all cockpit doors now have to be locked closed before departure not just closed.

J
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Mr Spaceman
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Sat Feb 11, 2006 10:19 pm

Hello Julesmusician.

I don't know what the procedure is for fixing this specific situation during initial climbout after takeoff (at least not how it's typed out in a SOP manual), but I'm sure the number one step is to "fly the airplane" first, and then close the door when it's OK to safely do so. I don't think the sudden opening of the cockpit door during takeoff would be considered an inflight emergency regarding aerodynamic control of the airplane.

Sadly, several GA pilots have lost control of their aircraft and crashed after a cabin door or luggage door on the outside of the plane has suddenly opened during takeoff & climbout and the pilots allowed themselves to become distracted by the door and let their airplane depart from controlled flight which they couldn't recover from before hitting the ground.

In this case with the cockpit door to the cabin opening, if both pilots attempted to quickly close it, I think the auto pilot was already flying the plane so it was safe for both members of the crew to respond immediately.

Unfortunately, during these crazy days, if a cockpit door opens like this during takeoff, the crew are probably required to close it immediately when it's safe to do so ........ instead of a more relaxed atmoshere & attitude where the Captain may say something like .... "hey Mike, can you please close the door when you get a chance".

Quoting Julesmusician (Thread starter):
Recently on a flight the cockpit door came open on rotation at take off.

Julesmusician, what type of aircraft were you in, and how close to the door were you seated?


Chris  Smile
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Starlionblue
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Sun Feb 12, 2006 12:09 am

I agree with Mr. Spaceman. I mean seriously. How likely is it that a terrorist is on board on the off chance that thecockpit door should accidentally open? If that's the best they can come up with, I would stop worrying about terrorism.
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Mr Spaceman
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Sun Feb 12, 2006 12:15 am

Hi guys.

Quoting Julesmusician (Thread starter):
Amazingly the cabin crew immediately took off their belts and attempted to shut the door with difficulty as the aircraft had started a steep climb.



Quoting Mr Spaceman (Reply 1):
In this case with the cockpit door to the cabin opening, if both pilots attempted to quickly close it, I think the auto pilot was already flying the plane so it was safe for both members of the crew to respond immediately.

Unfortunately, during these crazy days, if a cockpit door opens like this during takeoff, the crew are probably required to close it immediately when it's safe to do so ........ instead of a more relaxed atmoshere & attitude where the Captain may say something like .... "hey Mike, can you please close the door when you get a chance"

Oops!  bitelip  Julesmusician, I thought you said the "flight crew" immediately took off their belts to close the door (not the cabin crew as you explained), so my post was based on the pilots responding, not the FA's.

I'm sorry about that!  sorry  I haven't had my morning coffee yet.


Chris  Smile
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PurdueAv2003
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Sun Feb 12, 2006 11:28 am

There was an issue that came up a few years back after the modified cockpit doors were installed on the NarrowBus. Some of the modified doors would pop open due to an alignment issue as the planes would flex during climb. Once the plane leveled out at cruise the doors could be closed and latched. There was an additional modification that came out to correct this problem.
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freakydeaky
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Sun Feb 12, 2006 1:10 pm

I've had a door pop open once on every aircraft I've flown on liftoff. As a pilot, you ignore it - same as when you ignore your Venti Grande Mucho Deluxo Expensivea Coffee taking double twisting high arc backwards tumble to a full lay-out position behind you.

