rj777
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A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:35 pm

I remember hearing a while back that the A380's callsign was going to be considered SUPER. Did this happen or is it still just HEAVY?
 
baw217
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:41 pm

It is a classed as "Super", but I have not heard super being used by any London ATC, whilst the A380 has been serving London.

Cheers
 
EXAAUADL
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:48 pm

So obviously this mean even greater spacing behind a A380?
 
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tjwgrr
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:50 pm

When I was listening to ATC (Chicago & Cleveland centers) the Airbus A388 demonstrator was designated as Lufthansa #### "super"
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71Zulu
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 4:16 pm

First arrival at JFK, 19 Mar 2007

http://mp3space.com/stream.php?id=49083
Clickable links only please!
 
smokeyrosco
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 4:24 pm

Which call sign does SQ use?
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JohnJ
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:04 pm

Used the "super" designation on the visit to Hartford as well.
 
Lexy
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:09 pm

Visit to CVG was "Airbus 202 Super"
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FlyHoss
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:11 pm



Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 5):
Which call sign does SQ use?

SQ uses "Singapore" as their call sign. Here's a link to a list of call signs starting with "s":

http://atcmonitor.com/callsigns.html#s

Note that the call signs are on the left with the company name on the right.
A little bit louder now, a lil bit louder now...
 
baw217
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:16 pm



Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 5):
Which call sign does SQ use?

"Singapore xxx"

Its rare to hear the "Heavy" or "Super" tag, outside of North America, here in the UK, you may hear it a few times a day, but thats about it!

Cheers
 
cloudyapple
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:17 pm



Quoting BAW217 (Reply 1):
It is a classed as "Super", but I have not heard super being used by any London ATC, whilst the A380 has been serving London.

The wake suffix is a peculiarity for the US. Most of the rest of the world, including NATS, do not suffix their callsigns. It does next to nothing and clogs up the R/T.
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N766UA
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:29 pm

It's "super." Or, more correctly, "supaahhh."
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AustrianZRH
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:44 pm



Quoting 71Zulu (Reply 4):
First arrival at JFK, 19 Mar 2007

Love that line: "LH8940 Super, just be advised that they'd LIKE you to taxi down 31L!"  rotfl   rotfl 
WARNING! The post above should be taken with a grain of salt! Furthermore, it may be slightly biased towards A.
 
futurecaptain
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:19 pm

That is odd that ATC would call it "super" since that term is not a standard aviation term. Heavy, large, and small are the only classifications of aircraft. No super.
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Maverick623
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:38 pm



Quoting Futurecaptain (Reply 13):
That is odd that ATC would call it "super" since that term is not a standard aviation term. Heavy, large, and small are the only classifications of aircraft. No super.

ATC classifications are based on the maximum gross takeoff weight of an aircraft, which is supposed to determine the strength of the wake turbulence it generates, which determines minimum separation criteria.

Until the A380, the largest minimum separation required was 4-8 minutes behind a heavy depending on aircraft type. The FAA decided that the A380 needed greater separation mins (6-10 minutes), and hence created a new category of airplane called "Super".
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cloudyapple
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:39 pm

Quoting Futurecaptain (Reply 13):
That is odd that ATC would call it "super" since that term is not a standard aviation term. Heavy, large, and small are the only classifications of aircraft. No super.

And you call yourself a future captain. Check you facts before you make firm statements next time.

The proper (ICAO) wake categories are Super, Heavy, Medium and Light. Some countries have different categorization like Super, Heavy, Upper Medium, Lower Medium, Small and Light for the UK. Your categorization only applies in the US. And the world is a little bit bigger than that.

[Edited 2008-04-30 11:51:05]
A310/A319/20/21/A332/3/A343/6/A388/B732/5/7/8/B742/S/4/B752/B763/B772/3/W/E145/J41/MD11/83/90
 
futurecaptain
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:32 pm



Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 14):
Your categorization only applies in the US. And the world is a little bit bigger than that.

I thought the above replies established that adding "heavy" or "super" to a callsign was more of a US issue than around the world. You yourself even wrote "Most of the rest of the world, including NATS, do not suffix their callsigns." So I wrote my response to the "super" suffix as taking this issue to be for the most part an American thing. In which the FAA AFAIK has not added a "super" category of aircraft.

