Bofredrik
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FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Mon Jun 05, 2006 8:29 pm

It would be interesting to have your opinion OR a picture that is better and is more as real as it gets... Smile
Big version: Width: 800 Height: 600 File size: 128kb
As real as it gets?
 
jetflyer
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Mon Jun 05, 2006 11:49 pm

No. The sky is way too unrealisitc plus the aircraft doesn't have the shine or reflection quality on the textures anything like a real one.
 
Bofredrik
Topic Author
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Tue Jun 06, 2006 1:34 am

Lets see one of yours then...  Wink
 
MaverickM11
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Tue Jun 06, 2006 2:18 am

looks nice but....flaps?
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
B737200
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Tue Jun 06, 2006 2:20 am

I think we are still VERY, VERY far away from a Flightsimulator version to produce screenshots that can be passed on as real photos without some serious photoshop treatment (even with PhotoshopI have my doubts, and big ones), no matter how good your computer specifications are.

Oh and btw I forgot to mention that your 747 looks supersharp. bigthumbsup 

[Edited 2006-06-05 19:26:41]
Lady Guinness is ready to fly...
 
Gofly
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net

Tue Jun 06, 2006 2:25 am

Quoting B737200 (Reply 4):
I think we are still VERY, VERY far away from a Flightsimulator version to produce screenshots that can be passed on as real photos without some serious photoshop treatment (even with PS I have my doubts, and big ones), no matter how good your computer specifications are.

Try telling that to this guy! His PS work is the best I have seen!

http://www.fs2004.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=80137

Excellent FS shot Bofredrik! Big grin

-Gofly

[Edited 2006-06-05 19:29:58]
Living the high life on my ex-Airliners.net Moderator pension...
 
B737200
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Tue Jun 06, 2006 2:34 am

[QUOTE]Try telling that to this guy! His PS work is the best I have seen! /QUOTE]

His work is impressive, wish I was that good but I still don't think that they can be passed on as real photos. Just my humble opinion. Unless you are being sarcastic and I didn't realize. Big grin
Lady Guinness is ready to fly...
 
GEEZ
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Tue Jun 06, 2006 2:58 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 3):
looks nice but....flaps?

Yeah... thats known as Slew Mode  rotfl 
If it ain't broke, don't try to fix it... UNLESS it's a crap AFCAD!
 
jamotcx
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Tue Jun 06, 2006 6:37 am

Hmm, I wonder if he got permision to use the background pic for this edit? I know the photographer that took the pic very well, and I was even there on the day the pic was took at MAN.

http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/1904/08420650nh.jpg
 
jetflyer
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Tue Jun 06, 2006 8:33 am

Quoting Bofredrik (Reply 2):
Lets see one of yours then... Wink

My graphics look OK to me and I'm not even comparing them with real life so I couldn't care less. You AND OLD: Guangzhou - Baiyun (CAN / ZGGG) (closed), China">CAN NOT AND NEVER WILL be able to compare a FS picture with real life and not tell the difference.
 
Newark777
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Tue Jun 06, 2006 10:08 am

Besides baddistance, badquality, and badborder, I see a lot of JPEG compression, and the sky doesn't look very real.

But hey, standards are high these days.  Wink

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
Q330
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net

Tue Jun 06, 2006 10:34 am

Quoting Gofly (Reply 5):
Try telling that to this guy! His PS work is the best I have seen!

http://www.fs2004.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=80137

Those are some damn good shots, but the shadows of the ones seen from above shouldn't be motion-blurred...

-Q
Long live the A330!
 
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AirPacific747
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Tue Jun 06, 2006 1:12 pm

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 9):
AND OLD: Guangzhou - Baiyun (CAN / ZGGG) (closed), China">CAN NOT AND NEVER WILL be able to compare a FS picture with real life and not tell the difference.

How can you be so sure about that? Its only a matter of time...
 