It's one of those things you just deal with and hopefully a FA will be able to close it is soon as it's safe.
"Finish each day and be done with it. You have done what you could."
 
widebody
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Mon Feb 13, 2006 3:12 am

Would depend on what type of aircraft it is. Airbus doors for example open into the cockpit, therefore they can't open during acceleration and climb, only during descent and deceleration. Flex causes large problems for all door designs, but the effects differ from aircraft to aircraft depending on the attachment design principles. Alignment issues on Airbus doors were caused by the fact that the upper fittings were attached to the airframe, while the lower fitting was attached to the aircraft floor. Therefore there were (are) some specific deformations in-flight.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Mon Feb 13, 2006 1:38 pm

If the Solenoid lock bar has not be activated & there is play between the Frame & the Door.This can occur.
Surprisingly why the Door was not closed.
In spite of the struggle due the Aircraft Attitude.The Cabin crew would have a better change at closing the door,which they did.Hopefully then the Flying crew relocked the door to avoid its reoccurance.

regds
MEL
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Bobster2
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Mon Feb 13, 2006 1:50 pm

Hijackers wouldn't leave their seats during takeoff. The seatbelt light is on. Big grin

To say nothing of the air marshals.

Reminds me of the "Twilight Zone" episode where the William Shatner character steals a gun from a sleeping passenger and walks into the unlocked cockpit. Things sure have changed since those days.
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DBCooper
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Mon Feb 13, 2006 6:55 pm

Used to have a 732 at CP that did this on every takeoff. There was a problem with the door frame alignment and it was not an easy fix. Maintenance ended up putting a wooden pool cue on board for the FA to use to close the door from the cabin jumpseat...until the aircraft went in for a heavy check.


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Starlionblue
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Mon Feb 13, 2006 11:20 pm

Quoting DBCooper (Reply 9):
There was a problem with the door frame alignment and it was not an easy fix. Maintenance ended up putting a wooden pool cue on board for the FA to use to close the door from the cabin jumpseat...

I want to see those certification documents. On the MEL: "Pool Queue". Big grin
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mandala499
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Tue Feb 14, 2006 12:40 am

On a take off on a 732 here a few years back had a friend on the center jumpseat but did not secure the seat back properly... and as the aircraft rotated, the door opened and my friend rolled off into the cabin, much to the bemusement of the pax and embarrassment of the crew... *and 1 guy laughing out damn loudly... me*

Mandala499
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DeltaGuy
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Tue Feb 14, 2006 3:47 am

^^^^^^Great post  slaphappy  slaphappy  slaphappy ^^^^^
"The cockpit, what is it?" "It's the little room in the front of the plane where the pilot sits, but that's not importan
 
David L
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Tue Feb 14, 2006 4:07 am

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 10):
On the MEL: "Pool Queue".

On a VS A380, maybe. On other types, probably a "pool cue". (Sorry!  Smile )
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Tue Feb 14, 2006 4:26 am

Quoting David L (Reply 13):
Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 10):
On the MEL: "Pool Queue".

On a VS A380, maybe. On other types, probably a "pool cue". (Sorry! Smile )

As a fellow nitpicker, I appreciate being corrected when I'm wrong. Thanks.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
David L
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Tue Feb 14, 2006 4:32 am

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 14):
As a fellow nitpicker

I don't get too many opportunities but when I do...  Smile
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Tue Feb 14, 2006 4:31 pm

Quoting Mandala499 (Reply 11):
but did not secure the seat back properly

What about the Seat belt  Smile

Why was the Door not locked Electronically.

regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
mandala499
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Tue Feb 14, 2006 9:18 pm

Why was the Door not locked Electronically.

This happened before 9/11... in those days, no one in Indonesia would lock their doors... Well, last week they locked the door because we were having a smoke in the cockpit!

Mandala499
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Wed Feb 15, 2006 2:17 pm

Quoting Mandala499 (Reply 17):
in those days, no one in Indonesia would lock their doors

Isn't locking the door a part of the checklist.Pre 9-11 too
regds
MEL
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mandala499
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Wed Feb 15, 2006 5:52 pm

MEL,
"Yes it is"... But shhh... here, no one bothered in those days...

Mandala499
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HAWK21M
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RE: Cockpit Door Comes Open On Take Off Rotation

Wed Feb 15, 2006 10:21 pm

Quoting Mandala499 (Reply 19):
no one bothered in those days...

Ok Understood,Like the Smoking stuff  Smile
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)

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