smartt1982
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Varying Wind Speeds/direction And Tailwheel Limits

Sun Jan 27, 2013 5:17 pm

With regards to wind speed given by ATC/atis when they say for example “160@16 knots, varying between 180 and 120 degrees”.

Our company policy is that we take the steady wind speed component and if applicable half the gust value, this would play a part in crosswind and headwind/tailwind limitations.
What I am curious about is the varying bit, for the above example could I take the 160@16 knots for let’s say my tailwind limitation or would I have to plan for the worst case scenario i.e. take the wind from 120 degrees.

I know it may be slightly different depending on what part of the world you fly but we have an approach limit/outer marker whereby the pilot can go past this point on the approach as long as the required visibility (and ceiling for non precision approach) is in place, if this Vis declines after passing that point the pilot can continue to minimums and attempt a landing.

Would this apply to wind limits also i.e. crosswind/tailwind? If the winds are out of limits can you even attempt an approach in the hope that they will die down by the time you get to your minimums?

Any thoughts or input would be greatly appreciated.
 
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tb727
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RE: Varying Wind Speeds/direction And Tailwheel Limits

Sun Jan 27, 2013 6:00 pm

Quoting smartt1982 (Thread starter):
Would this apply to wind limits also i.e. crosswind/tailwind? If the winds are out of limits can you even attempt an approach in the hope that they will die down by the time you get to your minimums?

Well if it's above your max, it's above your max. I always go with worse case scenario, never be behind the airplane. I wouldn't land with a tailwind in that situation and request a different runway. In the case of visibility, when you get to the bottom of the approach, the runway is either there or it isn't, that's a reason you can continue. In the case of wind, you aren't gonna know if it changed to above your max until it's too late when you possibly go scooting off the other end of the runway because of it.
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glen
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RE: Varying Wind Speeds/direction And Tailwheel Limits

Sun Jan 27, 2013 8:28 pm

Quoting smartt1982 (Thread starter):
I know it may be slightly different depending on what part of the world you fly but we have an approach limit/outer marker whereby the pilot can go past this point on the approach as long as the required visibility (and ceiling for non precision approach) is in place, if this Vis declines after passing that point the pilot can continue to minimums and attempt a landing.

We have also the requirement, to have at least the minimum visibility at the OM in order to complete the approach. If the visibility is deteriorating after passing the OM we may continue the approach to the DH/MDA and decide there if the visual requirements are met to complete the landing.

Quoting smartt1982 (Thread starter):
Would this apply to wind limits also i.e. crosswind/tailwind? If the winds are out of limits can you even attempt an approach in the hope that they will die down by the time you get to your minimums?

The wind has to be within limits for the actual landing, i.e. the wind together with the landing clearance or the latest received wind has to be within limits. There is no limitation for the approach per se. So we could theoretically fly an approach regardless of the wind situation. That's fine when there is a chance of having the wind within limits at landing. Of course this doesn't make sense with a steady wind outside the limits with no reasonable chance to have an acceptable wind at landing. In this case I would ask for a different runway before starting the approach.

Quoting smartt1982 (Thread starter):
What I am curious about is the varying bit, for the above example could I take the 160@16 knots for let’s say my tailwind limitation or would I have to plan for the worst case scenario i.e. take the wind from 120 degrees

For the wind direction we have to consider the worst direction, i.e. most tailwind or crosswind.
"The horizon of many people is a circle with zero radius which they call their point of view." - Albert Einstein
 
Mir
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RE: Varying Wind Speeds/direction And Tailwheel Limits

Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:20 pm

Quoting smartt1982 (Thread starter):
Our company policy is that we take the steady wind speed component and if applicable half the gust value, this would play a part in crosswind and headwind/tailwind limitations.
What I am curious about is the varying bit, for the above example could I take the 160@16 knots for let’s say my tailwind limitation or would I have to plan for the worst case scenario i.e. take the wind from 120 degrees.

I don't want to sound unhelpful, but if you have a question about company policy it's probably better to ask someone in your company. You could get a variety of answers from people here who work for different companies, and there's no guarantee that their company policy would match your company policy. So you may be getting bad information.

-Mir
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smartt1982
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Posts: 226
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RE: Varying Wind Speeds/direction And Tailwheel Limits

Tue Jan 29, 2013 7:16 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 3):

I understand what you mean Mir, probably didn't make it clear in the first post but that was one of the things I was interesting in hearing. Basically what are the guys and girls out there doing, attempt an approach even if it is out of limits? My understanding is that it is purely for landing but wanted to hear other views etc

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