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nighthawk
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Tue Jun 06, 2006 5:14 pm

Quoting Gofly (Reply 5):
Try telling that to this guy! His PS work is the best I have seen!

http://www.fs2004.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=80137

Oh If only flightsim looked that good without photoshopping!!!!
 
jetflyer
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Wed Jun 07, 2006 3:29 am

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 12):

How can you be so sure about that? Its only a matter of time...

Well even now it takes a hell of a lot of photoshopping. Maybe with a supercomputer something could be created, but even then most would sniff a rat. Give it 100 years or so maybe.
 
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AirPacific747
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Wed Jun 07, 2006 4:00 am

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 14):
Give it 100 years or so maybe.

Not even close to 100. Look at how much computer games have changed the past 20 years. Even the difference between fs98 and fs2004 is extremely big.
I'd say, give it 10-20 years.
 
RichardPrice
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Wed Jun 07, 2006 6:50 am

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 14):
Well even now it takes a hell of a lot of photoshopping. Maybe with a supercomputer something could be created, but even then most would sniff a rat. Give it 100 years or so maybe.

5. And I would be willing to put £100 on that.

GPU technology and performance is far ahead of CPU tech, and its more than doubling in power each year. By the end of this decade, expect photorealism in realtime.
 
jetflyer
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 6:38 am

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 15):

Not even close to 100. Look at how much computer games have changed the past 20 years. Even the difference between fs98 and fs2004 is extremely big.
I'd say, give it 10-20 years.

It was said we will have computers which can communicate perfectly with humans by 2000... that happened.. not. I just don't believe anyone will ever really by fooled by something computer generated. Sorry.
 
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AirPacific747
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 7:34 am

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 17):
It was said we will have computers which can communicate perfectly with humans by 2000... that happened.. not. I just don't believe anyone will ever really by fooled by something computer generated. Sorry.

There's a big difference though. You're comparing apples to oranges right now. Creating something that looks like reality is way different from creating something that acts like a real human. Creating something that looks like reality has already been done many many times, especially in hollywood movies.
 
jetflyer
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net

Thu Jun 08, 2006 7:43 am

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 18):
There's a big difference though. You're comparing apples to oranges right now. Creating something that looks like reality is way different from creating something that acts like a real human. Creating something that looks like reality has already been done many many times, especially in hollywood movies.

What's an orange?

It's all the same thing really though. Its about making something more "real" whether it's communication on a PC or graphics on a PC. Maybe graphics will one day be real life like and computers will communicate with humans perfectly and probably the former will happen quicker. I just don't know if the hardware for personal computers will ever be powerful enough. You do realise that to have everything graphically perfect everthing, frome very house, tree etc.. would need to be perfectly modelled even down to the last cigarette butt or dog poo on the sidewalk. The planes would actually have to have each rivet individually modelled. It's not so much the possibiliy of making it look perfect, but the feasibilty. Everyone would need to own nothing short of super computers to even run something so realistic.

[Edited 2006-06-08 00:48:03]
 
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AirPacific747
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 7:45 am

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 19):
What's an orange?

lol  Silly
 
jetflyer
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net?

Thu Jun 08, 2006 7:53 am

Plus at the moment the graphics from crusing altitude on FS look awful even on a good PC, the graphics engine would need to be completely re-done spo much it might need 393285237592 megabytes of RAM. We've gone from 266MHz CPUs 10 years ago and only have reached about 3800MHz today. It's not fast enough to support "real" looking graphics in 20 years but maybe 50. I'm talking about on PCs here, it will be possible in 10-20 years, but not on a PC. The average PC now can not even run FS2004 very well unless its tweaked alot anyway and FS2004 is nothing like real. 10-20yrs is a bit optimistic in terms of computer/hardware power progression.
 
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AirPacific747
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net

Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:01 am

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 21):
Plus at the moment the graphics from crusing altitude on FS look awful even on a good PC, the graphics engine would need to be completely re-done spo much it might need 393285237592 megabytes of RAM. We've gone from 266MHz CPUs 10 years ago and only have reached about 3800MHz today. It's not fast enough to support "real" looking graphics in 20 years but maybe 50. I'm talking about on PCs here, it will be possible in 10-20 years, but not on a PC. The average PC now can not even run FS2004 very well unless its tweaked alot anyway and FS2004 is nothing like real. 10-20yrs is a bit optimistic in terms of computer/hardware power progression.

