CoolGuy
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Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Sun Nov 18, 2007 7:28 am

Has there ever been a problem with retracting the landing gear due to the panels that normally extend out to let the gear in. (I doubt that's what they're called, but they're the parts that open up underneath the fuselage only when the gears are extending or retracting.) For example, has a panel ever not deployed and the gear rotated right into the panel, or some other technical problem (excuding problems where the gear simply doesn't move).
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:09 pm

I presume you are reffering to the Landing Gear Doors.
The Sequence valves play the path in ensuring the Doors & Gear Actuators operate in sequence.
regds
MEL
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Starlionblue
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Sun Nov 18, 2007 1:32 pm

While the 380 gear was being tested for gravity deployment (before first flight) the wing gear outer wheels got stuck on the gear doors and did thus not descend the whole way. Some grease temporarily solved the problem and there has since been a redesign.
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Jetlagged
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Sun Nov 18, 2007 2:29 pm

As MEL said, sequence valves prevent the gear moving before the door is open. If a door fails to open, the gear can be extended by gravity with the hydraulics depressurised and the gear door locks mechanically opened.

If the gear door fails to open for retraction then the gear cannot be retracted.
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avt007
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Sun Nov 18, 2007 5:11 pm

In the very early days of the Dash8, The PSEU (proximity sensors) controlled door sequence. After many problems, including the gear retracting through the doors (which never opened), the system was redesigned.
 
tdscanuck
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Sun Nov 18, 2007 7:17 pm



Quoting Jetlagged (Reply 3):

If the gear door fails to open for retraction then the gear cannot be retracted.

It depends why they failed to open. If the sequence valve itself failed (in the right way) then the gear could retract and it would go right through the door, I suspect. The gear is a *lot* stronger than the doors.

Tom.
 
avioniker
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Mon Nov 19, 2007 2:43 am

There have been a few instances of the center gear on a DC10-30 center gear not retracting because the forward doors were improperly rigged causing them to close before the gear was in the well.
On one KC10 out of C check, in the late 80's, it caused a strut change and cracked the left side gearwell wall and mount.
 Smile
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ArmitageShanks
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Mon Nov 19, 2007 5:03 am

Can gear doors be MEL'd? Does that ever happen?
 
Tristarsteve
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Mon Nov 19, 2007 5:23 am



Quoting ArmitageShanks (Reply 7):
Can gear doors be MEL'd? Does that ever happen?

Yes but its not MEL its called the CDL, a list of parts that can be missing for flight.
On the A320 for example one MLG door may be missing, or both NLG doors. No pax allowed and fuel increase 5pc.
I once met a Tristar that had flown with a MLG fixed fairing missing. What a mess. The airflow in the bay had ripped out some plugs in the brake system so there was no antiskid working.
It is not something you would dp lightly.
 
pilotboi
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Mon Nov 19, 2007 5:47 am



Quoting ArmitageShanks (Reply 7):
Can gear doors be MEL'd? Does that ever happen?

Our CRJs come in once in a while without MLG doors.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Mon Nov 19, 2007 1:47 pm



Quoting TristarSteve (Reply 8):
On the A320 for example one MLG door may be missing, or both NLG doors. No pax allowed and fuel increase 5pc.

That would be a ferry  Smile
Cheaper to fly in the Doors.Unless the base has no facility.
regds
MEL
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fr8mech
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Mon Nov 19, 2007 5:03 pm

Several types allow gear door removal, usually the fixed door, with only speed/weight and/or fuel penalties. No need for ferry flight. This is a CDL item.
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HAWK21M
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Sun Nov 25, 2007 3:25 pm



Quoting Fr8Mech (Reply 11):
Several types allow gear door removal, usually the fixed door, with only speed/weight and/or fuel penalties. No need for ferry flight. This is a CDL item.

Not > 1 door C/f on each Gear under CDL.
regds
MEL
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BR715-A1-30
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Tue Dec 04, 2007 5:36 am



Quoting Pilotboi (Reply 9):
Our CRJs come in once in a while without MLG doors.

Nice one Pilotboi.. I frequently see them missing on 737s as well.  duck 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Tue Dec 04, 2007 10:21 am



Quoting BR715-A1-30 (Reply 13):
Nice one Pilotboi.. I frequently see them missing on 737s as well

The B737s have three Doors on each Main Gear  Smile
regds
MEL
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boeing767mech
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Tue Dec 04, 2007 10:23 am

We had a 757 that had the opposite problem happen, The gear retracted but one of the MLG doors did not close. The airplane flew around with the door hanging out in the airstream. They returned and we replaced the sequence valve.