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 15):
The FAA decided that the A380 needed greater separation mins (6-10 minutes), and hence created a new category of airplane called "Super".

Can you find a source detailing the FAA changing the categories and adding "super?" The word is used on A.net quite alot but I don't think officially the FAA has decided what to do when the plane starts flying here regularly.

I did find this...
http://www.faa.gov/airports_airtraff...ons/at_notices/media/N7110.478.pdf

Interm procedures for the route proving flights and promotional flights. ATC was to use "super" in the callsign but this notice is coming to an end and we will have to see what happens. Maybe we will still be required to call it "super" in the US. Maybe it will just be "heavy." I don't think we know yet.
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flexo
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:27 pm



Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 15):
Until the A380, the largest minimum separation required was 4-8 minutes behind a heavy depending on aircraft type. The FAA decided that the A380 needed greater separation mins (6-10 minutes), and hence created a new category of airplane called "Super".

What about the AN-225, is that treated as "Super" or as a regular heavy?
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Thu May 01, 2008 1:55 am



Quoting BAW217 (Reply 1):
It is a classed as "Super", but I have not heard super being used by any London ATC, whilst the A380 has been serving London.

I though "Heavy" was only used in North America anyway.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
Blackbird
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Thu May 01, 2008 4:15 am

What weight do you have to mass in at MTOGW to have a Super rating?
 
lowrider
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Thu May 01, 2008 7:53 am



Quoting N766UA (Reply 11):
It's "super." Or, more correctly, "supaahhh."

LOL, that was the first thing that came to my mind.

Quoting Cloudyapple (Reply 10):
The wake suffix is a peculiarity for the US. Most of the rest of the world, including NATS, do not suffix their callsigns. It does next to nothing and clogs up the R/T.

You might want to reconsider that. The following is from a Nov 2007 revision to the ICAO PANS-ATM.
4.1 Regarding radiotelephony procedures for air-ground voice communication channel changeover,
when so prescribed by the appropriate ATS authority, the initial call to an ATC unit after a change of
air-ground voice communication channel shall contain the following elements:
» Designation of station being called;
» Call sign, and for aircraft in the heavy wake turbulence category, the word "Heavy";
» Level, including passing and cleared levels if not maintaining the cleared level;
» Speed, if assigned by ATC; and
» Additional elements, as required by the appropriate ATS authority
4.2 For aircraft being provided with aerodrome control service, the initial call to the aerodrome control
tower shall contain:
» Designation of station being called;
» Call sign, and for aircraft in the heavy wake turbulence category, the word "Heavy";
» Position; and
» Additional elements, as required by the appropriate ATS authority
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twinotter
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Thu May 01, 2008 7:05 pm



Quoting Futurecaptain (Reply 16):
Can you find a source detailing the FAA changing the categories and adding "super?" The word is used on A.net quite alot but I don't think officially the FAA has decided what to do when the plane starts flying here regularly.

The FAA issued a temporary procedure prior to the A380 promotional flights. It read in part:

The A380 is in the “Heavy” aircraft weight category. However, wake vortices generated by the A380 are more substantial than those of other aircraft in the Heavy wake turbulence category, thus requiring special designation (“Super”) and additional wake turbulence separation during certain segments of flight. The A380 may therefore identify itself as [call sign] “Super” in radio communications with air traffic control.

The notice identifier was N JO 7110.464 if you want to google it.
 
futurecaptain
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Thu May 01, 2008 7:20 pm



Quoting TwinOtter (Reply 21):
The notice identifier was N JO 7110.464 if you want to google it.

Yes, and I see it was a temporary procedure. That notice ended 1 year ago. AFAIK the FAA never created a new "super" category of aircraft so while the A380 may dictate extra spacing for other aircraft its callsign should simply be "heavy."
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747luvr
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Thu May 01, 2008 7:28 pm

If I was an ATC controller I'd say..... "Singapore XXX Fatty, you are cleared for takeoff, after you loose some weight."  box 
 
Blackbird
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Thu May 01, 2008 7:37 pm

I thought the airliner that generated the worst wake turbulence was the MD-11?
 
pilotntrng
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Mon May 26, 2008 2:14 am



Quoting Blackbird (Reply 24):

757 takes the title for worst wake
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BWilliams
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Mon May 26, 2008 4:31 am



Quoting 71Zulu (Reply 4):
First arrival at JFK, 19 Mar 2007

http://mp3space.com/stream.php?id=49083

Thanks for posting this.. very interesting to hear the Whalejet coming in.