FS2004 is from 2003. That's 3 years ago. Things have already changed a lot. Have you seen screenshots from FSX? Also, FS is made so that most people are able to run it. It is not a sign of what the software developers are actually capable of creating. Seeing that you already went from 100 years to 50 years seems to me like you know I am right about a lot of what I am saying here

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 21):
it will be possible in 10-20 years, but not on a PC.

Again, it IS already possible.

[Edited 2006-06-08 01:02:56]
 
jetflyer
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net

Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:45 am

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 22):
FS2004 is from 2003. That's 3 years ago.

Yet even today the average computer struggles with it at high settings, and I can count amazingly enough.

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 22):
Have you seen screenshots from FSX?

Yes... and it is unimpressive to say the least from what progressions I'd have expected from the stand point of some people's views here of having 100% photo-realistic simulation by 10 years time...

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 22):
Also, FS is made so that most people are able to run it.

Most tripe I ever heard, especially at high graphics settings. The system specification requirements from microsoft are much understated, and FS2004 has exceptionally poor memory management. Well known fact. It is inefficient code. The V9.1 patch did help this but still it has many problems with performance.

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 22):
t is not a sign of what the software developers are actually capable of creating.

Yet again I am talking about desktop flight simulators and desktop PCs I am not interested in something they are simply "capable of creating", because it isn't the point. The point is creating something that can operate on a typical desktop PC (whatever that'll be in 10-20yrs) to a high standard AND allow full functionality with good performance on such a computer for everybody, AND look EXACTLY like real life. Jeez please don't tell me it will happen soon.

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 22):
Seeing that you already went from 100 years to 50 years seems to me like you know I am right about a lot of what I am saying here

Complete BS. What I do know is you are full of yourself. And nobody here is "right" because nobody can see literally into the future. Don't try to be smart.
How can someone be "right" when speculating about what might happen the future you don't know! Truly silly and laughable comment.

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 22):
Again, it IS already possible.

Evidence please. Hollywood? I don't think so. And they use computers to do really professional thngs with hardware and software WELL out of everyday consumer's and PC users reach.

You can't seem to comphrehend the fact that COMPLETE REALITY as it looks with your own eyes will probably never be PERFECT on a computer. The computer screen itself would be a physical limitation because of resoltution etc... everything still is made up in pixels. How do you get round that problem eh?

In the end a flight simulator is a hobby, means to an end, etc... if anyone really cares so much about having it look sooo real they have to argue about it and find it so important they really should just get flying real planes. I don't expect my flight simulator to look "real" completely and never will because that's not "realism" to me. It is a computer game, at the end of the day. If I want to be real I'll fly real planes.

Even if you do endup with a flight sim with that looks exactly like real life, will the ATC be perfect, as if talking with a real controller? Will the flight dynamics be EXACTLY like real life? No. So what's the point in having one thng pristnie when the fact is the whole picture just won't be perfect? I'd rather fly real planes because you're also achieving something as well as it being "realistic". I don't care about flight sim looking realistic as long as I find it enjoyable as a hobby when I get free time.

[Edited 2006-06-08 01:49:01]

[Edited 2006-06-08 01:51:32]
 
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AirPacific747
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RE: FS2004 Picture That Could Be Accepted On A.net

Thu Jun 08, 2006 3:12 pm

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 23):
Yet even today the average computer struggles with it at high settings, and I can count amazingly enough.

Yeah, the average computer...

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 23):
Yes... and it is unimpressive to say the least from what progressions I'd have expected from the stand point of some people's views here of having 100% photo-realistic simulation by 10 years time...

Why is it unimpressive? If you don't expect computer games to look like reality before 100 years from now, I would say that it is a major change
And again, it does not show what software developers are really capable of.