Also have had problems getting the doors to open on the ground to do maintainence checks. We MEL the maintainence door open side of the sequence valve. Makes it interesting to work in the wheel wells, since you have to pin the gear and select gear up to get the doors to open up.

David
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vzlet
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:37 pm

It took a paper clip to safely resolve this situation:

http://www.labiker.org/xb70/m-Gear_incident.jpg
(Photo from, and more details at http://www.labiker.org/xb70.html)
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DH106
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Tue Dec 04, 2007 4:00 pm



Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 1):
I presume you are reffering to the Landing Gear Doors.
The Sequence valves play the path in ensuring the Doors & Gear Actuators operate in sequence

Is that true for every type MEL?

Reason I ask is that I've noted in other threads that several aircraft types (DC-8 springs to mind) seem to start swinging the gear inwards well before the doors are fully open. It seems to me the timing is almost as if both gear and doors seems to start to move about the same time but the legs swing much slower than the doors so the doors achieve full open before the wheels get anywhere close. I admit that this seems quite a precarious situation from an engineering standpoint - it's just what I've observed.

Here's a good example - note both gear and doors are moving: http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1298718/L/[
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HAWK21M
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Tue Dec 04, 2007 4:52 pm



Quoting DH106 (Reply 17):
Is that true for every type

Im aware of the B752 it def is.
regds
MEL
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ex52tech
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Thu Dec 13, 2007 4:40 pm

Back in 87, AA Had a 722 come in to DFW with just the nose gear extended, the crew did a great job of greasing it in on the tail skid, and belly. The LH main landing gear door actuator broke internally, and the door would not open hydraulically or manually. I understand that had happened before.

They burned through the belly skins, but not through the cargo compartment floor, and missed the keel beam by about 10". A crew from TUL came down, and had it fixed in about 10days.

There was a dog in the aft cargo.
"Saddest thing I ever witnessed....an airplane being scrapped"
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Thu Jan 03, 2008 9:53 pm



Quoting Ex52tech (Reply 19):
They burned through the belly skins, but not through the cargo compartment floor, and missed the keel beam by about 10". A crew from TUL came down, and had it fixed in about 10days

Thats Fast.

Quoting Ex52tech (Reply 19):
There was a dog in the aft cargo

How was the Dogs Reaction when Located?.

regds
MEL
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411A
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:16 am

Landing gear doors....sometimes they fall off, inflight.
SVA had one do this over France in the mid-eighties.
The panel concerned was the RH main landing gear fixed door.
This door is fixed to the trunion and moves when the landing gear is extended and retracted.
It fell off, and impacted on a farm, and killed a cow.
The door was retrieved, identified, and SVA was norified....but not before the airplane arrived in JED, and then flew for three more days before anyone noticed it was missing.

An absolutely true story...
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:46 am



Quoting 411A (Reply 21):
SVA had one do this over France in the mid-eighties

What Type Aircraft.

Quoting 411A (Reply 21):
The door was retrieved, identified, and SVA was norified....but not before the airplane arrived in JED, and then flew for three more days before anyone noticed it was missing.

What about Scheduled Inspections.Even a Transit Check calls for that.
regds
MEL
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474218
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Fri Jan 04, 2008 5:28 pm



Quoting 411A (Reply 21):
Landing gear doors....sometimes they fall off, inflight.
SVA had one do this over France in the mid-eighties.
The panel concerned was the RH main landing gear fixed door.
This door is fixed to the trunion and moves when the landing gear is extended and retracted.
It fell off, and impacted on a farm, and killed a cow.
The door was retrieved, identified, and SVA was norified....but not before the airplane arrived in JED, and then flew for three more days before anyone noticed it was missing.

An absolutely true story...

There were at least six (6) different service bulletins on the L-1011 Fixed Main Landing Gear Door. The way the door sealed to the wing was through the use of a bending beam on the lower end of the door. If the door was rigged to tight the beam attach points would fail and the door would depart the aircraft. If the beam was rigged was rigged to loose the door could flutter and cause it to depart the aircraft.

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 22):
What Type Aircraft.

See above.
 
ex52tech
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RE: Has There Ever Been A Problem With Gear Panels?

Sat Jan 05, 2008 3:38 pm



Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 20):
How was the Dogs Reaction when Located?.

I heard that he was ok.
"Saddest thing I ever witnessed....an airplane being scrapped"

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