On a humorous note, I've never heard that ground controller (starting around 10:30) so excited, in all the time I've listen to LiveATC at JFK.  Wink
Regards, Brad Williams
 
jacobin777
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Tue Jun 10, 2008 7:42 pm

When the A380 came to SFO, it too had the callsign of "super".... yes 
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Zkpilot
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Wed Jun 11, 2008 7:38 am



Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 15):
Until the A380, the largest minimum separation required was 4-8 minutes behind a heavy depending on aircraft type. The FAA decided that the A380 needed greater separation mins (6-10 minutes), and hence created a new category of airplane called "Super".

I understand that the 748I will also take on the Super designation as it is larger than the 744 heavy.
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Dreamflight767
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Sun Jan 17, 2016 4:35 am

Hey Crew:

What is the prefix on the flight progress strip for the super.

i.e. it's H/TYP for a heavy.

Thanks.
 
Whiteguy
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Sun Jan 17, 2016 7:16 am

Quoting Futurecaptain (Reply 16):
Can you find a source detailing the FAA changing the categories and adding "super?" The word is used on A.net quite alot but I don't think officially the FAA has decided what to do when the plane starts flying here regularly.

You hear the call sign followed by "Super" every initial call up in the U.S. and Canadian ATC. They fly to the U.S. pretty regularly already....
 
speedbird128
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Sun Jan 17, 2016 1:07 pm

Quoting Whiteguy (Reply 30):

You hear the call sign followed by "Super" every initial call up in the U.S. and Canadian ATC. They fly to the U.S. pretty regularly already....

This thread is over 7 years 7 months old - FutureCaptain ejected a while back as his username is no longer active...
A306, A313, A319, A320, A321, A332, A343, A345, A346 A388, AC90, B06, B722, B732, B733, B735, B738, B744, B762, B772, B7
 
LONGisland89
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Sun Jan 17, 2016 7:09 pm

Quoting Dreamflight767 (Reply 29):
What is the prefix on the flight progress strip for the super.

i.e. it's H/TYP for a heavy.

The prefix is still "H/A388." The A380 is in the heavy weight class. Super is just used in radio communications.
 
Dreamflight767
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Mon Jan 18, 2016 12:24 am

Thanks much. I thought so but I remember thinking/seeing it was a "J".
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Mon Jan 18, 2016 12:56 am

"Super" and "Heavy" are used in Australia as well, at least by ATC. Most crews don't seem to bother.  
Quoting LONGisland89 (Reply 32):

Quoting Dreamflight767 (Reply 29):
What is the prefix on the flight progress strip for the super.

i.e. it's H/TYP for a heavy.

The prefix is still "H/A388." The A380 is in the heavy weight class. Super is just used in radio communications.

"A380" also has its own ICAO wake turbulence separation category.

Heavy behind Heavy 4 NM
Medium behind Heavy 5 NM
Light behind Heavy 6 NM
Light behind Medium 5 NM
Heavy behind A380 6 NM
Medium behind A380 7 NM
Light behind A380 8 NM
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
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DocLightning
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Mon Jan 18, 2016 1:42 am

At all ATC feeds I've listened to in the U.S. (JFK, LAX, SFO) have used the "Super" suffix on the A380.
-Doc Lightning-

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speedbird128
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Mon Jan 18, 2016 4:43 pm

Quoting Dreamflight767 (Reply 33):
Thanks much. I thought so but I remember thinking/seeing it was a "J".

ICAO *is* a J to designate a Super.
H for Heavy
M for Medium
L for Light.
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speedbird128
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Mon Jan 18, 2016 4:45 pm

Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 34):

Heavy behind Heavy 4 NM
Medium behind Heavy 5 NM
Light behind Heavy 6 NM
Light behind Medium 5 NM
Heavy behind A380 6 NM
Medium behind A380 7 NM
Light behind A380 8 NM

Forgot one there buddy  

And Super following another Super has no wake separation, only radar minimum separation.
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LONGisland89
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RE: A380 Callsign- Heavy Or Super?

Mon Jan 18, 2016 7:03 pm

The .65 still has the verbiage how the FAA has not rendered a final determination in support of the "J" indicator. Any idea when they'll get around to making a decision?   

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