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 23):
Most tripe I ever heard, especially at high graphics settings. The system specification requirements from microsoft are much understated, and FS2004 has exceptionally poor memory management. Well known fact. It is inefficient code. The V9.1 patch did help this but still it has many problems with performance.

Let's just say that this has probably something to do with an agreement between Microsoft and Intel The more computers Intel sell with their hardware in it, the more money Microsoft earns as well, because every one of those computers come with windows.

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 23):

Yet again I am talking about desktop flight simulators and desktop PCs I am not interested in something they are simply "capable of creating", because it isn't the point. The point is creating something that can operate on a typical desktop PC (whatever that'll be in 10-20yrs) to a high standard AND allow full functionality with good performance on such a computer for everybody, AND look EXACTLY like real life. Jeez please don't tell me it will happen soon.

Why isn't it the point? You didn't mention this in your original post. You're changing your story now. The original discussion was about whether it will be possible to make something that looks like reality, and you said in a 100 years which I think be both can agree on is wrong.
And yes, that will happen within 20 years on ordinary PCs. Take a look at what computer games looked like 20 years ago and you would understand.
This one is from 1986:


less than 20 years later:
http://ckkoshi.free.fr/images/25.jpg

http://www.ling.ohio-state.edu/~kyoon/etc/final-fantasy.jpg

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 23):
Complete BS. What I do know is you are full of yourself. And nobody here is "right" because nobody can see literally into the future. Don't try to be smart.
How can someone be "right" when speculating about what might happen the future you don't know! Truly silly and laughable comment.

Um ok, that is not exactly the part I was talking about I was talking about the development that has taken place during the last 20 years, but ok.
Again, instead of calling me things, you should get out more. You take these things way too seriously. And you know, 50 years is a lot of time... I just think it is weird how you *suddenly* changed your opinion from 100 years to 50 years

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 23):
Evidence please. Hollywood? I don't think so. And they use computers to do really professional thngs with hardware and software WELL out of everyday consumer's and PC users reach.

Well if you ever watch any movies besides playing FS, you would know what I am talking about. There are lots of movies where they put in computer animated characters into the movie and you wouldn't know which ones are real and which ones are fake.

This is from a movie that is a couple of years old. 100% computer animated.
Not hard to imagine what they are going to be capable of within 20 years



And here's an image from the movie King Kong where they have made New York look like the way it did many years ago:
http://img-nex.theonering.net/images/scrapbook/orig/17094_orig.jpg

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 23):
You can't seem to comphrehend the fact that COMPLETE REALITY

Okay so now we're talking facts about the future? Tell me how you're able to know because you're only speculating here

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 23):
In the end a flight simulator is a hobby, means to an end, etc... if anyone really cares so much about having it look sooo real they have to argue about it and find it so important they really should just get flying real planes. I don't expect my flight simulator to look "real" completely and never will because that's not "realism" to me. It is a computer game, at the end of the day. If I want to be real I'll fly real planes.

Who's argueing here? No one was argueing. We're all just speculating but you're not respecting other people's opinions since you're so busy telling me how full I am of it instead of simply discussing this with me. And I am sure FS is going to look very real within 20 years, if you don't, fine. That's your opinion. I also think we can both agree that flying a real airplane would be more fun But then again, you can't crash your plane in real life just for fun without dieing as well, and you can't just fly whatever route you like in real life either. Therefore it would be cool to have an FS that looks like reality.

Quoting Jetflyer (Reply 23):
Even if you do endup with a flight sim with that looks exactly like real life, will the ATC be perfect, as if talking with a real controller? Will the flight dynamics be EXACTLY like real life? No.

What, is that a "fact" too? Now you're also moving focus from the original topic, but to answer your question: yes, some day it will, I just don't know how long that is going to take to create. You already have video games where the computer needs to figure out what will happen to the barrell if you shoot at it (half life 2). Why not be able to create an ATC with a huge vocabulary that will be able to figure out what to say as well?

Again, instead of calling other people things, why don't you just cool off and get some fresh air or something?

[Edited 2006-06-08 08:15:15]

[Edited 2006-06-08 08:46:22]

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