airtechy
Topic Author
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Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2006 7:35 am

Pilot Requirement For Charters?

Sun Aug 07, 2011 5:51 am

What are the experience requirements....if any..... for pilots to fly charters into airports that the carrier doesn't normally fly into? Let's say I wanted to charter Delta to fly a group of skin divers into Pago Pago for lack of a better example. Would one of the pilots have to have flown into the airport without passengers before?
 
flymia
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Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2001 6:33 am

RE: Pilot Requirement For Charters?

Sun Aug 07, 2011 6:34 am

Quoting airtechy (Thread starter):
Would one of the pilots have to have flown into the airport without passengers before?

No, I am not certain but I highly doubt it. That is what all the charts are for anyway. An experienced airline pilot should have no problem flying into a new airport. Maybe need some extra time taxing the plane and look over procedures and charts more carefully but I do not know of any requriements.
"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
 
maxpower1954
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Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 1:14 am

RE: Pilot Requirement For Charters?

Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:28 am

No extra qualifications are required to operate a charter, if the airport meets all FAR 121 specs, at least for U.S. carriers.

Last fall, I was offered a trip to fly the Carolina Panthers into Cleveland Lakefront Airport, which I've never seen in my life, in a Airbus 321. The runway is short, the weather wasn't great and an easy trip to San Juan was also available so I took that one. I must be getting old (plus SJU paid quite a bit more!)
 
BMI727
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RE: Pilot Requirement For Charters?

Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:32 am

Quoting airtechy (Thread starter):
What are the experience requirements....if any..... for pilots to fly charters into airports that the carrier doesn't normally fly into?

In almost all cases, none. Some airports might be designated by airlines as "captains only" but that is up to them and not regulating bodies.

Quoting airtechy (Thread starter):
Would one of the pilots have to have flown into the airport without passengers before?

I vaguely recall a reference to something like that somewhere, but suffice to say, such airports are extremely few and far between.
Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
 
maxpower1954
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Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 1:14 am

RE: Pilot Requirement For Charters?

Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:58 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 3):
I vaguely recall a reference to something like that somewhere, but suffice to say, such airports are extremely few and far between.

That's something I've never heard before, and hardly seems practical. If I flew my 1957 Cessna 172 into such an airport, would that count?
 
HNLPointShoot
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Joined: Fri Feb 02, 2007 3:32 pm

RE: Pilot Requirement For Charters?

Sun Aug 07, 2011 9:26 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 3):
I vaguely recall a reference to something like that somewhere, but suffice to say, such airports are extremely few and far between.

I think that's an internal procedure certain airlines have for airports with unusual conditions such as SAN, TGU, and FNC.
 
theginge
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Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 1:53 am

RE: Pilot Requirement For Charters?

Sun Aug 07, 2011 10:59 am

For one off charters to 'difficult' airports the pilots might go in to the simulator to review the approach but I very much doubt they would take an empty aircraft there to practice.
 
Bellerophon
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Joined: Thu May 09, 2002 10:12 am

RE: Pilot Requirement For Charters?

Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:19 am

airtechy

...What are the experience requirements....if any..... for pilots to fly charters into airports that the carrier doesn't normally fly into?...

There are in fact some airfields, around the world, where special restrictions, imposed by the civil aviation authority of the state in which that airfield is situated, apply.

These airfields may be relatively few in number but they do exist and the restrictions imposed by the state apply to anyone operating in and out of that airfield. In my (very limited) experience, such conditions are generally imposed for two reasons:

Firstly because of the existence of some particularly difficult or dangerous local factors which may affect the approach, landing, or go-around. These factors could include a curved final approach path, prohibited airspace very close to the runway, very short, very steep, very slippery runways, very high altitude airfields, lack of any over-run or undershoot area, high terrain very close to the airfield or approach path or dangerous local wind conditions.

Secondly because the state involved became fed up with having a few pilots who, despite being provided with briefing documents for that airfield, still remained rather complacent or unaware about the gravity of the particular problems at that airfield and who then caused problems by messing up badly - sometimes fatally - on arrival.

One such restricted airfield is Madeira (LPMA) where the Portuguese civil aviation authority impose conditions - and monitor compliance - on anyone operating in there in an aircraft capable of carrying more than 10 passengers.

Very broadly, amongst the Portuguese requirements for a Captain to operate into LPMA are:
  • * Completion of a Portuguese CAA approved initial training course.

  • * 200 hrs P1 on the aircraft type concerned.

  • * One T/O and LDG there in the last six months.
Interestingly, for Madeira, the Captain's approval to operate there is aircraft type specific, so an approved Captain who later changes to another aircraft type loses approval and must regain approval on the new aircraft type by satisfying the initial training requirements again.

Finally, don't forget that there are many airfields that will not allow a particular aircraft type to operate there (as I repeatedly found out some years ago   ) so whenever operating to a new destination it is always prudent to look at the National or State documentation for the airfield concerned, as well as that airfield's own local regulations, before setting off.

Something that charter pilots, particularly those who fly internationally - and who fly to new destinations much more frequently than I ever did as pilot with a scheduled airline - are actually well aware off.


Best regards

Bellerophon
 
Northwest727
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RE: Pilot Requirement For Charters?

Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:27 pm

On a side note, are charters that are operated by a normal 121 carrier (using the OP's example, Delta) still operating under 121 rules? Or are they now a 135 operation, since it is a non-scheduled charter to an airport they may normally not fly into?
 
Maverick623
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RE: Pilot Requirement For Charters?

Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:54 pm

Quoting Northwest727 (Reply 8):
On a side note, are charters that are operated by a normal 121 carrier (using the OP's example, Delta) still operating under 121 rules?

Yes.
"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way

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