zizo6
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2006 1:05 am

Aircraft Accessories

Fri Mar 31, 2006 5:04 am

Do all airbus types use standard Nosewheel pin ?
I saw a towbar written on it (use for 330-340-777), can this be ?
 
fr8mech
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RE: Aircraft Accessories

Fri Mar 31, 2006 5:17 am

Quoting Zizo6 (Thread starter):
can this be

Yes it can be. The operator can specify the tow fitting installed.
When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
 
474218
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RE: Aircraft Accessories

Fri Mar 31, 2006 9:11 am

Quoting Fr8Mech (Reply 1):
Yes it can be. The operator can specify the tow fitting installed.

That would require different nose landing gears, or at the least a different pistons as the tow lug is an integral part of piston. The tow bar may be modified to fit several different aircraft but the aircraft is not modified to fit the tow bar.
 
fr8mech
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RE: Aircraft Accessories

Fri Mar 31, 2006 9:38 am

Some aircraft have tow fittings that are bolted on. When I worked at DAL we used 1 towbar for the B727 and the B757 and another one for the B767 and L1011.
When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
 
zizo6
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2006 1:05 am

RE: Aircraft Accessories

Mon Apr 03, 2006 3:43 am

for 330 - 340 same pin
300 - 310 same pin

-----------
some one told me : no need to install the pin while pushback , just notify the pilot and he should do the needful from up ! ... is this true ??

this was his reply after sheering the B747 towbar !!!
 Wow!  Wow!
 
dl757md
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RE: Aircraft Accessories

Mon Apr 03, 2006 4:12 am

Quoting Zizo6 (Reply 4):
some one told me : no need to install the pin while push-back , just notify the pilot and he should do the needful from up ! ... is this true ??

I believe the thread was about the pin that the towbar attaches to rather than the steering bypass pin you are referring to. But, yes the steering bypass pin is not needed for towing operations IF the hydraulic system that powers it is not pressurized. Since most SOPs have the pilots pressurize hydraulics, BEFORE push-back, it is needed. About the only time you'll ever see a plane intentionally pushed without a bypass pin is durng MX ops when the plane is totally shutdown. Even then best practice dictates the use of a bypass pin so that MX crews don't get in the habit of towing a plane without the pin and forget to install it when it is needed.

DL757Md
757 Most beautiful airliner in the sky!
 
Tristarsteve
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RE: Aircraft Accessories

Mon Apr 03, 2006 4:34 am

Quoting Dl757md (Reply 5):
MX crews don't get in the habit of towing a plane without the pin

About 5 years ago SAS was towing a B767 from the hangar to the ramp. The pin was not fitted. The APU would not start and some mechanics were on board trying to start it. When they got it started, the tug was doing about 50kph downhill, the hyd pump was switched on and the hyd pressure sheared the towbar. The aircraft overtook the tug which ended up embedded in the packs!, taking most of the lower 41 with it. It was in the hangar for repairs for months. So always fit the bypass oin.
 
kaddyuk
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RE: Aircraft Accessories

Mon Apr 03, 2006 4:52 am

Too many times have i found towbars attatched to aircraft with no bypass pin...

As part of the pre-departure walk round its the engineers job to ensure that all down lock pins are removed and that the bypass pin is installed, even when towing a dead aircraft, ALWAYS have the pin in there... Its just habit...
Whoever said "laughter is the best medicine" never had Gonorrhea
 
L-188
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RE: Aircraft Accessories

Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:12 am

Quoting Zizo6 (Thread starter):
saw a towbar written on it (use for 330-340-777), can this be ?

I know we are talking about pins, but given any thought that this was a towbar with interchangable heads?

Where I used to work we had a tronair bar and heads for the Merline/Metro, Lear and Casa.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
kaddyuk
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RE: Aircraft Accessories

Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:40 am

For intrest, the A343 Tow Bar is not the same as the A346 towbar...

Same head its just the 345/346 is uprated to deal with the larger weight...
Whoever said "laughter is the best medicine" never had Gonorrhea
 
Tristarsteve
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RE: Aircraft Accessories

Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:59 am

Quoting Kaddyuk (Reply 9):
Same head its just the 345/346 is uprated to deal with the larger weight

The problem with towbars is that they fit but are not the correct shear rating. The DC10 Tristar B767 and B777 all have the same size pin. but push back a B777 with a B767 towbar and it will shear when you turn the corner. Use a DC10 towbar on a B767 and it will NOT shear when it should.
 
dl757md
Posts: 1482
Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 9:32 am

RE: Aircraft Accessories

Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:29 am

Quoting Tristarsteve (Reply 6):
When they got it started, the tug was doing about 50kph downhill, the hyd pump was switched on and the hyd pressure sheared the towbar. The aircraft overtook the tug which ended up embedded in the packs!

How's the tug driver?

That was definitely a dumb call. From a practical standpoint I could see leaving the pin out moving in or out of the hangar or other low speed ops with known brake pressure. But at 50KPH, that's just stupid. Bottom line, it's safer and easier to put the bypass pin in for all towing ops even if you have to hunt one down.

On the subject of having brake pressure the other day I was in the left seat signing off the logbook on a 764 while they were pulling us out of the hangar(bypass pin installed). As they turned us perpendicular to the hangar they exceeded the max tow angle and broke the shear pin. I heard it break and started paying attention. I looked out the window and saw the tug at about my 8 o'clock and we're continuing on forward at about 2mph. I hit the breaks about a half a second before they radioed me to. Close call but no damage. If we would have wrapped it up the 281 people waiting to go to OGG in an hour would have been very pissed. As it was they pushed 2 minutes early.  Smile

DL757Md
757 Most beautiful airliner in the sky!
 
zizo6
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2006 1:05 am

RE: Aircraft Accessories

Mon Apr 03, 2006 9:08 pm

for my situation i blamed both the mechanic and the pushbacker .
the mechanic did not install the bypass pin
the pushbacker did not remind him ..
but can any one tell me what does the mechanic do in A B C format.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Aircraft Accessories

Tue Apr 04, 2006 5:50 pm


Keep those streamers clear & Clean.I've seen some operators with Stained streamers that cannot be clearly viewed.
regds
MEL
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MD11Engineer
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RE: Aircraft Accessories

Tue Apr 04, 2006 6:45 pm

Quoting TristarSteve (Reply 10):
Quoting Kaddyuk (Reply 9):
Same head its just the 345/346 is uprated to deal with the larger weight

The problem with towbars is that they fit but are not the correct shear rating. The DC10 Tristar B767 and B777 all have the same size pin. but push back a B777 with a B767 towbar and it will shear when you turn the corner. Use a DC10 towbar on a B767 and it will NOT shear when it should.

I had a MD-11 once in STN (diverted there due to a tech problem), where the rampers wanted to use a 767 tow bar to push it. I refused and made them go and get the Dc-10 / MD-11 tow bar.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
Tristarsteve
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Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 11:04 pm

RE: Aircraft Accessories

Wed Apr 05, 2006 3:15 am

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 14):
I had a MD-11 once in STN (diverted there due to a tech problem), where the rampers wanted to use a 767 tow bar to push it. I refused and made them go and get the Dc-10 / MD-11 tow bar.

Jan

But if you don't have a DC10 towbar, you can use a B767, only it is best to push it straight back and not try and turn.
Same with B777. You can use the B767 towbar, but it will shear on a turn.

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